Population Growth for OKC

[soonerguru]

Then pull the stick out of your a** - must be difficult living there if you can't deal with anything halfway positive said.

I understand your pretzel logic arguments, but the bottom line is that Tulsa is stagnant and OKC is growing. You know you're stretching when you're trying to pull in places like Tahlequah and Locust Grove to find areas of growth. One is not like the other.

[PhiAlpha]

I understand your pretzel logic arguments, but the bottom line is that Tulsa is stagnant and OKC is growing. You know you're stretching when you're trying to pull in places like Tahlequah and Locust Grove to find areas of growth. One is not like the other.

Again, that’s true of the city proper, but both census MSAs are growing. OKC is growing faster.

[Mississippi Blues]

I understand your pretzel logic arguments, but the bottom line is that Tulsa is stagnant and OKC is growing. You know you're stretching when you're trying to pull in places like Tahlequah and Locust Grove to find areas of growth. One is not like the other.

I’d imagine lots of things seem like pretzel logic if you conflate any growth below boomtown status as being stagnant.

[UrbanistPoke]

I’d imagine lots of things seem like pretzel logic if you conflate any growth below boomtown status as being stagnant.

Exactly lol. Just shows how some people spout off such dumb opinions not remotely based on any facts or even doing a simple google search to see if what they're saying is slightly based in reality. The two counties with significant growth in the Tulsa area are Rogers and Wagoner which have been in the MSA definition for a very long time. If I was "looking for growth" it wouldn't be adding in Cherokee County, Mayes County, etc. as most of those have been stagnant growth wise. Mayes County has a huge lack of housing issue and that's pushed a lot of growth into Rogers County toward the Claremore area. Mayes County has barely grown population wise. Cherokee County I believe is growing population wise again but it hasn't been anything massive. Mayes County has a lot of potential to boom population wise if they can get out of their own way and make it easier to build housing. The Tulsa MSA is growing +1% per year since 2020 while OKC MSA is pushing +2% almost anymore consistently. Both are growing faster than a lot of major metros, far from "stagnant".

[josh]

No, you should learn how to read and not reply just to troll. No one here is refuting commuting patterns being part of the consideration. In this example, it's perfectly reasonable to think as Stillwater grows and the fact that Guthrie is nearly a suburb of OKC now that Stillwater may eventually develop enough ties between either Tulsa or OKC to be grouped in. No where did anyone say it should at this second or that it is.

Just like my past comments you either didn't read/comprehend (I know they were challenging topics of discussion) or you just ignored them to be a troll. I stated my option on how dumb I think commuting patterns being such an important factor. People like you are insufferable to debate or discuss a topic over.

This insult riddled sad excuse of a response is just pure irony. I doubt you’ll understand why it’s ironic but oh brother, it is.

[josh]

I’d imagine lots of things seem like pretzel logic if you conflate any growth below boomtown status as being stagnant.

Which is odd because by that logic that he seems to be using, OKC growth is stagnant as because OKC metro growth sure as heck isn’t “booming”.

[josh]

Exactly lol. Just shows how some people spout off such dumb opinions not remotely based on any facts or even doing a simple google search to see if what they're saying is slightly based in reality. The two counties with significant growth in the Tulsa area are Rogers and Wagoner which have been in the MSA definition for a very long time. If I was "looking for growth" it wouldn't be adding in Cherokee County, Mayes County, etc. as most of those have been stagnant growth wise. Mayes County has a huge lack of housing issue and that's pushed a lot of growth into Rogers County toward the Claremore area. Mayes County has barely grown population wise. Cherokee County I believe is growing population wise again but it hasn't been anything massive. Mayes County has a lot of potential to boom population wise if they can get out of their own way and make it easier to build housing. The Tulsa MSA is growing +1% per year since 2020 while OKC MSA is pushing +2% almost anymore consistently. Both are growing faster than a lot of major metros, far from "stagnant".

The OKC and Tulsa metro areas have literally the same percentage growth the last three years.

In the last two years the difference was nothing. 1 percent growth in OKC to .8 percent growth in Tulsa,

Neither metro area is booming or close to booming but neither is stagnant.

OKC really has nothing to boast about or hold over Tulsa’s head when it comes to population growth.

Both regions are experiencing moderate healthy growth.

If you really analyze the numbers, what really gives OKC the population growth advantage is their much higher birth rate. Tulsa basically has no growth from new births as the birth/death rate is nearly identical.

[Jake]

There should just be a separate OKC-Tulsa Argument thread or something for this stuff.

