Memorial Stadium Master Plan

[warreng88]

Well, it looks like I am the one that is far more tied into this great universities future. PhiAlpha, OU48A, warreng88, Venture you will see that all my comments regarding Memorial Stadium have been 100% in line w/ the $300 M expansion. Hmmm? why is that?

I never said it wasn't necessary or that I wouldn't like it, I just said it doesn't affect recruits as much as you might think.

[OKVision4U]

I never said it wasn't necessary or that I wouldn't like it, I just said it doesn't affect recruits as much as you might think.

warreng, I will explain it this way, There has not been a single expansion project completed ( or in the future ) that is directed to increasing the Cheerleaders, The Band Members, The Ruf Neks.... All project expansions are for the existing needs & future needs ( ... ie, Recruits ) for the football program. It is the reality of the OU Monster Bud started.

[warreng88]

warreng, I will explain it this way, There has not been a single expansion project completed ( or in the future ) that is directed to increasing the Cheerleaders, The Band Members, The Ruf Neks.... All project expansions are for the existing needs & future needs ( ... ie, Recruits ) for the football program. It is the reality of the OU Monster Bud started.

Um, no. It is done since there is an increase in demand so much so that the supply needs to go up. I am not sure what the waiting list is anymore to get season tickets, but it was around 10,000 or more about five years ago. I think a major overhaul of a small, almost high school stadium like OSU's ten years ago into what it is now, would make a bigger impact on recruits than updating their weight room, sure. But redoing the press box and bowling in the south side of OU's Memorial stadium doesn't do as much for recruits as beating Alabama in one of the biggest upsets of the year. Just ask five star all purpose RB Joe Mixon, “Once they won the Alabama game that shut the deal,” Mixon said. “Now I’m a Sooner.“

[OKVision4U]

...and the loss to Baylor? ...helped their recruiting, yes. But we won't win all our games all the time. So at OU, me must continue to increase our presense in every other area ( Stadium, etc ), it is required.

[warreng88]

...and the loss to Baylor? ...helped their recruiting, yes. But we won't win all our games all the time. So at OU, me must continue to increase our presense in every other area ( Stadium, etc ), it is required.

I am not disagreeing with you, I just think you think it has more of an impact on recruiting that you think it does. If what you are saying is true, then Michigan, Penn State, Tennessee, Ohio State and Alabame would get all the top recruits, all the time. Alabama is arguably the best college football team right now and it has nothing to do with their stadium. It has to do with coaching, winning championships and putting players in the NFL. THAT is what gets recruits to come to a stadium. Look at Oregon, Autzen Stadium. Their capacity in 2001 was 41,698 and was increased to 54,000 in 2002 but they bring in a ton of top recruits due to playing really well, having cool uniforms and the stadium being a great place to play.

[SoonerDave]

Um, no. It is done since there is an increase in demand so much so that the supply needs to go up. I am not sure what the waiting list is anymore to get season tickets, but it was around 10,000 or more about five years ago. I think a major overhaul of a small, almost high school stadium like OSU's ten years ago into what it is now, would make a bigger impact on recruits than updating their weight room, sure. But redoing the press box and bowling in the south side of OU's Memorial stadium doesn't do as much for recruits as beating Alabama in one of the biggest upsets of the year. Just ask five star all purpose RB Joe Mixon, “Once they won the Alabama game that shut the deal,” Mixon said. “Now I’m a Sooner.“

The OU season ticket waiting list has grown into a phenomenon of almost urban legend proportions, and has long been used to justify expansion to OMS - problem is the numbers aren't nearly as astounding as they seem.

First, many of the names on the list are overlapping members of individual families just trying to, as it were, "stuff the ballot box." If one finally hits the list, the others don't bother buying.

Second, many of the folks on that list have been around forever, and when their number does come up, they can't buy them due to fill-in-the-blank changes to their personal situation, divorces, marriages, deaths, financial reversals, kids, or just plain don't want them anymore, whatever.

