According to today's Oklahoman, Tulsa will have commuter rail from Broken Arrow to downtown by 2012

Costlier rail link plan endorsed (http://www.newsok.com/article/3047626)

I've always thought that was a good route in Tulsa, but before the Edmond-Norman line? That seems odd. If Tulsa is serious about this OKC needs to step up and get something planned...and quick!

Why? Is there some sort of competition I was unaware of?

Mick Cornett and Roy Williams are 100% ready to go to the State of Oklahoma for funding for a rail project including downtown streetcar and suburban commuter rail next year, and the legislature is ready to give both OKC and Tulsa the funding they need.

End of story.

When do you (spartan) expect that we will see a rail connect between Tulsa and Okc?

I don't really see it as a competition. Why would OKC need to get this done in a hurry just because Tulsa is doing it?

It's hard to say because it's been in the work for a while now. Steam is really picking up and ODOT's interest in extending the Heartland Flyer is increasing. I would imagine some money be appropriated at least by 2010 but I don't see it happening next legislative session. There's a small chance of this session, but again, at least by 2010. I think most likely in '09 or '10 for sure.

There won't be money for anything if Gub Henry keeps vetoing every bill that goes to his desk.

A moderator ought to look at the spelling of the thread...

A moderator ought to look at the spelling of the thread...

No kidding, I got through 4 posts before I realized that there wasn't a guy named Tulas rolling through town and taking money while getting people to chant "THE MONORAIL, THE MONORAIL".

OKC definately needs a downtown loop ASAP, as well as the Edmond to Norman link and Tinker to WRWA link.

I also think a (Japanese style) high-speed train between OKC and Tulsa would be very beneficial to both of our economies. Could you imagine a 15 minute, or less, trip either way? I don't think the OK Turnpike Authority would appreciate it, but screw 'em.

OKC definately needs a downtown loop ASAP, as well as the Edmond to Norman link and Tinker to WRWA link.

I also think a (Japanese style) high-speed train between OKC and Tulsa would be very beneficial to both of our economies. Could you imagine a 15 minute, or less, trip either way? I don't think the OK Turnpike Authority would appreciate it, but screw 'em.

That's the problem with Oklahoman's these days. We always rely on a form of transportation where we just sit and let technology do all of the work for us, which is why we're one of the fattest states in the union. Whatever happened to walking uphill both ways?

J/K, I agree. Instead of stopping at Will Rogers, I'd like to see the link go to Mustang, though. What about Yukon? Puke on Yukon...that's what.

It doesn't sound like they are any further along than we are. They have a completed study, we have a completed study.

J/K, I agree. Instead of stopping at Will Rogers, I'd like to see the link go to Mustang, though. What about Yukon? Puke on Yukon...that's what.

I'm sure when rail is finally built, it will stop at WRWA, but eventually head out the Mustang/Yukon way.

That's the problem with Oklahoman's these days. We always rely on a form of transportation where we just sit and let technology do all of the work for us, which is why we're one of the fattest states in the union. Whatever happened to walking uphill both ways?

J/K, I agree. Instead of stopping at Will Rogers, I'd like to see the link go to Mustang, though. What about Yukon? Puke on Yukon...that's what.

There is not a great enough potential rider base in Mustang or Yukon to make it feasible that the line would end up hitting either Yukon or Mustang. Living so far out there is a choice.

I believe the heartland flyer will be expanding to tulsa from OKC and is long over due. Just like previous posts- both cities are looking at plans and will eventually complete the mission. I just find it funny(especially when I talk to my tulsa friends) that tulsans go crazy over any new development that happens. Recently-"Hey have you heard that the same developer that did lake hefner will be coming to jenks riverside?" - I was like-" Cool man cant wait to see it." They always have to be center stage and take up the entire spotlight, like miss america or something- if they can. I have always felt there is an intense competition between the sister cities-like duh. Many of our first highrises in the state were always competing on timetables and of course they were situated in OKC and tulsa. Im sure tulsans love the idea of a train truckin' at european speeds back and forth within their little(180 sq. miles) community structure, like they are soo avant garde. LOL. OUR situation is way more complicated, because of the 620+ sq. miles and I hope we take more time for good measures to complete it right. So let them have it first...who cares....we all know what is basically planned for the future of OKC anyway.

The Heartland Flyer will more likely be extended to Wichita, where Amtrak already connects.

