Tinker AFB

[oneforone]

GM bailed on us, I do not see any reason why we should help GM.

I voted NO because I am tired of the Government taking my money. A basketball team, bail out GM under the guise of helping
Tinker. I can only imagine what is next? A tax to provide stretch limos for every state, county and city official. A fast food tax to help the schools throw more money away on indoor practice facilities and mall style food courts for schools.

[hipsterdoofus]

Even if this were a good idea...I don't think its a good time to bring it up...who wants to vote a tax raise now?

[Blazerfan11]

Andrew Rice!

[mmonroe]

Perhaps you should have found the thread with the SAME subject matter and commented on it instead of making a duplicated thread.

// On another subject, you all need to read the OK Gazettes article on this. It tells why the AF can't go in a buy it, and then you have the base nazi from the late 80's talking about how it's not good for tinker. It's the same guy who doesn't want the shoppes in Del City to go through either.

[AFCM]

...at it again, I see.

[mmonroe]

ditto.

[hipsterdoofus]

1. Tinker Air Force Base ($55M)

Dang thats a generic description for the funds usage...

[SoonerDave]

Dang thats a generic description for the funds usage...

The text of the question actually describes the purpose of the monies as "...including, but not limited to, the...." purchase of the GM plant. It goes on to create an even larger loophole, essentially providing an out for anything under the heading of "economic development." I think that's a catchy way of saying "boondoggle."

Before I get accused of some sort of undue bias, let me state up front I have no personal dog in the fight - I'm not an Oklahoma County resident, but I am an OKC resident. My opinion is that this is one of the most specious and questionable uses of county authority to come along in a long, long time.

To me, it just smells funny. We have county commissioners urging OK county property owners to pony up the funds to buy a building for a base that doesn't want it, being sold under the guise of "saving" Tinker when its former commander says its not necessary, to cement the illusion that some theoretical jobs are coming Tinker's way if it is passed - but not one concrete piece of information guarantees any of it. And all this in light of the fact that underutilization of a military base was one of the important indicia used to identify candidates for closure during the last BRAC round. Bottom line? None of it makes any sense.

Who benefits from this? I have no idea. GM, presumably, benefits by unloading a worthless plant and the attendant tax burden, and presumably whatever real estate broker(s) and attorney(s) might handle the sale...beyond that, who knows?

It just smellls funny to me. Were I an OK county resident, I'd be voting a big, bold no.

[BabyBoomerSooner]

If this fails, will Oklahoma county residents get criticized for okaying the tax incentive package for an NBA team but not "helping" their largest employer? Anxiously awaiting the verdict.

[Blazerfan11]

It didn't fail, its approx 20k-18k with like 95% reporting. Humphries is doing cartwheels right now....

[Redskin 70]

To me, it just smells funny. We have county commissioners urging OK county property owners to pony up the funds to buy a building for a base that doesn't want it, being sold under the guise of "saving" Tinker when its former commander says its not necessary,
It just smellls funny to me. Were I an OK county resident, I'd be voting a big, bold no.

To correct some misinformation.
The Senior base commanders Col. Correll was and is in favor of this acquisition. The Two star General on the base , General Reno, wants this deal. the One star General on this base, General Robinson, wants this deal. the Secretary of the Air Force, wants this. Actually numerous area Mayors and cities have came out for this deal.

Now Why would a current serving TWO STAR GENERAL who certainly has more information on the status of Tinker be for a purchase like this and a two star general retired over twenty years be butting heads so publicly?????

Im sorry but I think I will go with the active duty officer at the base......

And lets not forget this self same retired general was dismissed from the Oklahoma CIty chamber of commerce for supporting positions the Chamber did not support.

[mmonroe]

Redskin knows what i'm talking about.

[SoonerDave]

To pretend that Burpee is some idiot without any knowledge of the process behind base closure decisions is astonishingly naive. He may have been retired for several years, but I think he's already been through one round of BRAC review as Tinker's commander, which none of the other individuals can claim.

There's not one shred of guarantee from anyone on the government side about so much as one penny's worth of additional work en route to Tinker solely because of this acquisition, and that doesn't even add in the fact that some programs are slowing/ending in the coming years at Tinker.

Once again, this "great" idea for the future of Tinker is a bad idea in light of the fact that it will actually be more likely to create the appearance that Tinker is underutilized, which is like padding your deductions and daring the IRS not to audit you.

As I said, I'm not a resident of Oklahoma County, so I have no dog in this fight, and the questionable motives of the corresponding commissioners will be something paid for by the voters of that county for some time to come. I just hope it doesn't end up costing a bunch of jobs in the future.

[metro]

It didn't fail, its approx 20k-18k with like 95% reporting. Humphries is doing cartwheels right now....

Speaking of Humphries, looks like he was nominated as temporary chair of the OKC School Board, he also announced he would be running for the permanent seat when it goes to vote.

[mmonroe]

add SoonerDave to that list of "knows what i'm talking about".

[SouthsideSooner]

It's very interesting to look at what passed and what didn't. I realize data and record retention is not very sexy but I'm kind of surprised about the OSU extension building.

Does anyone close to the situation have any insight?


Tinker bond proposal will likely pass
John Estus
Staff Writer
Oklahoma County voters appear to have narrowly approved the latest Tinker Air Force Base bond issue proposal today.
With 296 of 297 precincts reporting, approval of the plan to buy the abandoned General Motors plant and lease it to Tinker is carrying about 53 percent of the vote, according to the Oklahoma County Election Board.

