Tulsa hates you.

[nik4411]

I live in Norman, but OKCpulse, to be fair, tulsa has a much better selection of lakes to go and enjoy.

[okcpulse]

I live in Norman, but OKCpulse, to be fair, tulsa has a much better selection of lakes to go and enjoy.

a) That still doesn't make Tulsa better than us, nor us better than them. I am merely trying to emphazise the beauty of both worlds.

b) Those lakes are not Tulsa assets, they are state assets, but Tulsa is lucky to be so close.

c) You have to drive OUT of Tulsa to get to any lakes. Hefner, Draper and Overholser are right in our backyard, Hefner being the best of the three. You don't need to drive far to get to any of these lakes. If I want to go on a weekend lake trip, I'll drive to any one of our major reservoirs.

[bombermwc]

Tulsa sees OKC and Tulsa has weiner envy.

Oh did I say that?

[Mr. K]

The mentality is just different in the two places. I grew up in Tulsa and have a brother that lives in Norman. I think OKC is a lot more open to becoming a modern city. It will never be a sprawling metropolis like NYC but the city is always willing to make improvements. The people of Tulsa frown on new things and only want to help expand things like churches. They don't want it to become a modern city at all. They would prefer less things to do over more.

[In_Tulsa]

Mr. K When was the last time you were in Tulsa 1981. YOU CRAZY!!!!!!

[soonerguru]

Mr. K, I believe you're right that OKC is currently more "wide open," but the under-40 set in Tulsa is working very hard to change things there. They have an awesome music scene and arts scene, a cool downtown neighborhood (Blue Dome) and lots of progressive thinkers. Tulsa is AOK in my book, but OKC is still home.

The problems they do have their is that their suburbanites haven't figured out what Mick Cornett told our suburbanites: "You can't be a suburb of nothing." Up there, many Owassoans think, foolishly, that they don't "need" Tulsa.

When they put public projects up for vote, the Broken Arrowheads and Owassoans vote them down.

[soonerguru]

Oh, and one more thing: Tulsa is more racist and segregated than OKC.

[circuitboard]

As a Tulsa native, and now living in OKC for the past 4 years. I can contest, Tulsa is not as diverse or open minded as OKC, the art scene and music makes people from the outside think it is open and diverse, but if you live there, you will get bored real fast. Tulsa has alot of race tension as well and white people are obsessed with living in the suburbs. Tulsa has alot of old thinkers, and in order for Tulsa to change, they need some new ideas. Everytime I go back, I think man this place is still the same.

[okclee]

The Race factor is a major problem in Tulsa.

[BG918]

The Race factor is a major problem in Tulsa.

And it's not in OKC? IMO, it's pretty equal.

I also think the two are equally diverse but with OKC having a higher Asian population.

[fromdust]

And it's not in OKC? IMO, it's pretty equal.

I also think the two are equally diverse but with OKC having a higher Asian population.

and black population.

[Architect2010]

Are you crazy?

Hecks no its not near as problematic here as Tulsa. I have never experienced anything remotely racially degrading my whole life as an inner Northeast side resident and now as inner Southside resident, and I'm White! I went on a BPA trip to Tulsa my freshmen year and I was stared down along with my friends when we stopped at a convenience store that consisted of all black customers.

[CuatrodeMayo]

it's not in OKC? IMO, it's pretty equal.

I also think the two are equally diverse but with OKC having a higher Asian population.

I did a little research on this very subject. (I posted this on on okmet.org a while back.)

Cosmopolitan.

This word has been thrown out many times in reference to OKC and Tulsa. I decided to do a little research to find which city truely was cosmopolitan.

1. What does the work mean?
cos·mo·pol·i·tan [ kòzmə póllit'n ]
adjective
Definition:

1. made up of diverse peoples: composed of or containing people from different countries and cultures

2. showing cultural diversity: showing the influence of many countries and cultures

Cosmopolitan - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

2. Which city more closely matches the definition?

American FactFinder

NOTE: colors do not represent the same percentages from map to map (i.e. the darkest blue might represent 50% black in Tulsa and the same color might represent 20% black in OKC).
Percentage of Whites alone - Tulsa

Percentage of Whites alone - OKC

Percentage of Native Americans - Tulsa

Percentage of Native Americans - OKC

Percentage of African Americans - Tulsa

Percentage of African Americans - OKC

Percentage of Hispanics - Tulsa

Percentage of Hispanics - OKC

Percentage of Asians - Tulsa

Percentage of Asians - OKC


Cosmopolitan

[Floyd]

Congratulations on demonstrating the severity of white flight in the greater OKC metro area.

[BDP]

They have an awesome music scene and arts scene

Can someone give me the music and art scene highlights from Tulsa, i.e. top local bands, top art shows/artists, etc.

[soonerguru]

BDP,

They have many "underground" parties, and others that aren't, like the New Genre Festival in March.

As for music, they have Cain's Ballroom, Brady Theatre and Dfest.

We have the Zoo with concerts like REO Speedwagon. At the Brady, they get Tom Waits.

At the Brewery and places like that, we get Stoney Larue. Up there, they get Sonic Youth, Yo La Tengo, etc.

We do have the Conservatory and Opolis in Norman, but right now, they have better venues and a better regular rotation of music.

Dfest has made itself into a huge event.

OKC also has a great art scene and many great musicians and bands, but our venue situation is a little behind.

[BDP]

Thanks guru.

No doubt they get some better acts coming through. I was just wondering what their local scene is like, which is what I think of more when I think of music "scene".

