University Town Center

[BoulderSooner]

I would make sure the mixed use portion of this proposal is built and leased well before I promised to play home games in the new arena. If this ends up just being an 8,000 seat arena surrounded by nothing or is developed like the south portion of UTC is then staying at LNC for the next 20 years would be the better option by far.

if this was a new building in an empty field at the proposed location it would still be 100x better then staying at the LNC

[Pete]

if this was a new building in an empty field at the proposed location it would still be 100x better then staying at the LNC

Yep.

[GoGators]

if this was a new building in an empty field at the proposed location it would still be 100x better then staying at the LNC

You will most likely find out if that is actually true because a new building in an empty field at the proposed location is the most likely outcome.

[Pete]

You will most likely find out if that is actually true because a new building in an empty field at the proposed location is the most likely outcome.

Based on what other than your high hopes this will all somehow fail?

[SEMIweather]

Based on what other than your high hopes this will all somehow fail?

Based on the fact that the closest restaurant to the proposed location as of this moment of time is a Chuck E. Cheese.

[GoGators]

Based on what other than your high hopes this will all somehow fail?

Based on what has previously been promised by the developers of UTC vs what has actually been delivered.

[Jersey Boss]

Does OU currently own all the land that the proposed entertainment district would sit on? Who will own the land if this deal goes through? If OU sells it what will they get?

[Pete]

Does OU currently own all the land that the proposed entertainment district would sit on? Who will own the land if this deal goes through? If OU sells it what will they get?

Yes, the OU Foundation owns all of it.

They will likely contribute at least some of the land as a contribution towards the project. The rest will probably be sold for profit, as they did with all the land to the south in UTC.

[Video Expert]

I'm going to let the rest of you debate the funding, location, and viability of the new OU Arena and this Entertainment District. I also didn't attend either OU or OSU, so I have nothing to add to that back and forth. But I will say as a 25 year resident/home owner in Norman, this is the first time I have ever seen the City Officials, County, OU, Mayor, City Council, the Chamber, et al, all on the same page about anything. That just never happens. So that does give me some optimism that this has been well thought out, planned, and that the project will actually get built and be successful. I don't believe this project could feasibly be done on or close to the OU campus in the near future or that's what they would be proposing in the first place.

[caaokc]

Joe C said earlier in the spring that 85 percent of students drive to games, so it shouldn’t be much of an issue. Also, 8k is a great number for the arena.

[Pete]

Joe C said earlier in the spring that 85 percent of students drive to games, so it shouldn’t be much of an issue. Also, 8k is a great number for the arena.

It's very hard for me to believe that even 15% don't drive. I never, ever saw that when I was a student.

[Video Expert]

My #1 concern is going to be the transportation infrastructure around this area and how it's going to affect my (and other Normanites) way around town on a daily basis. I live in North Norman and so this project is going to obviously affect me and others who live here whether we like it or not. I certainly do not want to see Norman traffic become just as awful (or worse) than what we now see in Edmond.

[jdross1982]

My #1 concern is going to be the transportation infrastructure around this area and how it's going to affect my (and other Normanites) way around town on a daily basis. I live in North Norman and so this project is going to obviously affect me and others who live here whether we like it or not. I certainly do not want to see Norman traffic become just as awful (or worse) than what we now see in Edmond.

Agree with you but that is even more reason for it to go in this development. Additional infrastructure is needed regardless of where this will be built. Improvements to Robinson, Rock Creek and Tecumseh will all be needed and the service road needs to be extended from South of Cavenders to Tecumseh.

[SEMIweather]

Agree with you but that is even more reason for it to go in this development. Additional infrastructure is needed regardless of where this will be built. Improvements to Robinson, Rock Creek and Tecumseh will all be needed and the service road needs to be extended from South of Cavenders to Tecumseh.

I would hope that this will be the impetus for Norman to extend 24th Ave NW out to Flood instead of having it dead-end at Tecumseh.

It would also be ideal to add an exit onto the east side service road from NB I-35 to the south of the Rock Creek underpass, and an entrance onto NB I-35 from the east side service road to the north of the Rock Creek underpass. Doing anything with the west side service road is going to be just about impossible given the current configuration, but I think adding a half interchange to the east side service road is doable.

[Video Expert]

Agree with you but that is even more reason for it to go in this development. Additional infrastructure is needed regardless of where this will be built. Improvements to Robinson, Rock Creek and Tecumseh will all be needed and the service road needs to be extended from South of Cavenders to Tecumseh.

Agreed. I've thought quite a bit about this. There will need to be on/off ramps installed at the Rock Creek overpass. They are going to have to widen, add additional turn lanes, etc. in the Tecumseh/Flood/24th Ave. NW/I-35 area because it's a nightmare traffic problem as it stands now with all of the growth in North Norman. Extending 24th Ave. NW from where it currently ends at Tecumseh up to the North a couple of blocks to intersect at Flood will have to happen as well so those exiting Southbound I-35 on Flood have a direct route into the district without having to turn right on Tecumseh and then Left at 24th.

To your point JDRoss, officials are going to have to negotiate with Southwestern Wire to secure at the very least, right-of-way for a service/frontage road extension of Interstate Drive (on the East side of I-35) from the Subaru dealership northward to Tecumseh. For the right price, they might be able to buy them out completely and have them relocate elsewhere as this property is huge and a major eyesore. And speaking of frontage roads, they are going to have to make Interstate Drive One-way on each side of I-35. That's going to be unfortunate for some of us who like the current setup, but it is what it is.

