Top 5 stores (retail, grocery or otherwise) you wish we had in OKC

[bchris02]

Charlotte had Total Wine, it was great and I miss it along with Harris Teeter, Trader Joe's, and World Market.

Changing the liquor laws is something that has been discussed for decades and hasn't been done so I am not holding my breath. In my opinion its the lack of everyday amenities like this that really hurt the quality of life in OKC compared to cities its size or even smaller.

[onthestrip]

QT. It's hard to find a good gas station around here.

I see so much talk about how people wish we had more places like QT and Im not sure I get it. Its a gas station. You go and get gas, maybe a drink. What else do you need? Are that many people eating their meals from convenience stores? Are QT's taquitos that much better than everyone elses? Do they have a larger candy section? Other than it being somewhat cleaner than 7-11s, what is the big deal about a gas station?

[bhawes]

I only have one..... Sportsmen's Warehouse.

Moore would be nice but having one back anywhere in OKC would make me really happy.

With Dicks in Moore they may be scare to locate in Moore.

[bhawes]

Restoration Hardware was #6 on my list and I think something like that would do well in the space next to Anthropologie.

I heard rumors that Costco was looking at Moore. But that was before the events in May.

[venture]

People finally hit on it why Kroger isn't here...wine sales. Until the laws get changed they won't touch the place. I could totally see them buying up Homeland, but I see them going for only the newer locations or former Albertson locations. The older, smaller locations would probably be closed or not even purchased.

[bhawes]

The typical Crest is still well below the standard of the grocery stores found in most other cities.

The Crest in SW Oklahoma City and the one being built in Norman are really nice. The rest of them are below standard. Not sure about the one in Edmond.

[bhawes]

Is the one on SW 104th and May? I always thought they had an expansive meat and deli selection as well as their produce being very good. I have been to Publix in Florida, Reasor's in the Tulsa area as well as a few Kroger's in Texas and I think this one tops them all. Maybe I am not going to as nice of stores in the other areas?

Crest on SW 104th and May and new one being built in Norman are way above standard.

[warreng88]

My wife has had several conversations with people in the know and they say that getting the liquor laws changed in 2014 is all but a done deal. I think some details with the Naifeh's and other liquor distributors need to be ironed out, but it should happen pretty quickly (for Oklahoma). Can anyone remember what the proposed law was? You could sell cold beer and wine in grocery stores up to a certain alcohol content or something?

[bhawes]

I don't think any of them come close to the one on 104th and May. Most of the other ones were just retro-fitting older grocery stores and this one was built on open land from the ground up. Again, I may be wrong in my assessment of grocery stores, but I have always really like that one so that is where my focus is.

No you are correct I live about 10 minutes from the Crest on 104th and May. Since they open I don't go to Homeland,WM Neighborhood Markets or Walmart Super Centers for grocery shopping any more.

[bchris02]

The Crest in SW Oklahoma City and the one being built in Norman are really nice. The rest of them are below standard. Not sure about the one in Edmond.

The Edmond one is decent. It's not SW 104th but I would still say its above standard.

NW OKC needs a few of these Crests in a pretty bad way. If that were to happen, the grocery situation would be a lot better in this city and I think most people would stop complaining about it. They should start with the Gaillardia area. A lot of people live there but its a good drive from a grocery store period, let alone a decent one. From there, they should upgrade the existing stores and add another one on NW Expressway and one down in the Penn Square Mall area.

[bhawes]

I think Kroger could eventually get involved in the OKC market. They stopped expanding to new markets using the Kroger name over a decade ago. It became too difficult to compete with Walmart and the entrenched grocery stores even in the fastest growing markets. They learned that it was much easier to buy an established local chain and implement their business model on the acquiree. That's exactly what they did with Ralph's in order to get into California.

Crest would probably be a juicy target for them here, but I doubt that the Harroz family would sell out to them. Especially since they seem to be on the upswing. I think they'll get around to updating their old stores, but right now they're in expansion mode. They did spend a decent amount of money on refreshing the Edmond store though.

Homeland could be an alternative target, but they have so many run-down stores, that the capital investment needed would run into the tens of millions of dollars. However, if the local population continues to grow, they could pull the trigger regardless.

They had to update Edmond stores the homes in that area are nice homes the other crest are located in areas where homes are not as nice compare to 104th and May. So I doubt they update the other Crests.

[bluedogok]

Change the laws to allow Total Wine and everything else will take care of itself.

Shop Wine, Liquor & Beer Online | Total Wine & More

Real Ale...a microbrewery out of Blanco, Texas (west of Austin), they have some real good beers. We went to a shop here in Littleton last weekend (Tipsy's Liquor World) that is like a large Whole Foods sized liquor store (80,000 sf), just their beer section or wine section is almost as large as the Spec's that we would go to in Austin which was in a former Academy Sports location.

People finally hit on it why Kroger isn't here...wine sales. Until the laws get changed they won't touch the place. I could totally see them buying up Homeland, but I see them going for only the newer locations or former Albertson locations. The older, smaller locations would probably be closed or not even purchased.

