What are the reasons why we fellas don't commit?....

We're still looking elsewhere?

Don't feel it's reciprocated?

She's still shopping around/looking?

Where do we get our security?

I stayed single for so many years for many reasons that varied from relationship to relationship. However, there was always one constant - Until I met my wife I hadn't dated anyone that gave me that sick feeling if I thought about them not being in my life.

I really think it was because our relationship fit together so perfect. There were no lies in the beginning (can't tell you the number of women I dated that had other 'boy friends' but denied it. One was even married but seperated.). We also took it slow. We only saw each other once a week at most and didn't sleep with each other or 'stay over' until we had dated for several months. I think space in the begining allowed us to really develop a bond.

My previous relationships were based on mostly sex or boredom. Also, many women had way too much baggage (braty kids, an ex husband, bills, emotional issues, etc.).

When I met a woman that liked me but obviously didn't 'need' me, I was hooked.

Well being a single female...I can tell you the reasons I am still single. Most of the men I dated lied about the same things....1. stating they were single when they were married 2. invovled with someone "attached but looking" (if that makes any sense!) , 3. not wanting a commitment saying they had been hurt and not wanting to get hurt again, so they say they want "friends with benefits" 4. refuse to take responsilblity for any other their actions. 5. being hung up on women that are drug addicts, alcoholics, strippers, or just general underachievers looking for a free ride, men will say "she needs me and I feel for the children she has" or just because "she is hot" believing they can "change" them bring them home and make them a housewife...
I had one that wants a woman to support him! I have also heard that most men are still looking for the "fireworks" when they first see a woman, then they will know. I always question how this is going to happen in a bar when the beer goggles are on?
I think society in general has a distorted view of marriage and family. Living together , children out of wedlock, having affairs.... acceptable all with no consequences. loyalty is something that has been lost, If people would just try and build a relationship built on honesty and stick to commitments, taking pride in themselves we might get some headway.

Honestly, I had no real problem with all the games of the single life. It is what it is. The problem comes when people can't seperate 'typical single behavior' from reality.

Sure I lied to few girls (gave them a false name, told them I'd call, said I wasn't dating anyone else, etc.), dated the stripper or two to get it out of my system and enjoyed a few 'friends with benefits.' However, I knew better than to fall in love or lead someone to believe that we were in a committed relationship.

Even when I lived with someone (don't recommend it) we were clear that we had no intention of getting married.

Some people never mature out of that lifestlye and some do.

The people I feel for are those that were in a committed marriage that falls apart due to no fault of their own.

They are thrown into this world of lies and dissappointment after coming from a world of committment.

I think people should always be cautious when dating anyone (male/female) who is over the age of 35 that has never been married. Likewise, if they have been married and divorced more than twice, run, run, run!

I applaud you bailjumper for being honest!
The only thing I dont agree with is the belief that "something is wrong" with someone 35 and over and never married. I have chose this. I personally have not meet an honest, good man that I would settle down with. I am not a troll, pyshco, or loser by any stretch of the means. I have many friends that have been caught up in the lies of a player also. Why would I choose to marry one of these players?I have a great career, good outlook on life in general and thankly common sense. You freely admit your past, how many other men do you think do this? Plenty. Women too. That is why most of us are single and over 35! Getting caught up in lies of another. Not that anything is wrong with us some of us, just have good sense. I do not accept lies or drama and will not put up with it in my life.
So finding a good decent man is exhausting especially when they are dating the strippers, emotionally unavailable or just flat out players, so they then become jaded on marriage and commitment.

Sorry, don't mean there is anything 'wrong' with a person that is over 35 and never married. I just mean that it may say alot about them as opposed to a person in their 20's.

But trust me, I have issues with many people who get married as soon as they turn 21 also.

If I hadn't been introduced to my wife, I very well would be a 30's single man.

What I meant is that a person who has gone 35+ years without marriage is going to be set in many of their ways.

Committment may not mean alot or it may mean so much that they are unable to find someone with the same values.

Often an older single person has a career, education and their habits. I think it makes it harder to find a match in many cases.

If, heaven forbid, my wife died tomorrow in a car accident, I would hate the idea of jumping into a world of single 30-somethings because I have routine that works for me and probably wouldn't for many other people.

