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  1. #76

    Default Re: RFP south of arena

    Quote Originally Posted by chuck5815 View Post
    To be fair, most of them either (a) own oil and gas companies or (b) own considerable interests in oil and gas wells that flow many barrels per day. These folks have a STRONG vested interest in creating a city that favors the ICE powered automobile over almost any other consideration.

    And I think Exhibit A is the Street Car. It is more of a toy train than a legitimate form of public transportation, and that is because the powers that be have no real interest in fostering public transport.
    The same powers that be are pushing the regional transit district

    And the streetcar is the last mile route of that system.

  2. #77

    Default Re: RFP south of arena

    So if this parking for concerts is an arena issue, wouldnt this be an OKC and SMG problem and not something thats included in this plan? Why would Thunder and Hogan care about the one night a year when a few trucks need to park for a concert? Seems like the city should take care of that. And the new convention center wont now have room for several semis?

    I have the feeling this will become the new owner/VIP parking for all games and thats why its included.

    One more thing, we dont need to give them $1.5 million so we can have competing orb statues.

  3. #78

    Default Re: RFP south of arena

    So they want the city to give them this land plus $250,000. Pass.

  4. #79

    Default Re: RFP south of arena

    Since the Thunder want it, it will pass with flying colors. Doubt there will be a no in the room. Yay...

  5. #80

    Default Re: RFP south of arena

    Quote Originally Posted by onthestrip View Post
    So if this parking for concerts is an arena issue, wouldnt this be an OKC and SMG problem and not something thats included in this plan? Why would Thunder and Hogan care about the one night a year when a few trucks need to park for a concert? Seems like the city should take care of that. And the new convention center wont now have room for several semis?

    I have the feeling this will become the new owner/VIP parking for all games and thats why its included.

    One more thing, we dont need to give them $1.5 million so we can have competing orb statues.
    Seconded re the statues. Gonna look very weird catty corner from the Orb at Scissortail.

  6. Default Re: RFP south of arena

    Quote Originally Posted by BoulderSooner View Post
    The same powers that be are pushing the regional transit district

    And the streetcar is the last mile route of that system.
    Not exactly. The Streetcar was designed by committee with input from professional transit planners. Urban Pioneer can explain that process at length. As for the RTA: ACOG - the Association of Central Oklahoma Governments, the Metropolitan Planning Organization for this region in Oklahoma - is leading that push; soon the Regional Transit Authority of Central Oklahoma will be it's own separate organization. The board that runs RTACO is comprised of representatives selected from each member city.

  7. #82

    Default Re: RFP south of arena

    If we needed that parking lot to facilitate concerts and large shows, why didn't the city jump on the chance when it came into our possession?

    I get the strong feeling this is more to this.

  8. #83

    Default Re: RFP south of arena

    Although we have questions about the 70 space surface parking; the surface parking could eventually be replaced with a project. Don't know if we'll be able to savage the 947 spots for parking underneath the Cox cc once it's demolished.

    To give $1.5 million in TIF for a $10.5 million project (10% +) isn't too bad considering the 36% investment incentive ($85.4 million) we paid for the Omni not to mention a potential 865-space, $30-$40 million parking garage; yes these are two different projects.

    Upon reading above posts, what seems to be the glaring turn offs are the name 'Hogan' & surface parking.

  9. #84

    Default Re: RFP south of arena

    The idea that tours go to Tulsa instead of OKC because of surface parking is ridiculous, there is far more surface parking adjacent to Chesapeake Arena than the BOK. The BOK will close 3rd Street for big events, but there's no reason that streets can't be closed if needed in Oklahoma City. And you cannot begin to fit 16 trucks in 70 automobile parking spaces.

    One thing that helped get U2 to Tulsa, and other tours as well, is that Tulsa doesn't have a NBA or NHL team and the act can book a solid week or more in Tulsa leading up to the concert date. A number of tours, including U2, started in Tulsa and did dress rehearsals at the BOK. Roger Waters also did this, I think Fleetwood Mac did it, as well as others.