Third, and this is the hardest pill for some to swallow, is that there's no surging demand for OU home season football tickets. The football office last year sent out a mass email soliciting season ticket sales from current holders that did not renew, or presumably folks on the existing list that declined them. They wouldn't go to that hassle for a few dozen tickets.

Given the increased competition for discretionary/entertainment dollars in Oklahoma, particularly central Oklahoma, OU home season ticket sales aren't a slam dunk - and haven't been for years when you see the river of third-party tickets for sale around the stadium on most home dates. And I have no doubt that some generous corporate donors have bought up rather conspicuous blocks of unsold tickets to preserve OU's current home game sellout streak - some in the visitor section, some not.

Lastly, people who really want season tickets are all-but guaranteed to get them if they make a donation to the Sooner Club. I won't swear to this, but I believe a $100/seat donation last year got you in - and if you're already predisposed/able through your own resources or budget or whatever to drop several hundred dollars on a pair of OU season tickets, a couple hundred more probably isn't that big a hurdle to overcome if you really want them that badly.

Joe C has always maintained he wanted the "just right" balance between supply and demand for OU football tickets, and I think a gross expansion of supply right now just wouldn't be smart. As a result, I think the bulk of the monies being tossed around here are going to a pressbox/suite expansion rather than some monumental seating increase. If they can fit in bowling the south corners in the budget, great, but if they don't expand to 100K, it won't be a shock, nor will it be some heartbreaking failure to OU's recruiting future. OU's win over Bama was worth five stadium expansions.

[OKVision4U]

I am not disagreeing with you, I just think you think it has more of an impact on recruiting that you think it does. If what you are saying is true, then Michigan, Penn State, Tennessee, Ohio State and Alabame would get all the top recruits, all the time. Alabama is arguably the best college football team right now and it has nothing to do with their stadium. It has to do with coaching, winning championships and putting players in the NFL. THAT is what gets recruits to come to a stadium. Look at Oregon, Autzen Stadium. Their capacity in 2001 was 41,698 and was increased to 54,000 in 2002 but they bring in a ton of top recruits due to playing really well, having cool uniforms and the stadium being a great place to play.

They do get the pick-of-the-litter when it comes to top recruits..and they have massive stadiums.

I"m going to speak to the Univ. of Oklahoma... We have a formula to winning. All these factors play a major role into a young man's decision to play ball at OU and we can't fall behind on any of the criteria needed to produce championships.

[ou48A]

One of the cheapest and most neeeed items is a new or expanded weight room.
It's something most recruits pay very close attention to and OU could proceed with it fairly soon.

[OKVision4U]

The OU season ticket waiting list has grown into a phenomenon of almost urban legend proportions, and has long been used to justify expansion to OMS - problem is the numbers aren't nearly as astounding as they seem.

First, many of the names on the list are overlapping members of individual families just trying to, as it were, "stuff the ballot box." If one finally hits the list, the others don't bother buying.

Second, many of the folks on that list have been around forever, and when their number does come up, they can't buy them due to fill-in-the-blank changes to their personal situation, divorces, marriages, deaths, financial reversals, kids, or just plain don't want them anymore, whatever.

Third, and this is the hardest pill for some to swallow, is that there's no surging demand for OU home season football tickets. The football office last year sent out a mass email soliciting season ticket sales from current holders that did not renew, or presumably folks on the existing list that declined them. They wouldn't go to that hassle for a few dozen tickets.

Given the increased competition for discretionary/entertainment dollars in Oklahoma, particularly central Oklahoma, OU home season ticket sales aren't a slam dunk - and haven't been for years when you see the river of third-party tickets for sale around the stadium on most home dates. And I have no doubt that some generous corporate donors have bought up rather conspicuous blocks of unsold tickets to preserve OU's current home game sellout streak - some in the visitor section, some not.