My experiences with their local stuff hasn't been anything special, or at least I haven't been to anything up there on the scale of Momentum here, Girlie Show, or even the IAO stuff in terms of art scene. So, I was just wondering what I should check out. I am sure there is a lot to offer, but maybe a Tulsan can steer me in the right direction. I'm always down for a road trip to see good music or art.

[CuatrodeMayo]

Congratulations on demonstrating the severity of white flight in the greater OKC metro area.

I sense a sarcastic put-down, but I'll take you at face value and say "thanks".

[Floyd]

I sense a sarcastic put-down, but I'll take you at face value and say "thanks".

Not a put-down, just pointing out that this demographic aspect of OKC you describe as "cosmopolitan," and insinuate makes OKC superior, is in fact a result of the fact that white people have fled the core of the city for outlying areas and the suburbs over the last 40 years.

But hey--whatever makes you feel special. Every city has the problem. It's an issue in Tulsa as well, although not as stark judging by your maps. But to imply that what you describe is a virtue is disingenuous to say the least.

[okcpulse]

Not a put-down, just pointing out that this demographic aspect of OKC you describe as "cosmopolitan," and insinuate makes OKC superior, is in fact a result of the fact that white people have fled the core of the city for outlying areas and the suburbs over the last 40 years.

But hey--whatever makes you feel special. Every city has the problem. It's an issue in Tulsa as well, although not as stark judging by your maps. But to imply that what you describe is a virtue is disingenuous to say the least.

I don't believe he was claiming OKC was superior. What needs to stop happening is elitist Tulsans (not all Tulsans are like that) need to stop thinking they are superior to OKC. No one is superior to another.

[okcpulse]

BDP,

They have many "underground" parties, and others that aren't, like the New Genre Festival in March.

As for music, they have Cain's Ballroom, Brady Theatre and Dfest.

We have the Zoo with concerts like REO Speedwagon. At the Brady, they get Tom Waits.

At the Brewery and places like that, we get Stoney Larue. Up there, they get Sonic Youth, Yo La Tengo, etc.

We do have the Conservatory and Opolis in Norman, but right now, they have better venues and a better regular rotation of music.

Dfest has made itself into a huge event.

OKC also has a great art scene and many great musicians and bands, but our venue situation is a little behind.

Yes, our venue situation is in need of creativity. However, what is a "local" music scene? To me, the bands Oklahoma City produces makes up our true local music scene. From The Flaming Lips to Hinder and the like, that is a true "local" music scene. Not a bunch of touring bands in venues.

[Floyd]

I don't believe he was claiming OKC was superior.

There's no question that his elaborate set of maps was attempting to show that OKC was more "cosmopolitan" and therefore superior.

There also should be no question that this argument is ridiculous. Racial diversity is a good thing, but not when it's a result of white flight to the suburbs.

[okcpulse]

There's no question that his elaborate set of maps was attempting to show that OKC was more "cosmopolitan" and therefore superior.

There also should be no question that this argument is ridiculous. Racial diversity is a good thing, but not when it's a result of white flight to the suburbs.

Again, he wasn't claiming OKC was superior. But it is more cosmopolitan. Facts are facts.

And as far as white flight, name what city where that didn't happen. White flight in Oklahoma City happened over 30 years ago, as it did everywhere else. Let go of the past.

And his 'elaborate set of maps' are nothing more than facts. Is OKC having a positive something that is unacceptable?

Indeed, this argument is ridicilous. But so attacking someone who is just merely sharing information.

[Floyd]

Again, he wasn't claiming OKC was superior. But it is more cosmopolitan. Facts are facts.

And as far as white flight, name what city where that didn't happen. White flight in Oklahoma City happened over 30 years ago, as it did everywhere else. Let go of the past.

And his 'elaborate set of maps' are nothing more than facts. Is OKC having a positive something that is unacceptable?

Indeed, this argument is ridicilous. But so attacking someone who is just merely sharing information.

First, learn to spell.

Second, you're just wrong about "facts."

The kid throws out a definition of the adjective "cosmopolitan" that reduces the meaning to "diversity."

He does so because he found some maps that show that OKC has a higher percentage of minorities in its city center than Tulsa does. He also insinuates that because of this, OKC is more cosmopolitan than, and therefore superior to, Tulsa.

Uh, what do you think the reason is for OKC having a high concentration of minorities in the city center? Is it because OKC is so incredibly cosmopolitan? Or is it because all the scared white people moved as far as they could from downtown?

Facts are facts? Then the fact is, white people in OKC have fled the center at a far faster rate than Tulsa.

So "cosmopolitan"! So "positive!

Conclusion: You're clearly wrong and you sound very stupid. Stop talking **** on Tulsa. Both cities are fine. The ignorance of certain members of the forum does not make either city look any better. But it makes you look terrible.

[soonerguru]

Yes, our venue situation is in need of creativity. However, what is a "local" music scene? To me, the bands Oklahoma City produces makes up our true local music scene. From The Flaming Lips to Hinder and the like, that is a true "local" music scene. Not a bunch of touring bands in venues.

Yikes, I wouldn't recommend using Hinder to bolster your argument! You make good points, and i largely agree with you. I actually think OKC has better bands right now: Uglysuit, Samantha Crain, Evangelicals, etc., but that was not my point.

To be a great music city we need both a thriving scene of local artists and solid venues with many great touring artists. We can have both here. Tulsa is just a little better organized for whatever reason.