Costco

[catch22]

and for the record, I’m not against automation. I would say self checkout is fine as long as these stores will give you a discount equivalent to your time at their prevailing cashier wage. If you spend 5 minutes at the checkout stand, a $1.25 discount (0.08 hours at $15 an hour) is fair. These companies tout it as a consumer benefit. However they are the only ones benefiting from lower overhead. You do the work, they keep the savings.

[AP]

You are benefiting from not have to deal with cashiers, which many people prefer. I would probably pay a little extra to go to a self-checkout line, tbh.

[catch22]

You are benefiting from not have to deal with cashiers, which many people prefer. I would probably pay a little extra to go to a self-checkout line, tbh.

To each their own. I like my setup at my union grocery store. I pull my art up, they unload the cart for me. Someone is at the end of the belt bagging my items for me. I don’t have to lift a finger. And I happy knowing I’m supporting fellow union workers.

[Mr. Blue Sky]

The automation threat is real. Not just self-checkouts at retail stores, but anything and everything is on the horizon. Even conservatives in Europe are on board with UBI because without it, you have all this automation and AI and who’s working? The UBI can be funded by corporations paying payroll taxes on each and every piece of automation replacing a worker. It’s not like replacing typewriters with computers. This is an all new, existential threat to the world economy. Pick up a good book on the threats to our way of life from AI and automation (and there are many good ones). It is very real and not very well understood by most people.

[Jersey Boss]

To each their own. I like my setup at my union grocery store. I pull my art up, they unload the cart for me. Someone is at the end of the belt bagging my items for me. I don’t have to lift a finger. And I happy knowing I’m supporting fellow union workers.

Keeping it a 100. Agree with your sentiments.

[OKC Guy]

I've never understood the argument about job loss...

Should we have not had the industrial revolution and still have most the populace performing back-breaking work?

MENIAL jobs are lost and HIGH PAYING jobs are gained. Certainly not in equal numbers but then again it's very inexpensive to get higher education in this country and/or technical training and learn a vocation that will get you higher pay. (Some schools are very expensive but virtually everywhere there are bargain JC's and vo-tech's.)

How many great jobs have been created through technology?

When I started work as a real estate broker in 1982, we still had a typing pool. Yes, a room full of women and typewriters who would crank out our correspondence. Did PC's and email ruin all those great jobs too? Should there have been an uproar when automated switching technology came along and scores of people were no longer required to sit in small rooms and move plugs from one port to another?


It's just such a silly way to look at things, especially with unemployment rates at near all-time lows and the average person living a lifestyle that was reserved for only the upper class just a generation or two ago. And BTW, if you want to get paid $15-$20/hour for unskilled labor, there are many other options in town.

I don’t agree with this for a few reasons.

1. Replacing a typewriter with computer is equipment vs equipment. Not the same thing. We are replacing humans with equipment now.

2. Go to any Crest and most of the cashiers and baggers are HS or college age. You say scan eliminates mennial jobs yet to these kids its their first encounter with real work and only way to make extra money. Not all kids can go straight to these so called higher playing jobs. These are great bridge jobs and I hate seeing them eliminated by scanners. If one looks at all the jobs taken away for entry level its harder and harder for youngsters to find first jobs. Most box stores now require 18 years old so we eliminated those entry jobs for high schoolers. Auto scan and kiosks are entrenching into grocery, retail and even fast food.

Where will folks get entry level jobs? Econony is great now but always goes in cycles. Next downturn will hurt lower scale wage workers the most as machines have replaced a lot of jobs.

Plus I think its healthy for people to interact and I always enjoy talking to cashiers and baggers. And its good social interaction for them too since a lot of interaction is now done online or by social media methods. I think these entry jobs help push people to work harder to improve their stock and want to move on to those better jobs. And then once they get those better jobs they appreciate it more having started at the bottom rung of ladder.

Like I posted I am fine with scanners as convenience but hate seeing jobs eliminated by them. Its a ripple effect .