Hope you see where I'm going. I know what I want to say, but don't have the energy to say it.

What I meant is that a person who has gone 35+ years without marriage is going to be set in many of their ways.


I disagree.

In many cases, the situation can be quite the opposite. A person who is still single in their 30s may actually be MORE flexible and accepting because they've had time to sit back and evaluate their lives and consider what is really, truly important in a potential partner. There's a very good chance that they are more likely to compromise and change than someone who is younger because they're not as idealistic... they're (hopefully) mature enough to understand the value that can be found in someone that is not like them.

I, for one, am a little more open-minded than I was when I was 18-25.

I think people should always be cautious when dating anyone (male/female) who is over the age of 35 that has never been married.

I think this is a terrible thing to say. I am 34 and have never been married. It's not because I didn't want to be. Believe me, I've looked high and low and worked very hard at every relationship I've had... for various reasons, things didn't work out with any of them. I've never cheated on anyone... I've never lied or been abusive or taken advantage of them. I've done everything I could think of to make things work with anyone that I felt might be worth the effort. However, I suppose my one fatal "mistake", the one thing that has apparently put me in the "Danger Will Robinson" category of unmarried people approaching 35+, is that I didn't SETTLE. I didn't settle for anyone who treated me like crap, who brought me down, or simply didn't want me around. If that puts me in an undesirable category in the dating scene, then I guess I'm just screwed because even if I found someone tomorrow, I wouldn't know them long enough to feasibly consider breaking "the curse".

I'm not trying to be a bitch, but honestly... you can't just dump all unmarried people over the age of 35 into one category because there's too many reasons why a person is unmarried. Many times, it's no fault of their own.

Tracy I think its easy for men and especially married men or married people in general to pass judgment on a single professional woman that has not been married. I chose to get a great career (not that I was not looking for men) and it hurts you to make more then men, or more educated....again a "curse"
Seems that were are judged all the way around. I know that men are threatned by women that have their own means of support (as with us) and feeling that we dont "need" them. That "need" factor again. Its about women being subservient to their man. Since they are not stepping up to the plate as they should, good thing we have our own means!

Ohhhhh, I have no problem with an educated, working woman. The closest i got to even considering marriage before taking the plunge was with a beautiful red head I had lived with for about a year. Then one day she proclaimed that she saw no need to go back to college and get her degree because she intended to be a house wife. That ended any consideration for marriage for me.

I am very attracted to the 'working woman.'

My 'set in their ways' had more to do with men than women. I have several single guy friends in their 30's. I doubt they will ever get married unless the right mom type comes along. They have their guy pals, their drinking places and their hunting, fishing and golfing days. I hear over and over - things were going great, then SHE actually expected me to not hang out with my guy friends as much or at all!

Also, many of them fool around with married women. I think this has caused a very negative feel for marriage and lots distrust.

One guy I know actually told a woman he's been seeing for a couple of years "I'm sorry but I could never marry you. When I met you, you cheated on your then husband with me. Now that your divorced, I don't want to get into the same situation as your ex. Sorry, I don't think you take marriage seriously enough." Yeah, I know, I rolled my eyes at him too.

I don't think men are threatened by a women that is smart or a professional, I think women are threatened to let their guards down when they are professionals. This is my way of thinking if I threaten a man because I am smart or have been married as one put it with baggage ( kids) then that man is not a man I want in my life.l have and will never again settle for the one I can just live with. I was always told dont settle for the one you can live with, choose the one you can't live without. Now on the other aspect of things, If a man sees my daughter or my ex as baggage by all means I can carry my own suitcase. I dont need him to fix anything, nothing in my life is broken. I dont want him to take care of me. I don't need a man, but if I want someone in my life that is a bigger compliment than me ever needing him. Babies need their moms, Wanting something is much better than needing them. As most of the married people know, You always understand why relationships dont work out. No one can tell me that they just dont understand why they have not found the right person. All we have to do is look inside, ask ourselves 3 major heart wrenching questions. Who am I ? What do I stand for? and what image or what do I show of myself? If you are happy with the answers you get I am sure you will find everything you are looking for. I am a professional woman that has "baggage" I am very proud of and I wont settle for a man that looks at my daughter as that. As far as ex's goes well that aint baggage that is the past and it is going to stay that way. What I do in the future has no bearings on what he does. I will always have that past, but my future is way brighter now. Keep a smile on your face, stop looking so hard and love will be there to find you.

