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  1. #151

    Default Re: Trumps Accomplishments

    Quote Originally Posted by Swake View Post
    Nominally correct, but that doesn't take into account inflation or the annual increase in population causing a natural expansion in revenue. The actual amount of tax as a percentage of revenue as a share of the economy decreased by 9.1 percent from 2017 to 2018.

    http://www.crfb.org/blogs/no-tax-rev...sen-not-really
    In other words, it doesn't. In case not all of you have a swake BS detector. The only way the tax cut adds to the deficit (according to the CBO mind you), is it expires. Let that sink in when you sling that talking point around for the one millionth time.

  2. #152

    Default Re: Trumps Accomplishments

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric View Post
    In other words, it doesn't. In case not all of you have a swake BS detector. The only way the tax cut adds to the deficit (according to the CBO mind you), is it expires. Let that sink in when you sling that talking point around for the one millionth time.
    That's not what the CBO says at all. Fake News son, that's Fake News.

  3. Default Re: Trumps Accomplishments

    Quote Originally Posted by OKC Guy View Post
    82 percent of independents approve of the president's SOTU speech last night. This is the segment of the population that will determine whether we continue as a free republic, or go commie socialist
    Well hell, I approved of a lot of his speech too and I really dislike the guy. It's easy for a serial liar to give a nice speech when not a word was written by him...
    The truth is never embarrassed by honest inquiry.

  4. #154

    Default Re: Trumps Accomplishments

    Quote Originally Posted by Swake View Post
    That's not what the CBO says at all. Fake News son, that's Fake News.
    Should read it. Reuters and such try to tie the increases in deficit to tax cuts (because that's what they do), but the CBO took into account several things, not just the tax cut. The only negative impact the tax cut has is that it expires. PLEASE read it.

  5. #155

    Default Re: Trumps Accomplishments

    Quote Originally Posted by Dustin View Post
    Well hell, I approved of a lot of his speech too and I really dislike the guy. It's easy for a serial liar to give a nice speech when not a word was written by him...
    I honestly can't remember his first one, but apparently the wrap on him was that he wouldn't do written speeches, he just like to go out and "bull ****" for lack of a better term. Obviously he has a knack for it.

  6. #156

    Default Re: Trumps Accomplishments

    https://www.cbo.gov/publication/53787

    The CBO credited the tax act with an estimated increase in receipts. Along with pretty much every other economic indicator (including GDP ironically for you).

    The CBO estimates include 4 years assuming it is not renewed, which I suppose could happen. Would be stupid, but hey, there are Democrats out there too.

  7. #157

    Default Re: Trumps Accomplishments

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric View Post
    https://www.cbo.gov/publication/53787

    The CBO credited the tax act with an estimated increase in receipts. Along with pretty much every other economic indicator (including GDP ironically for you).

    The CBO estimates include 4 years assuming it is not renewed, which I suppose could happen. Would be stupid, but hey, there are Democrats out there too.
    From the CBO:
    What Are the Act’s Projected Budgetary Effects?
    To construct its baseline budget projections, CBO incorporated the effects of the tax act, taking into account economic feedback—that is, the ways in which the act is likely to affect the economy and in turn affect the budget. Doing so raised the 11-year projection of the cumulative primary deficit (that is, the deficit excluding the costs of servicing the debt) by $1.3 trillion and raised projected debt-service costs by roughly $600 billion. The act therefore increases the total projected deficit over the 2018–2028 period by about $1.9 trillion.

    Before taking economic feedback into account, CBO estimated that the tax act would increase the primary deficit by $1.8 trillion and debt-service costs by roughly $450 billion. The feedback is estimated to lower the cumulative primary deficit by about $550 billion, mostly because the act is projected to increase taxable income and thus push tax revenues up. And that feedback raises projected debt-service costs, because even though the reduction in primary deficits means that less borrowing is necessary, the act is expected to result in higher interest rates on debt, which are projected to more than offset the effects on debt-service costs of the smaller debt. On net, economic feedback from the act raises debt-service costs in CBO’s projections by about $100 billion.
    So the 2017 Tax Act will increase the deficit by $1.9 Trillion through 2028? Even after you add it all the positive benefits? That sounds great.

    BUT, those numbers are only true of the middle class tax cuts are allowed to expire in 2025. If they are extended, the numbers are much worse.

    https://www.cbo.gov/publication/53787

  8. #158

    Default Re: Trumps Accomplishments

    The CBO said Obamacare would lower health care costs to everyone. The CBO (generally) uses the best information they can when trying to forecast what will happen but trying to forecast what will happen by 2028 is like trying to forecast where tornado's will hit in 2028.