Kroger is here in Colorado under the name King Soupers, under the state liquor laws they can only have one location with wine, high point beer and liquor sales (the store is in Glendale), all the other stores only have 3.2 beer.

Prices at Publix, Kroger and Ralph's aren't any higher than Crest or Homeland.

I doubt the prices are higher at the nice Crests than the bare bones locations.


We aren't talking about carpeted aisles, just raising the standards to those already found just about everywhere else.

With very few exceptions, I get totally depressed when I go into OKC grocery stores. And considering that is a place most people go into at least once a week, it's arguably the most important component of local retail.

There are certain items at Crest that are significantly cheaper than our version of Kroger or Safeway, if we are driving we usually stop at Crest by my parents house (23rd & Meridian) and stock up on those items plus some we can't find in Colorado or that we could find in Austin. We do miss the HEB stores in Texas, when we were down in Midland for two weeks last month (father-in-law in the hospital and subsequent funeral) we stocked up on stuff at HEB before the drive back to Colorado. My father really liked the HEB store by our house in Austin and wished they had them in OKC.

Homeland is just as much to blame.

Long before Wal-Mart staged their bliztkrieg on the local market, they were the main players and very poor. They've done very little since.

They are a spin-off (Oklahoma only) of Safeway, which is still thriving all over the country. And for the most part, Safeways are a million times nicer.


When Homeland split from Safeway, it basically created a very insular situation in OKC, whereby there were virtually zero national chains -- until Wal-Mart came calling.

So, our grocery market was left to the boys from Arkansas and local operators without any sort of larger ties in terms of assets, expertise, desire, pride or perspective. And OKC has suffered acutely because of that.

The Oklahoma Safeway stores were split off because of the Milken junk bond scandal and the need for Safeway (acquired by Milken thru a LBO in 1986) to shed assets to satisfy creditors. The Safeway stores in Houston and Central Texas were spun off into Apple Tree stores and stores in the DFW were divvied up between the existing grocers. Those weren't the only ones, they sold off a bunch of stores including Vons in Southern California. Many of those that they sold have since been reacquired after they became solvent and stable, they acquired Randall's in Texas (based in Houston) after Randall's had acquired Tom Thumb (DFW).

A Fry's would be nice.

Electronics or grocery? I miss Fry's Electronics from Austin and wish we had one in Denver. Micro Center is good but not quite the same.

[bchris02]

My wife has had several conversations with people in the know and they say that getting the liquor laws changed in 2014 is all but a done deal. I think some details with the Naifeh's and other liquor distributors need to be ironed out, but it should happen pretty quickly (for Oklahoma). Can anyone remember what the proposed law was? You could sell cold beer and wine in grocery stores up to a certain alcohol content or something?

I wouldn't be so sure. There will be a massive campaign from the religious right, MADD groups, as well as liquor store owners against any changes. I hope you are right though.

And the law allows a grocery chain to have five stores with wine in the most populous counties in Oklahoma.

[poe]

I would love to see Oklahoma City get California Pizza Kitchen. And, some type of outdoor lifestyle center in Edmond or Norman; something along the lines of The Summit shopping centers in Birmingham, Reno, and Louisville.

[Soonerman]

Cost Plus World Market would be a wonderful add to OKC/Norman. Costco would be nice too. Also doesn't Kansas have similar liquor laws as Oklahoma?? Why is Kroger in Kansas and not Oklahoma if thats the case?

[bchris02]

Kroger is here in Colorado under the name King Soupers, under the state liquor laws they can only have one location with wine, high point beer and liquor sales (the store is in Glendale), all the other stores only have 3.2 beer.

The difference between OKC and other markets is that for one OKC didn't have a real strong existing chain prior to Wal-Mart's blitzkrieg. It's likely Kroger was well established in places like Denver and Wichita prior to Wal-Mart becoming a big grocery player. Plus, Wal-Mart didn't exercise its market saturation strategy in those markets like it did OKC. Reasor's is a great chain and they were well-established in Tulsa prior to Wal-Mart. Secondly, other chains aren't going to enter the market and try to compete with Wal-Mart unless they can sell wine as a profit cushion as well as to give them leverage. If wine is allowed, a grocery chain will be able to enter the market and offer a superior wine selection beyond anything Wal-Mart will sell. Maybe even have wine tastings like Harris Teeter does in Charlotte. People will shop their for their wine and buy their other groceries while they are at it. That plus all the people fed up with Wal-Mart already, should enable them to really put a dent in Wal-Mart's dominance.

[bchris02]

I would love to see Oklahoma City get California Pizza Kitchen. And, some type of outdoor lifestyle center in Edmond or Norman; something along the lines of The Summit shopping centers in Birmingham, Reno, and Louisville.

Agreed. OKC would have an outdoor lifestyle center if it wasn't for the crash of 2008. There were several proposed and then cancelled if I recall.

