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Thread: Evolution

  1. #1
    Patrick Guest

    Default Evolution

    Looks like scientists found another link proving evolution....what do you think?

    Fossil discovery fills gap in human evolution
    ‘We just found the chain of evolution, the continuity through time’
    By Seth Borenstein
    Updated: 1:01 p.m. ET April 12, 2006

    WASHINGTON - The latest fossil unearthed from a human ancestral hot spot in Africa allows scientists to link together the most complete chain of human evolution so far.
    The 4.2 million-year-old fossil discovered in northeastern Ethiopia helps scientists fill in the gaps of how human ancestors made the giant leap from one species to another. That’s because the newest fossil, the species Australopithecus anamensis, was found in the region of the Middle Awash — where seven other human-like species spanning nearly 6 million years and three major phases of human development were previously discovered.
    “We just found the chain of evolution, the continuity through time,” study co-author and Ethiopian anthropologist Berhane Asfaw said in a phone interview from Addis Ababa. “One form evolved to another. This is evidence of evolution in one place through time.”
    The findings were reported Thursday in the scientific journal Nature.
    The species anamensis is not new, but its location is what helps explain the shift from one early phase of human-like development to the next, scientists say. All eight species were within an easy day’s walk of each other.
    Until now, what scientists had were snapshots of human evolution scattered around the world. Finding everything all in one general area makes those snapshots more of a mini home movie of evolution.
    “It’s like 12 frames of a home movie, but a home movie covering 6 million years,” said study lead author Tim White, co-director of Human Evolution Research Center at University of California at Berkeley.
    “The key here is the sequences,” White said. “It’s about a mile thickness of rocks in the Middle Awash and in it we can see all three phases of human evolution.”

    Modern man belongs to the genus Homo, which is a subgroup in the family of hominids. What evolved into Homo was likely the genus Australopithecus (once called “man-ape”), which includes the famed 3.2 million-year-old “Lucy” fossil found three decades ago. A key candidate for the genus that evolved into Australopithecus is called Ardipithecus. And Thursday’s finding is important in bridging — but not completely — the gap between Australopithecus and Ardipithecus.

    I

    In 1994, a 4.4 million-year-old partial skeleton of the species Ardipithecus ramidus — the most recent Ardipithecus species — was found about six miles from the latest discovery.
    “This appears to be the link between Australopithecus and Ardipithecus as two different species,” White said. The major noticeable difference between the phases of man can be seen in Australopithecus’ bigger chewing teeth to eat harder food, he said.
    While it’s looking more likely, it is not a sure thing that Ardipithecus evolved into Australopithecus, he said. The finding does not completely rule out Ardipithecus dying off as a genus and Australopithecus developing independently.
    The connections between Ardipithecus and Australopithecus have been theorized since an anamensis fossil was first found in Kenya 11 years ago. This draws the lines better, said Alan Walker of Penn State University, who found the first anamensis and is not part of White’s team.
    Rick Potts, director of the Smithsonian’s Human Origins Program, agreed: “For those people who are tied up in doing the whole human family tree, being able to connect the branches is a very important thing to do.”

  2. #2

    Default Re: Evolution

    Too bad the kool-aide drinkers aren't here to decry this false "science."

  3. #3
    Uptown Guest

    Default Re: Evolution

    Kool-Aid drinkers?

  4. #4

    Default Re: Evolution

    Biblical literalists... unfortunately also known as "the majority" in this state.

  5. #5
    Uptown Guest

    Default Re: Evolution

    There are still several links missing in the evolutionary picture. But, it along with religion are the best explanations we have at this time.

  6. #6

    Default Re: Evolution

    "along with"? How is any religious creation myth a "best" explanation? The only reason anyone finds them credible is by way of faith, not of reason.

  7. Default Re: Evolution

    Okay, this has been discussed over and over.

    MONKEYS DID NOT JUST MAGICALLY TURN INTO MAN.