    No one predicted the economy would boom the way it has or that unemployment rates would be near all time lows and more people would be employed today, including minorities, would be at all time highs. It took way too long but wage rates are rising, as they should in this environment, the minimum wage increases and vast numbers of employed people, the taxes they pay and the money they spend which is taxed for the most part should work into the deficit numbers. When people are working, they are NOT on unemployment compensation, they are not on Welfare, they are not on all the other various entitlement programs which add to deficits so it still has to be seen how the tax cuts will effect the deficit after a few years.

    The CBO puts things out but you certainly should not rely on it as fact. Its nothing more than a weather forecast.

  9. #159

    Default Re: Trumps Accomplishments

    Quote Originally Posted by Swake View Post
    From the CBO:


    So the 2017 Tax Act will increase the deficit by $1.9 Trillion through 2028? Even after you add it all the positive benefits? That sounds great.

    BUT, those numbers are only true of the middle class tax cuts are allowed to expire in 2025. If they are extended, the numbers are much worse.

    https://www.cbo.gov/publication/53787
    Read it all, they also took into account huge inflation of spending. Which is the problem. Which is what I have been trying to drill into your liberal logic drunken skull.

  10. #160

    Default Re: Trumps Accomplishments

    Quote Originally Posted by mugofbeer View Post
    The CBO said Obamacare would lower health care costs to everyone. The CBO (generally) uses the best information they can when trying to forecast what will happen but trying to forecast what will happen by 2028 is like trying to forecast where tornado's will hit in 2028.

    No one predicted the economy would boom the way it has or that unemployment rates would be near all time lows and more people would be employed today, including minorities, would be at all time highs. It took way too long but wage rates are rising, as they should in this environment, the minimum wage increases and vast numbers of employed people, the taxes they pay and the money they spend which is taxed for the most part should work into the deficit numbers. When people are working, they are NOT on unemployment compensation, they are not on Welfare, they are not on all the other various entitlement programs which add to deficits so it still has to be seen how the tax cuts will effect the deficit after a few years.

    The CBO puts things out but you certainly should not rely on it as fact. Its nothing more than a weather forecast.
    I'm willing to bet it will significantly worse unless something significant changes to healthcare, S.S. or military spending. The CBO assumes no recessions which seems highly unlikely.

    I didn't support the tax cuts, but at the end of the day, I wonder if it really matters and we just end up in the same place. An economy that's in recession takes a far greater chuck from government revenues then the tax cuts currently does and its hard to gauge the level of can kicking that these tax cuts achieve in keeping this super hot economy going a little longer.

    Companies were doing a record number of buybacks before the tax cuts were enacted(many doing while this while taking on debt). Corporate debt levels are at historically high levels right now. That's why there is a big freak-out every time the talk of raising rates comes up.

  11. Default Re: Trumps Accomplishments

    The Laugh’s On Us: How The Trump-Radical Republican Tax Cut Broke The Economy

    "The National Association for Business Economics found this month that the Trump-Radical Republican tax law has failed to increase business investment and activity.

    NABE president, Kevin Swift, who is chief economist for then American Chemistry Council, said that 84% of business economists it surveyed agreed that “one year after its passage the 2017 Tax Cuts and Jobs Act has not caused their firms to change hiring or investment plans.”"

    "Manufacturing activity has grown for 116 consecutive months, the last 23 of them under Trump, the Institute for Supply Management’s latest report showed.

    But institute reports also showed a sharp slowdown as 2018 ended despite the Trump-Radical Republican tax cut favors for business. In December, the institute’s Purchasing Managers Index (PMI) stood at 54.1, down sharply from 59.3 in November.

    Much more worrisome was an 11-point decline in the index for future orders, which fell in December from 62.1 to 51.1. That suggests economic growth will slow, perhaps even stall, later this year.

    Expect some contraction in consumer spending in the first half of this year as many prosperous Americans get hit with much bigger than expected income tax bills."

  12. #162

    Default Re: Trumps Accomplishments

    Quote Originally Posted by TheTravellers View Post
    The Laugh’s On Us: How The Trump-Radical Republican Tax Cut Broke The Economy

    "The National Association for Business Economics found this month that the Trump-Radical Republican tax law has failed to increase business investment and activity.

    NABE president, Kevin Swift, who is chief economist for then American Chemistry Council, said that 84% of business economists it surveyed agreed that “one year after its passage the 2017 Tax Cuts and Jobs Act has not caused their firms to change hiring or investment plans.”"

    "Manufacturing activity has grown for 116 consecutive months, the last 23 of them under Trump, the Institute for Supply Management’s latest report showed.

    But institute reports also showed a sharp slowdown as 2018 ended despite the Trump-Radical Republican tax cut favors for business. In December, the institute’s Purchasing Managers Index (PMI) stood at 54.1, down sharply from 59.3 in November.

