Nordstrom's to Tulsa?

[bchris02]

I think Penn Square is as nice as any mall in a major city. I wasn't impressed with Woodland Hills last time I was there and think Penn Square is better. Tulsa's jewel is Utica Square. What Penn Square needs is an anchor buildout as well as the mall to terminate the leases of low-end stores that already have locations within a few blocks, like Payless and GameStop. I remember hearing something about this a few years ago when they did the last remodel. They didn't revamp the northwest entrance and the reason I heard is the possibility of a new anchor there. Not sure how true that is.

[Plutonic Panda]

I don't think that is true nor is a new mall likely to be built. Penn Square is fine size-wise, it could probably use another anchor buildout, change in tenant mix, and maybe a remodel. Quality-wise, it isn't any different than Woodland Hills, just smaller.

I agree with you on the new mall thing. I'd be surprised if one was announced within the next 5 even 10 years depending on how fast we grow. I also don't necessarily think one should be announced either.

[Swake]

I think Penn Square is as nice as any mall in a major city. I wasn't impressed with Woodland Hills last time I was there and think Penn Square is better. Tulsa's jewel is Utica Square. What Penn Square needs is an anchor buildout as well as the mall to terminate the leases of low-end stores that already have locations within a few blocks, like Payless and GameStop. I remember hearing something about this a few years ago when they did the last remodel. They didn't revamp the northwest entrance and the reason I heard is the possibility of a new anchor there. Not sure how true that is.

You need to stop comparing Pen Square and Woodland. They don't fill the same market need and aren't the same kind of mall. Woodland is a huge, suburban mid-scale mall like you see in any city, and it was built as a mall so it looks much like any other mall. The similar mall in OKC is Quail Springs, not Penn Square, you are comparing the wrong center to Penn. Woodland is a lot larger than QS, but they are in the same market niche.

Penn's comparative center in Tulsa is is Utica Square.

[Swake]

I agree with you on the new mall thing. I'd be surprised if one was announced within the next 5 even 10 years depending on how fast we grow. I also don't necessarily think one should be announced either.

When was the last time a new mall opened anywhere in the United States?

[Plutonic Panda]

When was the last time a new mall opened anywhere in the United States?

There are several u/c right now. I have seen many new ones recently proposed or started but the one right off of the top of my head is new one in Miami.

Mega-mall project in Northwest Miami-Dade wins state approval for land deal | Miami Herald

Now that article is a little old, but it gives you an idea of what the mall is. I didn't want to spend the time going to Skyscraper page, but I will do it later tonight.

This discussion about a new mall build is pointless and stupid for OKC as I have already said many times before. It is likely not happening in the 5-10 years and SHOULD NOT as I think it would fail and cause over-saturation which I think OKC is barely getting to the point where it can successfully support the 4 malls it has now in the metro. The only reason I brought it up was to point out the fact that I don't think Penn Square will ever foot the bill for an upscale mall.

I'm not trying to come off as snobby, but Penn Square is not that nice of a mall. Neither is Woodland Hills. I can't speak for The Promenade because I have never been there.

As for Woodland Hills to Penn Square, it is absolutely comparable to Penn Square because comparing Penn Square to Utica is invalid, at least in my opinion. I don't compare an open shopping center to an enclosed mall because I'm sure there are even retailers that prefer one to the other.

[bchris02]

Penn's comparative center in Tulsa is is Utica Square.

I disagree. Utica Square is a step above Penn Square. Penn Square is a notch above Woodland Hills and Quail Springs.

OKC's answer to Utica Sqaure will be the Glimcher development at Classen Curve once it finally happens.

[Thomas Vu]

Isn't utica square mostly outdoor? No entry way from one store to the other without going outside? I haven't been to Tulsa in years, mind you.

[Plutonic Panda]

Isn't utica square mostly outdoor? No entry way from one store to the other without going outside? I haven't been to Tulsa in years, mind you.

Unless I have never seen it, no. It's a shopping center. A very nice one.

[Swake]

Utica is not a mall. It's what all these lifestyle centers are trying to copy.

[Plutonic Panda]

Utica is not a mall. It's what all these lifestyle centers are trying to copy.

Copy? Utica Square was not the first lifestyle center in the U.S. and to call Utica Square a lifestyle center is a bit of a stretch.

[Zorba]

Isn't utica square mostly outdoor? No entry way from one store to the other without going outside? I haven't been to Tulsa in years, mind you.

Yes, Utica is all outdoors. It is a nice place, but as far as shopping goes, it is no where as good as some people on here would lead you to believe. It is great for walking around though.

[Zorba]

When was the last time a new mall opened anywhere in the United States?

There are two in DFW built in 2000 and 2001.

[Swake]

There are two in DFW built in 2000 and 2001.

That was 15 years ago. The only mall I am aware of that's being built is that ugly thing by the Meadowlands that's been "under construction" for more than a decade.

