New Downtown Arena

[chssooner]

Thought that T. Swift only plays concerts in football stadia these days.

She does.

But if the arena is built to the ideal specs, then it will get thr big concerts that skip over Oklahoma City and either go to Tulsa, or just do KC and then Dallas.

[PoliSciGuy]

Professor, you should know future profits can only be guestimated. One Garth or Taylor Swift concert can make a huge difference in a year's revenues.

We can pretty firmly know profits from the past. How much profit has the Paycom Center brought in over the last, say, 5 years? Or further back to wash out the COVID impact. That could provide us with a good baseline for what this new stadium will generate.

[BoulderSooner]

BOK & Midfirst would probably have very little to do with the arena financing.

The city doesn't borrow from a bank. For something like this they would use a Wall Street investment banker who would underwrite a municipal bond issue. Those bonds would then be sold to anyone from individuals to investment and mutual funds. The interest rate is set by the market and would probably be very low because of OKCs stellar credit rating and the virtual payoff guaranty of sales tax revenue.

However, since it would be financed by a sales tax, the bond issue may not be nearly as large as the total project cost.

i don't believe this vote has any bond issue attached to it so they can't sells bonds to cover any part of it ..


this will be a loan ..

[warreng88]

Not sure if this has been discussed or not, but would the naming right for Paycom just carry over to the new arena? Paycom did a 15 year sponsorship starting in 2022.

[jdross1982]

Not sure if this has been discussed or not, but would the naming right for Paycom just carry over to the new arena? Paycom did a 15 year sponsorship starting in 2022.

Paycom's naming rights will stay with the current arena unless they sign a new contract (undoubtedly more money) for the new arena as well.

[jdross1982]

We can pretty firmly know profits from the past. How much profit has the Paycom Center brought in over the last, say, 5 years? Or further back to wash out the COVID impact. That could provide us with a good baseline for what this new stadium will generate.

You cannot use the current arena to determine future profit/revenues. Reason number 1 is the new arena will be much larger in sf for the purpose of selling those spaces to additional vendors which will raise additional revenues and profits. Once there are specs you could then make a guess as to what the expected additional revenue would be based on the increase in space made available to vendors but it would just be a guess.

[Teo9969]

Paycom's naming rights will stay with the current arena unless they sign a new contract (undoubtedly more money) for the new arena as well.

Are you sure about this? Did they sign their agreement with the Thunder or the city of OKC? My understanding is that it was done with the Thunder. Unless the Thunder will continue paying a lease agreement with the city for the current arena, then I would assume the contract with Paycom would be broken and they could enter a new contract with the new arena.

I would assume all parties would want to break that agreement, including the city, in favor of good partner relations.

ON EDIT: The deals of the Paycom agreement are not public knowledge so the lease was definitely executed with the Thunder and not the city. Deals of the lease were probably also kept very private as a way to prevent anyone from knowing that a new arena was in the works given that this news broke in Q3 2021.

[chssooner]

Are you sure about this? Did they sign their agreement with the Thunder or the city of OKC? My understanding is that it was done with the Thunder. Unless the Thunder will continue paying a lease agreement with the city for the current arena, then I would assume the contract with Paycom would be broken and they could enter a new contract with the new arena.

I would assume all parties would want to break that agreement, including the city, in favor of good partner relations.

ON EDIT: The deals of the Paycom agreement are not public knowledge so the lease was definitely executed with the Thunder and not the city. Deals of the lease were probably also kept very private as a way to prevent anyone from knowing that a new arena was in the works given that this news broke in Q3 2021.

Why would it be with the Thunder? It is for the arena. So I have no reason to think it wouldn't be with the city.

[PoliSciGuy]

You cannot use the current arena to determine future profit/revenues. Reason number 1 is the new arena will be much larger in sf for the purpose of selling those spaces to additional vendors which will raise additional revenues and profits. Once there are specs you could then make a guess as to what the expected additional revenue would be based on the increase in space made available to vendors but it would just be a guess.

