Got this off of Edmunds....Been trying to convince my wife for years that changing her oil every 3,000 miles is a crock....All about getting you into the service station frequently so they can upsell you on a $200 cabin air filter :fighting3

Oil's Slippery Slope: My Advice -- Stop Wasting It!

A recent AP story about oil change intervals has again confirmed what many automotive experts have known for years: Too many people change their oil too often. That statement likely goes against the "common wisdom" of dedicated automotive enthusiasts. After all, the image of the average American car owner is one of a mindless dolt who has never even cracked the owner's manual. This person certainly doesn't know (let alone follow) his car's service schedule. And while there has always been the mindless dolt minority that is forever oblivious to proper car care the majority of American car owners do try to maintain their vehicle. And, at least when it comes to oil change intervals, most of them are actually trying too hard.



To put it simply (and go against all those Jiffy Lube commercials), if you are changing your oil more than once a year or more than every 5,000 miles you are likely wasting time, money and a limited natual resource. I find it somewhat ironic that in a hyper-fuel-saving-awareness era few people consider the level of waste involved with unnecessary oil changes. Let's not forget the raw material that gasoline comes from, right? But as this article states, oil ain't what it used to be -- it's much better! Whether you want to talk thermal breakdown or water contamination modern lubricants are simply much better at resisting it.

Yes, under extreme conditions like high temperature driving, long-distance towing or short trips with stop-and-go conditions oil can break down quicker, but it's those conditions that call for 5,000-mile intervals -- and even that's borderline wasteful in my opinion. If you aren't subjecting your vehicle to the above conditions then 7,500 miles is certainly no problem. Unless you use a synthetic motor oil, in which case you're probably wasting money if you use each batch for less than 10,000 miles. Remember, while Ford just upped their oil change interval from 5,000 miles to 7,500 miles other companies use sensors to track oil life, and many of those systems don't suggest an oil change until between 12,000 and 15,000 miles!

Obviously the fallback position is to simply follow your car's service schedule, and if you're driving an older car it's going to specify an oil change between 3,000 and 5,000 miles or every 6 months. As a practical legal disclaimer I must officially defer to your owner's manual. Unofficially, I change the oil in my vehicles (which range from a 1970 Dodge Challenger R/T to a 2005 Ford GT) once a year or every 7,500 miles. And because my Ford GT uses synthetic oil, I'm probably still wasting oil with that schedule (call me kooky for wanting to keep a $150,000 exotic under warranty....). Bottom line, changing a vehicle's oil every three months or 3,000 miles is almost certainly wasteful. I'm not sure what kind of "extreme" driving conditions would warrant this frequency, but I've yet to hear them described to me.

Of course you'll probably get a different opinion from your local service station if you ask them. Hmmm...I wonder why...

Posted by Karl Mar 26, 2007 6:05 am

I agree that 3,000 miles is a crock or as I call it a con job. So is three months. I drive a Chevrolet Cobalt that has a computer that calculates oil life remaining. When it is old enough, I get a message saying "change oil soon." Even the sales guy told me to follow the computer and not the con jobs.

Most of the time I use a place on NW 50 near Mac Arthur called Mikes Goodyear. They are reasonable, fast and do not try to sell you crap you do not need. For the southsiders, Mike also has a place on SW 119 near Western.

The last time I changed my oil (last summer) I did it at Swanson's. I had them check a couple of other things, including my CV boots, which may or may not be on their last leg. They told me I had another year, changed my oil for a decent price, and I will probably go there to change my oil as soon as the school year is over.

My car runs just fine on my 1x/year oil changes lol.

OK, don't throw rocks or eggs at me, but I get my oil changed at Wal-Mart.....every 5,000 miles. I know, I know.....everybody hates Wal-Mart. But, for $22.00, they will vacuum my truck out, wash my windows, change the oil and filter, and check the pressure in my tires. While I wait, I shop.

I have to concur with that article. For the last ten years I've changed my oil on intervals of between 5,000 - 7,500 miles and I use synthetic oils exclusively. I usually like to do my own oil changes, but in certain circumstances have had it done for me (usually lack of time). Every 30,000 miles or so I'll put in a quart of a Oil-based Teflon additive like Slick50 with the oil change.

