2023 Oklahoma City Aviation Thread

[ComeOnBenjals!]

Flew through Salt Lake City for the first time recently. I couldn't get over how busy it was and how big it is. They're also in the process of significantly expanding the terminal. I'm assuming this is due to their fairly isolated location and being a Delta hub. Considering OKC's metro population is about 300k, I was surprised to see such a difference.

[unfundedrick]

Flew through Salt Lake City for the first time recently. I couldn't get over how busy it was and how big it is. They're also in the process of significantly expanding the terminal. I'm assuming this is due to their fairly isolated location and being a Delta hub. Considering OKC's metro population is about 300k, I was surprised to see such a difference.

I hope their terminal expansion will alleviate a situation I faced on my last flight there from OKC. After landing we went to a remote area where we got off the plane with steps that were rolled up to the plane. We then had to wait for a shuttle to take us to a satellite terminal. After a considerable walk up outdoor ramps I got inside of the satellite terminal. Then there was a considerable walk to get from the satellite terminal to the main terminal. It was quite a workout.

[runOKC]

I hope their terminal expansion will alleviate a situation I faced on my last flight there from OKC. After landing we went to a remote area where we got off the plane with steps that were rolled up to the plane. We then had to wait for a shuttle to take us to a satellite terminal. After a considerable walk up outdoor ramps I got inside of the satellite terminal. Then there was a considerable walk to get from the satellite terminal to the main terminal. It was quite a workout.

It will. That is a temporary setup while they build out the new buildings. It’s not fun, especially if it’s cold out or you are lugging around luggage/kids.

[Bellaboo]

Flew through Salt Lake City for the first time recently. I couldn't get over how busy it was and how big it is. They're also in the process of significantly expanding the terminal. I'm assuming this is due to their fairly isolated location and being a Delta hub. Considering OKC's metro population is about 300k, I was surprised to see such a difference.

300 thousand ??? Where did this come from ?

Edit - I think this is 300 k. less population ?

[ComeOnBenjals!]

Yep, they've still got the bus system going. Was a good mile plus walk from the plane to baggage claim.

Yes - mistake on my end. I meant to say that OKC's metro pop is about 300k more.

[jedicurt]

Flew through Salt Lake City for the first time recently. I couldn't get over how busy it was and how big it is. They're also in the process of significantly expanding the terminal. I'm assuming this is due to their fairly isolated location and being a Delta hub. Considering OKC's metro population is about 300k, I was surprised to see such a difference.

try closer to 680k

[BoulderSooner]

try closer to 680k

OKC metro is almost 1.5 mil

[chssooner]

SLC benefitted from Delta purchasing Western Air Lines 40 years ago. They are an outlier for hubs. But, most hubs are carried forward due to an acquisition (see Charlotte and Philly with American). Not many airports growing organically into a hub. Heck, I can't think of any current hubs like that for legacy carriers. They are all older or acquired hubs.

[jedicurt]

OKC metro is almost 1.5 mil

right, my bad, i just looked at the OKC population, not the whole metro

[Richard at Remax]

SLC has a ton of tourism with the nearby mountains. and the Greater SLC region in that state has over 2.7 million in the catchment area. And its kind of in no mans land which is great for connections for delta to serve the western US.

https://www.flightconnections.com/fl...-lake-city-slc

[HOT ROD]

does Utah even have that many people? I've driven throughout the state and with the exception of the I-15 Wasatch region there were hardly any people to speak of or any great number of towns (like we have in OK). I suppose SLC catchment goes into NV and to a lesser extent ID, but even then there aren't many people. ...

But I agree, SLC airport is large due to its isolation, relative large consolidated metro areas in the Wasatch front, and the high number of small airports where SLC can provide connecting access. OKC can't really compete on any of these other than population but there are numerous mid-size airports and one top-10 world airport within a 200-mile radius of downtown OKC to provide the 1.5m OKC metro residences choices beyond Will Rogers World Airport.

[Swake]

does Utah even have that many people? I've driven throughout the state and with the exception of the I-15 Wasatch region there were hardly any people to speak of or any great number of towns (like we have in OK). I suppose SLC catchment goes into NV and to a lesser extent ID, but even then there aren't many people. ...

But I agree, SLC airport is large due to its isolation, relative large consolidated metro areas in the Wasatch front, and the high number of small airports where SLC can provide connecting access. OKC can't really compete on any of these other than population but there are numerous mid-size airports and one top-10 world airport within a 200-mile radius of downtown OKC to provide the 1.5m OKC metro residences choices beyond Will Rogers World Airport.