When you start to get a little older in life you realize that anyone you get involved with is going to have baggage of one type or another. Whether that is kids or a bad experience with an ex-spouse or fiancee. We all have a little baggage. I have dated a woman that already had a kid and had no problem with it. The reason we broke was totally seperate from that issue. As long as you feel something for that person I don't think that should matter.

I think there's a lot of people that actually PREFER someone with "baggage", whether they are consciously aware of it or not, because it makes them seem more human and attainable in the dating scene. They believe that person will better understand them and their shortcomings and will be less judgmental.

Well being a single female...I can tell you the reasons I am still single. Most of the men I dated lied about the same things....1. stating they were single when they were married 2. invovled with someone "attached but looking" (if that makes any sense!) , 3. not wanting a commitment saying they had been hurt and not wanting to get hurt again, so they say they want "friends with benefits" 4. refuse to take responsilblity for any other their actions. 5. being hung up on women that are drug addicts, alcoholics, strippers, or just general underachievers looking for a free ride, men will say "she needs me and I feel for the children she has" or just because "she is hot" believing they can "change" them bring them home and make them a housewife...
I had one that wants a woman to support him! I have also heard that most men are still looking for the "fireworks" when they first see a woman, then they will know. I always question how this is going to happen in a bar when the beer goggles are on?


Mercy, mercy, mercy, StephiOKC,....Don't you realize men are saying the same things about women....Can you acknowledge that they are true for both genders?

Ohhhhh, I have no problem with an educated, working woman. The closest i got to even considering marriage before taking the plunge was with a beautiful red head I had lived with for about a year. Then one day she proclaimed that she saw no need to go back to college and get her degree because she intended to be a house wife. That ended any consideration for marriage for me.

I am very attracted to the 'working woman.'

Tradition is gone!!!!! The housewife, staying at home to raise the kids is no more.....Step back to the time when it was the norm and it may still be possible. But if that housewife wants her own car...cell phones for everyone, cable TV, to eat out five times a week, lawn service, pool service, etc.,....one income doesn't cover all that.

Leon I bet you are right. I see men and women that stay in relationships for all the wrong reasons everyday. Hence, lies and infidelity. I am speaking from my experiences. You are involved with someone so why does all this matter to you?

I just find peoples' behavior interesting. I think I missed my calling to a different profession.

I can only speak for myself but women want a guy that is aggressive and takes charge but when he committs, she can't understand why she can't CONTROL him. I won't be controlled and I don't want to control her. If everyone at work is going out for a drink after work and I want to go, I'm going to call and tell her where I'm going, not ask if I can go!!! If she wants to come along, GREAT, meet me there. But she's not going to tell me I can't go. If I have even the slightest feeling that she wants to be controlling, I'm gone.

What are the reasons why we fellas don't commit?....

We're still looking elsewhere?

Don't feel it's reciprocated?

She's still shopping around/looking?

Where do we get our security?

Personally...Dating after 30, all I've been getting is women ready to explode in a shower of worn-out biological clock parts. Every woman I've dated in the last 5-10 years has wanted to get married within 6 months of our first date. They seem to be more worried about getting married than to whom they get married. It really puts an extra element of tension in a relationship that can taint the whole experience.

I'm not saying that all my relationships have been that way, or that it's always a bad thing, but c'mon...Don't pressure me to get married and have babies after mere months of dinners and movies. I'm sure I'll get married at some point, but certainly not because I'm 35 and I'm "supposed" to be married and have 2.5 children at this point in life. I'll get married when I meet somebody that makes me feel like I couldn't do without them.

I've dated a lot great people in recent years but no one has produced that spark that tells me that they're the one. I jumped the gun a little too soon the first time around and I'm content to wait until the right one comes along. In the meantime, I'm enjoying the search.

Everyone I have talked to that has found the one found them by accident. It is just something that happens. They spent time with somone and the next thing they new they fell for them and vice versa.

In other words, if you search for love it will never find you. If you relax and let love find you, it will happen and it will be in away you would least expect.