  10. #85

    Default Re: RFP south of arena

    Quote Originally Posted by Ross MacLochness View Post
    ^^^Because parking is like crack. How do you get off crack? You stop taking it. Unfortunately your body still craves crack as it has adapted itself to need it. It will really hurt for a while because your body needs crack to function properly but eventually your body re-adjusts and that insatiable need lessens and lessens until you don't need it any more. However, if you keep taking crack, you find that you need more and more of it until you eventually die.
    That is a ridiculous analogy and though I understand what it alludes to, it’s not a good one. So what is your proposal? To stop building parking entirely downtown? Or you want to slowly “ween” people off it to force them into a lifestyle they may not want to live or suffer the consequences of lack of parking downtown.

  11. #86

    Default Re: RFP south of arena

    Oh, and Tulsa does get more concerts.

    The BOK ranked 47th in the world with 382,205 concert tickets sold in 2018. Chesapeake Arena ranked 97th with 185,682 tickets sold. Less than half as many.

    https://www.pollstar.com/Chart/2018/...Venues_702.pdf

  12. #87

    Default Re: RFP south of arena

    Quote Originally Posted by Swake View Post
    The idea that tours go to Tulsa instead of OKC because of surface parking is ridiculous, there is far more surface parking adjacent to Chesapeake Arena than the BOK. The BOK will close 3rd Street for big events, but there's no reason that streets can't be closed if needed in Oklahoma City. And you cannot begin to fit 16 trucks in 70 automobile parking spaces.

    One thing that helped get U2 to Tulsa, and other tours as well, is that Tulsa doesn't have a NBA or NHL team and the act can book a solid week or more in Tulsa leading up to the concert date. A number of tours, including U2, started in Tulsa and did dress rehearsals at the BOK. Roger Waters also did this, I think Fleetwood Mac did it, as well as others.
    Good point.

    I remember prior to OKC obtaining an NBA franchise, The Peake (Ford Center) received similar reviews as the BOK now gets: https://newsok.com/article/1938057/f...-ticket-sales?

    Tulsa is strategically located to serve both OKC-TUL for concerts; IMO they have more money available to spend on entertainment.

  13. #88

    Default Re: RFP south of arena

    If the lack of parking for trucks is really the reason we are passed over by a handful of events a year, is the only answer really 70 dedicated parking spots for the 360 days a year that trucks wouldn’t use that space?

    Or could you have a commons there, a multi-use public space that can hold food trucks, artists, pop-up shops, small concerts, public events, all with an easy access to the road so that for 5-10 days a year it can be closed off to public events and function as a parking slot for semi-trucks and tour busses?

  14. #89

    Default Re: RFP south of arena

    Please also remember SMG has done terrible job with the Peake. Supposedly, the Thunder and city communicated the need for more production prior to awarding them a contract extension and including the new convention center in the deal. They have totally shaken up the management team at the Peake since last fall and the results are starting to show. Look at the shows already announced this year. Lots of activity. I also don’t recall seeing a lot of advertising outside the arena. Like the banners on the Cox promoting Pink and Grande’. The notion that the NBA schedule prevents us from competing for shows is BS. The gross mis management by SMG is he reason and there continued deference to the BOK. Also, OKC has proven to be a dynamic music market that supports shows.

  15. #90

    Default Re: RFP south of arena

    More money for entertainment? We have 300k more people in our MSA. That is BS. 40% of BOK ticket sales come from outside Tulsa.

  16. #91

    Default Re: RFP south of arena

    Or you want to slowly “ween” people off it to force them into a lifestyle they may not want to live or suffer the consequences of lack of parking downtown.
    You are right. lets abandon good urban principals and continue to destroy the fabric of our core so its slightly easier for someone from Edmond to park for a Thunder game.