Lastly, people who really want season tickets are all-but guaranteed to get them if they make a donation to the Sooner Club. I won't swear to this, but I believe a $100/seat donation last year got you in - and if you're already predisposed/able through your own resources or budget or whatever to drop several hundred dollars on a pair of OU season tickets, a couple hundred more probably isn't that big a hurdle to overcome if you really want them that badly.

Joe C has always maintained he wanted the "just right" balance between supply and demand for OU football tickets, and I think a gross expansion of supply right now just wouldn't be smart. As a result, I think the bulk of the monies being tossed around here are going to a pressbox/suite expansion rather than some monumental seating increase. If they can fit in bowling the south corners in the budget, great, but if they don't expand to 100K, it won't be a shock, nor will it be some heartbreaking failure to OU's recruiting future. OU's win over Bama was worth five stadium expansions.

Dave, don't forget about the Baylor loss... how much does that count? Yes, the win over Bama was the B-12 shot this season needed ( and start of next year too ).

The balance Joe C / Boren must maintain is "Relevance". Each year we must be in that category of relevance to all those involved in the program, the fans, the media ( national ), and the players. As we add more "facilities" it keeps it fresh & current. This is the requirement of a TOP 5 Program. It gives Bob more to close with in the living rooms of the recruits.

[SoonerDave]

They do get the pick-of-the-litter when it comes to top recruits..and they have massive stadiums.

I"m going to speak to the Univ. of Oklahoma... We have a formula to winning. All these factors play a major role into a young man's decision to play ball at OU and we can't fall behind on any of the criteria needed to produce championships.

Then why did Rich Rodriguez fail? Why did Lloyd Carr get to "retire"? How did Appalachian State ever win at Ann Arbor? They surely should have seen the big stadium, genuflected, and died out of pure respect.

[SoonerDave]

]Dave, don't forget about the Baylor loss... how much does that count? [/B] Yes, the win over Bama was the B-12 shot this season needed ( and start of next year too ).

Didn't seem to be a player at all to Mixon.

And, after beating the previous two-time national champion on national television in a BCS bowl by two touchdowns, that Baylor loss is barely a flickering memory.

]
The balance Joe C / Boren must maintain is "Relevance". Each year we must be in that category of relevance to all those involved in the program, the fans, the media ( national ), and the players. As we add more "facilities" it keeps it fresh & current. This is the requirement of a TOP 5 Program. It gives Bob more to close with in the living rooms of the recruits.

And you do more to remain relevant by winning then installing benches. If it were the other way around, Tennessee would have been the de-facto national titlists years ago and Phil Fullmer would still be employed. Besides, having a "stadium master plan" doesn't mean nearly as much for "closing" if the last thing on that kid's head had been a double-digit loss to Bama.

What you don't seem to get, OKVision, is that in general most of us here agree with you that we need to keep facilities updated and fresh. No argument there. But this notion you seem to put up there that we have to perpetually construct some sort of half-billion-dollar Taj Mahal upgrade every three years or we'll fall off the map just doesn't pass the sniff test. And it doesn't pass the reality test, either, as many other programs listed here would attest.

Not really interested in further perpetuating this discussion, in all honesty. I'd just like to see the actual master plan and what's coming. I have no doubt Joe C has his pulse on what's needed and how to get it done. I think, whatever it is, he'll do a grand job of getting it implemented, and it will be right-sized for the Sooners.

[OKVision4U]

Then why did Rich Rodriguez fail? Why did Lloyd Carr get to "retire"? How did Appalachian State ever win at Ann Arbor? They surely should have seen the big stadium, genuflected, and died out of pure respect.

1. They watched "Facing the Giants" for their Friday Night at the Movies.
2. They played inspired ball.
3. On any given day, any team can win.
4. The big boys overlooked ApState by practicing for the next "significant" apponent?
5. Parity in sports.

At OU it is simple, to maintain any advantage for our tradition, NC's, Sooner Magic, we have to keep that momentum going through Expansions, Keeping Bob S as our HC, ....all the above.

