BancFirst Tower

[Plutonic Panda]

I’m in Las Vegas all the time and I disagree. Vegas does much better in insuring protected ped access

[DowntownMan]

I think only option now is to try to get a news station to do a story and get bad publicity on the coty as that is usually the only way they listen these days

[Dob Hooligan]

I’m in Las Vegas all the time and I disagree. Vegas does much better in insuring protected ped access

With zero snark, I will say we have a difference of opinion between two people who are both intelligent, well informed and love Oklahoma City. Nothing wrong with that.

[EastCoastGator]

You'd think they were dropping anvils on peoples' heads as they walked by. It's not that serious.

[jn1780]

I haven't been in the area in awhile, so I have a question and an observation.

Question. Can't pedestrians go across the street and walk north-south on the west side of the street (in front of the Sheraton)?

FNC construction is taking the whole southbound side Broadway. Plus, either way, its nowhere near ADA compliant.

The solution is simple really, if they wanted to spend the money,anyway. Build a covered walkway. There spending millions of dollars on a remodel, they can build a covered walkway.

[dankrutka]

There is no way to get to the Sheraton from the Skirvin without walking in the car lane.

[dankrutka]

Vegas is NOT a great pedestrian city. Neither is Dallas. Not really sure the point of pointing out other cities that are terrible for pedestrians. If it’s bad it’s bad.

[Plutonic Panda]

Yet Vegas boulevard has more pedestrian traffic per hour than lots of cities see in a year. lol okay

[DowntownMan]

I feel that median along Broadway will probably be turn up eventually for a turn lane into fnc garage so why not turn it is to a temporary sideway right now?

[gopokes88]

Vegas is NOT a great pedestrian city. Neither is Dallas. Not really sure the point of pointing out other cities that are terrible for pedestrians. If it’s bad it’s bad.

Buildings aren’t close together, and there’s tons of elevated walkways, but it’s pretty easy to walk place to place without interacting with BLVD traffic.

[Dob Hooligan]

My reference to Las Vegas regards only pedestrian protection during construction on Las Vegas Blvd. And I have had many harrowing experiences on narrow and uneven diverters during construction at Palazzo, Linq, Harmon Corner, City Center, etc. Permanent pedestrian access is another story.

Only reason I mentioned it is because posters opined that OKC is the worst at construction pedestrian protection.

[BoulderSooner]

^

And that sidewalk is not the property of BancFirst, it's city-owned ROW.

Isn't the Underground also now closed in this area?

generaly speaking property owners own the the middle of the street around their property

ROW and easements are not ownership

[Pete]

generaly speaking property owners own the the middle of the street around their property

ROW and easements are not ownership

What???

[shawnw]

I've heard Eric Wenger give this lecture as well. He says that in OKC the property line goes to the middle of the street. Not testifying to the veracity, just saying I have witnessed him say this on at least three occasions.

[Pete]

Yeah, well try building anything on a sidewalk or into the street and see how that works out.

And if you look at the county assessor site, you can see this is 100% not true. Lines are clearly drawn.

And for example, all the P180 work was done on city property (sidewalks, streets) and with city money.

[jn1780]

I've heard Eric Wenger give this lecture as well. He says that in OKC the property line goes to the middle of the street. Not testifying to the veracity, just saying I have witnessed him say this on at least three occasions.

Even if that is technically true, does that really change anything? It's still the cities ROW, I cant just go out and block the road because I feel like it. Also, if someone hits a pothole in the street in front of my house, they cant expect me to pay for damages.

[PaddyShack]

But the city expects you to mow their ROW on your own dime...

[Southsider2]

Oklahoma counties assessor is very good IMO, but can be inaccurate when it comes to the property lines on the map. Surveys provide the most accurate lot line locations which shouldn't surprise anyone. I will say though I have never experienced people owning to the middle of the road. Usually it is just to the curb cut where there is ROW as well as zoning setbacks that cannot be built on.

[BoulderSooner]

What???

ie when the city vacates an alley easement or vacates a street the ajoining property owners don't "buy" that land back from the city


when REHCO wanted the city to close the streets going through their property next to the peake they would not have had to buy that land from the city

[PhiAlpha]

ie when the city vacates an alley easement or vacates a street the ajoining property owners don't "buy" that land back from the city


when REHCO wanted the city to close the streets going through their property next to the peake they would not have had to buy that land from the city

Yes that's correct, the property lines do go to the center of the street, but the owner of the easement is reponsible for maintining it per the terms of whatever ROW/easement agreement was made with the surface owner at the time.

[Pete]

ie when the city vacates an alley easement or vacates a street the ajoining property owners don't "buy" that land back from the city


when REHCO wanted the city to close the streets going through their property next to the peake they would not have had to buy that land from the city

That does not at all mean they own it anyway.

BTW, the city denied that request and now REHCO can't build on it. That doesn't sound like any type of ownership to me.

[dankrutka]

Yet Vegas boulevard has more pedestrian traffic per hour than lots of cities see in a year. lol okay

Yes, some sidewalks are fine with high pedestrian counts. There are so many broken pedestrian areas, which are far more dangerous than most cities because of their highways for streets. Two things can be happening at once. Vegas is NOT a good example of how to design a city IMHO.

[Plutonic Panda]

With zero snark, I will say we have a difference of opinion between two people who are both intelligent, well informed and love Oklahoma City. Nothing wrong with that.

Just out of curiosity are there any specific parts of the city you noticed this in? In and around Summerlin I’ve noticed there aren’t too many accommodations for pedestrians.

Yes, some sidewalks are fine with high pedestrian counts. There are so many broken pedestrian areas, which are far more dangerous than most cities because of their highways for streets. Two things can be happening at once. Vegas is NOT a good example of how to design a city IMHO.

Fair points but I don’t think every city should be accompanying pedestrians over cars and Las Vegas is one of those cities. I love the wide roads and freeways. I wish OKC would be akin to Vegas than Portland.

[Pete]

[PaddyShack]

Just out of curiosity are there any specific parts of the city you noticed this in? In and around Summerlin I’ve noticed there aren’t too many accommodations for pedestrians.


Fair points but I don’t think every city should be accompanying pedestrians over cars and Las Vegas is one of those cities. I love the wide roads and freeways. I wish OKC would be akin to Vegas than Portland.

I think you would like Barcelona, I think they do transit as a whole very well.