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  1. #126

    Default Re: Governor Stitt - Surprising Start

    Quote Originally Posted by Midtowner View Post
    The States not honoring agreements with the tribes? Gee.. I can't think of a single instance of that sort of nuisance taking place. The nerve.
    Is it not honoring an agreement, or that the existing agreements expire? I know the Tribes are stating that the compacts automatically renew, so therefore aren't up for renegotiating, but I've never heard of autorenewing contracts that don't have some ability for either part to not renew under the established terms. Otherwise, the renewal wouldn't be necessary, correct?

  2. #127

    Default Re: Governor Stitt - Surprising Start

    Quote Originally Posted by Midtowner View Post
    The States not honoring agreements with the tribes? Gee.. I can't think of a single instance of that sort of nuisance taking place. The nerve.
    I get the way it looks, but we don't have to pay for the sins of our for-for-for-for-for-fathers with bad deals today. It is in the tribe's best interest to not rock the boat too much as well. Nothing says we have to maintain the monopoly that currently exists.

  3. #128

    Default Re: Governor Stitt - Surprising Start

    Quote Originally Posted by Midtowner View Post
    The States not honoring agreements with the tribes? Gee.. I can't think of a single instance of that sort of nuisance taking place. The nerve.
    Although one side says it automatically renews, the agreement does expire. Its not about not honoring it, just negotiating an extension.

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric View Post
    I get the way it looks, but we don't have to pay for the sins of our for-for-for-for-for-fathers with bad deals today. It is in the tribe's best interest to not rock the boat too much as well. Nothing says we have to maintain the monopoly that currently exists.
    No doubt. The state could always removed the tribes exclusive rights to gaming and allow other private operators to open in our state.

  4. #129

    Default Re: Governor Stitt - Surprising Start

    So raising taxes is always bad unless its on the tribes? I don't think renegotiating is a bad idea it's just funny how the same people talking about the state receiving so little in gaming revenue compared to other states were so anti tax increase during the GPT debate when the argument was essentially identical.

  5. #130

    Default Re: Governor Stitt - Surprising Start

    Quote Originally Posted by GoGators View Post
    So raising taxes is always bad unless its on the tribes?
    Who has said that? Otherwise you are making a strawman argument.

  6. #131

    Default Re: Governor Stitt - Surprising Start

    Quote Originally Posted by Plutonic Panda View Post
    Who has said that? Otherwise you are making a strawman argument.
    .

    “I am not for any new taxes," Stitt said. "We first have to get reform. There's two sides to an income statement and some people just bang on revenue, revenue, revenue. In business we look at revenue and we look at expenses, but the last thing I’m going to do is pour more water into a bucket if there's holes in it, I have to plug the holes first.

  7. #132

    Default Re: Governor Stitt - Surprising Start

    Quote Originally Posted by GoGators View Post
    .

    “I am not for any new taxes," Stitt said. "We first have to get reform. There's two sides to an income statement and some people just bang on revenue, revenue, revenue. In business we look at revenue and we look at expenses, but the last thing I’m going to do is pour more water into a bucket if there's holes in it, I have to plug the holes first.
    I think the current agreement with the tribes is a hole needing to be plugged.

  8. #133

    Default Re: Governor Stitt - Surprising Start

    Quote Originally Posted by jonny d View Post
    I think the current agreement with the tribes is a hole needing to be plugged.
    I agree in the same sense as the GPT was a hole that needed to be plugged as well. But the “no new taxes” crowd didn’t see it that way. So my question is, why the sudden change of heart?

  9. #134

    Default Re: Governor Stitt - Surprising Start

    Quote Originally Posted by GoGators View Post
    I agree in the same sense as the GPT was a hole that needed to be plugged as well. But the “no new taxes” crowd didn’t see it that way. So my question is, why the sudden change of heart?
    This is a bit different IMO. The Indian Casinos can't pick up and move their business/investment to another state like Oil and Gas Producers have been doing for the last year. Oklahoma has lost 50% of its rigs on a year-over-year basis. A lot of that capital is being allocated to the Permian / Bakken / etc. instead of being invested in Oklahoma plays. Keeping the GPT artificially low was meant to incentivize investment in the State.

  10. #135

    Default Re: Governor Stitt - Surprising Start


  11. #136

    Default Re: Governor Stitt - Surprising Start

    Quote Originally Posted by chuck5815 View Post
    This is a bit different IMO. The Indian Casinos can't pick up and move their business/investment to another state like Oil and Gas Producers have been doing for the last year. Oklahoma has lost 50% of its rigs on a year-over-year basis. A lot of that capital is being allocated to the Permian / Bakken / etc. instead of being invested in Oklahoma plays. Keeping the GPT artificially low was meant to incentivize investment in the State.
    Fair points. I can see this side of the argument. Appreciate the response.

  12. #137

    Default Re: Governor Stitt - Surprising Start

    Quote Originally Posted by checkthat View Post
    Is what the tribes offer their members considered "insurance", at least as it relates to "studies" like this? I always wondered if that aspect of Oklahoma life played a role in that.

