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  1. #226

    Default Re: OPUBCO / Oklahoman Business Practices

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Blue Sky View Post
    I knew this practice goes on at The Oklahoman regarding their recycling of content from this site and presenting it as their own. However, I think only now am I realizing how often this occurs. For what it's worth, Pete, since your move from LA to Oklahoma City, and seeing your hard work and commitment to OKCTalk, I have a whole new respect for you and see you as a trailblazer and a force for nothing but good in our fair city. The Oklahoman is embarrassing and I'm disappointed to read that the Journal Record is also resorting to the same practices.
    Thank you for saying this.

    Of course, I come at this from a somewhat fresh perspective and don't assume to know things without researching them. This lifting of information without credit always seemed very wrong to me but still, I have interviewed journalism ethics experts, the chair of the ethics board for the Society of Professional Journalists, and writers and editors from Reuters, Bloomberg and others. They all have said, unequivocally, that this practice without proper attribution is highly unethical and have forwarded handbooks for other publications that specifically spell out the proper way to provide credit and when it is to be done.


    There is another highly unethical journalistic approach used heavily by the Oklahoman that has a specific name in the industry: Access Journalism. Basically, it's becoming overly friendly with the subjects you report on and having them feed you information and entire stories with the obvious understanding things will be reported a certain way and no tough questions will be asked. (Otherwise, why feed this to a particular person or publication at all?) This is unethical on both sides, including the source of the story. The Alliance and staff from the city of OKC have even engaged in this practice which is wrong on many levels.

    When I first started to report, I would often get flat denials. Then I would point out I was holding their permit/plans/info in my hand. Then it would turn to, "Well, we aren't ready for that to be out." And I finally started telling people, "Look, I have the story. I'm just giving you the opportunity to comment. I'm not seeking your permission." The fact so many people were floored by that illustrates the way news sources are used to controlling what actually gets reported.

    Still, I will hold a story at times. But never due to a personal relationship or favor granting; more because there may be a delicate issue or some other intervening factor.

    I've also had several developers tell me, "I/We don't like OKCTalk because we can't control it." Which, of course, implies that they are used to controlling the media to some extent.


    Someone who is also new to OKC but in a different field summed all this up in a way that I greatly appreciated. He said that people say they want change and growth and progressiveness but that most people in power are very threatened by those things when they actually start to happen. And that new people with fresh approaches that don't conform to the old way represent a particular threat, and often the wagons get circled against you by the Old Guard.

    I think all that is very true and I've had to let go of negative comments and judgments. In the end, I have to do what I know to be right, without compromise. And regardless of ethics experts and industry standards, what is right is usually very obvious.

  2. Default Re: OPUBCO / Oklahoman Business Practices

    Quote Originally Posted by TheTravellers View Post
    That might be a legal issue, and not just an ethical one - doesn't copyright exist in photos by the photographer unless stated otherwise? May not know what I'm talking about, though. Not sure who on Twitter used it, could you get them to take it down or make them credit it to you, Pete?
    The abdomination known as the Digital Millenium Copyright Act, DMCA for short, does in fact provide remedy for such actions, in the form of a "takedown notice" which requires that the contested material be removed from public view until the offender proves ownership. It's seldom used, though, except to harass opponents...

  3. Default Re: OPUBCO / Oklahoman Business Practices

    "Access journalism" is as old as the printed page, and isn't by any means limited to OKC. When you have some spare time and need some amusement, Google for "Brann the Iconoclast" and read about the editor down in Waco during the 19th century who took on the Powers That Were.

    And if you can find anyone who really knew Walter M. Harrison, the late lamented Skipper, who was an OPubCo insider until he went to war and came back with a radically new moral compass, ask about him. There's a great biography hidden there if anyone cares to pursue it.

  4. Default Re: OPUBCO / Oklahoman Business Practices

    Quote Originally Posted by PaddyShack View Post
    So what other news outlets are there for local OK news that doesn't do this? Are any of them in print or only online?
    Well, there's the Oklahoma Gazette, and also Friday -- several have started, but few live long much less prosper.

  5. Default Re: OPUBCO / Oklahoman Business Practices

    The DO continues to change over pages to new format. They have changed Lackmeyers OKCCentral now and you can't find anything. Complete worthless page now as you have to just scroll and scroll and hope they posted it.

    Foes anyone know if yesterdays live chat transcript is posted anywhere and what the link is?

  6. #231

    Default Re: OPUBCO / Oklahoman Business Practices

    Quote Originally Posted by Jeepnokc View Post
    The DO continues to change over pages to new format. They have changed Lackmeyers OKCCentral now and you can't find anything. Complete worthless page now as you have to just scroll and scroll and hope they posted it.

    Foes anyone know if yesterdays live chat transcript is posted anywhere and what the link is?
    https://newsok.com/article/5606739/o...teve-lackmeyer
    Took forever to load the full page.

    That site is a mess.

  7. Default Re: OPUBCO / Oklahoman Business Practices

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Blue Sky View Post
    https://newsok.com/article/5606739/o...teve-lackmeyer
    Took forever to load the full page.