Oh, sorry my bad.

Don't concede that, he doesn't know that. And in fact, ODOT sure as hell isn't going to pay for an OKC-Wichita connection. There is no need for an OKC-Wichita connection AT ALL. There have been studies for years about the OKC-Tulsa corridor and ODOT has a duty to both OKC and Tulsa. Tulsa is the largest city without Amtrak access. Why would ODOT not kill two birds with one stone? An OKC-Tulsa rail connection is something that would be big, and is something that is much needed.

Don't concede that, he doesn't know that. And in fact, ODOT sure as hell isn't going to pay for an OKC-Wichita connection. There is no need for an OKC-Wichita connection AT ALL. There have been studies for years about the OKC-Tulsa corridor and ODOT has a duty to both OKC and Tulsa. Tulsa is the largest city without Amtrak access. Why would ODOT not kill two birds with one stone? An OKC-Tulsa rail connection is something that would be big, and is something that is much needed.

I still do not understand why you think there is no need for a Wichita-Oklahoma City connection. There is a LOT of large businesses in Wichita. We VERY MUCH need connections by air AND rail. The rail could be a stop on the way to an Amtrak hub for east and west connections.

I still do not understand why you think there is no need for a Wichita-Oklahoma City connection. There is a LOT of large businesses in Wichita. We VERY MUCH need connections by air AND rail. The rail could be a stop on the way to an Amtrak hub for east and west connections.

I would tend to agree. However, most Amtrak travel isn't even business related.

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Keep in mind the article did not state Tulsa WOULD have light rail by 2012 but is doing a study feasibility right now that includes the possibility of bus service instead. Just like OKC's studies.

Keep in mind the article did not state Tulsa WOULD have light rail by 2012 but is doing a study feasibility right now that includes the possibility of bus service instead. Just like OKC's studies.

Exactly.


Spartan, although I agree with you that it makes more sense for Oklahoma for it to go through Tulsa, for Amtrak it makes more sense and is much cheaper to extend to Wichita (technically Newton) than to create an extension from OKC all the way to Kansas City.

I think i have been logged in or something for like a week straight. lol. didnt know you had to log off. I thought- How convenient, I can access the site by merely typing in OKCTALK and I dont have to deal with anything! LOL.

Spartan- I would have to agree with myself(lol). I had heard of the connection mentioned recently again and had read an article in the Oklahoma Journal-

"With all that's being done in downtown and the work in Tulsa and the railroad coming back, the next two years will be the most exciting time in Oklahoma since statehood," Brewer said.

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Amtrak and state transportation planners are working on a study to determine what routes will be opened initially with the return of rail passenger service. The first service is expected to be between Oklahoma City and Fort Worth, where the rail lines are in the best condition. Only signalization and crossing improvements are needed to operate 70 mph passenger trains.

With that route, Oklahomans will be able to ride to Fort Worth, switch to another train to San Antonio and pick up east and west service there.

Ultimately, service on the now defunct Lone Star Line, running from Newton, Kan., to Fort Worth, is expected to be returned, with one exception. That line would provide through service to Denver.

Service between Oklahoma City and Tulsa is expected to be restored as soon as the line is upgraded to handle faster passenger trains. Earlier this year, the Oklahoma Department of Transportation bought the line from Oklahoma City to Sapulpa from the Burlington Northern- Santa Fe Rail way. While it is in good condition, there are too many curves to handle high-speed trains, Transportation Secretary Neal McCaleb said.

After service is restored between Oklahoma City and Tulsa, Amtrak will provide links between Tulsa and Kansas City and St. Louis.

THIS IS WHAT I WAS TRYING TO GET AT AND I AM SURE IT WILL HAPPEN EVENTUALLY ANYWAY.

This is an old article(2000)- but I think the connection would have to happen eventually anyway.

Lots of business folks use Amtrak in Chicago and New York, DC, and Boston.

While OKC is neither, the Heartland Flyer could develop into sort of an extended commuter trunk line like those into Chicago. While there are businesses in Wichita, there are MUCH MORE in Oklahoma City.

OKC mainly needs Wichita to connect to the E-W main Amtrak tho, but Im sure Wichita in turn could use the OKC connection as well! I hope they will contribute to it UNLIKE how Texas contributes nothing to the existing Heartland flyer IIRC.