For sure, it'd be an estimate, or at least a floor to project future earnings. But if we're saying that a benefit of this new arena is the profits it will generate for the city, I think it's wholly reasonable and germane to look at what our current venue is generating to see just how much of a benefit it may be.

[jdross1982]

Are you sure about this? Did they sign their agreement with the Thunder or the city of OKC? My understanding is that it was done with the Thunder. Unless the Thunder will continue paying a lease agreement with the city for the current arena, then I would assume the contract with Paycom would be broken and they could enter a new contract with the new arena.

I would assume all parties would want to break that agreement, including the city, in favor of good partner relations.

ON EDIT: The deals of the Paycom agreement are not public knowledge so the lease was definitely executed with the Thunder and not the city. Deals of the lease were probably also kept very private as a way to prevent anyone from knowing that a new arena was in the works given that this news broke in Q3 2021.

Not 100% but those agreements are signed with the owner of the building almost always and not with a tenant.

[jdross1982]

For sure, it'd be an estimate, or at least a floor to project future earnings. But if we're saying that a benefit of this new arena is the profits it will generate for the city, I think it's wholly reasonable and germane to look at what our current venue is generating to see just how much of a benefit it may be.

Completely fair.

[jdross1982]

Are you sure about this? Did they sign their agreement with the Thunder or the city of OKC? My understanding is that it was done with the Thunder. Unless the Thunder will continue paying a lease agreement with the city for the current arena, then I would assume the contract with Paycom would be broken and they could enter a new contract with the new arena.

I would assume all parties would want to break that agreement, including the city, in favor of good partner relations.

ON EDIT: The deals of the Paycom agreement are not public knowledge so the lease was definitely executed with the Thunder and not the city. Deals of the lease were probably also kept very private as a way to prevent anyone from knowing that a new arena was in the works given that this news broke in Q3 2021.

I am almost 100% positive the contract was with the city. Just no reason for it to not be with the City. The contract may very well be broken but would only be done if they were signing a new one / more profitable one with the new arena. All speculation but almost 100% positive it was with the city.

[Teo9969]

I'm 100% certain that if the agreement was with the city someone would have FOIAed the details of the lease. I recall this being a big discussion about how the Thunder were receiving the money and not the city.

[warreng88]

The way the press release is worded, it sounds like it was with the Thunder:

“We are honored and excited to expand our partnership with Paycom to include a centerpiece, 15-year naming rights commitment for our arena,” said Clayton I. Bennett, chairman of the Oklahoma City Thunder.

“On behalf of our ownership group and the entire Thunder organization, we look forward to presenting our new arena partner, Paycom, to the NBA global audience. We are especially proud to be able to welcome back our fans to again enjoy the Thunder game experience inside the fresh and exciting Paycom Center,” Bennett said.

https://www.nba.com/thunder/news/release-paycom-210727

[jdross1982]

I'm 100% certain that if the agreement was with the city someone would have FOIAed the details of the lease. I recall this being a big discussion about how the Thunder were receiving the money and not the city.

I didn't say the city was the one receiving the money. However, a tenant cannot sign into an agreement with something they have no ownership of.

[Laramie]

Got to remember, a part of the Thunder entering the NBA with the city is that the NBA franchise receives arena naming rights revenue.

They will more than likely have to work out some agreement with the Paycom if they want to rename the new arena Paycom Center or Paycom Arena.

Once the new arena is built and a naming rights agreement is worked out with Paycom, Hobby Lobby, Devon, BanFirst, MidFirst, WinStar (Chickasaw Tribe) or Continental Resources then hopefully, the Thunder can begin new branding.

[chssooner]

The way the press release is worded, it sounds like it was with the Thunder:

“We are honored and excited to expand our partnership with Paycom to include a centerpiece, 15-year naming rights commitment for our arena,” said Clayton I. Bennett, chairman of the Oklahoma City Thunder.

