New info on MAPS 3

[mugofbeer]

Wow.

That's all you got out of my response to Flatlander

No wonder the city council is able to hoodwink you people.

Purple - I think the issue is that we make our own decisions and we look past our own noses to see the benefits of MAPS3. We don't have unions and personal interests that make us willing to shoot ourselves in the foot.

There is no denying there are other things in the city that need addressing, but MAPS isn't the forum to address them. Otherwise, there is no denying that MAPS and M4K were wildly successful programs that brought billions in private investment to our city and provided much better learning environments to many of our children. MAPS3 is clearly a continuation of that process and will bring in hundreds of millions in additional private development and redevelopment to the central city.

[purplemonkeythief]

Purple - I think the issue is that we make our own decisions and we look past our own noses to see the benefits of MAPS3. We don't have unions and personal interests that make us willing to shoot ourselves in the foot.

There is no denying there are other things in the city that need addressing, but MAPS isn't the forum to address them. Otherwise, there is no denying that MAPS and M4K were wildly successful programs that brought billions in private investment to our city and provided much better learning environments to many of our children. MAPS3 is clearly a continuation of that process and will bring in hundreds of millions in additional private development and redevelopment to the central city.

And my point is that the rest of the city needs hundreds of millions in additional private development and redevelopment. The central part of the city is thriving right now. You're asking the people in the blighted areas of this city, areas that have become hundreds of times worse in less than a generation, to foot the bill to reward the central part of the city and the residents living there.

Us "po folk" are being told to sit down and shut up. The rich folk living it up in the downtown area know what's good for us. If we're silent, obedient little "po folk", we might just be lucky enough to get a job and one of these fancy new projects cleaning up after the rich downtown residents. Hey! we might even get to drive rich people around in one of the Streetcars! Woo!

Oh, and if we don't shut up and vote Yes, we'll be sorry!!

The gangsters in the city council are taking this city for a ride. That's why they worded the ballot the way they did to specifically circumvent Article 10, Section 19 of the Oklahomoa Constitution.

[iron76hd]

Perhaps it is in San Diego. Its not necessarily a money pit everywhere. Dallas and Denver have pretty successful rail systems that are packed like sardine cans during rush hour and are continuing to expand.

Ok. How much of the rail systems in those cities are paid for by the City and not the riders?

I'm pretty sure in those two cities, which I've been to several times, they have a major traffic problem. Do we? No, We don't.

So what's the need for a rail? Parking downtown?

[iron76hd]

(Article IV S 11 No officer of the City shall benefit DIRECTLY OR INDIRECTLY in any contract made by, to or with the City, or be otherwise directly financially interested in any corporation having any contract or subcontract for doing any contact job or work for the City.)

Yea. How does the Mayor get past this Article with his job at Akerman? Doesn't he violate this article? Nay.. I'm crazy..

[Golfer]

Betts, I haven spoken to you in awhile and I hope you are doing fine. I just want to say that the NOT THIS MAPS campaign was probably the last to come aboard an already large number of people who oppose Maps 3. I also wanted to remind you that I was the first to tell you some 2 weeks ago that this is not going to past on the first try, trust me.

[andy157]

Purple - I think the issue is that we make our own decisions and we look past our own noses to see the benefits of MAPS3. We don't have unions and personal interests that make us willing to shoot ourselves in the foot.

There is no denying there are other things in the city that need addressing, but MAPS isn't the forum to address them. Otherwise, there is no denying that MAPS and M4K were wildly successful programs that brought billions in private investment to our city and provided much better learning environments to many of our children. MAPS3 is clearly a continuation of that process and will bring in hundreds of millions in additional private development and redevelopment to the central city.

What is it about the members are the supreme authority of the Police and Fire Unions that you people for some reason don't or can't seem to understand?

[betts]

Betts, I haven spoken to you in awhile and I hope you are doing fine. I just want to say that the NOT THIS MAPS campaign was probably the last to come aboard an already large number of people who oppose Maps 3. I also wanted to remind you that I was the first to tell you some 2 weeks ago that this is not going to past on the first try, trust me.

I don't think anyone is sure this will pass. I also think it's almost impossible to predict what is going to happen on election day, but, if it doesn't pass on the first "try", I'm not sure why you think there will be a second. I may not be around for a second try, as, if I see nothing but bleak days ahead for this city, I may end up giving in to my husband's wishes and go back to Denver, which, quite frankly, is a better city with far more to do. I'm not 30, and I don't want to wait around five years just in case the voters start caring more, and then wait another ten years for the projects to be implemented. MAPS is the only reason I stayed in the first place, and it's depressing to think we've got citizens who are so short sighted that they think there's anything good that can come of not passing this one. I love Oklahoma City, but I certainly loved Denver more when I moved here. There I can live downtown and use mass transit. I can shop downtown, I would again have four different professional teams, and a reasonable chance my kids will move to be near me. I can't get any of them to consider moving back here.

I'm just one person, although I'm diligent about keeping my sales tax money in the city, and one person doesn't matter. However, what I've found is most of us aren't unique, and if I'm thinking about it, I'm probably not alone. I keep racking my brain trying to figure out precisely how MAPS not passing IS good for Oklahoma City. I have yet to see one single valid argument for that point of view.

[PLANSIT]

Ok. How much of the rail systems in those cities are paid for by the City and not the riders?

I'm pretty sure in those two cities, which I've been to several times, they have a major traffic problem. Do we? No, We don't.

So what's the need for a rail? Parking downtown?

About the same as San Diego. But guess what? The direct and indirect benefits far outweigh the cost. The people of Dallas and Denver see that, and that's why they are investing billions more.

You're right they do have congestion problems, far greater than OKC. But I guarantee that had they had the foresight they would have started their systems before the traffic became stifling. Instead, they are reacting to the problem. We have a chance to be proactive for better transit and better land uses. We have the opportunity to catch it on the front end. You're right though, let's just wait till s#!t hits the fan.

[andy157]

True or False. This MAPS (3) is structured the SAME way as the original MAPS (1) and MAPS 4 KIDS, except the ballot has been changed because of lawsuits. This MAPS (3) has the SAME legal requirements in place as the original MAPS (1) and MAPS 4 Kids.