SoSA District

[dwellsokc]

If you poke around enough on the Planning website, you'll find a "Zoning Locator Map" that IDs specific zoning... then continue poking to find downloadable "City Ordinances," in which you'll find buried the required setbacks, FARs, and many more wonderful rules!

[MidCenturyModOKC]

Anyone know of any new projects in this neighborhood? Just thinking we could revisit where SoSa is at and where it is headed. Is there a neighborhood group of any kind?

[metro]

No there isn't. I tried to start one years ago with Dwells support, but I just didn't have the time.

[dwellsokc]

There are a few new projects on the board: The Mode multifamily project at 9th & Shartel, and a private residence at 7th & Dewey… one is contemporary, the other a contrary retro design.

Although I personally prefer contemporary design, I promote design freedom… but first there has to be design. (I’d prefer not to see “builder” cottages or McMansions because there are plenty of other places where those are appropriate, not in SoSA.)

The City’s design guidelines COULD be crafted to encourage a contemporary or even experimental esthetic, but those crafters are not crafty enough… and a group of neighbors will have a group of differing preferences that would turn into guideline-mush.

We’ll know where SoSA is headed when it gets there.

[tuck]

Two additional home projects should start at 7th and Dewey within the next few months, from what I have heard.

[Rover]

The City’s design guidelines COULD be crafted to encourage a contemporary or even experimental esthetic, but those crafters are not crafty enough… and a group of neighbors will have a group of differing preferences that would turn into guideline-mush.

We’ll know where SoSA is headed when it gets there.

So now you want our government to start telling people where they have to live if they want a certain type of aesthetic/size of home? This sounds very much like central social planning or the city as a developer. I think I prefer organic mix and choice. Homogeneous neighborhoods may well develop if there is enough demand for it and a private developer or sets of developers will collaborate. However, we tend to object to planned developments here.

[ThePlainsman]

Most are well under $10K, however some are upwards of $25K. There i are at least two squatter property owners living in a dream wanting $200K plus for a lot. They will NEVER get it. This is OKC, not Boston.

Really? When I looked at them this time in 2010, they were primarily bought up by local architects for around 12k, but now listed at 60k. And...you have to use the seller of the lot as your architect/contractor.

I'd look at buying one today for 10k. But I'd pick my architect and builder.

Opinion time--My reading of what's going on or has gone on is that there are basically two primary architects driving this train and that they seem to disagree on principle. I've been advised to "look elsewhere" by several folks. On the other hand, I've heard that it's a great neighborly 'hood as well. I think there was a "rush" on the lots over the past 3 or 4 years, but it's resulted in a holding pattern as I personally don't believe that most folks are willing to spend 500+ k for these type of homes on these smallish lots and be handcuffed to whatever someone else deems as "appropriate". The city ordinance allows for considerably more latitude than the designs currently seen.

It's a little frustrating knowing that I could buy and build a home in this area immediately, but am unwilling to get fleeced into buying a lot that sold for 10 or 12k and trying to be flipped for 60k and even then be tied to a specific arch/contactor. I'm all for people speculating and making a buck, but 12k to 60k is unreasonable and frankly, insulting.

As I've heard said before, it takes one with more money than good sense. As appealing as this development could be, I just can't take leave of good decision making.

Prove me wrong.

[metro]

ThePlainsmen, I own property in the area. If you're talking about a lot on the market ready to go,usually owned by Randy Floyd, Brian Fitzsimmons (two of the well renowned architects) then yes it can be expensive, but if you do your own finding and negotiating you can still find a reasonable lot. There are a few spec owners who've owned them forever and are basically squatters and don't know the current dynamics of the current economy. As I mentioned, one of them is asking $250K for the small lot on the SE corner of 7th and Dewey, COMPLETELY realistic. We all know who the 2 big players are in SoSA, Fitzsimmons and Floyd, no need hiding that fact and yes Randy is the traditionalist and Brian is the modernist.

[LakeEffect]

We all know who the 2 big players are in SoSA, Fitzsimmons and Floyd, no need hiding that fact and yes Randy is the traditionalist and Brian is the modernist.

I'd hardly call randy a traditionalist. The peoples residence in the Cottage District and her sister's house in Edgemere demonstrate that. However, her views towards setbacks and some other details are quite different from D Wells and Fitzsimmons.

[onthestrip]

O

Really? When I looked at them this time in 2010, they were primarily bought up by local architects for around 12k, but now listed at 60k. And...you have to use the seller of the lot as your architect/contractor.I
I'd look at buying one today for 10k. But I'd pick my architect and builder.

Opinion time--My reading of what's going on or has gone on is that there are basically two primary architects driving this train and that they seem to disagree on principle. I've been advised to "look elsewhere" by several folks. On the other hand, I've heard that it's a great neighborly 'hood as well. I think there was a "rush" on the lots over the past 3 or 4 years, but it's resulted in a holding pattern as I personally don't believe that most folks are willing to spend 500+ k for these type of homes on these smallish lots and be handcuffed to whatever someone else deems as "appropriate". The city ordinance allows for considerably more latitude than the designs currently seen.

It's a little frustrating knowing that I could buy and build a home in this area immediately, but am unwilling to get fleeced into buying a lot that sold for 10 or 12k and trying to be flipped for 60k and even then be tied to a specific arch/contactor. I'm all for people speculating and making a buck, but 12k to 60k is unreasonable and frankly, insulting.

As I've heard said before, it takes one with more money than good sense. As appealing as this development could be, I just can't take leave of good decision making.

Prove me wrong.

Totally agree.

[BDP]

So now you want our government to start telling people where they have to live if they want a certain type of aesthetic/size of home?

This would not be the "start" of it. In most cases you can not build what you want however you want in any neighborhood. I am sure there is something you would not want built next door to you.

