Tesla in Tulsa

[dankrutka]

Agreed on universities. It was made clear to Stitt and Tulsa leaders we must improve in higher ed. But for public k-12 schools it became eh they suck everywhere with good in suburban and ex-urb. (Claremore, glenpool etc)

Ou needs to find a way to become an AAU university. They would be if not for the medical school being in OKC. But perception is reality and AAU matters.

Perception is self-fulfilling. Sorry, I try not to add education talk in these threads, but the ways people talk about "good" (suburban) and "bad" (urban) schools is so problematic. Schools grades are largely just representations of parental income and they include almost nothing related to educational quality. These ratings get spouted about like gospel and they've led to re-segregation of American schools and continued White flight and anti-Black and Brown racism. There's a ton of literature on all this. Here's a good podcast if you'd like to learn more: https://haveyouheardblog.com/the-mis...d-segregation/

[G.Walker]

The quality of K-12 education has nothing to do with corporations moving to a location. It has to do with incentives, cost of living, and location. People will move for jobs, thats a given.

[Pete]

The quality of K-12 education has nothing to do with corporations moving to a location. It has to do with incentives, cost of living, and location. People will move for jobs, thats a given.

I would add that there isn't a huge difference between cities in terms of upper-middle-class independent school districts anyway.

[gopokes88]

Curious why does it matter that the med school is in OKC, the campuses are only 20 miles apart.

I know AAU was always one of Boren’s goals, maybe Harroz can lead the charge but can only do so much without adequate state funding to supplement private donors.

Medical schools MUST be on flagship campus to be considered for AAU. Period. I think Nebraska got kicked out of AAU for building a new one off campus or something similar.

[HangryHippo]

I don’t think that’s the case. Nebraska’s was off their campus when they were invited, no? I’ll have to look it up to confirm.

[Swake]

Medical schools MUST be on flagship campus to be considered for AAU. Period. I think Nebraska got kicked out of AAU for building a new one off campus or something similar.

KU is AAU, main campus is in Lawrence, KUMC is in KCK.

[gopokes88]

I don’t think that’s the case. Nebraska’s was off their campus when they were invited, no? I’ll have to look it up to confirm.

It’s why Nebraska got kicked out.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asso...n_Universities

[HangryHippo]

It’s why Nebraska got kicked out.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asso...n_Universities

A separate medical campus was apparently part of it, but several articles also cite that research funding from the USDA wasn’t counted. But as Swake said, Kansas and Missouri don’t have on-campus medical schools and they’re both AAU.

[Swake]

It’s why Nebraska got kicked out.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asso...n_Universities

Colorado - Main Campus in Boulder, medical school in Aurora
Northwestern - Main campus in Evanston, medical school in Chicago
Penn State - Main campus in State College, medical school in Hershey
Indiana - Main campus in Bloomington, medical school in Indianapolis

[BG918]

Colorado - Main Campus in Boulder, medical school in Aurora
Northwestern - Main campus in Evanston, medical school in Chicago
Penn State - Main campus in State College, medical school in Hershey
Indiana - Main campus in Bloomington, medical school in Indianapolis

Exactly, that obviously doesn’t matter. I believe OU’s exclusion is tied to research funding. Former President Gallogly mentioned increasing research funding as a way for OU to get invited to join the AAU.

“We need to double the amount of research that we’re doing today,” Gallogly said in a press conference Aug. 16. “That’s incredibly important because at this point in time, that’s about the only thing that keeps us from being an AAU-type institution.”

Gallogly said this initiative is part of his strategy to promote the graduate student experience at OU and better serve faculty members who conduct research. However, OU falls well behind the pack of AAU schools when it comes to funding for research.

According to the AAU website, the University of Kansas, Iowa State and University of Texas at Austin are the only schools in the Big 12 Conference in the AAU.

http://www.oudaily.com/news/ou-presi...98c7336d6.html

[HOT ROD]

KU is AAU, main campus is in Lawrence, KUMC is in KCK.

