Oklahoma liquor laws

[warreng88]

I can see some pushback from small liquor stores on refrigeration but not much, I think most either want to offer it or they don't care at all.

So, I confused a little by this; would liquor stores be required to install refrigeration or would it just be an option?

[bchris02]

From the JR:

State Rep. James Lockhart, D-Heavener, said via email the bill would not have his support. He historically votes against matters that increase access to alcohol, including the bill – now law – that allows breweries to offer house-made beer samples.

“I had several friends from high school and college die in alcohol-related traffic incidents,” he said. “I generally vote against any legislation that I feel would put more drunk drivers on our roads.”

This is going to be the biggest obstacle towards passing something like this. The larger liquor stores with money to actually pull weight i.e. Byrons are more than likely for refrigeration. Our conservative state lawmakers aren't going to want to vote for anything that will offend MADD groups or fundamental Baptists whose votes they rely on.

[bchris02]

So, I confused a little by this; would liquor stores be required to install refrigeration or would it just be an option?

It will be an option, but a lot of the smaller stores don't want the expense yet also don't want the competition from the larger stores that opt for refrigeration. I had a discussion with the owner of the small liquor store near where I live regarding it. She said that if it passes, she will have to mark everything up 25-50% to cover the costs or just not offer refrigeration, both of which would cost her business. Understandable from her perspective, but I don't understand how 49 other states have no problems allowing refrigerated beer yet this one does.

[warreng88]

It will be an option, but a lot of the smaller stores don't want the expense yet also don't want the competition from the larger stores that opt for refrigeration. I had a discussion with the owner of the small liquor store near where I live regarding it. She said that if it passes, she will have to mark everything up 25-50% to cover the costs or just not offer refrigeration, both of which would cost her business. Understandable from her perspective, but I don't understand how 49 other states have no problems allowing refrigerated beer yet this one does.

This is my biggest issue. How is that all the other states seem to have smaller liquor stores operating in tandem with larger liquor stores? When we went to Maui, we went to Whole Foods to get some snacks and food for breakfast each day. The law in Hawaii is liquor can be sold on the shelves at grocery stores, not unlike several other states. But everywhere we went, there were small liquor stores too. How do those survive?

[bille]

25-50% markup seems rather extreme. I frequent stores in Texas that have massive walk-ins where 75-90% of their beer is refrigerated, that's certainly not cheap to buy or pay utilities on but at the same time they survive and have competitive prices. Sure a smaller place will be limited but I can't see a three door true cooler breaking the bank causing them to raise prices out of a competitive window or worse, fold for not offering refrigeration. Besides if the bread and butter is all on wine like Jerry says why would they care anyway?

[warreng88]

Maybe the mark up would be higher at first and then as sales increase it could decline? I still wonder how this is done in other states and not here.

[jerrywall]

Maybe the mark up would be higher at first and then as sales increase it could decline? I still wonder how this is done in other states and not here.

Because the coolers were part of the initial cost of getting the stores up and running, and now a new cost on an established store. It will be much easier for the larger stores to absorb the cost, or get a business loan. Many of the small shops are just barely making money.

[bille]

So in your opinion would $5k really break the bank?

[warreng88]

So in your opinion would $5k really break the bank?

Yeah, that's what doesn't make sense to me. I would think if it were that detrimental to the business, maybe focus your sales on wine and liquor and less on beer. I would be curious what the markup on beer, wine and liquor are. I would think beer would be highest and that is where they make their most money.

[jerrywall]

So in your opinion would $5k really break the bank?

Do you keep $5k sitting around to spare?

[bille]

Do you keep $5k sitting around to spare?

I don't own a liquor store so commenting what I'd do is a moot point. That said if you want your business to prosper you have to be willing to reinvest and sometimes that may involve borrowing money in order to do so, right? Unless of course you're simply in the business just to make money/pay bills.