Any other enclosed malls actually under construction now or completed since the 2008 crash? Anywhere?

[Thomas Vu]

Unless I have never seen it, no. It's a shopping center. A very nice one.

Yes, Utica is all outdoors. It is a nice place, but as far as shopping goes, it is no where as good as some people on here would lead you to believe. It is great for walking around though.

Glad I'm not completely crazy.

[Swake]

And now Utica Square has now asked Petty's Fine Foods to leave, the store closes next month. The owner is considering a new location but nothing is planned yet. H&P, who owns Utica, wants to "repurpose" the building that Petty's and Miss Jackson's were in. Petty's has been in Utica Square since 1972.

I highly doubt this is actually for a Nordstroms, but the space is now way too large for H&M, which was the latest idea floating around. Fresh Market is rumored to want to build a new store at Utica Square, but on a current parking lot, not in this space.

[Plutonic Panda]

I hope it is a Nordstrom. That would be good for the area although I would prefer to see Nordstrom go to Woodland Hills if they were to enter the Tulsa market.

[Swake]

I hope it is a Nordstrom. That would be good for the area although I would prefer to see Nordstrom go to Woodland Hills if they were to enter the Tulsa market.

Sears can't last forever. We will see who take their space.

[soonerfan_in_okc]

I hope it is a Nordstrom. That would be good for the area although I would prefer to see Nordstrom go to Woodland Hills if they were to enter the Tulsa market.

Why would you prefer it in woodland hills?

[Plutonic Panda]

Why would you prefer it in woodland hills?

That malls needs a rehab and this would help the mall.

Some of these things are just certain taste for certain cities. I think Utica Square is doing pretty good. It could use some mid-high rise residential and perhaps some mass transit such as a street connection to downtown Tulsa, but I at the moment give it an H&M, Container Store, and World Market and it will continue to do well.

Woodland Hills seems to be struggling or getting close. A Nordstrom would really help Woodland Hills. If the old Sears space went into a Von Maur and a Nordstrom build was added to the mall, I would really enjoy seeing that.

I think Utica Square should stick to smaller stores. I would like to see an Louis Vuitton or Gucci store go there as opposed to Woodland Hills.

[Swake]

That malls needs a rehab and this would help the mall.

Some of these things are just certain taste for certain cities. I think Utica Square is doing pretty good. It could use some mid-high rise residential and perhaps some mass transit such as a street connection to downtown Tulsa, but I at the moment give it an H&M, Container Store, and World Market and it will continue to do well.

Woodland Hills seems to be struggling or getting close. A Nordstrom would really help Woodland Hills. If the old Sears space went into a Von Maur and a Nordstrom build was added to the mall, I would really enjoy seeing that.

I think Utica Square should stick to smaller stores. I would like to see an Louis Vuitton or Gucci store go there as opposed to Woodland Hills.

Woodland is undergoing a renovation right now and I don't think there's any empty space there at all.

[Plutonic Panda]

Woodland is undergoing a renovation right now and I don't think there's any empty space there at all.

Glad they are doing renovations however they need some new tenants.

[Zorba]

That malls needs a rehab and this would help the mall.

Some of these things are just certain taste for certain cities. I think Utica Square is doing pretty good. It could use some mid-high rise residential and perhaps some mass transit such as a street connection to downtown Tulsa, but I at the moment give it an H&M, Container Store, and World Market and it will continue to do well.

Woodland Hills seems to be struggling or getting close. A Nordstrom would really help Woodland Hills. If the old Sears space went into a Von Maur and a Nordstrom build was added to the mall, I would really enjoy seeing that.

I think Utica Square should stick to smaller stores. I would like to see an Louis Vuitton or Gucci store go there as opposed to Woodland Hills.

The one mid-high rise condo complex near Utica Square was faught tooth and nail by those that lived in the area. Although that was quite a while ago, I doubt they'd welcome it now.

I don't think Woodland needs the help, but I think Nordstrom's would do substantially better at Woodland than Utica Square. I think that Sears is on its last legs. I was there on Saturday and it didn't look like they had restocked at all since Christmas.

[Swake]

The building at Utica Square that housed Miss Jackson's and Petty's is slated for demolition to make way for a new building. Still no word on what will be in the new building.

Miss Jackson's, Petty's at Utica Square slated for demolition within 60 days - Tulsa World: Retail

[KayneMo]

I disagree. Utica Square is a step above Penn Square. Penn Square is a notch above Woodland Hills and Quail Springs.

OKC's answer to Utica Sqaure will be the Glimcher development at Classen Curve once it finally happens.

I feel like what Classen Curve and The Triangle is right now is the "answer". The Glimcher addition will make it much better.

[Eric]

Utica could really change it up by adding a building with residential. They could sell it in a heart beat and for a huge premium as well. It would really distinguish that area from anything else in the state.