[SoonerDave]

1. They watched "Facing the Giants" for their Friday Night at the Movies.
2. They played inspired ball.
3. On any given day, any team can win.
4. The big boys overlooked ApState by practicing for the next "significant" apponent?
5. Parity in sports.

And you finally proved my point. Top five reasons for underdogs to win? Not one has anything to do with having a 100,000 seat stadium.

Whew. Glad that's finally done.

[OKVision4U]

Didn't seem to be a player at all to Mixon.

And, after beating the previous two-time national champion on national television in a BCS bowl by two touchdowns, that Baylor loss is barely a flickering memory.



And you do more to remain relevant by winning then installing benches. If it were the other way around, Tennessee would have been the de-facto national titlists years ago and Phil Fullmer would still be employed. Besides, having a "stadium master plan" doesn't mean nearly as much for "closing" if the last thing on that kid's head had been a double-digit loss to Bama.

What you don't seem to get, OKVision, is that in general most of us here agree with you that we need to keep facilities updated and fresh. No argument there. But this notion you seem to put up there that we have to perpetually construct some sort of half-billion-dollar Taj Mahal upgrade every three years or we'll fall off the map just doesn't pass the sniff test. And it doesn't pass the reality test, either, as many other programs listed here would attest.Not really interested in further perpetuating this discussion, in all honesty. I'd just like to see the actual master plan and what's coming. I have no doubt Joe C has his pulse on what's needed and how to get it done. I think, whatever it is, he'll do a grand job of getting it implemented, and it will be right-sized for the Sooners.

Dave, you can blow my statement way out of proportion, ...never said every 3 years, never said .5 B. I have been 100% accurate on exactly what is intended for this expansion. Now you can disagree w/ the "why" we are doing it, sure.

What I'm talking about is making Bob's job easier, not more difficult. Thus, a stadium expansion that is significant is required. If you don't like the numbers of 100K fans, then so be it.

Relevance & Fresh.

[warreng88]

One of the cheapest and most neeeed items is a new or expanded weight room.
It's something most recruits pay very close attention to and OU could proceed with it fairly soon.

Agreed. That seems to be the trend over the last couple of years with top college football teams like Bama, Oregon, Nebraska and Florida spending obscene amounts of money upgrading their weight room and personalizing them. Here is a cool article with pictures to match:

Arms Race: Photos of top weight rooms in college football | Saturday Down South

[OKVision4U]

And you finally proved my point. Top five reasons for underdogs to win? Not one has anything to do with having a 100,000 seat stadium.

Whew. Glad that's finally done.

Dave , Warreng, let me ask you, if we "froze" all spending on OU Football for the next 50 years, what would be the outcome of our program then? ...we don't have to spend it. we could save it.

Dave you may not truly understand "how the OU advantage" is maintained. If you want the OU program to "be an underdog", then yes, they have a small % of winning each game.

But this is not who we are. Decades of winning is not cheap and will not be played in a pasture.

[warreng88]

Dave , Warreng, let me ask you, if we "froze" all spending on OU Football for the next 50 years, what would be the outcome of our program then? ...we don't have to spend it. we could save it.

Dave you may not truly understand "how the OU advantage" is maintained. If you want the OU program to "be an underdog", then yes, they have a small % of winning each game.

But this is not who we are. Decades of winning is not cheap and will not be played in a pasture.

Show me where I said or anyone else said we don't want OU to spend any more money on the program...

[SoonerDave]

Show me where I said or anyone else said we don't want OU to spend any more money on the program...

Ditto for me, Vision. You seem to be purposely ignoring and misrepresenting what is being said by folks in this thread, and I for one don't appreciate it.

Dave , Warreng, let me ask you, if we "froze" all spending on OU Football for the next 50 years, what would be the outcome of our program then? ...we don't have to spend it. we could save it.

Dave you may not truly understand "how the OU advantage" is maintained. If you want the OU program to "be an underdog", then yes, they have a small % of winning each game.