Hopefully, we'll get another train - as I'd like to see Express service to/from OKC and FTW and maybe a commuter trunk from Guthrie and Norman to downtown!!!

Nonetheless, all good news.

As for light rail, Im sure OKC will have its downtown circular up and running well before Tulsa - since the original planning is already in place and since the city is gung-ho on it and has received top support reflective of the maps3.org. Funding should not be an issue since MAPS will fund it

ASIDE - hopefully our Senator will not screw us this time (SLC is the same size - if not smaller - than OKC yet they have a commuter rail, all OKC asked for was a circular and it got shot down, way to go OKIE politicians).

Back to point.

The commuter rail line in OKC might be a tougher sell since it is more than just OKC, but I think a Edmond-Norman run with downtown as the terminal would be highly successful and would likely be OKC's first commuter line.

Nevertheless, kudos to Tulsa for at least considering a commuter line to its major suburb!

As the price of gas continues to skyrocket, we might see these and more rail lines SOONER!! rather than later.

Hot Rod. How do you know that the light rail has received top support from the citezens. From the Maps3 web site I couldn't find that info. I would like to think that is true but find it hard to believe the citezens of our fair city feel the same. Just wondering. Thanks.

I do think a Tulsa-OKC route would probably be used more than an OKC-Wichita route.

CCOKC, I dont know for sure - Im making an assumption based on the support it got during MAPS I and the fact that OKC has enjoyed the taste of being a major city - and major cities have transit options, and just the feel I got the two times I visited the city in 2007 - just leads me to think a downtown circular is definitely on the calendar for Oklahoma City.

I dont have any facts per say, but just a gut feeling. I think the city is on the move, and Im sure the citizens want to keep that momentum going since it will only add to the vibrancy of downtown and the overall quality of life of the city.

Hot Rod, I sure hope you are right. I would love to be able to take any kind of Metro. I live on a very busy street in mid NW OKC and I think I could get downtown by bus right now but would have problems getting home late at night. I was a season ticket holder of the Hornets the last two seasons and I wished there was a way to get downtown and home by public transportation. Maybe with higher gas prices this will become a priority with the citizens and the government of our city.

ccokc

One of the things I brought up on the Maps3.org survey, was for the city to build more sidewalks and lighting city wide - to encourage pedestrianism and transit usage.

This is something that the city is highly lacking and would be a relatively easy fix. Every major thoroughfare in the urbanized area and every major street/avenue in the population zone should have sidewalks and lighting! Bus Shelters should also be installed.

I have come to Oklahoma City and have seen people walking in the grass alongside major thoroughfares, even in the roads on some. And I've noticed the city is pretty dark as well, not really encouraging people to "venture out" after dark. Well, this is also an easy fix - might cost some dollars to fund the energy efficient/bug deterrent lighting - but nonetheless should be done. Lighting also adds to that big city feel yet some parts of the city seem like a ghost town after dusk.

Imagine, with sidewalks (handicap capable) and lighting - Oklahoma City would be an even more pedestrian friendly city, which would encourage more use and demand of transit which would encourage and build critical mass which would encourage better retail options which would drastically improve the city!!

I agree totally. Like I said I live on a major street and my side yard has a worn path from people walking. I know this is their mode of transportation. Not sure why they don't ride the bus. Are the buses just not accessible enough, too expensive? I don't know but it would be interesting to find out. I am going to replace my fence this summer and am seriously thinknig about putting in a sidewalk just because. Our neighborhood just recently incorporated a neighborhood association and we were all wondering why now. One of the first things the organizers asked us was "now who here would like sidewalks?" I don't know if you saw the bkie survey that someone posted here last week. I took the survey and I think what is bascially boils down to is we are having a bond election soon to finance better bike paths and sidewalks. I could be wrong but that was the impression I got. I know it is a rather daunting task because the city is so physically large. I think the city is trying to start in the middle and go out. Every new business in the inner city is required to put sidewalks in. If you go down 39th and May you will see sidewalks in front of the new Ford dealership and the new Lowes. Of course they end there but it is a start and the city I guess does not have to pay for it.

CC, that is wonderful. I think sidewalks would make a huge difference!!!

Add in some lighting to that, and OKC could become a true pedestrian city - so to say. and that would lead to transit use. Which would lead to MASS transit!!!

Im glad the sidewalks are in the works, my "outsider" views/suggestions only provides further support for this and other improvements to the city.