I have no problem with marriage or a serious commitment. I hate being alone. I have found women who don't want to commit. They complain that they are single and no one wants to commit to them but even after years of many men who are willing to marry them, they are still single and complaining about the same thing.

I'm not afraid to commit. I'll gladly commit to the right person. What I'm afraid of is committing to a "chameleon"

I'm not afraid to commit. I'll gladly commit to the right person. What I'm afraid of is committing to a "chameleon"

I would LOVE to date a girl that changed colors. Especially if her cheeks were like a mood ring. That would make a relationship SO much easier. I'd be able to tell if "I don't care" meant "I don't care" instead of "do it and I'll cut your peener off when you sleep" because she'd turn puce first.

Dustbowl's Excellent Adventure:

Married twice, one my fault the other hers. Single for five years now. I don't LOOK for women to date and I don't have a problem getting dates. They just sort of happen. I've dated the "upper crust", the working girl, the professional, the artist, the psycho, the mother, the man hater and even a lesbian. She thought I was cute. Let's not go there.

I don't like to make judgments and I try to realize that we are all fooked up one way or the other. Compatibility is the most important thing for me. I hate conflict and I won't put up with head games for very long. If you like me fine, if you don't that's fine too, just tell me.

Love yourself first before you try to find a mate or accept a mate.

I have a friend who says all women fall into one or more of these categories:
1. I want a baby.
2 I want money.
3. I want security.
4 I want to control you.

I'm not saying he is right. Tough area when it comes to finding what fits and what doesn't.

Oh yeah, and if either of you own a business or have more than $25,000 in assets the word is PRENUP, PRENUP, PRENUP. Kids excluded of course. Pay your damn child support and stay involved with your children's lives. You didn't divorce the kids moron.

I think a lot of professional women in their thirties and forties chalk up a lack of men to their allegedly being threatened by their success.

I doubt it. I'm a professional and as near as I can tell, that has never been a problem for men who aren't a mess, anyway.

<<I won't be controlled and I don't want to control her. If everyone at work is going out for a drink after work and I want to go, I'm going to call and tell her where I'm going, not ask if I can go!!! If she wants to come along, GREAT, meet me there. But she's not going to tell me I can't go. If I have even the slightest feeling that she wants to be controlling, I'm gone.>>

I can't even relate to this attitude. If someone has that sort of attitude towards the woman, why be there in the first place? I can't imagine being so hostile to my mate. I'd say you'd be better off gone - you aren't in a good situation to begin with.

Dustbowl's Excellent Adventure:

Married twice, one my fault the other hers. Single for five years now. I don't LOOK for women to date and I don't have a problem getting dates. They just sort of happen. I've dated the "upper crust", the working girl, the professional, the artist, the psycho, the mother, the man hater and even a lesbian. She thought I was cute. Let's not go there.

I don't like to make judgments and I try to realize that we are all fooked up one way or the other. Compatibility is the most important thing for me. I hate conflict and I won't put up with head games for very long. If you like me fine, if you don't that's fine too, just tell me.

Love yourself first before you try to find a mate or accept a mate.

I have a friend who says all women fall into one or more of these categories:
1. I want a baby.
2 I want money.
3. I want security.
4 I want to control you.

I'm not saying he is right. Tough area when it comes to finding what fits and what doesn't.

Oh yeah, and if either of you own a business or have more than $25,000 in assets the word is PRENUP, PRENUP, PRENUP. Kids excluded of course. Pay your damn child support and stay involved with your children's lives. You didn't divorce the kids moron.

Really?

:sofa:


<<I won't be controlled and I don't want to control her. If everyone at work is going out for a drink after work and I want to go, I'm going to call and tell her where I'm going, not ask if I can go!!! If she wants to come along, GREAT, meet me there. But she's not going to tell me I can't go. If I have even the slightest feeling that she wants to be controlling, I'm gone.>>

I can't even relate to this attitude. If someone has that sort of attitude towards the woman, why be there in the first place? I can't imagine being so hostile to my mate. I'd say you'd be better off gone - you aren't in a good situation to begin with.

It's got nothing to do with an attitude towards the woman, it's a mutual respect thing. Respect that in addition to being a part of our little team of two...I'm also still an individual that doesn't need to ask permission to deviate from home-work-sleep-home-work-sleep-home-home-home-home as long as it's not a frequent habit and it's not inconveniencing the family. Just like she shouldn't need to "ask" for permission to buy a new purse.