[Pete]

I’m sure Pete will feel different when Artificial Intelligence can submit interview requests and via machine learning, imitate the feel of a journalist and replicate his job.

AI and machine learning is already taking a huge chunk out of data processing for large corporations. Instead of a team of 40 analysts, a company can get away with 20 because the computers can analyze data with little human input.

It’s the way things are going but that doesn’t mean it’s a great idea.

Actually, that's an incredibly small part of what I do currently and even if my current profession was completely automated, I'd move on to something else.

In fact, I've done many, many different things in my career. Responding in a personal way because you made this personal.


Still a terrible argument.

[catch22]

Actually, that's an incredibly small part of what I do currently and even if my current profession was completely automated, I'd move on to something else.

In fact, I've done many, many different things in my career. Responding in a personal way because you made this personal.


Still a terrible argument.

I apologize Pete, I was only using your profession as an example just because I was responding to your post. I would make the same argument for any profession - because truthfully they could all be automated.

[Pete]

I don’t agree with this for a few reasons.

1. Replacing a typewriter with computer is equipment vs equipment. Not the same thing. We are replacing humans with equipment now.

Both involve new technology that allows someone to easily do something themselves as opposed to having dedicated, relatively unskilled laborers do it for them.

Exact same result.

[Pete]

I apologize Pete, I was only using your profession as an example just because I was responding to your post. I would make the same argument for any profession - because truthfully they could all be automated.

And when they are automated, that will lead to other new jobs with higher pay.

The most menial jobs are the first to get automated. I can't think of any job I've had in the last 30 years that is going to be automated any time soon, if ever. There are good reasons why more people are currently employed in this country than ever before.

And BTW, automation is all done in the name of cost-cutting and increases in efficiency which creates an inherent, huge societal value in itself. Standard of living is much higher in this country (and just about everywhere else) than it ever has been.

What exactly is the problem? Certain types of jobs have been going away for centuries and new types are always being created.

Frankly, this all sounds like fear of change rather than any real negative consequence.

[TheTravellers]

I apologize Pete, I was only using your profession as an example just because I was responding to your post. I would make the same argument for any profession - because truthfully they could all be automated.

I'm UNIX sys admin and seriously doubt the validity of your last statement, been doing sys admin work on mainframes and UNIX for 33 years, and don't see a point in time (during my lifetime at least) where all of my tasks could be automated. Some, yes, and I'm actively working on automating those because they're a repetitive PITA, but a wholesale get-rid-of-human-sys admins/engineers? Nope.

[ctchandler]

I like to remember (no, I'm not that old) Henry Ford's automation. It was early day "technology" and there was fear of folks losing jobs, but what actually happened was they manufactured more cars, were paid $5.00 per day (a very good pay rate in those days) ran three shifts, and produced an affordable car that until then, the average folks couldn't afford. And think of all the support jobs that were created. I was in Walmart the other day and there were only two checkers available and the lady in front of me asked whey they didn't have more, and her reply was "we can't seem to find anybody to do the job". I think automation and technology helps everyone.
C. T.

[catch22]

This isn’t really even automation in the sense of the word. The exact same work is being performed at a self checkout that happens at a staffed checkout. Items are scanned, weighed, and bagged manually, the only difference is that you are performing the work at a self check, where a cashier is performing the work at a staffed station.

I wouldn’t necessarily be opposeded to an automated checkout. You push your cart up, a robotic arm unloads your cart, scans the items, bags it for you, places it in your cart, and you are on your way out the door.

I refuse however to perform work on behalf of a company that is not paying me. Would you want a self-serve concrete truck when it comes time to pour that sidewalk in your backyard? It’s more convenient right?

[oklip955]

I was in Crest on Thursday in Edmond. As far as cashiers and baggers, most were either like you say college aged or they were seniors working to supplement their retirement. (or maybe to just get out of the house and stay in the working world). Yes it was the middle of the day so not the time for high schoolers. There will always be the need for entry jobs for high schoolers as well as seniors trying to make a few dollars.