[dwellsokc]

--My reading of what's going on or has gone on is that there are basically two primary architects driving this train and that they seem to disagree on principle. I've been advised to "look elsewhere" by several folks. On the other hand, I've heard that it's a great neighborly 'hood as well. I think there was a "rush" on the lots over the past 3 or 4 years, but it's resulted in a holding pattern as I personally don't believe that most folks are willing to spend 500+ k for these type of homes on these smallish lots and be handcuffed to whatever someone else deems as "appropriate". The city ordinance allows for considerably more latitude than the designs currently seen.

You're right. It's sad that holding lots hostage (whether from greed of money or design) is obstructing people from contributing to SoSA's growth. I know that one particular squatter has quipped that their sacred lot will not be sold for anything short of a $1M house... I call that design fascism (or maybe just being out of touch with reality).

With these attitudes, SoSA risks being leap-frogged by other neighborhoods, and left forever with missing teeth and stunted density... A shameful waste of potential.

[Spartan]

You're right. It's sad that holding lots hostage (whether from greed of money or design) is obstructing people from contributing to SoSA's growth. I know that one particular squatter has quipped that their sacred lot will not be sold for anything short of a $1M house... I call that design fascism (or maybe just being out of touch with reality).

With these attitudes, SoSA risks being leap-frogged by other neighborhoods, and left forever with missing teeth and stunted density... A shameful waste of potential.

This is going to keep happening everywhere, whether it be Bricktown or SoSA, just because per sq ft mol real estate values in OKC are so low. It's going to make the economics of quality development in general very difficult.

[Urban Pioneer]

For what it's worth, I own land there. I'm not greedy, but looking for like minded people to build a building containing three to four flats with a small "yard" for pets and garden. Feel free to hit me up. First public overture.

And also, the views are spectacular...

[MidCenturyModOKC]

At the end of this year I am going to get really serious about finding a lot in the $15-20,000 range and building a single family home for myself- I have saved and have spent every bonus dollar/weekend fixing up my current fixer upper to gain equity.

So my question is if the big players are Floyd and Fitzgerald then which one of these architects are more likely to work on smaller scale projects (such as something in the $200,000 neighborhood), either?! Would I be better off trying to find another arch/builder? I love having someone who shares my style and also an interest in the area that I like but from what I am hearing $1M and up is NOT going to apply to me.

[Urban Pioneer]

Branson Young, David Wanzer, Kenneth Fitzsimmons (Brian's Brother), and Sam Gresham are all familar with innercity projects on a budget. It depends on the style you like. But there are other options than the SOSA invested architects.

Randy Floyd and Brian Fitzsimmons have simply established themselves well in both the redevelopment record and the neighborly one as well. But it doesn't mean they "own" the entire area.

[MidCenturyModOKC]

Thanks Urban Pioneer! I am spending today researching the above names that you mentioned. My style is the Hook Residence by Randy Floyd but it is way out of my price range. I also like the personal home that Branson Young did in the SoSA area a great deal!

[bella]

For clarity, Fitzsimmons has designed and built two houses in SOSA, one personal, one for a client. Neither cost anything near the million dollar mark, nor the half million dollar mark for that matter, land and fees included.

He does have one lot for sale in the area, BUT there are NOT any so called design strings attached.

[MidCenturyModOKC]

Bella do you happen to know where the lot is? I drove through SoSA today looking for signs. No luck really.

[MIKELS129]

[QUOTE=MidCenturyModOKC;485035]At the end of this year I am going to get really serious about finding a lot in the $15-20,000 range and building a single family home for myself- I have saved and have spent every bonus dollar/weekend fixing up my current fixer upper to gain equity.QUOTE]

I don't think there will be any 25ft lots in SoSa for less than 35m to 40m. I fact from what I have heard that would be a very good price; if there are any.

[betts]

There was a lot next to the Valir Hospital that I thought was under$15,000 as well as one on 8th or 9th near Classen that was about that price, on the south side of the street.

[bella]

Bella do you happen to know where the lot is? I drove through SoSA today looking for signs. No luck really.

Its listed under Pat Slack Realty. It may be shortly perceived off of the market, but is being relisted.

[One Dot Less Than Nine]

I agree the style is a little strange, it's not bad, and looks MUCH better than a lot of the crap being allowed downtown and inner city. And a bigger bonus, it's infill of a vacant lot in a up and coming area, AND it looks like it's being built on a zero lot line with retail store frontage. This will be good for pedestrian traffic. We still have HUNDREDS of vacant lots that need filling in downtown. I'm with Kerry, let's not settle for subpar, but at some point we need to be realistic and accept infill with compromised standards (yet still slightly better than the past, but encouraging even better standards when possible). Once we have some mass density, then the nicer projects will come anyways.

I agree. I suppose its better than nothing. But I would have liked it to fit with the fabric that is being created by the newer construction in the area rather than attempting to be something its not.

[One Dot Less Than Nine]

Thanks Urban Pioneer! I am spending today researching the above names that you mentioned. My style is the Hook Residence by Randy Floyd but it is way out of my price range. I also like the personal home that Branson Young did in the SoSA area a great deal!

Thanks!! Still very much a work in progress but we are chipping away at it.

[One Dot Less Than Nine]

523 NW 7th $65,000 mls# 461291
1008 N. Francis Ave. $20,000 mls#466816
Theres the lot that Bella referred to that is East of Francis on the South side of NW 8th Street, theres a lot to the west of us on the NE corner of Classen and NW 8th that has a for sale sign on it for REX realty 816-7115

There are several properties in the area that are either vacant or have dilapidated structures on them that would be terrific to develop. I would suggest finding a property that you are interested in, look up the owner with the county assessor and contact them with an offer.