    APE-like creatures EVOLVED into humans. Evolution happens everywhere. Viruses evolve, the bird flu evolves, mammals evolve. Think about it, why are there so many species? They adapt to their environment. Animals that live in cold climates have thick hair and are larger to help keep them warm. Animals that live in warm climates don't need as much water to survive and have ways of keeping themselves cool.

    How can you not see the similiarties between apes and men? My god, we've taught them to sign and to communicate with us. Their DNA is 99% the same as ours! It's not magic, it's science. You don't have to believe in some holy spirit, the facts are there in front of your face, you just choose to ignore them.

  8. #8
    Uptown Guest

    Default Re: Evolution

    Quote Originally Posted by bandnerd
    Okay, this has been discussed over and over.

    MONKEYS DID NOT JUST MAGICALLY TURN INTO MAN.

    APE-like creatures EVOLVED into humans. Evolution happens everywhere. Viruses evolve, the bird flu evolves, mammals evolve. Think about it, why are there so many species? They adapt to their environment. Animals that live in cold climates have thick hair and are larger to help keep them warm. Animals that live in warm climates don't need as much water to survive and have ways of keeping themselves cool.

    How can you not see the similiarties between apes and men? My god, we've taught them to sign and to communicate with us. Their DNA is 99% the same as ours! It's not magic, it's science. You don't have to believe in some holy spirit, the facts are there in front of your face, you just choose to ignore them.
    Yeah, but viruses evolve into others of their own kind. Etc. Etc. I don't see how you get from monkey to human. No connection. They simply look similar.

    By the way, rats DNA is similar to humans as well. Did you come from a rat?

  9. #9
    Uptown Guest

    Default Re: Evolution

    Evolution defies the second law of thermodynamics. The second law of thermodynamics being the law of increasing entropy. Now, if all systems can only disorganize and DECREASE in complexity, how is evolution any exception?

  10. Default Re: Evolution

    It's not that ape DNA is similar, Uptown, it's that it is ONE chromosome away from ours. One. Saying that rat DNA is similar is a moot point.

    As for evolution defying the second law of thermodynamics, Creationists believe that. Those who believe in evolution do not. Just because it wasn't covered in the bible doesn't mean it can't and doesn't happen.

    http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/thermo/probability.html
    http://www.1729.com/evolution/2ndlaw.html

    I enjoyed the part about Maxwell's Demon in the second article.

    And another thing: If humans didn't evolve to their habitat, then why do people from different parts of the world look so different? Why are the aboriginals in Austrailia SO vastly different from people in Northern Europe? Why do some have dark skin and some light? Why are some shorter and some taller? And why have people continued to grow taller, on average? You can claim diet but those "tall genes" are passed on to future generations who have more tall children...oh wait, that's basically what evolution is *smacks forehead*

  11. #11

    Default Re: Evolution

    Ok, I've seen a few people say this. It has been awhile, but I took thermo-I in college, and I don't remember this ever being brought up. How does evolution violate this law? I am going to have to dig up the old text and check it out.

  12. Default Re: Evolution

    travis--it depends on who you talk to. Creationists will say that evolution defies the law and evolutionists will say it doesn't. Google has many answers out there along with your old texts. I have to say that this was the first time I'd ever heard that argument.

  13. #13

    Default Re: Evolution

    Quote Originally Posted by Midtowner
    "along with"? How is any religious creation myth a "best" explanation? The only reason anyone finds them credible is by way of faith, not of reason.
    Now, if only science could explain why we are here or what caused the beginning of existence. At least "religious creation myth" attempts to do that.

  14. #14

    Default Re: Evolution

    BF:

    An "attempt" does not equal success. Your statement does not succeed logically.

  15. #15

    Default Re: Evolution

    I never said that "attempt" equals success. My statement does succeed logically because it conveys exactly what I wanted it to.
    An attempt could lead to sucess. No attempt can not lead to success.

  16. Default Re: Evolution

    Why do we have to know why we are here? Maybe we are simply just here.

    I just enjoy the ride and the scenery.

