Boardwalk at Bricktown / Dream Hotel

[unfundedrick]

The convo was about the Parisians objecting to the Eiffel Tower like OKC and this maybe tower, No comparison to be had.

You are just trying to have the last word as always. The comparison about how the project would fit is totally accurate compared to how many objected to the Eiffel Tower. I was only responding to one person and that was his exact argument.

And I'm still impressed with "profundity". You have a great deal to add to many discussions but you tend to try too hard sometimes to impress with your knowledge. "convo" LOL

[bombermwc]

I'm not confident it will be built, because it's based on demand. There really is no vertical pressure in OKC like there is in other places like NYC or Chicago. Land is cheap, so there's really no reason to go through the expense of something like this. And frankly, housing in downtown OKC may be fairly solid, but the number of units this would bring at one time, is massive for our market (which is not large). But honestly, even with the other 3 towers, it's still a good win.

In response to some of these other comments, yeah the Eifel Tower was not well received when it was built. The metal erector set style was seen as UGLY, for one thing. It's amazing how something goes from being dislikes, to being a worldwide icon, isn't it?! But the same story has been told in other cities. When the Sears tower was built in Chicago, there wasn't anything even close to it in height. It wasn't for some time before things like Hancock, Aon, etc were constructed and many more years for the high fil-in to take place. In NYC, when the WTC was built, a lot of people thought it was also a plain concrete ugly eyesore that was "too tall". I mean if you're comparing it to the Empire State, they are so wildly different. The WTC ended up taking on an icon status because of it's sheer size and "in your face" statement. Not really because it was so pleasant to look at.

So if it did get built, would it stand out? yes. Does Devon? Yes. But have we all sort of gotten used to the size difference and even embraced it? I would argue to say yes. So if it did get built, I honestly think that after the initial period of shock, it would sort of level out eventually. With something all by itself like it would be, and so massively tall, it's always going to stand out no matter what. And you're always going to have people that think of it as awful (and some that are saying that are just annoyed it's not in their city). We would be able to wear that with pride though. Come to OKC and check out our two big middle finger towers that are pointed at everyone that says that we can't do it, or that we're flyover city. I mean there is something to be said for that iconic status, hated or loved. It will attract visitors, and that's a good thing.

[bombermwc]

I'm not confident it will be built, because it's based on demand. There really is no vertical pressure in OKC like there is in other places like NYC or Chicago. Land is cheap, so there's really no reason to go through the expense of something like this. And frankly, housing in downtown OKC may be fairly solid, but the number of units this would bring at one time, is massive for our market (which is not large). But honestly, even with the other 3 towers, it's still a good win.

In response to some of these other comments, yeah the Eifel Tower was not well received when it was built. The metal erector set style was seen as UGLY, for one thing. It's amazing how something goes from being dislikes, to being a worldwide icon, isn't it?! But the same story has been told in other cities. When the Sears tower was built in Chicago, there wasn't anything even close to it in height. It wasn't for some time before things like Hancock, Aon, etc were constructed and many more years for the high fil-in to take place. In NYC, when the WTC was built, a lot of people thought it was also a plain concrete ugly eyesore that was "too tall". I mean if you're comparing it to the Empire State, they are so wildly different. The WTC ended up taking on an icon status because of it's sheer size and "in your face" statement. Not really because it was so pleasant to look at.

So if it did get built, would it stand out? yes. Does Devon? Yes. But have we all sort of gotten used to the size difference and even embraced it? I would argue to say yes. So if it did get built, I honestly think that after the initial period of shock, it would sort of level out eventually. With something all by itself like it would be, and so massively tall, it's always going to stand out no matter what. And you're always going to have people that think of it as awful (and some that are saying that are just annoyed it's not in their city). We would be able to wear that with pride though. Come to OKC and check out our two big middle finger towers that are pointed at everyone that says that we can't do it, or that we're flyover city. I mean there is something to be said for that iconic status, hated or loved. It will attract visitors, and that's a good thing.

[HOT ROD]

well said

[G.Walker]

We keep circling back having the same conversations and arguments. We will know soon if this is for real or just a sham, hang tight.

[Tyson]

Thank you haha. I've read "I think the smaller towers will get built but not the big one" a million times now.

[Swake]

We keep circling back having the same conversations and arguments. We will know soon if this is for real or just a sham, hang tight.

We already know.

[PhiAlpha]

Thank you haha. I've read "I think the smaller towers will get built but not the big one" a million times now.

none of it’s getting built

(Let’s start the cycle again lol)

[bombermwc]

Well that is always a possibility. But what a lot of us are saying here, is that we feel like there are two different projects in play here. One is a perfectly plausible smaller collection of mixed use development. The other is a wile pie in the sky farse. The plausible is not dependent on the farse, so it at least stands a very good chance of being built. It's in a good location for what they are wanting to build. There is demand for something like that in the area.

The farse, well we'll all believe it when we see it. What it's dependent on is likely to not come to fruition. But that's not a lot of what the conversation here is about. A lot of the conversation surrounding this structure is the questioning of if OKC should have a structure like this. Does OKC "deserve" the tallest title? There's a lot of b.s. that fuels that ideology about OKC's status in the U.S. So it's a lot more highly charged than if we were just talking about another Devon sized structure. So i dont think it's as easy as saying we're repeating the same conversations. It really has evolved as there has been more buzz in social media/web/etc. The more people analyze, the more they are talking about OKC. And those conversations go both ways in terms of how OKC is viewed. For me, I prefer to think of it as IF it does get built, what does that mean? What impact would that have on OKC? And it would have one.