[OKCRealtor]

Both metro areas are healthy & growing which is great for the state. We like to take short trips to Tulsa frequently. That said, it's not on the same level as OKC and we will continue to experience more growth here. Many people who can work remotely that are moving to OK or even investing in property here are considering both areas often times. I've lost several folks who opted for Tulsa but win more that end up in OKC. For one thing it's still a good bit cheaper in Tulsa & with inflation still alive and well both areas should continue to grow. OKC is just catching up to the other top 20 cities and what's good for us should be good for Tulsa to some degree.

[BimmerSooner]

The OKC and Tulsa metro areas have literally the same percentage growth the last three years.

In the last two years the difference was nothing. 1 percent growth in OKC to .8 percent growth in Tulsa,

Neither metro area is booming or close to booming but neither is stagnant.

OKC really has nothing to boast about or hold over Tulsa’s head when it comes to population growth.

Both regions are experiencing moderate healthy growth.

If you really analyze the numbers, what really gives OKC the population growth advantage is their much higher birth rate. Tulsa basically has no growth from new births as the birth/death rate is nearly identical.

I have nothing against Tulsa, love visiting there and OKC, have no dog in the hunt...but to characterize the growth of the two metropolitan areas as "literally the same" is simply untrue and looking at it through Green Country colored glasses.

It does appear that since the last census the growth rates have seemingly become at least less lopsided toward OKC, but three years doesn't a trend make. Nonetheless, according to the US Census, OKC metro growth rate from 2020-2023 is 3.66% vs. Tulsa's 2.90%. I'm sorry, that's not "literally the same percentage". And in terms of a statistically short 3-year period of population growth, a 0.76% difference is not insignificant.

Looking at the recent decadal census numbers, it's not even close.

OKC
2000-2010 1,252,987 15.7%
2010-2020 1,425,695 13.8%

Tulsa
2000-2010 937,478 9.1%
2010-2020 1,015,331 8.3%

[Chicken In The Rough]

Tulsa's "little brother" complex is annoying.

[UrbanistPoke]

I have nothing against Tulsa, love visiting there and OKC, have no dog in the hunt...but to characterize the growth of the two metropolitan areas as "literally the same" is simply untrue and looking at it through Green Country colored glasses.

It does appear that since the last census the growth rates have seemingly become at least less lopsided toward OKC, but three years doesn't a trend make. Nonetheless, according to the US Census, OKC metro growth rate from 2020-2023 is 3.66% vs. Tulsa's 2.90%. I'm sorry, that's not "literally the same percentage". And in terms of a statistically short 3-year period of population growth, a 0.76% difference is not insignificant.

Looking at the recent decadal census numbers, it's not even close.

OKC
2000-2010 1,252,987 15.7%
2010-2020 1,425,695 13.8%

Tulsa
2000-2010 937,478 9.1%
2010-2020 1,015,331 8.3%

To be fair the other poster was just talking about the last 3 years which is true but OKC is still growing slightly faster even in the last 3 years but it has evened out some. It's a good thing to see Tulsa growing comparable finally. It gets this region closer to hitting critical mass for a lot of things like retailers, business expansions, etc.

OKC has by far been growing faster since 2000. While others may not call it 'booming' for either - there is a point when you cross into 'booming' that it is good for no one. Infrastructure can only be built so fast and just look at places like Austin, Research Triangle in NC, etc. and tell me what about that growth rate is desirable outside of the pure population growth numbers. It creates horrific traffic, unaffordable rent/housing cost rises, etc. etc. Having a growth rate between 0.75% a year and 2% a year is the ideal range, even if others hate that and consider it 'stagnant'

[Rover]

To be fair the other poster was just talking about the last 3 years which is true but OKC is still growing slightly faster even in the last 3 years but it has evened out some. It's a good thing to see Tulsa growing comparable finally. It gets this region closer to hitting critical mass for a lot of things like retailers, business expansions, etc.

OKC has by far been growing faster since 2000. While others may not call it 'booming' for either - there is a point when you cross into 'booming' that it is good for no one. Infrastructure can only be built so fast and just look at places like Austin, Research Triangle in NC, etc. and tell me what about that growth rate is desirable outside of the pure population growth numbers. It creates horrific traffic, unaffordable rent/housing cost rises, etc. etc. Having a growth rate between 0.75% a year and 2% a year is the ideal range, even if others hate that and consider it 'stagnant'

Sounds like a Yogi Berra ism…. No body wants to move to those boomtowns because they are growing so fast.

Austin and Raleigh have lots of good things going on as a result of their prosperity and growth.

[Rover]

Tulsa's "little brother" complex is annoying.

Yes. It seems like there are some on here who try to turn every thread into an “ oh, yeah, but Tulsa has….” thread. They need a “Tulsatalk” site so we can all go there tell them how OKC compares and is better. There are Tulsa threads here and they can be interesting. I love knowing what is going on there, and having lived there am glad for them. But their insecurity on OKC threads gets old.