Let me tell you something, OK, I'll bet dollars to donuts I'm older than you. In my lifetime, I've seen OU win four of its seven national titles. I've seen three of its Heisman trophy winners. And I've seen us get blown out in Norman when we had Chef Boy Ar Dee for a coach.

With all due respect, don't you dare patronize or condescend to me (or anyone else on this board) about "my not understanding how the OU advantage is maintained". Not one more message of it, because I won't up with it anymore.

I've told you in numerous posts on this thread that I AGREE WITH YOU regarding the need to keep facilities updated and expanded. I have actual photographs of the 1974 STEP west deck expansion taken when I was nine years old, and when we built the new south endzone a few years later .Heck, I have pictures of the segments of the sections of what was then the brand new, red electronic scoreboard that replaced the 50's era green beast IN that old south endzone. It is GREAT and vital to expand, to update, to refresh -- and of course I realize and agree that all of those things take money. Once and for all, STOP trying to make it sound like those of us who don't agree with YOUR vision of expansion as being anti expenditure, or part of your "freeze spending for 50 years" asininity. IT ISN'T TRUE. No more!!!!

You have asserted that if we don't make these gargantuan leaps of capacity that we will inevitably fall behind in recruiting, and numerous posters here have demonstrated that your statement is factually and historically wrong. Wrong. Your posts here contain the implicit notion that winning is not possible without a huge stadium, and you have taken nearly anyone that even slightly disagrees with you to task for it. If you dare to suggest otherwise, you're being disingenuous at worst and insulting at best. And I've had enough of it. You refuse to acknowledge that there are now more than a handful of Baylor's out there that were perpetual nobodies, yet started winning in the midst of playing in crappy little stadiums, yet now are upgrading. Parity in the game is distributing the athletic wealth across traditional and non-traditional powers. Winning is the elixer. Money is the grease. Recruiting is the fuel. Facilities, program support and a favorable administration are the gears in the machine that keep everything else churning.

Yes, we must enhance and refine. And we must do so intelligently, not because we're running scared of someone else that we think "has a bigger one." Fortunately, that's why they pay Joe C the big bucks- to make precisely those kinds of decisions. I've said before, and I'll say again, I'm sure Joe C. has his hand on the right steps to make sure that the next wave of expenditures on Sooner football are intelligent and in the best interests of the program and the university.

Said it before, but I've relented - but I'm going to stick by it this time - I'm done here until I see something material about the actual plan being released. That will be great fun to review and anticipate when it happens and the plans all start to unfold.

[ou48A]

Dave , Warreng, let me ask you, if we "froze" all spending on OU Football for the next 50 years, what would be the outcome of our program then? ...we don't have to spend it. we could save it.

Dave you may not truly understand "how the OU advantage" is maintained. If you want the OU program to "be an underdog", then yes, they have a small % of winning each game.

But this is not who we are. Decades of winning is not cheap and will not be played in a pasture.

All OU fans that I know of want major stadium, other football and basketball facility's improvements.

But most know the process must be financially managed in a big business like way.

Fortunately for OU we have one of the very top decision makers in the business. OU's revenue grew by over 17 million just last year under Joe C. leadership.. By comparison while operating in a similar state economy and while their program was at or near historic peaks, OSU's revenue declined by over $10 million dollars last year.

OU's revenue is now in 5th place at over $123 million and ahead of such schools as LSU, Tennessee Penn ST, Auburn ,TOSU and Michigan and their much larger stadiums.

Your way, of possible over expansion, could upset the balance that Joe C. has found and put at risk the OU's large athletic revenue increases.

With a track record like his I'm going to trust whatever Joe C wants.

[ou48A]

Agreed. That seems to be the trend over the last couple of years with top college football teams like Bama, Oregon, Nebraska and Florida spending obscene amounts of money upgrading their weight room and personalizing them. Here is a cool article with pictures to match:

Arms Race: Photos of top weight rooms in college football | Saturday Down South

Those are good pictures.... thanks for posting.