[BBatesokc]

I was in Crest on Thursday in Edmond. As far as cashiers and baggers, most were either like you say college aged or they were seniors working to supplement their retirement. (or maybe to just get out of the house and stay in the working world). Yes it was the middle of the day so not the time for high schoolers. There will always be the need for entry jobs for high schoolers as well as seniors trying to make a few dollars.

And I'd argue there will always be jobs for those people - maybe not the exact same jobs that are available today - but still entry level, no skill jobs.

Like was pointed out earlier, lots of menial jobs have been eliminated - yet, unemployment remains at record lows.

People adapt (of course, they complain and claim the sky is falling, but they adapt nonetheless).

[Pete]

This isn’t really even automation in the sense of the word. The exact same work is being performed at a self checkout that happens at a staffed checkout. Items are scanned, weighed, and bagged manually, the only difference is that you are performing the work at a self check, where a cashier is performing the work at a staffed station.

I wouldn’t necessarily be opposeded to an automated checkout. You push your cart up, a robotic arm unloads your cart, scans the items, bags it for you, places it in your cart, and you are on your way out the door.

I refuse however to perform work on behalf of a company that is not paying me. Would you want a self-serve concrete truck when it comes time to pour that sidewalk in your backyard? It’s more convenient right?

They used to have workers dedicated to carrying your purchases out to your car and putting them in your trunk; in fact, it was the default, you didn't even have to ask.

They used to have lots more dedicated employees who were happy to run get something off the shelf.

The stores were actually stocked on shelves, not just boxes cut open and stacked.

Used to be the only way to get gas was to have someone pump it for you, where they gladly cleaned your windshield for free and checked your oil.


It's the evolution of things and the trade-off is much, much cheaper products. And, I might add, you still have the option of going through the traditional checkout. And there used to still be full-service gas stations but they died because no one wanted to pay the extra that was needed to pay the employee.

It's all supply and demand. People will pay extra for some things but not others, and that's why these changes happen.

[OKC Guy]

And I'd argue there will always be jobs for those people - maybe not the exact same jobs that are available today - but still entry level, no skill jobs.

Like was pointed out earlier, lots of menial jobs have been eliminated - yet, unemployment remains at record lows.

People adapt (of course, they complain and claim the sky is falling, but they adapt nonetheless).

I’d like to point out most of the HS and young adults won’t show up on unemployment stats. Especially if in college.

[Pete]

I’d like to point out most of the HS and young adults won’t show up on unemployment stats. Especially if in college.

I know for a fact that fast-food and restaurants have a chronic shortage of workers (I've done consulting jobs with 2 big chains), but young people generally don't want those jobs.

It's one of the reasons you see big attempts at automation in that industry as well.

[BBatesokc]

I’d like to point out most of the HS and young adults won’t show up on unemployment stats. Especially if in college.

Are you saying there is this huge unrecognized HS and young adult population that is unemployed and not even seeking benefits (which would be contained in the stats) because of automation? You're joking right?

I can't tell you the number of fast food places and other menial jobs with "help wanted" signs out.

In fact, over the years I've sought extra income from menial jobs just to pay for non-essentials that I didn't want coming out of my bank account and it's NEVER been an issue to find those jobs and that extra income.

[Dob Hooligan]

I am sure a company will say that cost savings, if any, for automated checkout are already passed on to consumers through lower, or maintained in the face of increasing, prices. The fact that stores don't have the "full service" versus "self service" pricing option (like gas stations used to have) suggests to me that there isn't a large savings. Rather it allows more people to check out and leave more quickly.

I can't recall any farmers complaining that machines have taken away their cow milking jobs?

[BBatesokc]

Speaking of Costco....