[TheTravellers]

Can we please stop with this "deserving" crap? It's inane, doesn't mean anything, has no purpose other than to keep people arguing/debating (oh, wait....), and is just patently absurd. Cities can't "deserve", the criteria for it doesn't really exist, they're not living entities that have traits or have done things that "deserve" anything, either good or bad.

[jn1780]

Well that is always a possibility. But what a lot of us are saying here, is that we feel like there are two different projects in play here. One is a perfectly plausible smaller collection of mixed use development. The other is a wile pie in the sky farse. The plausible is not dependent on the farse, so it at least stands a very good chance of being built. It's in a good location for what they are wanting to build. There is demand for something like that in the area.

Well, one is most likely a PR stunt to get the smaller projects over the finish line(or at least one tower started) in terms of interest and funding. That brings the smaller projects into question if the developer felt the need to do that.

Tallest tower, deserving argument, tornado alley argument: all pointless noise to me. They don't have a building permit yet and won't get one for several more months at least. This could stay in Schrodinger's box for a long time.

[TornadoKegan]

any word on when legends tower might be approved by the faa

[jedicurt]

any word on when legends tower might be approved by the faa

i could be wrong, but i think i remember that the FAA won't look at an application for approval in a city without first having city council approval (when needed). i remember reading something about that back when Devon Tower was first announced, talking about how the FAA gets so many applications for approval, that they hold off on as many as possible, so that they aren't spending time and effort on something that gets denied somewhere else.

[okcrun]

i could be wrong, but i think i remember that the FAA won't look at an application for approval in a city without first having city council approval (when needed). i remember reading something about that back when Devon Tower was first announced, talking about how the FAA gets so many applications for approval, that they hold off on as many as possible, so that they aren't spending time and effort on something that gets denied somewhere else.

Hopefully the FAA is aware that we deserve this and can expedite the approval

[Bill Robertson]

Hopefully the FAA is aware that we deserve this and can expedite the approval

The FAA doesn't care a bit about anything but their requirements and standards. That being said the FAA approval will probably be the easiest, fastest single part of the process.

[Pete]

Assuming Legend Tower is built in some form and knowing that it will never be 1,907 tall, what would be the optimal height?

At 60 floors with some rooftop elements, it would likely be about the height of Devon Tower. Even that would be very out of scale with everything else surrounding it.

OTOH, it seems our only chance (albeit small) to add to our skyline anytime soon.

[CaptDave]

If it were up to me, I'd move the entire thing over to the the former Ford dealer block west of Paycom, get the first three buildings done (minus some of the garish Vegas style lighting), and then consider building the Legend Tower at a more reasonable 700-900 feet tall.

[jedicurt]

Assuming Legend Tower is built in some form and knowing that it will never be 1,907 tall, what would be the optimal height?

At 60 floors with some rooftop elements, it would likely be about the height of Devon Tower. Even that would be very out of scale with everything else surrounding it.

OTOH, it seems our only chance (albeit small) to add to our skyline anytime soon.

20% higher than the other 3 towers.

[stlokc]

The optimal height is halfway between the height of BancFirst and Devon. Around 650 feet.

[CaptDave]

20% higher than the other 3 towers.

This seems pretty reasonable and attainable actually. I'd still like to move the whole thing though.

[aDark]

Assuming Legend Tower is built in some form and knowing that it will never be 1,907 tall, what would be the optimal height?

At 60 floors with some rooftop elements, it would likely be about the height of Devon Tower. Even that would be very out of scale with everything else surrounding it.

OTOH, it seems our only chance (albeit small) to add to our skyline anytime soon.

Pete, is this a hypothetical discussion or do you think the chances of a Legends Tower being built is slowing materializing?

[Pete]

Pete, is this a hypothetical discussion or do you think the chances of a Legends Tower being built is slowing materializing?

Just hypothetical.

Until we see actual construction, I remain a skeptic of the entire project.

[HOT ROD]

I'd love to see this move to the REHCO lands, with the three towers moving up to 450' and the Legends Tower going up to 1000'. This is more reasonable to me in terms of location and height appropriate while also expanding the skyline. This would also allow 'proper' redevelopment of the Paycom site and the balance of the Cox site, creating a true dense downtown expansion with 'acceptable' height. Also, it'd probably be the only thousand footer chance we'll have for quite some time, so I don't want to cut Legends Tower too short.

But hey, if they can get it done at the location and with 1,907' - more power to them. I just think it MIGHT make the rest of downtown a little more difficult to fill-in for a while, while we allow Boardwalk to fill.

[HOT ROD]

As for the FAA, the developer said they were around 71% complete at the time of the OKC planning meeting that approved removing height restrictions for the site.

My question is when city hall will have the approval, I'd expect once that's done that the FAA would also be complete and they should be able to start permitting/digging over the summer like he said/intends.

[Pete]

As for the FAA, the developer said they were around 71% complete at the time of the OKC planning meeting that approved removing height restrictions for the site.

My question is when city hall will have the approval, I'd expect once that's done that the FAA would also be complete and they should be able to start permitting/digging over the summer like he said/intends.

What was 71% complete and where did he say this?

Matteson was not at the Planning Commission meeting that approved this project.