I have an idea about what might be a great location for a new OU weight room.... When they tear down the old dorm in the location that's just north of the BUD a new building with large windows overlooking the Heisman trophy statues would serve as a reminder to all athletes of the high expectation we have as they push them self's though the pain of getting better.

[OKVision4U]

Ditto for me, Vision. You seem to be purposely ignoring and misrepresenting what is being said by folks in this thread, and I for one don't appreciate it.



Let me tell you something, OK, I'll bet dollars to donuts I'm older than you. In my lifetime, I've seen OU win four of its seven national titles. I've seen three of its Heisman trophy winners. And I've seen us get blown out in Norman when we had Chef Boy Ar Dee for a coach.

With all due respect, don't you dare patronize or condescend to me (or anyone else on this board) about "my not understanding how the OU advantage is maintained". Not one more message of it, because I won't up with it anymore.

I've told you in numerous posts on this thread that I AGREE WITH YOU regarding the need to keep facilities updated and expanded. I have actual photographs of the 1974 STEP west deck expansion taken when I was nine years old, and when we built the new south endzone a few years later .Heck, I have pictures of the segments of the sections of what was then the brand new, red electronic scoreboard that replaced the 50's era green beast IN that old south endzone. It is GREAT and vital to expand, to update, to refresh -- and of course I realize and agree that all of those things take money. Once and for all, STOP trying to make it sound like those of us who don't agree with YOUR vision of expansion as being anti expenditure, or part of your "freeze spending for 50 years" asininity. IT ISN'T TRUE. No more!!!!

You have asserted that if we don't make these gargantuan leaps of capacity that we will inevitably fall behind in recruiting, and numerous posters here have demonstrated that your statement is factually and historically wrong. Wrong. Your posts here contain the implicit notion that winning is not possible without a huge stadium, and you have taken nearly anyone that even slightly disagrees with you to task for it. If you dare to suggest otherwise, you're being disingenuous at worst and insulting at best. And I've had enough of it. You refuse to acknowledge that there are now more than a handful of Baylor's out there that were perpetual nobodies, yet started winning in the midst of playing in crappy little stadiums, yet now are upgrading. Parity in the game is distributing the athletic wealth across traditional and non-traditional powers. Winning is the elixer. Money is the grease. Recruiting is the fuel. Facilities, program support and a favorable administration are the gears in the machine that keep everything else churning.

Yes, we must enhance and refine. And we must do so intelligently, not because we're running scared of someone else that we think "has a bigger one." Fortunately, that's why they pay Joe C the big bucks- to make precisely those kinds of decisions. I've said before, and I'll say again, I'm sure Joe C. has his hand on the right steps to make sure that the next wave of expenditures on Sooner football are intelligent and in the best interests of the program and the university.

Said it before, but I've relented - but I'm going to stick by it this time - I'm done here until I see something material about the actual plan being released. That will be great fun to review and anticipate when it happens and the plans all start to unfold.

SoonerDave, thank you for watching & following the program for many years. That said, you still may not fully understand it. You were comparing ApState to OU. ....enough said.

We need our stadium to equal our tradiion. Like it or not, it is an arms race.

[warreng88]

SoonerDave, thank you for watching & following the program for many years. That said, you still may not fully understand it. You were comparing ApState to OU. ....enough said.

We need our stadium to equal our tradiion. Like it or not, it is an arms race.

Yeah (in my best Lumbergh voice), he never compared OU to App State. That is you trying to discredit him. Here is the exact quote: "Then why did Rich Rodriguez fail? Why did Lloyd Carr get to "retire"? How did Appalachian State ever win at Ann Arbor? They surely should have seen the big stadium, genuflected, and died out of pure respect."