    Much more worrisome was an 11-point decline in the index for future orders, which fell in December from 62.1 to 51.1. That suggests economic growth will slow, perhaps even stall, later this year.

    Expect some contraction in consumer spending in the first half of this year as many prosperous Americans get hit with much bigger than expected income tax bills."
    LOL. Yet another article provided by TheTravellers that provides conclusions of a recent NABE survey that bears little resemblance to what the NABE survey actually says. If it is of interest, go into the article and read what this idiot has to say. Then, go back and click on the title link "National Association of Business Economics."

    The authors conclusions and the report say quite different things. While growth is slowing, if you read the article, much of manufacturing growths slowdown is the inability to find skilled workers. This is indicative of a hot, strong economy that has basically reached full employment.

    Over and over again, the author makes assertions blaming things on the tax cut that are either delayed results of a tax cut or, as he puts it, corporate tax cuts made in previous years have always produced a (desired) growth period in an economy followed by a slowdown. His assertion is the slowdown is the result of tax cuts when, in fact, the economy always has periods of increased growth followed by a slowdown. That is an economics 101 growth cycle.

    While the economy has shown signs of slowing down, this was 1. Completely expected at some point - an economy the size of the US and the maturity of the US cant maintain a 4% growth rate. Again, economics 101. 2. It's more because of a slowing worldwide economy led by China and caused by the tariffs. Not the tax cuts. That's a whole different discussion. The US and China are about to hold a summit where at least some type of compromise will be made. China desires it as does the US. Once done, see the economies of both countries pick up again.

    The survey says most employers say the tax cuts haven't caused them to change their hiring or investment plans. The author tries to conclude this is because the tax plan failed.... Not in the least. The reason their plans haven't changed is due to the worldwide economic slowdown and an inability to find employees. Companies won't build new plant and equipment or hire employees if there isn't increasing demand for product or people to work in factories or offices.

    The survey says while most surveyed feel the economy and their sales and revenues are slowing, few see a recession. Somehow, as the title to this putrid piece of literary garbage states, a slowdown in the GROWTH RATE apparently now equates to an economy that is broken.

    A reminder: 304,000 new jobs last month (hardly a broken economy), unemployment rate at 4% (widely accepted by economists as the top end of full employment). More women and minorities employed than ever before. Wage growth was at 2.4% annualized, down from the record 4.8% annualized rate. This shows the wage growth trend is still up through the end of 2018 into the start of 2019 and likely reflects the gov't shutdown.

    All in all, this article is juvenile junk written at a high school level. No real analysis or educated conclusions were present.

    Anecdotally, l was told this weekend by a former colleague at my former employer there are 15,000 job openings they can't fill.

  13. #163

    Default Re: Trumps Accomplishments

    Orange Man Bad.

    All the verification you need right there.

  14. #164

    Default Re: Trumps Accomplishments

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric View Post
    Orange Man Bad.

    All the verification you need right there.
    That hardly seems like sound reasoning.
    Don't hassle me, I'm local.

  15. #165

    Default Re: Trumps Accomplishments

    President Donald Trump said Japanese Prime Minister Shinzo Abe nominated him for a Nobel Peace Prize in “the most beautiful five-page letter” while speaking in the White House Rose Garden Friday.

    Trump said his talks with North Korean dictator Kim Jong Un were the basis for Abe’s reported recommendation.

    “Where are we now? No missiles, no rockets, no nuclear testing,” Trump said. “We’ve learned a lot. But much more importantly than all of it — much more important, much, much more important than that, is we have a great relationship. I have a very good relationship with Kim Jong Un. I’ve done a good job.”

    https://truepundit.com/trump-says-ja...l-peace-prize/

  16. #166

    Default Re: Trumps Accomplishments

    Quote Originally Posted by OKC Guy View Post
    President Donald Trump said Japanese Prime Minister Shinzo Abe nominated him for a Nobel Peace Prize in “the most beautiful five-page letter” while speaking in the White House Rose Garden Friday.

    Trump said his talks with North Korean dictator Kim Jong Un were the basis for Abe’s reported recommendation.

    “Where are we now? No missiles, no rockets, no nuclear testing,” Trump said. “We’ve learned a lot. But much more importantly than all of it — much more important, much, much more important than that, is we have a great relationship. I have a very good relationship with Kim Jong Un. I’ve done a good job.”

    https://truepundit.com/trump-says-ja...l-peace-prize/
    and of course the President either was not informed, or didn't care, that this could actually cost him getting the Nobel Prize, because there is a 50 year embargo on publication of nominations...

  17. #167

    Default Re: Trumps Accomplishments

    Quote Originally Posted by OKC Guy View Post
    President Donald Trump said Japanese Prime Minister Shinzo Abe nominated him for a Nobel Peace Prize in “the most beautiful five-page letter” while speaking in the White House Rose Garden Friday.