    That site is a mess.
    yep. thanks

  8. #233

    Default Re: OPUBCO / Oklahoman Business Practices


  9. #234

    Default Re: OPUBCO / Oklahoman Business Practices

    ^

    2 sections?

    News and sports?

  10. #235

    Default Re: OPUBCO / Oklahoman Business Practices

    Quote Originally Posted by Pete View Post

  11. #236

    Default Re: OPUBCO / Oklahoman Business Practices

    How do you cut the newspaper's content and increase subscriptions?

  12. #237

    Default Re: OPUBCO / Oklahoman Business Practices

    Quote Originally Posted by Pete View Post
    ^

    2 sections?

    News and sports?
    No no no. Sports and Coupons.

  13. #238

    Default Re: OPUBCO / Oklahoman Business Practices

    Quote Originally Posted by FighttheGoodFight View Post
    No no no. Sports and Coupons.
    Seriously, we only subscribe so my wife can get the coupons. I’ll read the paper on Sunday every once in a while

  14. #239

    Default Re: OPUBCO / Oklahoman Business Practices

    Quote Originally Posted by OkiePoke View Post
    How do you cut the newspaper's content and increase subscriptions?
    They will likely put more content behind a paywall.

    That has already increased in the last year or so.

  15. #240

    Default Re: OPUBCO / Oklahoman Business Practices

    Click image for larger version. 

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  16. #241

    Default Re: OPUBCO / Oklahoman Business Practices

    Quote Originally Posted by CloudDeckMedia View Post
    Click image for larger version. 

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    lulz. What a crock. We've asked people to "keep stories short and to the point?" - what the hell did they think they were doing previously?

  17. #242

    Default Re: OPUBCO / Oklahoman Business Practices

    ^

    They were commanded by their new owner to do these things, no doubt to keep printing costs down.

  18. Default Re: OPUBCO / Oklahoman Business Practices

    Does this mean.

    There are no more.

    Stories written by Jenni Carlson.

    In this format?

  19. #244

    Default Re: OPUBCO / Oklahoman Business Practices

    "Keep stories short and to the point?" That's so frustrating.

    I understand and appreciate effective editing, but "short" for the sake of "short" is ... just ... sad. There are a million places on the internet one can get paragraph-sized capsules of stories. Traditional print journalism works best when it is more "long form," when it can delve into context, quoting multiple sources etc.

    Every few weeks, I purchase a Sunday New York Times exactly so that I can read in-depth reporting that I don't get anywhere else. That's what newspapers, at their best, are most equipped to handle.

  20. #245

    Default Re: OPUBCO / Oklahoman Business Practices

    Quote Originally Posted by stlokc View Post
    "Keep stories short and to the point?" That's so frustrating.

    I understand and appreciate effective editing, but "short" for the sake of "short" is ... just ... sad. There are a million places on the internet one can get paragraph-sized capsules of stories. Traditional print journalism works best when it is more "long form," when it can delve into context, quoting multiple sources etc.

    Every few weeks, I purchase a Sunday New York Times exactly so that I can read in-depth reporting that I don't get anywhere else. That's what newspapers, at their best, are most equipped to handle.
    This.

  21. #246

    Default Re: OPUBCO / Oklahoman Business Practices

    So what happens if subscriptions drop, will The Oklahoman die or will they continue with syndicated news and what not?

  22. #247

    Default Re: OPUBCO / Oklahoman Business Practices

    They won't die, at least anytime soon.

    There was a recent report that with these changes they will be profitable to GateHouse who just bought them.

  23. #248

    Default Re: OPUBCO / Oklahoman Business Practices

    If you watch Fox, or CNN, or MSNBC, and pay attention, you'll notice that they all do a more-or-less adequate job of covering "events" - hurricanes, school shootings, even political rallies - although they all have their slant on that last one.

    But if you listen, the real meaty stuff, the "hard" stuff - like corruption, Bob Mueller, tax analyses, you know, things that require more than ten seconds of explanation - even on TV, they almost all start with "The New York Times is reporting..." Or "From the Washington Post today..." or "According to the Wall Street Journal..."

    Why is that?

    It's because print journalism doesn't have to be "sexy", it doesn't have to have quippy sound bites, it doesn't HAVE to be written to a third grade level (although it sometimes is). Even in this dramatically scaled back age, the really strong newspapers drive a lot of the coverage.

    The Oklahoman should be providing that role for Oklahoma City. I'm glad Pete has taken over the Gazette, I'm thrilled with the potential there but even he would say, I think, that OKC needs a very strong daily newspaper.

    I'm increasingly of the opinion that daily papers in the future, if they are to survive, are going to have to be non-profit entities.

  24. #249

    Default Re: OPUBCO / Oklahoman Business Practices

    The Gazette is committed to feature-length stories and to the print medium.

    In fact, we are growing.

    Lots more coming from us in the very near future. Very bullish on quality, unbiased journalism in OKC.

  25. #250

    Default Re: OPUBCO / Oklahoman Business Practices

    I'm very happy to read that, Pete!

    Quote Originally Posted by Pete View Post
    The Gazette is committed to feature-length stories and to the print medium.

    In fact, we are growing.

    Lots more coming from us in the very near future. Very bullish on quality, unbiased journalism in OKC.

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