“On behalf of our ownership group and the entire Thunder organization, we look forward to presenting our new arena partner, Paycom, to the NBA global audience. We are especially proud to be able to welcome back our fans to again enjoy the Thunder game experience inside the fresh and exciting Paycom Center,” Bennett said.

https://www.nba.com/thunder/news/release-paycom-210727

Again, why would a tenant of an arena have any authority to sign something like this? Does that not strike you as unenforceable? Almost like a tenant in an apartment saying they can completely redesign their apartment on their own authority.

[Teo9969]

Again, why would a tenant of an arena have any authority to sign something like this? Does that not strike you as unenforceable? Almost like a tenant in an apartment saying they can completely redesign their apartment on their own authority.

Because it's part of PBC's lease? That's a very easy clause to write in...how long was Chase's name on Cotter Ranch when they had nothing to do with it?

Again, if Paycom signed this with the city of OKC the contract is public information and that information would be well known at this point.

[chestercheetah]

I believe there is no way that Chad Richison would strike a deal that didn't guarantee the Paycom brand would be a part of any building that the Thunder are in. He knew going into negotiations for the sponsorship that there would be a new arena at some point in the next 15 years. I don't see him signing off on a deal that would have that brand torn down with an old arena unless it is a part of a new one.

[Rover]

Again, why would a tenant of an arena have any authority to sign something like this? Does that not strike you as unenforceable? Almost like a tenant in an apartment saying they can completely redesign their apartment on their own authority.

Legal contracts can be written with all kinds of stipulations.

In your example, the tenant would be given the right to incur expenses on behalf of the owner. That is not what this is. The Thunder can receive income accourding to the contract, just like they can receive income from concessions, suites rentals, etc. as long as all other conditions are met.

[gopokes88]

The way the press release is worded, it sounds like it was with the Thunder:

“We are honored and excited to expand our partnership with Paycom to include a centerpiece, 15-year naming rights commitment for our arena,” said Clayton I. Bennett, chairman of the Oklahoma City Thunder.

“On behalf of our ownership group and the entire Thunder organization, we look forward to presenting our new arena partner, Paycom, to the NBA global audience. We are especially proud to be able to welcome back our fans to again enjoy the Thunder game experience inside the fresh and exciting Paycom Center,” Bennett said.

https://www.nba.com/thunder/news/release-paycom-210727

League-wide naming rights for arenas go into BRI (basketball related income) that gets spilt between players and owners.

[Pete]

League-wide naming rights for arenas go into BRI (basketball related income) that gets spilt between players and owners.

According to this, only 50% of arena naming rights goes to revenue-sharing in the league:
https://sports.yahoo.com/nba-players...130000564.html

I believe the owner of the arena gets the other 50%, which in our case is the City.


It's amazing how little even the most interested and informed citizens know about how any part of the current and future arena deal is structured. And I include myself in that group.

[April in the Plaza]

According to this, only 50% of arena naming rights goes to revenue-sharing in the league:
https://sports.yahoo.com/nba-players...130000564.html

I believe the owner of the arena gets the other 50%, which in our case is the City.


It's amazing how little even the most interested and informed citizens know about how any part of the current and future arena deal is structured. And I include myself in that group.

Agreed. The relevant players know that most of us (not me, of course) are hopelessly ignorant on this topic.

For example, the city has mentioned nothing about the current or future non-relocate or liquidated damages clauses (arguably the most key clauses if we are content on conceding almost every other material deal point). The City would have everyone believe that the 25 year term is absolutely iron clad, but there are numerous examples of teams breaking leases early for, effectively, peanuts.

Would be much easier to vote yes if we knew that breaking the lease would be painful for the current ownership group or its successor. But I just don’t see Holt or the CM having the chutzpah to secure a big number for The City. It’s honestly a sad state of affairs. Wish we had real journalists who would push Holt on this question.

[caaokc]

Not a great look for Mayor Holt to lock his Twitter replies.

[citywokchinesefood]

Not a great look for Mayor Holt to lock his Twitter replies.

The majority of the people he is blocking are not going to vote. I don't blame him at all. I am fairly liberal politically; this thing is going to get the far left screechers in a frenzy.