Right. I've noticed most medical schools are located in the largest city of the state and not at the main campus (unless it too is in the largest city, like the UW-Seattle). Isn't U Texas Medical at the Texas Medical Center in Houston not Austin (and isn't OKC's Oklahoma Health Center a near exact smaller copy of TMC?)

Perhaps OU could try to become more of a research university (like the UW is). I think OU is probably only research for Weather (obvioulsy, OU is the biggest in the country for that) and probably some energy related, but why not go after other sectors/initiatives?

We/Seattle get tons of federal (and private) dollars for research up here for just about everything; you all know who does the Coronavirus Covid-19 models for the United States government? YEP, the University of Washington. We're also doing the first virus testing in conjunction with Kaiser Permanente.

Just a small but very current example of perhaps research dollars quickly being utilized/authorized and why Seattle is often mentioned so positively and perhaps something OKC/OU could try to jump on. UW is always testing for this and that, researching grants for this and that, for all economic and academic sectors. ..

[jccouger]

Interesting perspective from the man himself on why Austin was chosen.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ZZTBUtmX3M

[Pete]

Interesting perspective from the man himself on why Austin was chosen.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ZZTBUtmX3M

He specifically said that key people that would need to move from California strongly preferred Austin.

When asked about Oklahoma: "Wasn't a matter of who wanted Tesla. There's a critical mass of engineering and management that are needed to create this factory. There are a lot of smart talented people; it's not like just dropping a copy machine somewhere. The factory is the product more than the car. So it matters where these really talented people are willing to go and what is an uphill battle. Austin was not an uphill battle; that's why we picked Austin."

Also said there will be a 3rd gigafactory but said it would likely be in the northeast U.S. in the next 4-5 years.

HQ will stay in California in the short-term; long-term "we'll see".

[dcsooner]

Same negatives expressed 30 years ago about Oklahoma. lags most of the nation in higher education ranking and Q of L. People want to live in more progressive Cities/States. Oklahomas Uber conservative, poor education system and low number of college graduates. State leaders STILL don't have a program on how to grow talent in State and keep them. Doesn't help when you have Governor and legislatures that focus on Stupid SXXT.

[Pete]

The governor in Texas and their legislature gets the same sort of criticism.

The common thread between Austin, the Bay Area and the Northeast are great universities which in turn yield and attract the best and brightest from all over the world. That feeds off itself in a million different ways.

Musk specifically mentioned they floated Dallas and the team was not interested.

[Ronnie Jackson]

Doesn’t really explain the Nevada Gigafactory, though. There’s not an elite college within 250 miles.

As for Austin, people like it because it has California’s weather without all of the goofy taxes and red tape.

[BG918]

Doesn’t really explain the Nevada Gigafactory, though. There’s not an elite college within 250 miles.

As for Austin, people like it because it has California’s weather without all of the goofy taxes and red tape.

Right, the other Tesla factories are in Reno and Buffalo, not exactly education centers. And their electric truck competitor Rivian has their main factory in Normal, Illinois. The average salary for a Tesla factory worker is only $35k with no college degree required; I imagine many of these workers would've rather been in Tulsa where their salary would go further.

[Rover]

Doesn’t really explain the Nevada Gigafactory, though. There’s not an elite college within 250 miles.

As for Austin, people like it because it has California’s weather without all of the goofy taxes and red tape.

Weather in Austin isn’t like California unless you are talking about Barstow, or Bakersfield. Certainly isn’t like San Francisco, San Diego or west LA area.

And taxes in Tex are high overall...just no income tax. So, high earners not worried about property taxes etc, love to move there companies their regardless of the neg effect on the lower tier of their wage earners. Overall, cost for working class is better in Tulsa or OKC.

[Pete]

Doesn’t really explain the Nevada Gigafactory, though. There’s not an elite college within 250 miles.

