Something big coming?

[PWitty]

*Like* NWOKCGuy and Pete's posts. Well said.

[Teo9969]

If OKC does everything in the borders of NW 13th/Classen/River/I-235 correctly, and if we figure out adequate public transportation, we can compete with almost any Tier II city in the world.

[bombermwc]

You know, for every one of these "big" teaser things, we do actually get a few in0-fill projects, which actually excite me even more. You can't get a Devon Tower every other block, but if you can put one of those in and then get a few smaller projects (or even better, renovate something that's been sitting), then that's even better. There were a few exciting things that i really wish could have happened, like Cotton Exchange, but instead we get some crappy things like Centennial. But as much as i hate the way the Centennial is built, at least it's been able to be a successful mixed-use structure. We didn't get a 30 floor hotel, but we did at least get a few brick-faced hotels that are WAY better than what COULD have been put in (regardless of how much you might dislike them). So as unexciting as some things are, be thankful that they aren't 100% suburban stucco.

[Pete]

Over the last several years, Oklahoma has been experiencing positive migration from every single state, and that trend is accelerating.

As recently as five years ago, more people were moving to Texas (and a few other states) than moving to OK from them; but that trend has completely reversed and picking up strong steam in the other direction.


People in the U.S. are very mobile -- they are going to move. But stats show many more are moving to Oklahoma than away from it.

And as OKC is the biggest population center and the place that is growing much faster than anywhere else in the state, I'm sure if you could break down the numbers just for the city they wold show very, very strong moves in one direction.


As mentioned, this trend is accelerating. With the extremely low unemployment rate and very strong growth in jobs, you can bet in five years all these indicators will even be much more favorable.

[Plutonic Panda]

Over the last several years, Oklahoma has been experiencing positive migration from every single state, and that trend is accelerating.

As recently as five years ago, more people were moving to Texas (and a few other states) than moving to OK from them; but that trend has completely reversed and picking up strong steam in the other direction.


People in the U.S. are very mobile -- they are going to move. But stats show many more are moving to Oklahoma than away from it.

And as OKC is the biggest population center and the place that is growing much faster than anywhere else in the state, I'm sure if you could break down the numbers just for the city they wold show very, very strong moves in one direction.


As mentioned, this trend is accelerating. With the extremely low unemployment rate and very strong growth in jobs, you can bet in five years all these indicators will even be much more favorable.

+1

[Pete]

^

Actually, all that's already been proven to be completely false.

But I know you guys have no interest in facts, especially when they contradict what you prefer to believe.

[Bellaboo]

I'm an educated cheerleader and I still live here....with no plans to leave either, and I travel all over the world, a lot.

[Pete]

The streetcar will not only knit together a bunch of the districts through transportation, it will spur more development along it's path and thus create the needed bridges.

The districts are already growing together and the streetcar will be a huge catalyst.

[hoya]

There's been an enormous change in this city over the last 10 years. I'm not talking about development, I'm talking about the attitudes of the people here. When I was in high school (graduated in '96), I remember everyone complaining about this city. It seemed nobody liked it here or wanted to be here. When I moved back after law school in 2003, everyone asked me "why?" But today there's a great sense of community spirit here. There's a positive vibe in this town that I don't ever remember seeing before. To be sure, there are still cantankerous folks who like to complain all the time and who can't stand the place. But now they're actually being countered by people who are excited to live here and be here.

I am excited for what Oklahoma City is becoming. We have our faults, every city does. And I will criticize the way a lot of things are handled, and I will go on record as saying I think XYZ development should be denied, or changed, and I will complain about tearing down Stage Center and this is why we can't have nice things, etc. But it's because I can see the immense potential that OKC has and I'm very excited about how things are progressing here.

I had dinner with a coworker who grew up in L.A. and went to college in NYC. We went to Midtown. She raved about the Ambassador, talking about how the rooftop bar was "just like you would see in New York" and said how she loved living in Deep Deuce. Once these districts start linking up together, making a real walkable environment from Bricktown to Midtown, it will be incredible. Future stages of the streetcar that link downtown with 23rd street and the Paseo or with Capitol Hill will only improve that.

[zookeeper]

There's been an enormous change in this city over the last 10 years. I'm not talking about development, I'm talking about the attitudes of the people here. When I was in high school (graduated in '96), I remember everyone complaining about this city. It seemed nobody liked it here or wanted to be here. When I moved back after law school in 2003, everyone asked me "why?" But today there's a great sense of community spirit here. There's a positive vibe in this town that I don't ever remember seeing before. To be sure, there are still cantankerous folks who like to complain all the time and who can't stand the place. But now they're actually being countered by people who are excited to live here and be here.

I am excited for what Oklahoma City is becoming. We have our faults, every city does. And I will criticize the way a lot of things are handled, and I will go on record as saying I think XYZ development should be denied, or changed, and I will complain about tearing down Stage Center and this is why we can't have nice things, etc. But it's because I can see the immense potential that OKC has and I'm very excited about how things are progressing here.