  13. #138

    Default Re: Governor Stitt - Surprising Start

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric View Post
    Is what the tribes offer their members considered "insurance", at least as it relates to "studies" like this? I always wondered if that aspect of Oklahoma life played a role in that.
    i wondered that myself, so i checked the census bureau documentation... healthcare offered under ihs programs is factored in as public health insurance.

  14. #139

    Default Re: Governor Stitt - Surprising Start

    Quote Originally Posted by Martin View Post
    i wondered that myself, so i checked the census bureau documentation... healthcare offered under ihs programs is factored in as public health insurance.
    Good to know. I just knew it worked a bit different than traditional insurance so I wasn't sure. And these "studies" are generally used as a way to bash politicians on the head and can easily be manipulated.

    My guess as to the reason is likely that a combination of lower health standards overall (causing higher premiums) with lower income levels. Shouldn't really be a shock I suppose.

    We also are a leader in uninsured drives for similar reasons.

  15. #140

    Default Re: Governor Stitt - Surprising Start

    Quote Originally Posted by chuck5815 View Post
    This is a bit different IMO. The Indian Casinos can't pick up and move their business/investment to another state like Oil and Gas Producers have been doing for the last year. Oklahoma has lost 50% of its rigs on a year-over-year basis. A lot of that capital is being allocated to the Permian / Bakken / etc. instead of being invested in Oklahoma plays. Keeping the GPT artificially low was meant to incentivize investment in the State.
    The price of oil and gas is lower, so production is slowed. It has nothing to do with taxes. Other states have done the research and come back with the conclusion that Oklahoma's lowest GPT rates have done nothing to encourage production here.

    https://okpolicy.org/reality-check-r...t-hurt-economy

  16. #141

    Default Re: Governor Stitt - Surprising Start

    So do the contracts actually auto-renew or not? I haven't been able to find anything that said anything other than opinion (which admittedly may be the best I get).

  17. #142

    Default Re: Governor Stitt - Surprising Start

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric View Post
    So do the contracts actually auto-renew or not? I haven't been able to find anything that said anything other than opinion (which admittedly may be the best I get).
    Best opinion I've seen so far is from Rep. Tom Cole.

  18. #143

    Default Re: Governor Stitt - Surprising Start

    Quote Originally Posted by The Shadow View Post
    Best opinion I've seen so far is from Rep. Tom Cole.
    In the paper Cole literally says "But if they can't come to an agreement, does it automatically renew for 15 years? I'm not a lawyer. I don't know that. And that's the real sticking point right now."

    He also says what the state receives is seems to be in line, another fact I haven't bothered to confirm honestly. I really don't know how "in line" we are. But I do know that the gaming racket is not in the same bargaining position as most other industries that can just leave the state. That's not really an option here. We aren't trying to entice more gambling businesses.

  19. #144

    Default Re: Governor Stitt - Surprising Start

    FWIW:

    Public records: Osage, Comanche tribes cited 2019 expiration in seeking new gaming compact negotiations with previous governor @ Tulsa World

    Pull quote:
    In their letters, the tribal leaders said current gaming compacts expire at the end of 2019, which is a different position than they have taken in an ongoing dispute with current Gov. Kevin Stitt.

  20. #145

    Default Re: Governor Stitt - Surprising Start

    Interesting hire to run the CLO.

    If guy doesn't even meet the minimum educational requirement for the job, how the hell did he get an interview?

  21. #146

    Default Re: Governor Stitt - Surprising Start

    It's not what you know...

  22. #147

    Default Re: Governor Stitt - Surprising Start

    [QUOTE=The Shadow;1090294]Interesting hire to run the CLO.

    i really wish we had better reporters in this state both articles i read said the CLO "SHOULD" have an advanced degree which would NOT require him to have one

    when in fact the Statute that was passed says that the CLO "SHALL" have one which makes in a requirement

  23. #148

    Default Re: Governor Stitt - Surprising Start

    In fairness, it's been a policy for less than a decade. We have had plenty serve this role without advanced degrees before him, and in my opinion, it's at least up for debate as to whether we should in the future. I certainly wouldn't write off a candidate due solely to this one missed check box.

    That all being said, nothing above was intended to validate the credibility of Vawter. Frankly, I just don't know enough to say one way or another.

  24. #149

    Default Re: Governor Stitt - Surprising Start

    Vawter's wife is from South Tulsa. That might have something to do with it.

  25. Default Re: Governor Stitt - Surprising Start

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric View Post
    In fairness, it's been a policy for less than a decade. We have had plenty serve this role without advanced degrees before him, and in my opinion, it's at least up for debate as to whether we should in the future. I certainly wouldn't write off a candidate due solely to this one missed check box.

    That all being said, nothing above was intended to validate the credibility of Vawter. Frankly, I just don't know enough to say one way or another.
    Brandt is a good guy. I think heíll do a good job with it. Running that department isnít rocket science.

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