[Urbanized]

I have nothing against Tulsa, love visiting there and OKC, have no dog in the hunt...but to characterize the growth of the two metropolitan areas as "literally the same" is simply untrue and looking at it through Green Country colored glasses….

You’re wasting your time in thoughtfully replying to an avowed and demonstrated OKC hater, but to be clear he’s not looking through Green Country glasses. I would encourage anyone considering engaging with this poster to (I’m being very serious here) click on his profile and read through a few pages of his posts. They speak for themselves. He has two types of posts on this board:

1. Promoting projects happening in San Antonio (as a reader I appreciate those and find them interesting…I assume he lives in SA)
2. Throwing cold water (and worse) on anything happening or being discussed in a positive manner regarding OKC

I’m not kidding about this…just go check his history. Let me know when you find a single one speaking positively regarding activity in OKC. His negativity toward OKC is predictable to the point of being cartoonish. And his demeanor to other posters has also become increasingly insulting and abusive, often without provocation. Again, go check the posts. It’s in black and white.

[Swake]

Yes. It seems like there are some on here who try to turn every thread into an “ oh, yeah, but Tulsa has….” thread. They need a “Tulsatalk” site so we can all go there tell them how OKC compares and is better. There are Tulsa threads here and they can be interesting. I love knowing what is going on there, and having lived there am glad for them. But their insecurity on OKC threads gets old.

There are dozens of threads and thousands of posts just like that on TulsaNow, especially on the 'the burbs' sub-board.
http://www.tulsanow.org/forum/index.php?board=32.0

[PhiAlpha]

There are dozens of threads and thousands of posts just like that on TulsaNow, especially on the 'the burbs' sub-board.
http://www.tulsanow.org/forum/index.php?board=32.0

Yeah TulsaNow kinda sucks. I feel like the people running it stopped giving a crap in like 2012.

[Mississippi Blues]

Tulsa's "little brother" complex is annoying.

Between the overcompensating from Tulsans and the haughty projecting from Texans, God bless Wichita and Kansas for stabilizing the attitudes around here.

[theanvil]

There are dozens of threads and thousands of posts just like that on TulsaNow, especially on the 'the burbs' sub-board.
http://www.tulsanow.org/forum/index.php?board=32.0

And I would suggest nobody go to r/Tulsa on Reddit. The insecurity and OKC bashing is insane. There’s one recent thread about why Tulsa should be the state capital, lol. I just don’t understand the obsession. Most people here rarely even think of Tulsa.

[BoulderSooner]

Most people here rarely even think of Tulsa.

which is both very true and also makes them furious ...

[BDP]

And in terms of a statistically short 3-year period of population growth, a 0.76% difference is not insignificant.

And the base is significantly different, too.

[Zuplar]

which is both very true and also makes them furious ...

And here's what I don't get Tulsa is a fine city. Lot's to like about it, and I'm fine with with their pride. At the same time you can tell them you agree that they live in a nice city, and yet that still won't keep them from insulting OKC somehow. I used to quip back something like oh that must be why they are the Tulsa Thunder or something else along the line. Now I just ignore them.

The thing that cracks me up the most is the people I know that are the worst about this, live in Broken Arrow.

[soonerguru]

The OKC and Tulsa metro areas have literally the same percentage growth the last three years..

What?

LOL.

OK

[Pete]

I've told this story a few times...

A few years ago I met friends from California who were in Tulsa for a wedding. I drove up there Sunday morning and they insisted on Dilley's Diner which was fine by me.

When the waitress came by, made small talk and discovered they were from Cali, I had to point out that that's where I knew them from but now lived in OKC.

This nice young woman proceeded to go on the most negative tirade about OKC, how it was ugly, how the Tulsa art scene and creative classes were miles superior, etc. I had JUST told her I was from there and it was so ridiculous it was all I could do to stop from blurting out, "You just messed with the wrong guy. Allow me to eviscerate your opinions with tons of facts."

I decided against it and later told my friends that I couldn't imagine this working the other way; that a server in OKC would bash Tulsa to no end. I never hear anybody doing that here.


I honestly wish Tulsa well. Anything they can do to raise the bar in Oklahoma is positive for everyone.

[BDP]

^^^

In my experience, most of that sentiment is really just informed by ignorance at this point. Tulsa does have a good local art scene and has strong creative organizations doing good things in and around the city. What you will find, though, when talking to someone who feels it is superior to OKC in that respect, is how little they know about OKC's art scene specifically, its creative class, or basically OKC in general.

I'll just say that anyone saying either city is "miles ahead" of the other in that respect is simply revealing that they do not attend or participate in cultural / arts events in both cities.