[QUOTE=Oh GAWD the Smell!;131843]Really?

:sofa:


Really, at least in a relationship. As for guys, bring it on!!! No really, It's very difficult to communicate on these message boards. I do have a different personality, but I do enjoy my life and I'm probably not much different than anybody else here. I've been told I'm sort of a mix between George Carlin, Ward Cleaver and Ozzy Osborne. I is what I is.

Cheers, Summer is coming and maybe we can all meet-up sometime. I promise I will behave.

<<It's got nothing to do with an attitude towards the woman, it's a mutual respect thing. Respect that in addition to being a part of our little team of two...I'm also still an individual that doesn't need to ask permission to deviate from home-work-sleep-home-work-sleep-home-home-home-home as long as it's not a frequent habit and it's not inconveniencing the family. Just like she shouldn't need to "ask" for permission to buy a new purse.>>

Well, I wasn't talking about a generic attitude towards women. I meant THAT woman. To be so hostile towards a mate that you are worried about them controlling you sounds like a ghastly way to live. Find a woman who doesn't care because if she DOES and you are more worried about your freedom than her peace of mind is a match made in hell.

Comparing that to buying is purse is just peculiar. A purse is about a thing, stuff, money. A night out without her permission is about how you want to live your life, your lifestyle, who you want to spend it with and the message is clear - she isn't your first priority and you aren't too worried about whether she will be waiting when you decide to pull into the driveway.

If that is the way you feel, she isn't the woman for you. A lot of the guys have talked about meeting the right one. I am willing to bet that those who think they have don't share the attitude you are describing. Perhaps I'm wrong. If my man had that attitude, it wouldn't be about controlling him - it would just be so obvious that I wasn't that important to him.

Comparing that to buying is purse is just peculiar. A purse is about a thing, stuff, money. A night out without her permission is about how you want to live your life, your lifestyle, who you want to spend it with and the message is clear - she isn't your first priority and you aren't too worried about whether she will be waiting when you decide to pull into the driveway.

Yeah, the purse analogy was a bad one.

But your argument of a night out after work equaling a way of life, a lifestyle, is asinine. Since when does a night out after work equal a whole lifestyle? That's hardly a lifestyle and it's hardly selfish. More like a way of schmoozing with the boss over a cold one for a better raise to better support my family...That might happen once every 3 months.

As for the priority thing...Another crazy generalization. I mean really. Every relationship has it's own dynamic, so please don't tell me where my priorities are. If my woman called me and said "I'm going to go to Funplace McGee's with my friend and I'll be home around 11"...As long as we had no previous plans, I'd say "okay, see you then, HAVE FUN!" and go on about my day. See, she told me what she was going to do. Didn't ask. Told. And since I know she's not the "run amok until the cows come home" type (I don't make a habit of forming relationships with those), I'm fine with it. It's not a demand or hardcore statement of fact. There's no hostility. It's a discussion about plans for the evening between two people that know and respect one another.

Waiting for me in the driveway indeed. Who wants that? That's needy and creepy. She's got her own brain, job, friends, and schedule. And they're not always going to jive with mine. We'll work it out like adults without other people telling us about how we should prioritize each other.

Yeah, the purse analogy was a bad one.

But your argument of a night out after work equaling a way of life, a lifestyle, is asinine. Since when does a night out after work equal a whole lifestyle? That's hardly a lifestyle and it's hardly selfish. More like a way of schmoozing with the boss over a cold one for a better raise to better support my family...That might happen once every 3 months.

As for the priority thing...Another crazy generalization. I mean really. Every relationship has it's own dynamic, so please don't tell me where my priorities are. If my woman called me and said "I'm going to go to Funplace McGee's with my friend and I'll be home around 11"...As long as we had no previous plans, I'd say "okay, see you then, HAVE FUN!" and go on about my day. See, she told me what she was going to do. Didn't ask. Told. And since I know she's not the "run amok until the cows come home" type (I don't make a habit of forming relationships with those), I'm fine with it. It's not a demand or hardcore statement of fact. There's no hostility. It's a discussion about plans for the evening between two people that know and respect one another.