As for Austin, people like it because it has California’s weather without all of the goofy taxes and red tape.

The Nevada factory is a very different animal; only for batteries.

Not at all an apt comparison.

[Pete]

Right, the other Tesla factories are in Reno and Buffalo, not exactly education centers. And their electric truck competitor Rivian has their main factory in Normal, Illinois. The average salary for a Tesla factory worker is only $35k with no college degree required; I imagine many of these workers would've rather been in Tulsa where their salary would go further.

Both Reno and Buffalo are battery factories.

Very, very different.


The factory workers are clearly not the primary consideration; they are always going to hire local people for that. It's the management team that matters and they were never going to choose Tulsa over Austin.


I realize people are desperate to think Tulsa was somehow competitive for this Tesla facility, but I think it's pretty clear it was never a serious consideration given Musk's comments.

[jdizzle]

Same negatives expressed 30 years ago about Oklahoma. lags most of the nation in higher education ranking and Q of L. People want to live in more progressive Cities/States. Oklahomas Uber conservative, poor education system and low number of college graduates. State leaders STILL don't have a program on how to grow talent in State and keep them. Doesn't help when you have Governor and legislatures that focus on Stupid SXXT.

Texas is almost, if not more, conservative. Austin just happens to have a massive university that overrates itself, and is inflated by its size and mass.

As I said before, OKC vs. Austin is much more of a fair fight than Tulsa vs. Austin.

But TX legislators focus on the same stuff, they just have more money and people to play with. Your argument is invalid when it comes to Texas.

[Jersey Boss]

Texas is almost, if not more, conservative. Austin just happens to have a massive university that overrates itself, and is inflated by its size and mass.

As I said before, OKC vs. Austin is much more of a fair fight than Tulsa vs. Austin.

But TX legislators focus on the same stuff, they just have more money and people to play with. Your argument is invalid when it comes to Texas.

What metric are you using claiming Austin is as conservative as Tulsa? Mayor? Congressional Rep?

How is a AAU member university overated because of size? UT is hardly overrated by any measurable criteria or academic memberships.

As far as a fair fight, Musk did not consider OKC so he did not think along your lines.

To echo Pete, Tulsa was not a viable candidate and to Musk it was an unnecessary uphill battle.

[jdizzle]

What metric are you using claiming Austin is as conservative as Tulsa? Mayor? Congressional Rep?

How is a AAU member university overated because of size? UT is hardly overrated by any measurable criteria or academic memberships.

As far as a fair fight, Musk did not consider OKC so he did not think along your lines.

To echo Pete, Tulsa was not a viable candidate and to Musk it was an unnecessary uphill battle.

I think the Governor and Tulsa did that together, and OKC did not even want to try, since they knew it was a waste of taxpayer money. Tulsa won't get as much out of this as people thought.

And again, money allows for a lot of things. UT can piss money down the drain, and still have plenty to use. None of the OK schools can do that, and that is not even counting state appropriations. Yes, OK needs to invest more in higher ed, but lets not make it seem like the state of TX is infinitely better.

Austin is not conservative, but the state is HIGHLY conservative.

[Jake]

Tulsa simply doesn't have the talent pool that Austin has.

Tulsa and the state as a whole should take Musk's comments as motivation to implement better policies to try and remedy that, instead of, "Hey, they thought about coming here! I think we're doing a good job!"

If a company considers moving to your state/city as an "uphill battle," then that's not a good sign. That's why few large companies outside of call centers have set up shop in Tulsa.

[jdizzle]

Tulsa simply doesn't have the talent pool that Austin has.

Tulsa and the state as a whole should take Musk's comments as motivation to implement better policies to try and remedy that, instead of, "Hey, they thought about coming here! I think we're doing a good job!"

If a company considers moving to your state/city as an "uphill battle," then that's not a good sign. That's why few large companies outside of call centers have set up shop in Tulsa.

But they never even were serious about Tulsa. They barely visited, and that was after they had made up their minds.