My current vehicles have 62,000 and 98,000 miles on them. My previous truck had 142,000 miles on it before I traded it in. In all cases I've never once had an oil-related problem.

The article above says even a 7,500 mile interval may be overkill. I might try pushing it to 10,000 miles, but 15,000 seems a little high (but it all depends on the health of the engine and driving conditions I'm sure).

Certainly though, "every 3,000 miles" is indeed a croc. But, the oil change places try to scare people into believing that their engine could sieze up because they've driven 3,005 miles since the last change. :rolleyes:

As they say an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure. In same cases your warranty can be voided if your oil changes are not completed in a timely manner.

I spent five years in the military as a mechanic. I have seen what a lack of routine maintenance can do to a vehicle. If you drive your vehicle everyday you should get your oil changed at least every 3-4 months.

The oil change itself, is not that expensive, considering they are topping off your fluids, adding air to your tires,vacuuming and cleaning the windows. It only gets expensive when people allow themselves to be talked into useless services. Do not listen to the idiots at the lube places. Their training consists of parts changing and selling things based on odometer readings.

Do not worry so much about the mileage numbers unless you’re driving more than 1500 miles in a month's time. When you get your oil changed, refuse any additional services.


The lube places will gouge the crap out of you with all kinds of add-ons. They scare people into believing that your car will breakdown if you do not do this. If you use these places insist on the oil change and nothing more. Do not pay to have windshield wipers installed. Do not pay them to change an air filter. Anybody can do those things. If you do not know, just ask the guys at the auto parts store.

I for one avoid the lube places. I know what needs to be done and I either do it myself or take it to my favorite dealership Reynolds Ford. If you do not know a lot about cars, take your car to a reputable dealership or mechanic.

Reputable mechanics and dealerships will tell you what can wait and what needs to done now. They would rather make their money off loyal customers instead tickets stacked with unnecessary maintenance. In some cases mechanics and dealerships will cut you deal for all the services where the lube place will not.

As they say an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure. In same cases your warranty can be voided if your oil changes are not completed in a timely manner.

I spent five years in the military as a mechanic. I have seen what a lack of routine maintenance can do to a vehicle. If you drive your vehicle everyday you should get your oil changed at least every 3-4 months.

The oil change itself, is not that expensive, considering they are topping off your fluids, adding air to your tires,vacuuming and cleaning the windows. It only gets expensive when people allow themselves to be talked into useless services. Do not listen to the idiots at the lube places. Their training consists of parts changing and selling things based on odometer readings.

Do not worry so much about the mileage numbers unless you’re driving more than 1500 miles in a month's time. When you get your oil changed, refuse any additional services.


The lube places will gouge the crap out of you with all kinds of add-ons. They scare people into believing that your car will breakdown if you do not do this. If you use these places insist on the oil change and nothing more. Do not pay to have windshield wipers installed. Do not pay them to change an air filter. Anybody can do those things. If you do not know, just ask the guys at the auto parts store.

I for one avoid the lube places. I know what needs to be done and I either do it myself or take it to my favorite dealership Reynolds Ford. If you do not know a lot about cars, take your car to a reputable dealership or mechanic.

Reputable mechanics and dealerships will tell you what can wait and what needs to done now. They would rather make their money off loyal customers instead tickets stacked with unnecessary maintenance. In some cases mechanics and dealerships will cut you deal for all the services where the lube place will not.


Bacon is exactly right. Autozone will change your air filter for you, windshield wipers, burned out light bulbs and misc. little things like that, for FREE! YES I SAID FOR FREE! Not to mention, they sell you the parts way cheaper than an oil change place.

I have always had great luck with oil changes at Kwik Kar. They do try and talk you into other stuff, but i have no problem saying no thanks. I had a buddy that his mom droppped off his truck for an oil change and just general tune up. He left a check for her to pay for it while he was out of town, and he got back and it was higher than expected. Oh wait, that was because of the $18.00 per windshield wiper charge! GEEZ! I need to find out where that place is so we all can avoid it!