    Trump said his talks with North Korean dictator Kim Jong Un were the basis for Abe’s reported recommendation.

    “Where are we now? No missiles, no rockets, no nuclear testing,” Trump said. “We’ve learned a lot. But much more importantly than all of it — much more important, much, much more important than that, is we have a great relationship. I have a very good relationship with Kim Jong Un. I’ve done a good job.”

    https://truepundit.com/trump-says-ja...l-peace-prize/
    Overall, we rate True Pundit not only Questionable, but also a far right conspiracy site that rarely publishes credible news. This is a far right conspiracy source that cannot be trusted for accurate news reporting.

    https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/true-pundit/

  18. Default Re: Trumps Accomplishments

    Quote Originally Posted by jedicurt View Post
    and of course the President either was not informed, or didn't care, that this could actually cost him getting the Nobel Prize, because there is a 50 year embargo on publication of nominations...
    Well, that's probably not the only thing that would cost him getting it, I don't know of anything he's done that would make the committee want to give it to him (and for background, I didn't and still don't agree that Obama deserved it back in 2009).

  19. #169

    Default Re: Trumps Accomplishments

    Quote Originally Posted by Swake View Post
    Overall, we rate True Pundit not only Questionable, but also a far right conspiracy site that rarely publishes credible news. This is a far right conspiracy source that cannot be trusted for accurate news reporting.

    https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/true-pundit/
    I think you are one of the posters who since cannot dispute facts derails topics with deflection.

  20. #170

    Default Re: Trumps Accomplishments

    Quote Originally Posted by OKC Guy View Post
    I think you are one of the posters who since cannot dispute facts derails topics with deflection.
    Stop posting links to garbage propaganda and conspiracy theory sites. They don't deal in "facts" so there's nothing to debate.

  21. #171

    Default Re: Trumps Accomplishments

    The president of Ukraine Friday strongly endorsed President Donald Trump’s leadership and the way he handles Russian President Vladimir Putin.

    “I think that this administration does an excellent, a great job. This is not an assumption,” Ukrainian President Petro Poroshenko said on Fox News’ “America’s Newsroom.” “I have a feeling that this U.S. administration clearly understands the possible danger of Putin.”

    Poroshenko spoke out against Putin’s hostilities toward his country and said Putin’s only goal was to re-establish the glory of the “Russian Empire.”

    “He wants to renew, to restore the Russian empire, the Soviet Union and he does not have any red line for reaching these results,” Poroshenko told co-host Bill Hemmer.

    Wednesday marked five years since a popular uprising that resulted in a massacre in which nearly 100 protesters died and many were wounded. The protesters were supporting a trade agreement with the European Union that pro-Moscow president Viktor Yanukovych refused to sign.

    Asked whether it is possible for President Trump to have a working relationship with Putin, “I think it’s possible to speak with Putin only with the position of strength” the Ukrainian leader told Hemmer, saying that sanctions and a strong global coalition were necessary.

    “With this situation I am confident that only strong U.S., the global leadership of the United States and the leadership of President Trump can keep the world safe.” Porochencko said.

    https://www.foxnews.com/world/presid...-handles-putin

  22. #172

    Default Re: Trumps Accomplishments

    well... looks like the second North Korea meeting ended with nothing happening... glad to see he is still the worlds best deal maker who can fix anything...

  23. #173

    Default Re: Trumps Accomplishments

    Quote Originally Posted by jedicurt View Post
    well... looks like the second North Korea meeting ended with nothing happening... glad to see he is still the worlds best deal maker who can fix anything...
    https://www.cnbc.com/2019/02/28/cong...ea-summit.html

  24. #174

    Default Re: Trumps Accomplishments

    of which they should... it was the right move... but he has said time and time again, that he can always get the best deals, and no one is a better negotiator than him... and so far, with two meetings... nothing except that we stopped training exercises that NK wanted us to stop


    i mean come on... not long ago we heard about how they loved each other and he got such a nice letter. guess the love is gone

  25. #175

    Default Re: Trumps Accomplishments

    Quote Originally Posted by jedicurt View Post
    of which they should... it was the right move... but he has said time and time again, that he can always get the best deals, and no one is a better negotiator than him... and so far, with two meetings... nothing except that we stopped training exercises that NK wanted us to stop


    i mean come on... not long ago we heard about how they loved each other and he got such a nice letter. guess the love is gone
    It’s a very good thing Trump left because he had already caved on way too much.

    He was giving away the farm with not requiring a complete accounting of nuclear material and refusing to say he was going to require “complete and verifiable” disarmament. Things Obama actually got in the “terrible” Iran deal.

    It was dumb to go into this meeting without a deal ready to sign but at this point, whatever. It’s almost like he has no idea what he is doing. Which he doesn’t.

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