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  1. #76

    Default Re: Good things happening in the political world

    You said it not me.

    And what I said was not even directed exclusively at women. But thanks for sticking your foot in your mouth.

  2. #77

    Default Re: Good things happening in the political world

    Regardless of how you feel about the moraliity of offering oral contraceptives, hopefully there isn't a hobby lobby worker having unprotected sex because they think they can't afford contraceptives.

    https://www.walmart.com/cp/1078664

    9 dollars is cheaper than condoms in some cases and a whole lot cheaper than a morning after pill which you would hope would actually be used in emergency situations once or twice per year.

  3. Default Re: Good things happening in the political world

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric View Post
    Fair enough, but someone is programming the computers. What are the determining factors?
    No idea and I'm not interested enough in the mechanics of it to delve deeper, I'm not a gerrymanderer, google would probably know, though.

  4. #79

    Default Re: Good things happening in the political world

    I believe that the amount of folks on the GOP who flat out oppose birth control completely is the minority. I do know certain off label uses and methods are opposed. Even Hobby Lobby, an extremely religious privately held corporation, only opposed paying for 3 our of 12 potential birth control options (they're self insured). I know my BCBS doesn't cover all potential medications. Is it only birth control which is so sacred that private companies must be forced to cover every single available option? Do we absolve them of all liability in that case?

    Now, the attacks on planned parenthood do hurt access to BC, and I think they should stop. It would help if PP didn't have a political/lobbying arm. I think, from a clinical standpoint, Planned Parenthood is a good organization that serves a valuable service.

  5. #80

    Default Re: Good things happening in the political world

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric View Post
    So in essence, the limit access to BC by limiting discounts that people get with the health care coverage plans. You do understand that an insurance company not paying for something doesn't actually stop the patient from paying for something.

    I honestly would hope that Plan B should not be sold OTC, similar to Pseudoephedrine or something. This may surprise you but "The Pill" is also not available over the counter. Yet I don't hear people clamoring on about how doctors are limiting women's rights to BC. And Plan B has significantly more hormones than a standard daily pill.

    I'm not familiar with the Colorado thing, so I'll refrain from commenting on that one for now.
    But why single out BC from plans? GOP hasnt singled out Viagra or any other meds from plans. You do realize the pill is used by women for actual health reasons and not just to not get pregnant, dont you? To stay regular, reduce cramps, reduce bleeding, to help keep ovarian cysts in check, reduce acne. Its weird republicans are cool with taking the pill off health plans because they have everything to do with health.
    Yes, I know the pill isnt available OTC. And Ill take the FDC's word on whats safe to be sold OTC rather than Eric from OKCtalk.

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric View Post
    Abstinence is not just a "solid method of birth control". It is a "method" that works 100% of the time and protects women (and men) from the myriad of other problems and diseases swirling around because of the apparent lack of respect of people's bodies.

    And again, no where did I suggest we ban non-abortion birth control. Just stating a fact that there are even better options than that, for more reasons than not just getting pregnant.
    You can live in fantasy land where if you have enough hope, you can stop the human race's sex drive. Or you can live in the real world and give people the tools and knowledge to limit the problems that come from unwanted pregnancies. One of those being more people on entitlements and taking more of your tax dollars.

  6. #81

    Default Re: Good things happening in the political world

    Quote Originally Posted by onthestrip View Post
    But why single out BC from plans?
    Good questions. Insurance companies get to choose what medications they cover under their prescription plans, and to what extent they cover them. Why does BC get special status? There are tons of lifesaving medications that certain companies won't cover or cover at an amount to make them unaffordable (my inhaler costs me $90 a month alone - don't even get me started on my epipen).

  7. #82

    Default Re: Good things happening in the political world

    Quote Originally Posted by onthestrip View Post
    But why single out BC from plans? GOP hasnt singled out Viagra or any other meds from plans. You do realize the pill is used by women for actual health reasons and not just to not get pregnant, dont you? To stay regular, reduce cramps, reduce bleeding, to help keep ovarian cysts in check, reduce acne. Its weird republicans are cool with taking the pill off health plans because they have everything to do with health.
    Yes, I know the pill isnt available OTC. And Ill take the FDC's word on whats safe to be sold OTC rather than Eric from OKCtalk.



    You can live in fantasy land where if you have enough hope, you can stop the human race's sex drive. Or you can live in the real world and give people the tools and knowledge to limit the problems that come from unwanted pregnancies. One of those being more people on entitlements and taking more of your tax dollars.
    I do live in the real world which is why I don't through a hissy fit over HC plans limiting coverage on certain things, because that's what HC plans do for a living. They limit exposure. And like jerrywall mentioned, Hobby Lobby is a self funded plan, ie Hobby Lobby takes the hit on all claims, not BCBS or whomever. Are we now going to say companies like Hobby Lobby that go through the trouble and risk of insuring their own employees themselves (literally) have to do what we say they do? I guess I'm just not ready to cross that line yet, but you be my guest.