I also have Chevy with On-Star and the car actually e-mails me when to change my oil. I get nervous when it starts to go 10,000 with no e-mail but I guess that the synthetic oils are just so much better these days. I listen to the car talk guys on NPR most Saturday mornings and they confirm this.

With the new synthetic oils the only thing that holden back the oil is the filter, I have been told they crap out around 10,000 miles. Don't know if this is true however.

What works for me is about a 4,000-mile interval: one on either side of my summer road trip, and one halfway across the calendar. (Typically: June, July, January.) The manufacturer recommends 3,750 miles. (Yes, really.)

I go to a reputable dealer (not a quick change place) and get it done about every 3500 miles. To me, it's not just the oil change, it's having people you trust inspecting your car for other wear, such as the brakes, bearings, belts, whatever.

Doing that, I know my car is in good working order and I've never been stranded by it yet in 7 years. I also hope it reduces my chances of having a wheel fall off at 70mph, or an important belt break because some stinking mouse in the garage was gnawing at it. It's the funky stuff that'll kill ya.

I have to believe that good clean oil is a great way to go, and considering 25 dollars versus the cost of the car, I'm happy "wasting" that money.

The single, best thing you can do to preserve a car's engine for the long haul is a regular oil change.

These articles and comments miss the fundamental point - it isn't the mileage, it's the type and frequency of driving that has as much to do with how hard the engine is being "taxed." If you're putting a lot of miles on your car every month, and want to keep your car a long time, a $20 oil change every quarter isn't the least bit unreasonable. An entire of mechanics in my family, who tore down and rebuilt more automotive engines, aircraft engines, vechile transmissions, entire vehicles, motorcycles (you name it) than I could possibly count - both as a hobby and some for a living - told me that oil changes were the cheapest, simplest car insurance you could buy.

They didn't work on commission, they weren't trying to sell me wiper blades, they predated the Jiffy Screw shops by decades, and it was my uncle who taught me how to change the oil in my mom's evil ol' 1979 Pontiac Grand LeMans piece of JUNK who had a whole lifetime of mechanical experience on which to base his opinions.

At $20 per change, four times a year isn't even $100. In the context of a five-figure investment over a span of five, ten, or more years, that's barely a drop in the bucket.

-soonerdave

While you have a good point in general, there is a point of diminishing returns for your "insurance" where excessive changes do become wasteful. With the kind of driving I do (lots of highway miles), going 7,500 miles and using synthetic oil and good filters works well.

Hmmm, I change my oil when my husband says it's time to. Well, he actually does it himself. I went sooooo long w/out changing my oil that my oil was black and chunky. Sweet!

I went sooooo long w/out changing my oil that my oil was black and chunky.

I was going to stay out of this discussion, but ...

For diesel engines (and I'm speaking based on 20 years of experience) black oil is not necesarily bad, it shows that it's doing it's job. That said, 3000-5000 mile oil changes are crucial for diesel engines, as the oil gets diluted by fuel. Gasoline engines can "burn off" this dilution, diesels can not.

Why is everyone against Wal-Mart? Most of those guys have just as much training and experience as the dudes that work at Hibdons and other places. I know a lot of people that went to Moore Norman Technology Center (including my husband) and many of them work at places like that and I would take my cars to all of them. I'm just glad I was lucky to find a guy that can do all of that stuff for me. He actually just replaced my tranny over the weekend (with a new one that looks more like a woman). MWAHAHAHA.

I use Wal Mart for convenience and price - not quality unfortunately.

For about $20 they change the oil, check major fluids, vacuum and even test my battery on load - all while I shop.

Plus they never give me a hard time about one of my extra cars that tends to "tick, tick, tick." Several places refused to change the oil in that car because of the ticks.

BUT, it often looks like some sort of inbred reunion behind the counter. I seriously asked the guy checking me in once, "You're not the one who's gonna be working on my car are you?"

Two weeks ago I went to Wal-Mart, nobody was at the little guard shack, it was raining so I parked and went inside. The lady at the car care counter was actually going to have me go back outside in the rain and drive my car to the guard shack and wait for an employee who had gone inside out of the rain. I just laughed and handed her my keys and gave her that uncomfortable stare until she gave it up.

