Tinker AFB

[Oh GAWD the Smell!]

Just be careful about what you post and how specific. The Air Force takes their operation security (OPSEC) very seriously and wouldn't be thrilled about intimate details on the site. Sources and anonymous info is a different beast when it comes to national security (I'm sure you're well aware of all of this, just wanted to make sure it was in the open).

Pretty sure he was planning on using new sources, press releases, and Google Earth.

[Oh GAWD the Smell!]

Shucks, does that mean I can't post everything that Edward Snowden told me about?

[dmoor82]

Shucks, does that mean I can't post everything that Edward Snowden told me about?

A move to Moscow is in your future? Lol

[BrettM2]

Pretty sure he was planning on using new sources, press releases, and Google Earth.

It was more for people who might post what they know than Pete. I didn't think Pete would go rogue on us (but that would make this much more James Bond-ish).

[BrettM2]

Shucks, does that mean I can't post everything that Edward Snowden told me about?

Absolutely! Just don't do it from your cell phone so the NSA can't find you. (I'm starting to imagine them more as the old lady in Monsters, Inc than Orwellian: "Always watching...")

[ljbab728]

Air Force plans major construction at Tinker Air Force Base, reduction in AWACS | News OK

The U.S. Air Force plans to cut a quarter of the AWACS planes at Tinker Air Force Base, but station more air refueling tankers there and spend $111 million to build a maintenance depot space for the next generation of air refueling planes, according to the Air Force budget released Wednesday.

Oklahoma is one of only 10 states in which the Air Force is planning construction projects next year; Air Force budget documents state only the highest-priority projects were requested.

[Pete]

Just a little $111 million investment...

Wow, Tinker is an economic juggernaut.

[shawnw]

Just for future outlook, the next generation bomber (NGB) is supposed to be fielded by 2018. We'll see if that comes to pass. Regardless, Tinker will likely get the PDM (primary depot maintenance) work, and probably will be the location of the SPO (system program office), since the other bomber (B-1, B-2, B-52) PDMs and SPOs are at Tinker. That would likely also mean new engine workload. That said, at least one, if not more, of the other bomber platforms will be retired, but that will take some time so there will be overlap. I suspect Boeing will also be involved since they have the B-1 and B-52, which means possible future engineering jobs with the NGB.

[bombermwc]

I hope they get that rail yard. It would mean that the rail company would stop using it (cause Tinker would have no reason to). And hopefully they can strip out all those crappy crossing that make the road horrible and then tie up traffic while the train goes 2 mph.

[Plutonic Panda]

Reserve unit at Tinker Air Force Base would be inactive under AWACS proposal | News OK

[Pete]

To demonstrate the shear economic impact of Tinker...

They are in the process of awarding a $100 million construction contract JUST FOR PAVING!!

Incredible. And much more to come as the City is trying to acquire the rail yard between Tinker and the old GM plant, which would allow even more expansion.


By the way, the GM facility is over 4 million square feet and now essentially full.

Amazing we lost the General not that long ago and we didn't even skip a beat in economic terms. Certainly better off in the long-term.

[catch22]

Paving for streets or taxiway/runway/apron?

[Pete]

Paving for streets or taxiway/runway/apron?

Doesn't specifically say; you have to register as a gov contractor before you can see the details.

There is also a $25 million roofing contract to let.

[catch22]

I bet it is for apron and taxiway paving, seem to recall hearing they will be doing some taxiway work and added apron parking.

[Paseofreak]

It's a multi-year Indefinite Delivery Indefinite Quantity contract for up to 100 million. Could be any paving. They'll spend it as needs arise.

[BrettM2]

It's a multi-year Indefinite Delivery Indefinite Quantity contract for up to 100 million. Could be any paving. They'll spend it as needs arise.

The parking lot for Building 3001 won't be cheap on its own and it's absolutely falling apart. Hopefully that will be part of this.

[TAlan CB]

Air Force plans major construction at Tinker Air Force Base, reduction in AWACS | News OK

The reasons for building on Tinker are as often political as anything. Case-in-point, during the 1980's Tinker was competing with other maintenance depots to stay open during the consolidation periods in force drawn-downs (from a high during the Vietnam War). The location was good (central), work force good, etc. but because politics does not care about practicalities, but in keeping jobs in their 'neck of the woods', this does not matter for much. But Tinker had a small 'in' that many bases lacked, because of it's central location it was home to the new AWACs fleet. The other 'major' bases were - planes rotated from Tinker - Kadena in Okinawa Japan for Asia, and Reykjavic in Iceland for the European command. But planes could easily be moved to other 'home bases', how to keep AWAC's? Simple, create an emergency alert facility - a base within a base specifically built to house AWAC's crews on 24/7 stand by for immediate deployment. This facility was built in the area near the current Air Reserve base and current Navy facility. Nice quarters, lunch room, etc. and parking for a couple AWAC's planes - totally unnecessary as crews on the 'normal' side of the base are always ready to go. It was built as a political tool to insure AWAC's had an anchor to stay at Tinker. My father was the manpower specialist who did all the hiring for this and all AWAC's crews for more than 30 years (in the Air Force and as civil service). It worked, Tinker kept AWAC's and became the last large Depot repair facility. To further anchor Tinker, the Navy fleet communication plane home facility was located at Tinker. These planes share a similar air-frame (based on the Boeing 707), and similar missions AWAC's is a mobile radar station that can help command and control over a battle field. For a small state, we use to have powerful, intelligent, and well-placed Senators - one of who is now the President of the University of Oklahoma. This same man once asked me what I thought about the B-2, and whether I thought we should build any more .... but that's another (completely true) story.