CNN: It's only $4.99. But Costco's rotisserie chicken comes at a huge price

[Mastermind]

Surprised to see the self checkout lanes during my trip today, but I hate that it's THE WORST type of self checkout system.
I know a lot of folks frown upon shoppers who have a ton of items to scan, but *I* prefer self checkout because I don't like how cashiers place the items back into the cart..
Anyway, Costco's system is terrible because it doesn't have scan guns like Sam's, and it's the annoying type where you HAVE to place the scanned items in the "bagging" area and makes you stop every second because there's an UNEXPECTED ITEM or some other ridiculous clunky UI crap. Someone from Member Services had to restart the system because it wouldn't even read my credit card -_-

I don't know if Sam's developed their own system for the self checkouts, but I've NEVER had to ask for assistance using them. Target's self checkouts are pretty decent too.
A part of me thinks Costco made the self checkouts crappy so that people will stick with human cashiers, but they seriously need to step it up.

[TheTravellers]

Surprised to see the self checkout lanes during my trip today, but I hate that it's THE WORST type of self checkout system.
I know a lot of folks frown upon shoppers who have a ton of items to scan, but *I* prefer self checkout because I don't like how cashiers place the items back into the cart..
Anyway, Costco's system is terrible because it doesn't have scan guns like Sam's, and it's the annoying type where you HAVE to place the scanned items in the "bagging" area and makes you stop every second because there's an UNEXPECTED ITEM or some other ridiculous clunky UI crap. Someone from Member Services had to restart the system because it wouldn't even read my credit card -_-

I don't know if Sam's developed their own system for the self checkouts, but I've NEVER had to ask for assistance using them. Target's self checkouts are pretty decent too.
A part of me thinks Costco made the self checkouts crappy so that people will stick with human cashiers, but they seriously need to step it up.

Pretty pathetic - all the self-checkouts I've used (Lowe's, Home Depot, Crest, etc.) don't do that "unexpected item" or "please place item in bag" crap anymore, they either don't check for the items in the bagging area or if they do pop up with that warning, you can press a key to skip bagging that item (which is still annoying, but at least you have some control). I stopped using the Britton/May Homeland's self-checkout because of that idiocy (but we don't go to that one anymore, we go to the 18th/Classen one).

[BBatesokc]

...Costco's system is terrible because it doesn't have scan guns like Sam's, and it's the annoying type where you HAVE to place the scanned items in the "bagging" area and makes you stop every second because there's an UNEXPECTED ITEM or some other ridiculous clunky UI crap. ....

Those are the absolute WORST. You'd think if any company would be on the leading edge of the customer experience it would be a company like Costco. WE DO PAY TO SHOP THERE AFTER ALL.

Which reminds me of a conversation my wife and I had the other day. We've seriously considered canceling our membership and getting a prorated refund. We find going there to be a chore and checking out to be a inconvenient. Every time we go they ask us to go exchange our membership card for a new one with our photo. Whenever we look over at the CS desk there is always a line so we say "next time."

Honestly, as little as we shop there, I can just go with my neighbor because they go every couple of weeks. I like their higher end choices, but it comes with a cost far greater than the membership dues IMO.

[chuck5815]

Those are the absolute WORST. You'd think if any company would be on the leading edge of the customer experience it would be a company like Costco. WE DO PAY TO SHOP THERE AFTER ALL.

Which reminds me of a conversation my wife and I had the other day. We've seriously considered canceling our membership and getting a prorated refund. We find going there to be a chore and checking out to be a inconvenient. Every time we go they ask us to go exchange our membership card for a new one with our photo. Whenever we look over at the CS desk there is always a line so we say "next time."

Honestly, as little as we shop there, I can just go with my neighbor because they go every couple of weeks. I like their higher end choices, but it comes with a cost far greater than the membership dues IMO.

i just hate that area of the city. way too much traffic just for the opportunity to snap an Instagram photo at the TopGolf or Costco.

i'd go over there sometimes if they had a helipad. maybe i could use St. Anthony's.