Let me phrase it another way. If I owned a liquor store I'd want to be a relevant competitor with a focus on beer that was matched or bettered only by the states best stores. Sure this won't happen overnight but it's something I'd constantly be striving for and passing on refrigeration in my store would not even be a consideration.

[jerrywall]

I don't own a liquor store so commenting what I'd do is a moot point. That said if you want your business to prosper you have to be willing to reinvest and sometimes that may involve borrowing money in order to do so, right? Unless of course you're simply in the business just to make money/pay bills.

Let me phrase it another way. If I owned a liquor store I'd want to be a relevant competitor with a focus on beer that was matched or bettered only by the states best stores. Sure this won't happen overnight but it's something I'd constantly be striving for and passing on refrigeration in my store would not even be a consideration.

I agree and like I mentioned, I think the stores that don't do it will fade away. I was just explaining why some stores won't be able to. They either won't have the capital or the credit to make the upgrade. Some may not have the space or setup. Sam's, Byron's, Panchos, The Cellar, and most of those size shops will certainly have no problem.

[ljbab728]

Another somewhat progressive bill is being proposed.

Proposed bill would put Oklahoma beermakers on par with wineries | NewsOK.com

A bill proposed by a Tulsa senator would bring brewers of high-point beer in Oklahoma on par with wineries by giving them the ability to sell their products directly to consumers on site.

Senate Bill 424 by Sen. Brian Crain, R-Tulsa, would amend state statute to allow breweries to sell high-point beer to consumers “on the premises of the brewery.”

[ljbab728]

Thirsty Beagle: Refrigeration legislation could topple Oklahoma beer distribution barrier | NewsOK.com

Passage of SB 383 could lead to the opening of Oklahoma’s borders to several high-profile national craft beer brands.

Candidate No. 1 could be a brand that all hardcore beer fans would know, and one that even most casual consumers would recognize.

New Belgium Brewing Co., of Fort Collins, Colo., has for years maintained it would not distribute its products — including the ubiquitous Fat Tire Amber Ale — in Oklahoma due to the state’s alcohol distribution laws and lack of liquor-store refrigeration. The standard argument has been that the company cannot ensure its beers will be fresh if left unrefrigerated for extended stretches.

New Belgium’s reaction to the potential passage of SB 383?

“For us I’d say it’s the biggest piece of the puzzle,” said Brian Krueger, who leads New Belgium’s sales team in opening new markets.

[loveOKC]

What can we do to support this bill? What are the next steps before this can pass?

[bchris02]

What can we do to support this bill? What are the next steps before this can pass?

Agree. Anybody know what the next steps are and if us as the consumer can contribute in any way to helping it pass?

In my opinion this is one of the biggest pieces of the puzzle towards bringing Oklahoma's liquor laws in line with the rest of the country. This state isn't alone in having 3.2 beer or no wine in grocery, but it is the only state that requires beer be sold at room temperature. That needs to change.

[Urbanized]

Too bad that we didn't get it before Fat Tire lost a step. If I had taps in front of me for both Fat Tire and COOP Native Amber I'd pick NA every time. But it would still be great to have New Belgium, for sure.

[bchris02]

Too bad that we didn't get it before Fat Tire lost a step. If I had taps in front of me for both Fat Tire and COOP Native Amber I'd pick NA every time. But it would still be great to have New Belgium, for sure.

Personally I would as well. I think Fat Tire is very overhyped. New Belgium has other beers though that are different from anything else I've had, such as 1554, and I will be very excited to not have to drive to Dallas or Ft. Smith to get it.

[Urbanized]

The funny thing is, I don't think Fat Tire was overhyped 15 years ago. It definitely changed a bit when they expanded production. I toured the brewery a couple of years ago, and the difference between the old plant (which still exists) and the new one is astonishing. It's a fantastic place, but you can't escape the fact that these days it is very much a large beer factory rather than a warm and fuzzy craft brewer.

[bille]

Agree. Anybody know what the next steps are and if us as the consumer can contribute in any way to helping it pass?