I had dinner with a coworker who grew up in L.A. and went to college in NYC. We went to Midtown. She raved about the Ambassador, talking about how the rooftop bar was "just like you would see in New York" and said how she loved living in Deep Deuce. Once these districts start linking up together, making a real walkable environment from Bricktown to Midtown, it will be incredible. Future stages of the streetcar that link downtown with 23rd street and the Paseo or with Capitol Hill will only improve that.

There's no "like" button, but I had to say how much I liked this from hoyasooner. Very well said and I feel so much the same way. Thanks hoya!

[Tigerguy]

Geez, reading some of the posts, one would wonder why anybody would choose to live in a place that's not a large coastal city. Maybe they're masochists that love places where there's apparently nowhere to go or nothing to do?

Fact is, as has been said multiple times before, the city has come a long way in a fairly short amount of time. Is everything ideal? No. Is there much work to be done? Absolutely. Does that put everything on a scale from crapulent to disastrous until it is ideal? Certainly not. Improvements are going to take time. Change in mindset is going to take time. Everything's going to take time. There's going to be screw-ups, but what city doesn't screw things up? If we can't properly adjust ourselves to what we have (good and bad) and some of the realities of progress, then a move to somewhere more complete (whatever that is for you) might make sense. I only suggest this: while you're on your way in, don't talk to the people going in the opposite direction. I'd imagine their reasons for moving out to a smaller city are just as legitimate as yours are for moving in to a bigger city.

Also, I recommend that the title of this thread be changed to "What you don't like about OKC, Part II".

[NWOKCGuy]

Geez, reading some of the posts, one would wonder why anybody would choose to live in a place that's not a large coastal city. Maybe they're masochists that love places where there's apparently nowhere to go or nothing to do?

Fact is, as has been said multiple times before, the city has come a long way in a fairly short amount of time. Is everything ideal? No. Is there much work to be done? Absolutely. Does that put everything on a scale from crapulent to disastrous until it is ideal? Certainly not. Improvements are going to take time. Change in mindset is going to take time. Everything's going to take time. There's going to be screw-ups, but what city doesn't screw things up? If we can't properly adjust ourselves to what we have (good and bad) and some of the realities of progress, then a move to somewhere more complete (whatever that is for you) might make sense. I only suggest this: while you're on your way in, don't talk to the people going in the opposite direction. I'd imagine their reasons for moving out to a smaller city are just as legitimate as yours are for moving in to a bigger city.

Also, I recommend that the title of this thread be changed to "What you don't like about OKC, Part II".

Agreed. And since this isn't tied to a specific building or group of buildings, I really don't think it belongs in the Development section.

[okclee]

So the "Something Big Coming" thread is now taken a life of it's own. It's like the new Mystery Tower rumor title.

[Pete]

I've thought about what -- if anything -- is unique about Oklahoma City.

At the same time, I've long worried that the answer to that question is "nothing". That we are merely trying to do the same things other cities have already done (streetcar, urban districts, etc.) and generally done way better.

But I had a bit of an epiphany about a year ago and I have continued to analyze it, wanting to make sure that I was being at least somewhat objective. And I'm pleased to say the revelation has held up to scrutiny.


I believe -- truly believe -- that the thing that is truly unique about OKC is this: The citizens are incredibly enthusiastic and open to not only growth, but tremendous growth.

And I would add the City is unique in that it's infrastructure is very well positioned for explosive expansion.


Both these things are far more unusual than you may think. There are some in central Oklahoma who are worry about increased traffic and the like, but far less than in other cities I've visited.

And very, very few cities ever had the combination of great freeway and road systems already in place, tons of space to build everywhere, a booming economy AND almost everyone in town wanting more, more, more!!


These things are OKC's greatest assets, hands down. I'd say about 95% of the people that live there are incredibly excited and proud of what has happened thus far and at the same time very hungry for far bigger and better things.

[Just the facts]

I believe -- truly believe -- that the thing that is truly unique about OKC is this: The citizens are incredibly enthusiastic and open to not only growth, but tremendous growth.

I have had the same internal conversation Pete. Here in Jax our urban districts are 10X better than anything in OKC but on the 'momentum' front - OKC has a lot more steam behind it and when it passes Jax it is going to leave us in the dust quick, fast, and in a hurray. Jax will be standing around asking, "What the hell was that?"

[bchris02]

I have had the same internal conversation Pete. Here in Jax our urban districts are 10X better than anything in OKC but on the 'momentum' front - OKC has a lot more steam behind it and when it passes Jax it is going to leave us in the dust quick, fast, and in a hurray. Jax will be standing around asking, "What the hell was that?"

Jacksonville is quite often criticized for many of the same things OKC is criticized for. The two cities are pretty similar in population and both considered behind others in their tier. It surprises me they would be that far ahead of OKC. What are some neighborhoods that you would say fall into that category so I can look them up on Streetview?

[Just the facts]

Jacksonville is quite often criticized for many of the same things OKC is criticized for. The two cities are pretty similar in population and both considered behind others in their tier. It surprises me they would be that far ahead of OKC. What are some neighborhoods that you would say fall into that category so I can look them up on Streetview?

