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Thread: Oil prices

  1. #1551

    Default Re: Oil prices

    Quote Originally Posted by gopokes88 View Post
    We'll see. There's a huge amount of problems with the stack right now. The rig count has fallen by 50% in the past 12 months.

    You could buy all of chaparral for like $1700 an acre including debt right now. and no takers.
    I wasn't saying that someone will purchase Chaparral, I meant that a different oil and gas company will be purchasing the building.

  2. #1552

    Default Re: Oil prices

    Quote Originally Posted by chuck5815 View Post
    Selling the Corporate HQ (https://www.loopnet.com/Listing/701-...y-OK/16310080/), conducting layoffs, and (allegedly) telling many of the remaining employees to work from home.

    If this isn't a case study for economic diversification, I don't know what is. This City needs to attract more high-tech jobs.
    Thanks captain obvious. I don't think I've heard a single person ever argue against diversification.

    Anybody can identity a problem. Actually figuring out how to fix it is an entirely different conversation.

  3. #1553

    Default Re: Oil prices

    Quote Originally Posted by sooner88 View Post
    I wasn't saying that someone will purchase Chaparral, I meant that a different oil and gas company will be purchasing the building.
    There's a 0% chance that will happen.

    Private equity pulled all their money out of Oklahoma. There isn't another company O&G that could grow into the space, no one is cutting the checks to grow an O&G company right now.

    CHAP signed a long term lease on the building. If they merge (most likely) or get bought (for really cheap), they'll just shutter the doors and it will sit empty.

  4. #1554

    Default Re: Oil prices

    Quote Originally Posted by gopokes88 View Post
    There's a 0% chance that will happen.

    Private equity pulled all their money out of Oklahoma. There isn't another company O&G that could grow into the space no one is cutting the checks to grow an O&G company right now.

    CHAP signed a long term lease on the building. If they merge (most likely) or get bought (for really cheap), they'll just shutter the doors and it will sit empty.
    There is a 99% chance of this happening and I work closely with the company that is purchasing the building, who already has financing in place.

  5. Default Re: Oil prices

    Quote Originally Posted by chuck5815 View Post
    Selling the Corporate HQ (https://www.loopnet.com/Listing/701-...y-OK/16310080/), conducting layoffs, and (allegedly) telling many of the remaining employees to work from home.

    If this isn't a case study for economic diversification, I don't know what is. This City needs to attract more high-tech jobs.
    I know who is likely going to buy it and they will lease a few of the floors back to Chaparral. Will probably be announced in the next few weeks. There is plenty of space in the building and they are not leaving it unless something odd happens and an owner occupant (other than the one I know of) pops up and can fill the entire building.

  6. #1556

    Default Re: Oil prices

    Quote Originally Posted by sooner88 View Post
    There is a 99% chance of this happening and I work closely with the company that is purchasing the building, who already has financing in place.
    I know they sold it, but the CHAP guys I talked to said they turned around and signed the lease. They must have been wrong.

  7. Default Re: Oil prices

    Quote Originally Posted by sooner88 View Post
    There is a 99% chance of this happening and I work closely with the company that is purchasing the building, who already has financing in place.
    If it's who I think it is, it's actually multiple companies under one umbrella. They won't be able to fill all the empty space but will be able to take a good portion of one wing of the building. Chaparral would get the top 2 floors and the rest would be leaseable space.

  8. #1558

    Default Re: Oil prices

    Quote Originally Posted by gopokes88 View Post
    I know they sold it, but the CHAP guys I talked to said they turned around and signed the lease. They must have been wrong.
    It hasn't been sold yet, it is still owned by Chaparral. But you are correct, Chaparral would still lease space.

  9. #1559

    Default Re: Oil prices

    Quote Originally Posted by PhiAlpha View Post
    If it's who I think it is, it's actually multiple companies under one umbrella. They won't be able to fill all the empty space but will be able to take a good portion of one wing of the building. Chaparral would get the top 2 floors and the rest would be leaseable space.
    There are a few companies that would occupy space, but a majority of the employees are dedicated to a rapidly growing oil and gas group.

  10. #1560

    Default Re: Oil prices

    Quote Originally Posted by gopokes88 View Post
    Thanks captain obvious. I don't think I've heard a single person ever argue against diversification.

