Baptist pastor calls for Police Chief Citty's resignation (YouTube link/letter)

[urbanity]

http://www.okgazette.com/oklahoma/ar...der-siege.html

[BBatesokc]

[Easy180]

Always look to pastors for advice on gun control...With their years of required education on the subject

[betts]

They're getting rather political at that church, aren't they?

[bornhere]

They've always been political.

[brianinok]

This after that article a day or two ago about the tea partiers trying to take over the OKC city council being from that church. I'm sure glad my church (which also happens to be Baptist) doesn't get involved in politics like that church.

[Jersey Boss]

Must be a full moon.

[onthestrip]

Wow, a police chief doesn't want his officers outgunned, shocking. That's like criticizing a fire marshal for wanting a town to keep fireworks out of city limits. How can you blame the guy?

[ljbab728]

Sounds like we're developing our own version of the Hillsboro Baptist Church.

[bornhere]

I don't know if they still do it, but when Vineyard's father was pastor, Windsor Hills also sponsored a big 'police appreciation' event that, if my memory is correct, was cosponsored by the FOP lodge. Also, reaching waaay back in time, I seem to remember Windsor Hills providing 'ground troops' for Larry Jones's picket lines in front of adult bookstores.

[kevinpate]

Sounds like we're developing our own version of the Hillsboro Baptist Church.

Westboro maybe? If you mean the funeral protester bunch out of Kansas, I don't see the comparison myself.

[dhawkins]

I'm sure glad my church (which also happens to be Baptist) doesn't get involved in politics like that church.

According to their website: Windsor Hills Baptist Church is an independent, fundamental Baptist Church.
According to Wikipedia:
Independent Baptist churches (some also referred to as Independent Fundamental Baptist, or IFB) are Christian churches generally holding to conservative Baptist beliefs. They are characterized by being independent from the authority of denominations or similar bodies. Within some denominational churches more conservative elements set about establishing new Independent Baptist churches instead of remaining within the denominational churches.
Independent Baptists remain autonomous and congregationalist in nature and are generally fundamentalist in teaching. The IFB movement is not a denomination per se, but there are similarities that run throughout most independent Baptist churches. They reject some beliefs and practices found in most denominational churches because of their belief in the doctrine of separation, based on the command "…Come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord…."(II Corinthians 6:17

The Westboro Baptist Church is not affiliated with any known Baptist conventions or associations. The church describes itself as following Primitive Baptist and Calvinist principles, though mainstream Primitive Baptists reject the WBC and Phelps

[ljbab728]

Westboro maybe? If you mean the funeral protester bunch out of Kansas, I don't see the comparison myself.

Sorry, I definitely meant Westboro. My comparison was that they are trying to get heavily involved in nontraditional activities. Protesting at funerals is only the most openly seen aspect of their activities and views. It was not meant as a literal comparison of the views of both churches

[venture]

I wonder what would happen if churches became taxable entities once they started getting involved in politics?

[soonerguru]

I wonder what would happen if churches became taxable entities once they started getting involved in politics?

Maybe that would help bring down the deficit.

[Meaculpa]

Churches are allowed to be be involved in the political process when it comes to issues. They must stay non-partisan and cannot get involved in a candidate's campaign.
This is my understanding of their ability to stay tax exempt.

[betts]

So, no one in the pulpit tells the congregation how to vote? It might be interesting to attend the services the week prior to the City Council election.

[Meaculpa]

Not supposed to. If they want to stay tax exempt.
Churches have lost their status as tax exempt for telling members how to vote on an election. However if the vote is issue based (such as the lottery), then yes a church representative can advice his/her parish how to vote and retain their tax exempt status.
This is my understanding. I am well invloved in social justice activities with the Catholic Church. I speak from the experience I have had in the role.

Peace........

[Spartan]

Churches are allowed to be be involved in the political process when it comes to issues. They must stay non-partisan and cannot get involved in a candidate's campaign.
This is my understanding of their ability to stay tax exempt.

Meaculpa--

I think you're right about the letter of the law, but my point to just add to what you have to say, because I'm curious what you think, is that it's kind of impossible to enforce even if churches get partisan. Usually what the advocate churches do is rail all day about issues that obviously correspond to certain candidates, and even attack certain candidates on social issues, but they do a good job of walking a fine line and not finishing the train of thought with, "So what did we learn today? Vote for Smith!" or whoever. Really, I see that as the same thing, but you can't inhibit a churches freedom of expression.

The only thing you can hope for is that people understand when their preacher or pastor or priest or whatever is not being religiously honest and is start to try to force them to think a certain way. People should have the spine to walk up and leave, but they rarely do. Usually people first let it blow over, then they sit there and think about it and it begins to fester and then the brainwashing is on and next thing you know they're voting and drinking the koolaid.

[Doug Loudenback]

In 2008, as an inducement to get teenagers to come to a weekend youth retreat or camp, a give-away was going to be an $800 AR-47. Apparently that had occurred the year before, but this time it didn't happen. A story is here: http://www.koco.com/news/16860079/detail.html. The video there doesn't work but it shows the start-screen for the video, an ad for the weekend, as follows:

[Doug Loudenback]

FWIW, I saw in an on-line video taken of proceedings a few days ago that WHBC hosts regular meetings of the John Birch Society. The announcement came from the pulpit that the regular meeting would no occur as a precinct meeting wold occur on that night, instead. Somebody's gotta do it, I guess.

[urbanity]

http://www.okgazette.com/oklahoma/ar...for-three.html