You are the worst kind of internet person. You try and try to make a point and person after person proves you wrong over and over and over again and instead of saying, "You're right, I'm wrong, let's move on" you keep on with your mind-numbing drivel, running yourself in circles and I have had enough. You were at least a little entertaining when you were talking about building a recockulous 40 story tower on Highway 9 and Chautauqua, then with your absurd notion that OKC could host the Olympics in the next 15 years, let alone our lifetime. You are back on ignore and I will not ever address you again. I really hope all others on here put you on ignore so you will finally see that no one is in contact with you or responding to your posts and you will eventually just give up and go away.

[OKVision4U]

Yeah (in my best Lumbergh voice), he never compared OU to App State. That is you trying to discredit him. Here is the exact quote: "Then why did Rich Rodriguez fail? Why did Lloyd Carr get to "retire"? How did Appalachian State ever win at Ann Arbor? They surely should have seen the big stadium, genuflected, and died out of pure respect."

You are the worst kind of internet person. You try and try to make a point and person after person proves you wrong over and over and over again and instead of saying, "You're right, I'm wrong, let's move on" you keep on with your mind-numbing drivel, running yourself in circles and I have had enough. You were at least a little entertaining when you were talking about building a recockulous 40 story tower on Highway 9 and Chautauqua, then with your absurd notion that OKC could host the Olympics in the next 15 years, let alone our lifetime. You are back on ignore and I will not ever address you again. I really hope all others on here put you on ignore so you will finally see that no one is in contact with you or responding to your posts and you will eventually just give up and go away.

Ok, that really makes sense. Thanks.

[OKVision4U]

Yeah (in my best Lumbergh voice), he never compared OU to App State. That is you trying to discredit him. Here is the exact quote: "Then why did Rich Rodriguez fail? Why did Lloyd Carr get to "retire"? How did Appalachian State ever win at Ann Arbor? They surely should have seen the big stadium, genuflected, and died out of pure respect."

You are the worst kind of internet person. You try and try to make a point and person after person proves you wrong over and over and over again and instead of saying, "You're right, I'm wrong, let's move on" you keep on with your mind-numbing drivel, running yourself in circles and I have had enough. You were at least a little entertaining when you were talking about building a recockulous 40 story tower on Highway 9 and Chautauqua, then with your absurd notion that OKC could host the Olympics in the next 15 years, let alone our lifetime. You are back on ignore and I will not ever address you again. I really hope all others on here put you on ignore so you will finally see that no one is in contact with you or responding to your posts and you will eventually just give up and go away.

Ok, good. That works for me. I'm gonna miss ya.

[venture]

Yeah (in my best Lumbergh voice), he never compared OU to App State. That is you trying to discredit him. Here is the exact quote: "Then why did Rich Rodriguez fail? Why did Lloyd Carr get to "retire"? How did Appalachian State ever win at Ann Arbor? They surely should have seen the big stadium, genuflected, and died out of pure respect."

You are the worst kind of internet person. You try and try to make a point and person after person proves you wrong over and over and over again and instead of saying, "You're right, I'm wrong, let's move on" you keep on with your mind-numbing drivel, running yourself in circles and I have had enough. You were at least a little entertaining when you were talking about building a recockulous 40 story tower on Highway 9 and Chautauqua, then with your absurd notion that OKC could host the Olympics in the next 15 years, let alone our lifetime. You are back on ignore and I will not ever address you again. I really hope all others on here put you on ignore so you will finally see that no one is in contact with you or responding to your posts and you will eventually just give up and go away.

He seems to make these rounds on various sections of the forum. I guess we are being blessed with his trash again here. Ah well. Every village has to have an idiot, so I guess that is the role he is trying to fill.

Dave, OU48, and yourself got this locked down pretty well. I completely agree that over expansion for the sake of ***** envy is just stupid. I'd rather have an extremely profitable program, a beautiful 80,000 seat stadium with many luxury suites for those donors that can afford to support our school, and a quality weight room and other services for the students. This whole scheme of massive stadiums, towers in the middle of nowhere, and Olympics hosting wouldn't even fly in SimCity if playing without the cheat modes enabled. :-P