    Anybody can identity a problem. Actually figuring out how to fix it is an entirely different conversation.
    Sure, but I hear far too many folks claim that the city has diversified a significant amount of its economy away from oil and gas development. I just find that very hard to believe.

  11. #1561

    Default Re: Oil prices

    Quote Originally Posted by chuck5815 View Post
    Sure, but I hear far too many folks claim that the city has diversified a significant amount of its economy away from oil and gas development. I just find that very hard to believe.
    Well the data says it’s absolutely diversified.

    Oil prices crashed in 2014 then stabilized, but never recovered. employment at okc’s O&G companies has shrunk and keeps shrinking, and yet...

    Sales tax revenue in okc continues to grow, the city’s GDP growth slowed way down, never shrank, and is now back to growing at rapid rate.

    The only thing really struggling is office space which is largely because O&G’s have been forced to get very lean.

    So you’re wrong.

  12. #1562

    Default Re: Oil prices

    Quote Originally Posted by gopokes88 View Post
    Well the data says it’s absolutely diversified.

    Oil prices crashed in 2014 then stabilized, but never recovered. employment at okc’s O&G companies has shrunk and keeps shrinking, and yet...

    Sales tax revenue in okc continues to grow, the city’s GDP growth slowed way down, never shrank, and is now back to growing at rapid rate.

    The only thing really struggling is office space which is largely because O&G’s have been forced to get very lean.

    So you’re wrong.
    Lol, whatever you say, Coach.

  13. #1563

    Default Re: Oil prices

    Quote Originally Posted by chuck5815 View Post
    Lol, whatever you say, Coach.
    Page 21. We shrank one year in 2016 and rebounded despite the primary industry in the city experiencing the worst crash in a generation. Next tech bubble and Silicon Valley wont escape that easily.

    https://www.greateroklahomacity.com/...019_online.pdf

  14. #1564

    Default Re: Oil prices

    Quote Originally Posted by chuck5815 View Post
    Lol, whatever you say, Coach.
    Aerospace had become one of the top employers around. Boeing was named #1 employer in the state:

    https://www.boeing.com/features/2019...ers-06-20.page

    I only saw Haliburton in top 30 employers list from 2018 (Devon wqas 71st):

    https://okcommerce.gov/wp-content/up...oyers-List.pdf

  15. #1565

    Default Re: Oil prices

    Quote Originally Posted by mimino View Post
    Aerospace had become one of the top employers around. Boeing was named #1 employer in the state:

    https://www.boeing.com/features/2019...ers-06-20.page

    I only saw Haliburton in top 30 employers list from 2018 (Devon wqas 71st):

    https://okcommerce.gov/wp-content/up...oyers-List.pdf
    What I see on that list is a lot of tax consumers and not very many tax revenue producers, doesn't speak well for our economy. When most of your top 30 employers are government, Wal Mart, and gambling , that's not a good sign.

    How many of those employers on your list pay anything like a Gross Production Tax ?

    Or creates new value that did not exist before ?

    Tribal gaming is nothing but a transfer of value. It brings very little new money into the state. Probably, more money leaves the state , taken by the companies who actually manage the casinos. Patrons at casinos would spend that money somewhere else if they weren't gambling. It just takes from a variety of sectors and creates jobs in another sector.

    And ya really need to find a breakdown by industry. Oil and gas production is not labor intensive. Its drilling new wells that creates the jobs.

  16. #1566

    Default Re: Oil prices

    What evidence do you have that "probably more money leaves the state, taken by the companies who actually manage the casinos"?

    Probably? That's quite an assumption to be making.

  17. #1567

    Default Re: Oil prices

    Quote Originally Posted by The Shadow View Post
    What evidence do you have that "probably more money leaves the state, taken by the companies who actually manage the casinos"?

    Probably? That's quite an assumption to be making.
    None.

    Just common sense.

    Is Oklahoma a destination for out of state gamblers ? Maybe Durant or some other border towns.

    These Tribes hire management firms. And I'm sure they're getting a big hunk of the profits.

    But what if I'm wrong ? What diff does it make ? The point remains, that money spent for gambling, comes at the expense of other sectors of the state economy. We are not Las Vegas , where people travel here from all over to gamble.

    And all it takes is Texas legalizing gambling and the competition really heats up. Its not an industry that we should be hanging our hat on.

  18. #1568

    Default Re: Oil prices

    And btw, even Boeing's presence here, is dependent upon Fed Govt spending. Its new money for our state economy, but nationally its just more govt spending, that comes from tax money taken from somebody else.