    There's been proof provided that limiting coverage of certain (few) types of contraceptive doesn't actually limit it's availability, or cost to the consumer for that matter. You would literally have to redefine what affordable is to not think that the pill is affordable to 90% of the population, probably 100% when you take those on the government dole into consideration. I mean we are talking a lunch out as the cost of limiting your exposure to having a child when you don't want to have a child. That's IT. No more than that. With OUT insurance.

    I also think it's rather repugnant that people stand here and say I deserve this I deserve that. It's like a threat. Give me my BC or I'm gonna pump out babies like there's no tomorrow. Sick.

    Now, it can be argued that it is financially sound to do so (for a government that so heavily subsidizes it's poor). However, in my mind, it is no moral imperative that BC be provided. It is a good just like any other healthcare good.

  8. #83

    Default Re: Good things happening in the political world

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric View Post
    wtf are you talking about. You know I'm not talking about that. I just made a comment about first date sex. Basically my point is that society in general right now has devalued (or doesn't understand) sex. This discussion about contraception is all a bi-product of this in my opinion. It's just my opinion, so feel free to disagree. You won't be wrong. There's no imperial evidence, so...
    it wasn't initially clear what you were talking about, but thanks for clarifying you were talking about having sex on the first date

  9. #84

    Default Re: Good things happening in the political world

    Quote Originally Posted by bradh View Post
    it wasn't initially clear what you were talking about, but thanks for clarifying you were talking about having sex on the first date
    No worries, just seemed out of left field.

    Like I said, it's just my opinion. And on that note, I've been wrong a lot of times before. But I am trying to raise a handful of kids right now, and respect of others I think is such a huge deal that in general is really lacking in our society, even in relation to this discussion about sexual respect, for others and yourself. It's scary honestly with the stories I hear about what young high school kids ARE doing. It sounds like a bad porno, but it's reality sadly.

  10. #85

    Default Re: Good things happening in the political world

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric View Post
    No worries, just seemed out of left field.

    Like I said, it's just my opinion. And on that note, I've been wrong a lot of times before. But I am trying to raise a handful of kids right now, and respect of others I think is such a huge deal that in general is really lacking in our society, even in relation to this discussion about sexual respect, for others and yourself. It's scary honestly with the stories I hear about what young high school kids ARE doing. It sounds like a bad porno, but it's reality sadly.
    Im sure there are scary stories, but Im no expert since I dont have kids. However, sex and drug use among teens is actually down in recent years. Its maybe just a case of those that are doing it are doing it in crazier or weirder ways, and the fact that everyone is connected and these stories tend to get out to a wider audience.

  11. #86

    Default Re: Good things happening in the political world

    Quote Originally Posted by onthestrip View Post
    Im sure there are scary stories, but Im no expert since I dont have kids. However, sex and drug use among teens is actually down in recent years. Its maybe just a case of those that are doing it are doing it in crazier or weirder ways, and the fact that everyone is connected and these stories tend to get out to a wider audience.
    But it just shows me that modesty has flown out the window. In "my day" boys maybe bragged about "getting with" (which usually meant making out with) girls, but by and large sex was only assumed, not literally viewed by all my friends.

  12. #87

    Default Re: Good things happening in the political world

    I totally agree. The human sex drive was barely existent until recently. I blame lawyers and obama.

    Thank goodness our president is going to make america great again by setting the good example for everybody. Kids will read about his cheating on all his wives, paying porn chicks to spank him and have orgies and realize that they have to be billionaires before they can do that. THey'll know that that's not going to happen so they'll never even think about sex. Right?

  13. #88

    Default Re: Good things happening in the political world

    Quote Originally Posted by Edmond_Outsider View Post
    I totally agree. The human sex drive was barely existent until recently. I blame lawyers and obama.

    Thank goodness our president is going to make america great again by setting the good example for everybody. Kids will read about his cheating on all his wives, paying porn chicks to spank him and have orgies and realize that they have to be billionaires before they can do that. THey'll know that that's not going to happen so they'll never even think about sex. Right?
    TDS is strong with this one.

  14. #89

    Default Re: Good things happening in the political world

    Deranged is the best insult available? If my comment is, in fact, insane, disordered, or disarranged, then it must also be untrue, right? However, it isn't. Trump is the most divorced president. Trump has had very public infidelity with all his wives. Trump appears to have a very special relationship with a badly named porn performer and paid her lots of money to keep quiet.

    Of course, truth and justice no longer seem like the american way for conservatives. Faith family and freedom, among the most empty slogans of all time, seem to have been replaced by Porn, prostitutes, and perversion.