“We’re going to take a facility that was dead and we’re going to breathe some life back into it,” Vaughn said. “It’s going to benefit the greatest employer we’ve got in Oklahoma County.”

Retired Air Force Lt. Gen. Richard Burpee,Ö a former Tinker commander who opposed the plan, said he accepted the choice of the people.

“The voters have voted their conscience, and they voted for the tax increase and that’s what we’re going to do,” Burpee said.

Passage of the Tinker proposition will cost the owner of a $100,000 home an extra $9.85 a year in property taxes.

Two of the other four countywide propositions also appeared on their ways to passing.

County flood control improvements and renovations to the county courthouse were approved by voters.

Propositions to improve county records management and build a new county extension building appeared destined to fail. Both had been shot down by about 55 percent of voters.

As of 8:05 p.m., the election board reports:

Countywide:

Proposition 1 — $55 million bond issue to acquire vacant General Motors facility, to be leased to Tinker Air Force Base. Yes, 7,552 (52.7%); No, 6,781 (47.3%).

Proposition 2 — $10.5 million bond issue for courthouse improvements, including replacing utility systems. Yes, 7,746 (53.8%); No, 6,643 (46.2%).

Proposition 3 — $5.75 million bond issue for additional storage and management system for county records. Yes, 6,905 (47.1%); No, 7,755 (52.9%).

Proposition 4 — $7.25 million bond issue for new Oklahoma County OSU Cooperative Extension Service building. Yes, 7,023 (47.4%); No, 7,784 (52.6%).

Proposition 5 — $6 million bond issue for flood control and countywide flood relief plan. Yes, 8,634 (58.5%); No, 6,138 (41.5%).

[hipsterdoofus]

Shall we start taking bets on when the next "save tinker" bond election will be?

[mmonroe]

Let's go for it, how about acquiring all land east of Douglas Blvd. Wouldn't be the second time my family had to be moved, dead or alive, because of Tinker.

[sgt. pepper]

Do you think this vote will have any effect when ther city brings maps3 to the people? i keep thinkinf people are really going to get tired of the government raising taxes. i personally think maps3 will take OKC to a new dimension and would support it 100%, but at some point, people are going to say we had enough, and will vote it down.

[metro]

sgt. pepper, I don't think this will effect the timing of MAPS 3. Mayor Cornett made it somewhat clear we were looking at 2010 before announcing MAPS 3. I predict it would go to a vote in late 2010.

[OSUFan]

No one is saying Burpee is an idiot but who are you going to belive a retired general who is at odds with the Chamber (apparently) or everybody else currently on base.

Tinker can't come out and promise jobs (for political reasons). In fact, Tinker since they are a government can't come out and say a whole lot.

[soonerguru]

This is a potential strategic blunder. They never said exactly what "jobs" would be created, and Gen. Burpee knows his stuff about the base and the Air Force, and he opposed it, saying it could actually hurt our case if there's another round of BRAC.

What a waste of resources.

When is the city and county going to get after a plan to provide decent public transit? Stupid votes like these potentially jeopardize future Yes votes for much-needed improvements.

OK, so we bought a building that has no tenant. Wonderful. Then, we potentially endanger future public support on other, more concretely beneficial initiatives. Is Ray Vaughan really dumb or what?

[SoonerDave]

No one is saying Burpee is an idiot but who are you going to belive a retired general who is at odds with the Chamber (apparently) or everybody else currently on base.

Tinker can't come out and promise jobs (for political reasons). In fact, Tinker since they are a government can't come out and say a whole lot.

Then you cannot count anything said by the other Tinker officials as saying "they want this deal," because that's an endorsement. Can't have it both ways.

Burpee led Tinker through a prior round of BRAC, and Tinker is still open. I've been left entirely unimpressed with the C of C, so Burpee's apparent opposition thereto is to his credit.

Its a boondoggle, the commissioners got what they wanted, so its a done deal that's been sacked to OK county taxpayers. Done is done. Time to move on to the next ripoff.

[OKCMallen]

The text of the question actually describes the purpose of the monies as "...including, but not limited to, the...." purchase of the GM plant. It goes on to create an even larger loophole, essentially providing an out for anything under the heading of "economic development." I think that's a catchy way of saying "boondoggle."

Before I get accused of some sort of undue bias, let me state up front I have no personal dog in the fight - I'm not an Oklahoma County resident, but I am an OKC resident. My opinion is that this is one of the most specious and questionable uses of county authority to come along in a long, long time.

To me, it just smells funny. We have county commissioners urging OK county property owners to pony up the funds to buy a building for a base that doesn't want it, being sold under the guise of "saving" Tinker when its former commander says its not necessary, to cement the illusion that some theoretical jobs are coming Tinker's way if it is passed - but not one concrete piece of information guarantees any of it. And all this in light of the fact that underutilization of a military base was one of the important indicia used to identify candidates for closure during the last BRAC round. Bottom line? None of it makes any sense.

Who benefits from this? I have no idea. GM, presumably, benefits by unloading a worthless plant and the attendant tax burden, and presumably whatever real estate broker(s) and attorney(s) might handle the sale...beyond that, who knows?

It just smellls funny to me. Were I an OK county resident, I'd be voting a big, bold no.

I agree. And I voted no. *sigh

[hipsterdoofus]

Is Ray Vaughan really dumb or what?

Ray Vaughn is not dumb, which is why I don't understand this...I suppose I could have tried asking him, but he didn't seem to have very clear answers for the media either.