And while they're at it, ODOT better figure out a plan quick to propose a railroad underpass for Tecumseh (US-77) just East of Flood. Hopefully the City can work with ODOT to make this happen.

[mugofbeer]

Agreed. I've thought quite a bit about this. There will need to be on/off ramps installed at the Rock Creek overpass. They are going to have to widen, add additional turn lanes, etc. in the Tecumseh/Flood/24th Ave. NW/I-35 area because it's a nightmare traffic problem as it stands now with all of the growth in North Norman. Extending 24th Ave. NW from where it currently ends at Tecumseh up to the North a couple of blocks to intersect at Flood will have to happen as well so those exiting Southbound I-35 on Flood have a direct route into the district without having to turn right on Tecumseh and then Left at 24th.

To your point JDRoss, officials are going to have to negotiate with Southwestern Wire to secure at the very least, right-of-way for a service/frontage road extension of Interstate Drive (on the East side of I-35) from the Subaru dealership northward to Tecumseh. For the right price, they might be able to buy them out completely and have them relocate elsewhere as this property is huge and a major eyesore. And speaking of frontage roads, they are going to have to make Interstate Drive One-way on each side of I-35. That's going to be unfortunate for some of us who like the current setup, but it is what it is.

And while they're at it, ODOT better figure out a plan quick to propose a railroad underpass for Tecumseh (US-77) just East of Flood. Hopefully the City can work with ODOT to make this happen.

This is something that should be done anyway, just to avoid it turning into another absurd traffic nightmare like Moore. The starting point should be to get rid of the 1960's two-way access roads!

[warreng88]

My #1 concern is going to be the transportation infrastructure around this area and how it's going to affect my (and other Normanites) way around town on a daily basis. I live in North Norman and so this project is going to obviously affect me and others who live here whether we like it or not. I certainly do not want to see Norman traffic become just as awful (or worse) than what we now see in Edmond.

It shouldn't affect traffic too much if the naysayers are correct because it won't be successful anyways... ::end sarcasm::

[Pete]

I'm sure the arena and entertainment district are needed to complement each other.

There is absolutely nothing, anywhere, that even hints that the arena would be built without the entertainment amenities.

And there is no way anyone truly believes that OU, their regents, the university president and arguably the best athletic director in the country hasn't thought all this through. It's all a bunch of wild speculation fueled by agenda-driven negativity.

[PhiAlpha]

I'm sure the arena and entertainment district are needed to complement each other.

There is absolutely nothing, anywhere, that even hints that the arena would be built without the entertainment amenities.

And there is no way anyone truly believes that OU, their regents, the university president and arguably the best athletic director in the country hasn't thought all this through. It's all a bunch of wild speculation fueled by agenda-driven negativity.

Best point you could make on this. No way the athletic department makes a decision of this magnitude with everything that's riding on it, without having done their due diligence and gotten the necessary assurances from developers/the city.

[Pete]

But, but...

What if OU has a big master plan just to crater and stick taxpayers with all their debt?

What if there is a plague of locusts that descend on North Norman?

What if a ton of really smart people with the university's best interest at heart are really dumber than a bunch of fans from another school who have no idea what they are talking about and keep making false statements to prove it?

These are basically the arguments being presented.


It's valid to discuss concerns about moving the games a fair distance from the main campus and it's valid to worry about ingress and egress but the rest of this is just wishful thinking by people who want to see OU fail so they can feel better about their own miserable situation.

[PhiAlpha]

But, but...

What if OU has a big master plan just to crater and stick taxpayers with all their debt?

What if there is a plague of locusts that descend on North Norman?

What if a ton of really smart people with the university's best interest at heart are really dumber than a bunch of fans from another school who have no idea what they are talking about and keep making false statements to prove it?

These are basically the arguments being presented.


It's valid to discuss concerns about moving the games a fair distance from the main campus and it's valid to worry about ingress and egress but the rest of this is just wishful thinking by people who want to see OU fail so they can feel better about their own miserable situation.

You forgot about OU banishing fans to a children's rat casino for pre and post game entertainment. Heard they have a hell of a house band though. (sorry, had to lol)

[Pete]

This is from Placer, a commercial real estate database.

UNP has more visits than any other shopping center in Central Oklahoma and probably the entire state. And they are now under construction on a big new expansion not to mention this additional $1B in improvements.

BTW, this same group developed Town Center Plaza in Midwest City which is very high on this list, right there with Penn Square.


Anyone trying to portray this development as losing money or not being able to deliver on expansion is completely delusional.

[chssooner]

This is from Placer, a commercial real estate database.

UNP has more visits than any other shopping center in Central Oklahoma and probably the entire state. And they are now under construction on a big new expansion not to mention this additional $1B in improvements.

Anyone trying to portray this development as losing money or not being able to deliver on expansion is completely delusional.

What is the expansion?

[Pete]

What is the expansion?

Work has already started and it will be bigger than the proposed entertainment district surrounding the arena.

[chssooner]

Nice! While I wish this was going to be the luxury lifestyle center it was supposed to be, it looks like it will finally add a true theater to Norman (I assume that is what the entertainment parcel will be). And will be a hit, either way.