[TAlan CB]

[Pete]

^

Thanks for all the info.

It's really hard to get your head around everything they do there, which I still don't completely understand.

I was only on the base once and only saw a tiny part of it, as I was there for a wedding 30 years ago.

[TAlan CB]

On the Air Force military side of the base AWAC's is the main anchor. Also, there are major support facilities for this mission. Additionally, Tinker is a major in-land hub for air-cargo transport (military transport aircraft) to support the various missions on and around Tinker. There use to be a communications squadron (the '3rd Herd) stationed at Tinker, but it has been moved. It had fleet of trucks that would drive around to support communication missions for the Air Commands.

The Air Depot employs the most people - mostly civilian - to repair and or rebuild every airplane in the military fleet - of all services. This is one of the most complicated and expansive repair facilities in the world.

The Air Reserve Base has changed missions over the years, last I heard (which may be out of date) is that it housed a fleet of Air Force tankers - planes used to refuel other planes in the air.

The Navy Facility primary mission i is the home of the Navy air communication air fleet. These planes use very long cables that extend out the back of the plane (when in flight) that use very low frequency waves to keep the submarines in communication with the rest of the fleet - world wide. Not the same as AWAC's but similar.

AWAC's emergency facility - mentioned in an earlier post.

To support these missions on Tinker there are housing for both enlisted and families, stores, Hospitals, gas stations, storage facilities, banks, grocery stores, golf courses (the importance of a military post can be determined by the condition of its golf course), bowling alley, pools, parks etc. The one thing I did not call out was the old GM plant on the bottom of the picture. It is utilized by the repair Depot, a lot of their buildings were built during WW2 and were in poor shape. So, a lot of the work in these older facilities were moved to the newer and empty GM facility - and it at least had air conditioning.

[Pete]

^

Awesome summary! Thanks so much.


Would be interesting to know how the 27,000 employees break down. I know that number does not include about 1,500 Boeing employees.

[BoulderSooner]

The navy 707 at tinker has no shared AWACS roll and there is no AWACS 24/7 emergency facility

The tinker ALC (air logistics facility). Mostly works on jet engines (over 100 different kinds)

It also is the depot facility for the e-3 the KC 135 the b-52 and does work on the b-2 The b-2 program office is on base.

Not close to all Air Force planes.

[BoulderSooner]

Tinker also hosts a major DISA facility AWACS is a tenant of Tinker which is an AFMC base AWACS is an ACC unit. The ALC is the anchor

[TAlan CB]

The navy 707 at tinker has no shared AWACS roll and there is no AWACS 24/7 emergency facility

The tinker ALC (air logistics facility). Mostly works on jet engines (over 100 different kinds)

It also is the depot facility for the e-3 the KC 135 the b-52 and does work on the b-2 The b-2 program office is on base.

Not close to all Air Force planes.

Thanks for the update! What is the emergency facility used for now? ALC (Air Logistics) is just the current name for the old title 'Depot' and is no-doubt why the Base is open. I did not say that AWAC's has any shared Navy role, just that planes have similar, but obviously different missions, and share a common Air Frame. And since some of my family - and a lot friends, work on jet engines specifically at this facility - I'm quite aware of the planes they work on routinely (don't forget the B1 is also repaired here), though I was aware the B2 is on the base, I did not know its program office was here.
The Air Commands have been reorganized and are no longer called SAC, MAC, and TAC, but the missions are the same. Over the years I have seen every plane in the Air Force and most of the navy fighter fleet go through Tinker, though I have no doubt that this is not currently the repair depot for most - and some may have been simply going through.
As to the 'emergency AWAC's facility' I forget it's formal name, but know for a fact that it use to exist in that capacity. Not only did my father staff the facility in his manpower role, I worked at it during an earlier decade when the facility was used to host (at least the planes) red flag exercises. Navy, Air Force, ANG, and Marine fighter jets and support aircraft. I would hope that it found a more useful role as it seemed redundant. I'll make some calls to see how long it lasted and what it was used for.

[bombermwc]

You know, I always wondered why you never see the B2. We see the B1 all the time, but the B2 is hardly ever seen.

I've often wondered what will happen in the next 15-20 years when so much of the Air Force large fleet is due to be replaced. Some of this stuff is Eisenhower era equipment!!!!! They've done an AMAZING Job in keeping things modernized and running (and a lot of that is because of the Tinker crews and the now nearby Boeing engineers), but there's only so much you can or should do before it's time to retire a plane. The problem is, there aren't really good alternatives for the price.
The B-52, E3, KC135. They've all older than dirt now. I could (in an uneducated way) say that a new plane would be lighter and more efficient, but I do not know if the cost for maintaining a newer plane is actually better given how different it would be constructed now and the need to retrain the entire force. There are probably a lot of other details that go into why it hasn't been done yet. Heck, we had a KC135 replacement all but done before it was pulled back because of political nonsense between Boeing and Airbus (damned if I am gonna have my USAF fly a Euro bird <- personal opinion).

I have a few friends that are engineers at the Boeing office. Recently an age issue came up (as it often does) for the B-52. Something I don't seem to understand is that (and this is quite common as well), is that there are certain parts that are old enough (still original) and need to be replaced, but rather than doing that, the USAF and Boeing have decided to spend MORE money and repair/modify the existing structure. I don't understand why anyone would do this....and it's a repeated thing. Metal fatigue should have been a factor long ago so I don't really understand why an original part can be around after 60+ years of operation on this thing.

But think about the number of people involved in all aspects of this. How much of the Boeing force that just moved here does this? Quite a bit. How much of the Bldg. 3001 force works on these...again, quite a bit.