  17. #17

    Default Re: Evolution

    Why do we have to know if we evolved from monkeys?

  18. #18

    Default Re: Evolution

    Quote Originally Posted by BFizzy
    I never said that "attempt" equals success. My statement does succeed logically because it conveys exactly what I wanted it to.
    An attempt could lead to sucess. No attempt can not lead to success.
    Here are some other myths created by religion to explain phenomena which were not at the time understood:

    The sun traveling through the sky is the sun God Helios making a journey through the sky each day.

    The world is flat.

    The Earth is the center of the universe.

    The world was created in 7 days.

    --
    Science does not explain, it observes and hypothesizes. Religion on the other hand does not take the time to consider evidence. It simply teaches that we take what is told to us at face value and without consideration.

    When science tells us that our religion's explanation is lacking, in my mind, that trumps religion. Science attempts to explain truth through observable phenomena, religion just assumes truth based on what someone says or has written.

  19. #19

    Default Re: Evolution

    When religion offers explanations that science can not, in my mind, that trumps science. Just because science has shown evidence of error in religion, that does not mean that all religion is false. Since science will never be able to hypothesize about why we are here or what caused the beginning of existence, this debate will go on forever.

  20. #20

    Default Re: Evolution

    BFizzy, that debate has nothing to do with evolution.

    Evolution comes after creation.

  21. #21
    Uptown Guest

    Default Re: Evolution

    Quote Originally Posted by bandnerd
    And another thing: If humans didn't evolve to their habitat, then why do people from different parts of the world look so different? Why are the aboriginals in Austrailia SO vastly different from people in Northern Europe? Why do some have dark skin and some light? Why are some shorter and some taller? And why have people continued to grow taller, on average? You can claim diet but those "tall genes" are passed on to future generations who have more tall children...oh wait, that's basically what evolution is *smacks forehead*
    Adapting to your habitat is not the same as evolving into a more complex form.

  22. #22
    Uptown Guest

    Default Re: Evolution

    The world was created in 7 days.
    This has never been disproven. Also, are we really sure what God meant when he said 7 days? And was night and day the same length back when the earth was created?

  23. #23
    Uptown Guest

    Default Re: Evolution

    Quote Originally Posted by travis
    Ok, I've seen a few people say this. It has been awhile, but I took thermo-I in college, and I don't remember this ever being brought up. How does evolution violate this law? I am going to have to dig up the old text and check it out.
    Evolution teaches that monkeys evolved into a more complex, more ordered species, the human race. 2nd law of thermodynamics teaches that things go from order to disorder, not the other way around.

  24. #24

    Default Re: Evolution

    Quote Originally Posted by Uptown
    Evolution teaches that monkeys evolved into a more complex, more ordered species, the human race. 2nd law of thermodynamics teaches that things go from order to disorder, not the other way around.
    How are humans more complex?

    Cognitive capacity does not equal greater complexity.

    Doing some reading on the second law, your claim seemed awfully simplistic. Upon further examination, it is so simplistic that it's simply inaccurate. If you're interested, here's a fine explanation as to why your explanation doesn't work:

    http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/thermo/probability.html

    -- the final paragraph is below:

    The numerical calculation of entropy changes accompanying physical and chemical changes are very well understood and are the basis of the mathematical determination of free energy, emf characteristics of voltaic cells, equilibrium constants, refrigeration cycles, steam turbine operating parameters, and a host of other parameters. The creationist position would necessarily discard the entire mathematical framework of thermodynamics and would provide no basis for the engineering design of turbines, refrigeration units, industrial pumps, etc. It would do away with the well-developed mathematical relationships of physical chemistry, including the effect of temperature and pressure on equilibrium constants and phase changes.

  25. #25
    Uptown Guest

    Default Re: Evolution

    You're overanalyzing the simplistic statemenht of the 2nd law of thermodynamics.

    A humans neurons are much more "organized" and structured than a monkeys. That's what produces the increased cognitive capacity.

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