    Regardless, it is also not insane to find the current predicament of conservatives amusing and worthy of comment. It is interesting how far "conservatives" have to bend to wrap their "traditional values" around trump. Love the sin, love the sinner. Spankings and orgies for everybody.

    With the president now setting the standards of behavior for conservatives, Ralph Shortey seems like an ideal.

    They make a lovely couple in an Adams family sort of way.

  15. #90

    Default Re: Good things happening in the political world

    So I guess getting divorced is now worse than cheating on your wife, sexually harrasing women, and basically raping an intern? Ok. Now we know.

  16. #91

    Default Re: Good things happening in the political world

    I made no moral distinctions. Just stated fact as they appear to me at this point. Maybe Trump and Daniels are just good friends. It is, again, amusing behavior for a president who draws most of his core support from family values "conservatives" abandon those presumed "values" I very clearly recall all the moral panic about Bill Clinton and it is really funny how those "morals" now appear to be only a reliable way to manipulate the so-called "values voter." I never believed conservatives really cared about family, faith, or freedom so it's interesting to see them abandon these values for political expediency.

    Ralph Shortey should probably be the next GOP presidential candidate given the current state of conservative "family values." Why not?

    Just for the record, how is a sex act between two clearly consenting adults "basically rape" or any other kind of rape?

    I guess conservatives are adopting Andrea Dworkin's "all sex is rape" rhetoric. I think a Shortey/zombie-Dworkin presidential ticket would be the ultimate conservative ticket.

    Personally, I think impulse control and fidelity are important values. I guess I'll never be a conservative.

  17. #92

    Default Re: Good things happening in the political world

    I don't know that Trump really positioned himself as a moral conservative. If anything, it may be good that someone pulled themselves from that group. Not that he'd ever get credit. He ran on an America first platform, not a god guns and Bibles platform.

  18. #93

    Default Re: Good things happening in the political world

    Just for the record, how is a sex act between two clearly consenting adults "basically rape" or any other kind of rape?
    Power differential. If you don't know this at your point in life I can't help you and that reflects more on you than anything.

  19. #94

    Default Re: Good things happening in the political world

    Quote Originally Posted by jerrywall View Post
    So I guess getting divorced
    Yep, check mark in the Trump column.

    is now worse than cheating on your wife,
    Another check mark in the Trump column.

    sexually harrasing women,
    Three for three...

    and basically raping an intern?
    http://www.newsweek.com/donald-trump...y-moore-713531

    I understand your outrage.

  20. #95

    Default Re: Good things happening in the political world

    So NOW we're electing priests, not Presidents. Like that precident.

    And allegations vs admissions?

  21. #96

    Default Re: Good things happening in the political world

    Quote Originally Posted by jerrywall View Post
    So NOW we're electing priests, not Presidents. Like that precident.

    And allegations vs admissions?
    Cite where he admitted to rape? That too is an allegation, however well founded it may or may not be.

  22. #97

    Default Re: Good things happening in the political world

    Power differentials define rape? That pretty well renders consent impossible. That seems consistent with the conservative morality police position but it now requires some extreme social engineering. Affirmitive action for relationships. Perhaps we need a new government regulatory agency that measures the social, economic, physical, and other differences in people to certify them as capable of consent.

    Interestingly, Ms. Lewinski disagrees with the pearl clutching, victorian blue nose definitions. I guess her perspective is irrelevant.
    “ I will always remain firm on this point: it was a consensual relationship.

  23. #98

    Default Re: Good things happening in the political world

    Quote Originally Posted by mkjeeves View Post
    Cite where he admitted to rape? That too is an allegation, however well founded it may or may not be.
    He admitted to having sex to a 21 year old intern while the president of the United States. The power differential is so nuts that the concept of consent doesn't exist and any CEO in the world would be fired for this. This is the type of stuff that Louis CK is in trouble for. He got permission and consent too. And he was just a famous comedien. Compare that power to being the president.

  24. #99

    Default Re: Good things happening in the political world

    Quote Originally Posted by Edmond_Outsider View Post
    Power differentials define rape? That pretty well renders consent impossible. That seems consistent with the conservative morality police position but it now requires some extreme social engineering. Affirmitive action for relationships. Perhaps we need a new government regulatory agency that measures the social, economic, physical, and other differences in people to certify them as capable of consent.

    Interestingly, Ms. Lewinski disagrees with the pearl clutching, victorian blue nose definitions. I guess her perspective is irrelevant.
    The #metoo movement would.love you. Most of those women gave consent too. Because of the power differential. How progressive.

  25. #100

    Default Re: Good things happening in the political world

    Wow! So Trump not only cheated on his wife, he raped Stormy! Come to think of it, he rapes every woman he has sex with because nobody is more powerful than Trump. He says and I totally believe him. When do we start the prosecution?

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