In my opinion this is one of the biggest pieces of the puzzle towards bringing Oklahoma's liquor laws in line with the rest of the country. This state isn't alone in having 3.2 beer or no wine in grocery, but it is the only state that requires beer be sold at room temperature. That needs to change.

I’m glad you asked!

Follow Senator Bice

Follow LOCAL

Contact your state reps and voice your support for both of these bills!

If you go to LOCAL’s website they even have talking points and the hyperlink to finding your rep, it doesn’t get much easier than that.
What to say when you contact your reps about SB 383 and SB 424

Personally I would as well. I think Fat Tire is very overhyped. New Belgium has other beers though that are different from anything else I've had, such as 1554, and I will be very excited to not have to drive to Dallas or Ft. Smith to get it.

I also agree Fat Tire is overhyped but I’m fine with it if it continues to be a gateway into craft that it has been over the years. Many say the same for Boston Lager and Sierra Nevada Pale Ale. The fact is little has changed about these beers over their time; it’s our palates that have evolved as our craft beer journey continues. For the record the only thing that Fat Tire and Native Amber is that they are both ‘amber’ beers, other than that they are very different imo (Native Amber is WAY better). I will drink Fat Tire but don’t seek it out and wouldn’t even if it were available here. The same can be said for the majority of New Belgium’s core lineup, HOWEVER, I love their sour beers and once we get distro on their beers and people start getting access to more “mainstream” sour beer their lives will be forever changed. It’s akin to discovering you’re a fan of hoppy beers, an entire realm of beer and a multitude of beer categories are yet to be discovered in our state. At this stage we’re barely scraping the surface of this monster that’s building, which is why it’s paramount that we start updating our laws now.

[loveOKC]

Great, Thank you. I did this and shared to social media.

[bchris02]

I also agree Fat Tire is overhyped but I’m fine with it if it continues to be a gateway into craft that it has been over the years. Many say the same for Boston Lager and Sierra Nevada Pale Ale. The fact is little has changed about these beers over their time; it’s our palates that have evolved as our craft beer journey continues. For the record the only thing that Fat Tire and Native Amber is that they are both ‘amber’ beers, other than that they are very different imo (Native Amber is WAY better). I will drink Fat Tire but don’t seek it out and wouldn’t even if it were available here. The same can be said for the majority of New Belgium’s core lineup, HOWEVER, I love their sour beers and once we get distro on their beers and people start getting access to more “mainstream” sour beer their lives will be forever changed. It’s akin to discovering you’re a fan of hoppy beers, an entire realm of beer and a multitude of beer categories are yet to be discovered in our state. At this stage we’re barely scraping the surface of this monster that’s building, which is why it’s paramount that we start updating our laws now.

I agree with this completely. Sam Adams Boston Lager used to be my absolute favorite beer. Today, I will drink it but I don't usually order it unless I am somewhere that it is the most complex thing served. Many of my go-tos when I first started drinking (Dos Equis, Corona, Beck's, Rolling Rock) are hardly drinkable for me now. Most of my experience with New Belgium beers was years ago so I'll be interested to see how my current palate responds to them. At the time, I could hardly stand the taste of IPAs. Now I love them.

[Urbanized]

Actually Native Amber was specifically brewed from the start to be a substitute for those who loved Fat Tire but couldn't get it here. Except that it was modeled after the earlier, fresher version of FT. Trust me on this; it's fact. But you are correct that it is much better.

[bluedogok]

I prefer Breckenridge Avalanche to Fat Tire, still prefer Shiner Bock but I drink all three depending upon what is available. Just like Shiner is available almost everywhere in Austin Fat Tire is like that up here, Avalanche doesn't have the same level of distribution.

I did bring a case of Fat Tire up to OKC for someone on Spartan's old forum when I lived in Austin.

[bradh]

When I first moved here six years ago Breck Av was available here, and was pulled out of OK shortly after. Love that beer