Why is everyone against Wal-Mart? Most of those guys have just as much training and experience as the dudes that work at Hibdons and other places.

Those that complain about Walmart generally aren't complaining about mechanic knowledge, they are making a statememt about the "evil empire" so often portrayed by the media. There are winners and losers in any field, no matter if you are seeking bargain prices or boutique service. Treat vehicle service like any other service - find someone you like and follow him/her if there is a job change. You can't put a dollar figure on peace of mind.

I agree with BJ (hah) on the whole counter experience when taking your car to Wal-Mart. I havent taken my car there (remember hubby does the work) but I check out back there a lot when shopping and the people are freaking horrible.

I have two GM products, one of which requires a full synthetic oil be used in the motor. The other (a Silverado)...I just go by the engine Oil Life Monitor (OLM). It measures speed, load, RPM, etc. over time, and calculates roughly when I need to change the oil. Usually about every 5 to 7 thousand miles, the light pops up, telling me to do so.

That's with conventional oil, and it seemed scary to do it at such long intervals. But in one of my previous trucks (that had the same system), I would do the oil change based on the OLM, and send a sample in for oil analysis (yes, you can do this). They measure all manner of things in your used oil. Like how many contaminants have gotten in, if there's any metal in it, how is the lubricity holding up, etc. And they send you a detailed report on it. Mine always came back clean, and I put over 300,000 miles on that pickup without a single mechanical failure in any of the drivetrain, changing my oil when the truck said it needed it. The guy I sold it to me has recently emailed me and said that he's approaching 400k in it. That's on the original engine and transmission. Not bad at all for a crappy "domestic" huh?

My other truck (the weekender) requires a full synthetic oil, and it's OLM goes off around 10k (from what I've seen so far), but it's more of a garage queen, so I'll be following more of a time schedule rather than a mileage schedule when it comes time to change it. I've also switched it over to Amsoil, which says that it can go 25,000 miles between changes. Of course, it costs about $70 for enough of it to change my oil (I do my own).

And coming from a guy that used to work as a fast lube tech during high school...I'd say that the "inept a**hole" ratio is about the same in that field as it is anywhere else. Just enough of them to keep a permanent black eye in the eyes of the public. It only takes one to make WalMart or Hibdons look bad.

As a practical legal disclaimer I must officially defer to your owner's manual. Unofficially, I change the oil in my vehicles (which range from a 1970 Dodge Challenger R/T to a 2005 Ford GT) once a year or every 7,500 miles. And because my Ford GT uses synthetic oil, I'm probably still wasting oil with that schedule (call me kooky for wanting to keep a $150,000 exotic under warranty....). Bottom line, changing a vehicle's oil every three months or 3,000 miles is almost certainly wasteful. I'm not sure what kind of "extreme" driving conditions would warrant this frequency, but I've yet to hear them described to me.
Posted by Karl Mar 26, 2007 6:05 am

SORRY OFF SUBJECT!

Sweet... Dodge Challenger. My dad had a couple '73 Dodge Chargers... one black, one white (in better shape than black) both R/T. I remember growing up... thinking when I turned 16 I'd be driving those. I had dreams about drag racing in the black one. No luck, my mom wrecked the White one when I was just a baby (wow that put a dent in their marriage) and the black one rusted out so bad dad eventually abandoned the body and sold the transmission and various motor parts to friends and my brother tracked those pieces down and bought them back. Now lil bro owns two '73 Dodge Chargers. He's 16 years old and dead set on that Plum crazy purple ;)

kudos dude!

As with any advice, beware.

I change oil regularly as per the MFG suggestion while under warranty. Why? because when my Durango engine seized, they cited bad maintenance. I knew this was not the case, but I changed it myself and had no records they would accept.
(Turns out it was a leak in the intake plenum gasket sludging the oil in the head...)

If I had been getting the oil changed, with dated receipts and records, they would have had to investigate further and discover the real failure themselves. As it was, they pulled the pan, saw sludge, and quit looking. Had I still been right, but only changing oil every 7,500 miles, they would still have denied service.

(I never did get them to fix it. Would up swapping in an engine myself to get it running again.)