Salt Lake City's consolidated metro area (with Ogden and Provo) has 2.7 million people. More than Kansas City.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Combin...tistical_areas

[chssooner]

Salt Lake City's consolidated metro area (with Ogden and Provo) has 2.7 million people. More than Kansas City.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Combin...tistical_areas

The irony in that OKC to Tulsa are only 25 miles further than Ogden to Provo.

[Edmond Hausfrau]

The irony in that OKC to Tulsa are only 25 miles further than Ogden to Provo.

True, and if our nearby surround included Heavenly, Tahoe, Jackson Hole, Sun Valley ID, and Whitefish, MT the airport would reflect that clientele.
Plus Park City and Sundance are in the airport parking lot practically.

[Swake]

And Tulsa and OKC's CSAs also combine for 2.7 million people. But Stroud only has 2,000 people instead of the SLC MSA of 1.3 million.

[BG918]

And Tulsa and OKC's CSAs also combine for 2.7 million people. But Stroud only has 2,000 people instead of the SLC MSA of 1.3 million.

Yes I've never understood why the cities between OKC and Tulsa along I-44 are so small. If they were larger they may be a bigger push for regional rail.

[BoulderSooner]

The irony in that OKC to Tulsa are only 25 miles further than Ogden to Provo.

which would be fine if the biggest city in the state in stroud

[chssooner]

I never meant to imply it was the same situation... just that they have amount the same amount of people in the same area. My bad.

[brianinok]

The irony in that OKC to Tulsa are only 25 miles further than Ogden to Provo.

If Tulsa was actually 25 miles closer to OKC it might have sprawled toward OKC rather than away from it. And then we could have legitimately talked about a combined airport halfway between. But it's not, so we're not. So, we can move on.

[catch22]

I’m pretty sure SLC has a hub because their airport director has a nationwide calling plan, while OKC has local only.

[LakeEffect]

I’m pretty sure SLC has a hub because their airport director has a nationwide calling plan, while OKC has local only.

But seriously though, do airlines have data for all origination/destination travelers for themselves AND competitors? Isn't it kind of like a chicken and egg situation - you don't know if you're going to have the travelers until you try a market?

Or do they only look at their competitors? I.E., if one airline isn't getting OKC-LAX to turn a great profit, they won't try to even add their own to compete?

[BoulderSooner]

I’m pretty sure SLC has a hub because their airport director has a nationwide calling plan, while OKC has local only.

haha

[catch22]

But seriously though, do airlines have data for all origination/destination travelers for themselves AND competitors? Isn't it kind of like a chicken and egg situation - you don't know if you're going to have the travelers until you try a market?

Or do they only look at their competitors? I.E., if one airline isn't getting OKC-LAX to turn a great profit, they won't try to even add their own to compete?

There are various subscription services that provide market analysis, data aggregation, and traffic data to the airlines on the bulk level. There is also government O&D data that is publicly available: DOT consumer air fare report as well as T100 tables.

By the time an airline is ready to launch a route, they have a pretty good idea of expected revenue, passenger traffic, market stimulation, and hub contribution (connection flow).

For the most part all of the airlines have access to the same data, and are pretty good at guessing the competition’s performance as well as airfare data and load factors are available publicly. They can spot when a competitor has struck a gold mine, or are in a market that is really struggling not worth protecting.

[HOT ROD]

Salt Lake City's consolidated metro area (with Ogden and Provo) has 2.7 million people. More than Kansas City.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Combin...tistical_areas

the list of CSAs is beyond ridiculous for most of the cities listed. Corvallis is now part of Portland CSA? Loongview Wa also?? scratching head, these places are 100 miles away and there is not contiguous development, not even Portland to Salem - which I could sort of get behind actually. Seattle now includes Centralia?????? and Mount Vernon??? WHAT? makes NO sense.

why are they so generous with most of these cities cSA yet they do not give OKC Kingfisher county - i know it's not a lot of people but the people there do likely work/shop in OKC just the same if not moreso than as say Corvallis to Portland. .. lol.

I do generally agree with the SLC CSA as it is rather contiguous having been there many times, but including the mountain communities? scratch head again. the ONLY sizable city outside of the CSA is St George and Price but I'd agree the pop does congregate in the front area.

[amocore]

Hello,

These numbers are great, but they are so spectacular for United that I doubt of their correctness.

https://flyokc.com/sites/default/fil...t%20Report.pdf