  17. #92

    Default Re: RFP south of arena

    For those advocating for surface parking here. My short answer is simply that urban areas should follow urban design principles. In an area like this, surface parking is not the highest and best use. There is already too much surface parking and an overabundance of parking garages in the vicinity so more parking isn't necessary. There is actually too much of it. Moreover, OKC just invested a massive amount in a streetcar that can allow you to park in a variety of places and still get dropped off right at the arena. I have gone to hundreds of Thunder games, always park in a free spot, and walk to the game. Everyone doesn't have to live in the urban core, but if you want to visit it, you can't expect it to be like the suburbs where you park in front of every place you go. And, there is no way this concert excuse has much to it as I can't imagine these acts supposedly pass up venues around the country because they don't have a semi-truck parking spots next the arena.

  18. #93

    Default Re: RFP south of arena

    What kind of marketing best works for the BOK?
    That’s the third prong to our success -- besides ticket sales and hospitality. We’ve worked very hard to outline a large geographic area of fans who travel from Northwest Arkansas, Kansas and Missouri. Our data shows that 41 percent of our ticket buyers come from outside of the Tulsa area for shows. That’s 800,000 visitors a year and 13,000 [hotel] rooms within a 15-minute drive of the arena.

  19. #94

    Default Re: RFP south of arena

    What if the parking lot wasn't the final destination, and say a year later a 5 or 6 story office building were built? Would that be a better use for the corner?

  20. Default Re: RFP south of arena

    Personally, I like it. I like the basketball and hand. I like the theme. The parking I understand the dislike, but could see where the court side season ticket holders could possibly end up there.

  21. Default Re: RFP south of arena

    This is a piece of crap project - TIF, Hogan, parking, underwhelming building design, hitting all the low points of how to build in OKC all at once, congrats. So who can we voice our disapproval to? Email addresses, Facebook pages, phone numbers, etc.?

  22. #97

    Default Re: RFP south of arena

    Quote Originally Posted by GoGators View Post
    You are right. lets abandon good urban principals and continue to destroy the fabric of our core so its slightly easier for someone from Edmond to park for a Thunder game.
    How about we think realistically and not ideally. You can have good urban principles and parking. Personal transportation is the future. Not mass transit. People need a place to park. This isn’t rocket science. This parking lot can be converted to structured or even a ramp to subterranean parking in the future. There’s nothing there. This isn’t a bad project.

  23. #98

    Default Re: RFP south of arena

    I think surface parking means something can be done with that space in the future more easily. I'm OK with that.

    Seems to me that the TIF money might be available and they are asking for it. I don't see what is wrong with that. That is how people get money/make money/keep money. If I can get a fully legal deduction on my tax return, am I wrong to ask for it just because I have more money than most people (not me, asking for a friend)?

  24. #99

    Default Re: RFP south of arena

    Quote Originally Posted by GoGators View Post
    You are right. lets abandon good urban principals and continue to destroy the fabric of our core so its slightly easier for someone from Edmond to park for a Thunder game.
    I have a different opinion on parking lot complaints. It seems we want to be other cities and anything that does’t mimic them is declared anti city or urban failure.

    I like our city and its ok to be different. I don’t want to be another cloned city I want to be OKC. We are so spread out and rely on cars to get everywhere. That does not make us a bad city except for those who want to change us into being just another large city. I don’t get all this complaining about parking lots at all. If you like other cities then move there.

    The other point is not looking at the now but going forward. Its likely OMNI will protect their parking so no promises of using it especially game or event nights. Cox will be gone with its parking. The new park will need places for visitors to park too. And if we do end up with Soccer/stadium it won’t be too far. The area will grow out and parking will be a premium. Other than charging for Thunder games thats only 41+ nights a year. This will be good alt parking for other big downtown events. I think once park is done and surrounding buildings built out this parking will look like a smart advance planning.

    I know some hate the thought of Thunder making money but if one looks at the residual value Thunder have added to growth of our city its enormous. Thunder have added more positive growth value than any other entity we’ve given TIF or other monies too. And we are all gonna complain about 74 parking spots lol.

  25. #100

    Default Re: RFP south of arena

    Do we know if Larry Nichols recused himself from the decision?

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