    The same way gambling benefits local economies, but does little for the state as a whole.

  19. #1569

    Default Re: Oil prices

    So you saw Chickasaw Nation as #4 on that list (the only other gaming-related one was Muscogee Nation at the bottom of the list) and went on this posting tirade? Gamble much? lol You bring up GPT as some saving grace of the O&Gs. What was that % again? Again, the question was about diversification of our economy, not who pays how much in tax.

    Quote Originally Posted by RedDollar View Post
    And btw, even Boeing's presence here, is dependent upon Fed Govt spending. Its new money for our state economy, but nationally its just more govt spending, that comes from tax money taken from somebody else.

    The same way gambling benefits local economies, but does little for the state as a whole.
    You do realize Boeing has international work that's not dependent on our Govt spending, right?

    P.S. I have a feeling that arguing online is one of your hobbies.

  20. Default Re: Oil prices

    Quote Originally Posted by RedDollar View Post
    None.

    Just common sense.

    Is Oklahoma a destination for out of state gamblers ? Maybe Durant or some other border towns.

    These Tribes hire management firms. And I'm sure they're getting a big hunk of the profits.

    But what if I'm wrong ? What diff does it make ? The point remains, that money spent for gambling, comes at the expense of other sectors of the state economy. We are not Las Vegas , where people travel here from all over to gamble.

    And all it takes is Texas legalizing gambling and the competition really heats up. Its not an industry that we should be hanging our hat on.
    yes oklahoma is a huge destination for out of state gamblers .... the ones that come to the 2 largest (by far) casinos in the state

  21. #1571

    Default Re: Oil prices

    Quote Originally Posted by mimino View Post
    So you saw Chickasaw Nation as #4 on that list (the only other gaming-related one was Muscogee Nation at the bottom of the list) and went on this posting tirade? Gamble much? lol You bring up GPT as some saving grace of the O&Gs. What was that % again? Again, the question was about diversification of our economy, not who pays how much in tax.



    You do realize Boeing has international work that's not dependent on our Govt spending, right?

    P.S. I have a feeling that arguing online is one of your hobbies.
    Boeing in Oklahoma, is Dept of Defense spending.

  22. #1572

    Default Re: Oil prices

    Quote Originally Posted by RedDollar View Post
    And btw, even Boeing's presence here, is dependent upon Fed Govt spending. Its new money for our state economy, but nationally its just more govt spending, that comes from tax money taken from somebody else.

    The same way gambling benefits local economies, but does little for the state as a whole.
    Oh, I agree with that. I'm just curious what out-of-state company do you think is being paid to manage the Chickasaws tribal casinos? I would think as large as they are, they would be doing that themselves.

  23. #1573

    Default Re: Oil prices

    Quote Originally Posted by BoulderSooner View Post
    yes oklahoma is a huge destination for out of state gamblers .... the ones that come to the 2 largest (by far) casinos in the state
    Yeah, will proove it. hahaha, there's a lot of casinos in this state that are not built for Texans.

    And still, whenever Texas legalize gambling, and that day is coming , they have legislation to do that introduced in their state legislature every year, then Thackerville and Durant will become ghost towns.

    Sports betting is going to be legal nationally, probably sooner than later. Texas won't hold out.

  24. #1574

    Default Re: Oil prices

    Quote Originally Posted by The Shadow View Post
    Oh, I agree with that. I'm just curious what out-of-state company do you think is being paid to manage the Chickasaws tribal casinos? I would think as large as they are, they would be doing that themselves.
    Maybe so, but in the past I'd heard Harrah's as a company who was contracting with the Tribes. I've got no idea about the Chickasaw operation.

    But again, this is a small part of the point I was making. You're draggin me into the weeds. I may very well be wrong, but gambling is not something healthy for our economy. This same reasoning, is why the Texas legislature has not legalized gambling.

  25. #1575

    Default Re: Oil prices

    And btw, the demise of oil and gas , has been greatly exaggerated.

    Outside of some fantastic boom in construction of nuclear generation, this dream of an electric economy is just that , a dream.

    And it would take years and years to construct nuclear generation.

    As far as Oklahoma's oil and gas sector, I'd be far more concerned with depletion of existing reserves, than this move away from fossil fuels to combat climate change.

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