[Soonerman]

I'm suprised Reasor's isn't in OKC.

[adaniel]

I would love to see Oklahoma City get California Pizza Kitchen. And, some type of outdoor lifestyle center in Edmond or Norman; something along the lines of The Summit shopping centers in Birmingham, Reno, and Louisville.

Not going to lie, I find CPK highly overrated. Upper Crust and the Wedge are both way superior.

[Pete]

The OKC Chamber of Commerce actually employs a full-time person who has the responsibility of recruiting new retailers to the City.

It was Alison Oshel but now it's Jessica Herrera.


I'll get in contact with her and invite her to our OKCTalk gathering. In the meantime, I'll see if she has anything new to share in terms of possible new retailers.

[bluedogok]

The difference between OKC and other markets is that for one OKC didn't have a real strong existing chain prior to Wal-Mart's blitzkrieg. It's likely Kroger was well established in places like Denver and Wichita prior to Wal-Mart becoming a big grocery player. Plus, Wal-Mart didn't exercise its market saturation strategy in those markets like it did OKC. Reasor's is a great chain and they were well-established in Tulsa prior to Wal-Mart. Secondly, other chains aren't going to enter the market and try to compete with Wal-Mart unless they can sell wine as a profit cushion as well as to give them leverage. If wine is allowed, a grocery chain will be able to enter the market and offer a superior wine selection beyond anything Wal-Mart will sell. Maybe even have wine tastings like Harris Teeter does in Charlotte. People will shop their for their wine and buy their other groceries while they are at it. That plus all the people fed up with Wal-Mart already, should enable them to really put a dent in Wal-Mart's dominance.

The Walmart push into groceries came at the time the others were starting to founder, the lack of strong national chains gave them an easier entry into Oklahoma, no doubt. You also have to remember, the Neighborhood Market concept was launched in Oklahoma, along with Sam's Club. The fact that the Homeland group was the dominant store at the time and the management seemed to just want to take cash out of the company and not improve was one of the reasons for the market stagnation, they were the big player at the time. Albertsons (I worked there in 80-82) went through name changes and buyouts until the debt did them in and they had to shed assets and are a shell of what they were and they never had as large of a presence as Homeland. There were others like McCartney's and Bakers which came in with nicer stores but they could never sustain and grow like they needed to and most of those were before WM entered the grocery business. I still think Kroger could come in without alcohol and kick WM around because it would be a better option. I have never seen the WMNM packed like I see HEB or King Soupers stores, not even the ones in OKC. Crest on 23rd is usually busier than I have ever seen the WMNM at 23rd & MacArthur. I think people want something other than Walmart, I don't think their "hold" on the OKC market is as big as it is perceived, most people that I know who go to Walmart do it with reluctance, not because of any lofty business ideals but from just the drudgery of going through Walmart.

Kroger used to be in Oklahoma according to their Wiki page, it was in the 30's though....

[bchris02]

I think most of us can agree that as far as retail, good grocery stores are the most lacking thing in OKC - mindnumbingly so. In addition to that however, here is what I would like to see.

1. Bonefish Grill or McCormick & Schmicks
2. Fry's Electronics
3. Costco
4. A 24-hour trailer diner like this: Welcome To The Midnight Diner - Charlotte
5. A 24-hour bakery like this: Amelies French Bakery

6. IKEA - It isn't going to happen but it's nice to wish

[Buffalo Bill]

I see so much talk about how people wish we had more places like QT and Im not sure I get it. Its a gas station. You go and get gas, maybe a drink. What else do you need? Are that many people eating their meals from convenience stores? Are QT's taquitos that much better than everyone elses? Do they have a larger candy section? Other than it being somewhat cleaner than 7-11s, what is the big deal about a gas station?

Somewhat cleaner? You've never been to the 7-11 at 31st and Classen.

The big deal is having pumps that work, card readers at the pumps that actually work, and not having to walk across the puke encrusted sidewalk to deal with the comical idiocy inside since said card reader is out of order.

[Buffalo Bill]

I think people want something other than Walmart, I don't think their "hold" on the OKC market is as big as it is perceived, most people that I know who go to Walmart do it with reluctance, not because of any lofty business ideals but from just the drudgery of going through Walmart.

I laugh when I see the adds regarding WalMart beef on TV. Even if they had the finest dry aged USDA Prime porterhouses at $6.99 per lb., I wouldn't get them. Setting foot in there is beyond depressing. It's the whole experience.

[bluedogok]

I laugh when I see the adds regarding WalMart beef on TV. Even if they had the finest dry aged USDA Prime porterhouses at $6.99 per lb., I wouldn't get them. Setting foot in there is beyond depressing. It's the whole experience.

Not that I have anything against Walmart, we shop at Sam's more than we do any flavor of Walmart. We typically only go to WMNM to get a few specific items they don't have at Sam's, Costco or King Soupers. I hate going into a Supercenter, if I forget something on one side of the store I usually don't feel like walking back over there to pick it up. They are almost too big in my mind.