Avondale
Corner of St Johns Ave and Ingelside Ave.

Riverside
Kings Ave from Herschel St to College St.

5 Points
A large area with multiple midrise condos and apartments located around the intersection of Park St, Margaret St, and Lomax St.

Brooklyn
New neighborhood along Riverside Drive between I-95 and downtown. Check out 220 Riverside on multiple web sites.

Southbank
Corner of Riverplace Blvd and Gulf Life Dr.

Downtown Jax - do a streetview of Laura St starting at Duval St and working your way to Jax Landing (which is about to be torn down and replaced with a much larger mixed-use project)

San Marco
Just find Balis Park

San Marco North
San Marco Blvd from Nira St to Riviera St.

San Marco East
Hendricks Ave from the railroad tracks to Atlantic Blvd.

Jacksonville Beach
1st St from Beach Blvd to 6th Ave. Streetview doesn't do it justice becasue all those surface parking lots have been developed into housing, retail, hotels, bars, and restaurants.

Atlantic Beach
Atlantic Ave from 3rd St to the Ocean.

And finally, Betts would be mad if I didn't throw in Springfield. It is one of her haunts when she is in town.
Main St from 8th St to 6th St.

I drive Uber in all these places and they are packed with thousands of people. On Friday and Saturday nights don't even try to find a parking place (which is why I do Uber there). The problem with Jax is that these places are filling up quickly and there is no momentum to build new places, whereas OKCs historic districts are just now catching on and there is ample urban vacant land to build new walkable neighborhoods from scratch (the airpark for example).

[NWOKCGuy]

double post

[NWOKCGuy]

And very, very few cities ever had the combination of great freeway and road systems already in place, tons of space to build everywhere, a booming economy AND almost everyone in town wanting more, more, more!!

Don't let PluPan hear you say this.

[Plutonic Panda]

Don't let PluPan hear you say this.

Sir, I'm very aware that we have an nice established freeway system for a city of our size.

[NWOKCGuy]

Sir, I'm very aware that we have an nice established freeway system for a city of our size.

[Plutonic Panda]

our interchanges though, are a different story....

Perhaps I can be unrealistic at times about what we truly need, but something has to be done with out current interchanges because they are horribly outdated.

[josh]

I've thought about what -- if anything -- is unique about Oklahoma City.

At the same time, I've long worried that the answer to that question is "nothing". That we are merely trying to do the same things other cities have already done (streetcar, urban districts, etc.) and generally done way better.

But I had a bit of an epiphany about a year ago and I have continued to analyze it, wanting to make sure that I was being at least somewhat objective. And I'm pleased to say the revelation has held up to scrutiny.


I believe -- truly believe -- that the thing that is truly unique about OKC is this: The citizens are incredibly enthusiastic and open to not only growth, but tremendous growth.

And I would add the City is unique in that it's infrastructure is very well positioned for explosive expansion.


Both these things are far more unusual than you may think. There are some in central Oklahoma who are worry about increased traffic and the like, but far less than in other cities I've visited.

And very, very few cities ever had the combination of great freeway and road systems already in place, tons of space to build everywhere, a booming economy AND almost everyone in town wanting more, more, more!!


These things are OKC's greatest assets, hands down. I'd say about 95% of the people that live there are incredibly excited and proud of what has happened thus far and at the same time very hungry for far bigger and better things.

You could actually describe a few cities like that. But that wouldn't be the most unique thing about them though.

[bchris02]

You could actually describe a few cities like that. But that wouldn't be the most unique thing about them though.

San Antonio is definitely a unique city because of its history, the Riverwalk, etc. It has a unique vibe that you only find there.

Oklahoma City is a young city and lacks the historical legacy most of its peers have. It also lacks any kind of geographical, climate, or natural advantage. There is one thing OKC has that IS unique, and that's the Native American heritage. Unfortunately, the derplahomans in the state government refuse to capitalize on that and finish the Native American Museum and Cultural Center. That would be an attraction that is truly unique and would draw people from places like Dallas and Kansas City because nowhere else has anything like it. Shame on the state legislature!

[josh]

San Antonio is definitely a unique city because of its history, the Riverwalk, etc. It has a unique vibe that you only find there.

Oklahoma City is a young city and lacks the historical legacy most of its peers have. It also lacks any kind of geographical, climate, or natural advantage. There is one thing OKC has that IS unique, and that's the Native American heritage. Unfortunately, the derplahomans in the state government refuse to capitalize on that and finish the Native American Museum and Cultural Center. That would be an attraction that is truly unique and would draw people from places like Dallas and Kansas City because nowhere else has anything like it. Shame on the state legislature!

I really wasn't including san antonio in those cities (I had other cities in mind) but you could definitely make that argument we love growth and our freeway system is very comprehensive and there is tons of room to grow on the outskirts. However, as for the things you said, aside from the historical aspect, there is also the riverwalk as well as the hill country and the Hispanic and German heritage of the region that make San Antonio very unique.

But the native American history should be embraced.