Waiting for me in the driveway indeed. Who wants that? That's needy and creepy. She's got her own brain, job, friends, and schedule. And they're not always going to jive with mine. We'll work it out like adults without other people telling us about how we should prioritize each other.

I think my friend's list might have some merit. See #4 above. :Smiley112

My suggestion, seriously, is that you don't try to equate "buying a purse" with your god given right, god dammit, to party with your friends and if she doesn't like it, she can take a hike because you WON'T be "controlled."

Just a suggestion, of course.

OH how i wish i hadn't read this thread. sigh.

My suggestion, seriously, is that you don't try to equate "buying a purse" with your god given right, god dammit, to party with your friends and if she doesn't like it, she can take a hike because you WON'T be "controlled."

Just a suggestion, of course.

And I admitted that the purse analogy was a bad one. Want me to do it again? Okay. The purse analogy was a bad one.

And you're right. It's not my god given right to to "party". But it's not her god given right to stop me from doing something without her when it doesn't affect her in the slightest. If there is a demand for me to be present at all times without any reason other than simply because we're together...Then she's got co-dependency issues.

Seriously...I'm not a jerk to women. Never have been. The only family I have is a mother and two sisters. That's it. Nobody else. They wouldn't have it and would disembowel me if I treated ANY woman like crap.

My point, all along, has been that if this is an issue with a couple, it isn't a good match. People who are tuned in to each other wouldn't even "go there" on this issue. That is all I'm saying.

Love yourself first before you try to find a mate or accept a mate.




If only more people would truly live by this statement, the complex world of dating and relationships would be more fulfilling for all.

Not being sarcastic - I am serious - I read "love yourself" all the time and have no idea what that means. And I am female so you'd think it would be obvious! :bright_id Is it a feeling? Is it action? I know with a lot of my dysfunctional parents that they "love" their children (meaning they "feel" love) but they don't do much in terms of action that you'd expect from a parent who loved their child. I am always telling them that love is more than just a feeling. So what is meant by "love yourself?" And if you say it means both (action and feeling), ok, I expected that, but I am still at a loss as to what that means.

Does that mean I am supposed to feel good about myself even if I am a jerk? What does that fix? Does it mean that I should treat myself to something special? Even with children that should be used sparingly and I wouldn't want them to think that I love them because I give them stuff.

Does it mean that I go easy on myself when I am having a bad day? Take a bubble bath or get a pedicure when I am stressed? Be selfish even when it negatively affects others?

What does it mean? And how does that make anything better? I hear/read that all the time and usually just ignore it. The more I think about it, the less it makes sense (to me).

I'm confused.

Not being sarcastic - I am serious - I read "love yourself" all the time and have no idea what that means. And I am female so you'd think it would be obvious! :bright_id Is it a feeling? Is it action? I know with a lot of my dysfunctional parents that they "love" their children (meaning they "feel" love) but they don't do much in terms of action that you'd expect from a parent who loved their child. I am always telling them that love is more than just a feeling. So what is meant by "love yourself?" And if you say it means both (action and feeling), ok, I expected that, but I am still at a loss as to what that means.

Does that mean I am supposed to feel good about myself even if I am a jerk? What does that fix? Does it mean that I should treat myself to something special? Even with children that should be used sparingly and I wouldn't want them to think that I love them because I give them stuff.

Does it mean that I go easy on myself when I am having a bad day? Take a bubble bath or get a pedicure when I am stressed? Be selfish even when it negatively affects others?

What does it mean? And how does that make anything better? I hear/read that all the time and usually just ignore it. The more I think about it, the less it makes sense (to me).

I'm confused.

I think the general idea is that you have to be able to take care of yourself and have a self-awareness about your own strengths and weaknesses before you can begin to share a life with someone else..... it certainly increases the chances of a successful relationship.....

That's the way I take it, and after some good 'ole life experiences, I think it's true.....

I think the general idea is that you have to be able to take care of yourself and have a self-awareness about your own strengths and weaknesses before you can begin to share a life with someone else..... it certainly increases the chances of a successful relationship.....

That's the way I take it, and after some good 'ole life experiences, I think it's true.....

See, to me THAT makes sense as what contributes to being a happy, competent person and a good partner - but I am still not sure how the statement "love yourself" would be interpreted as that, at least based on the words of the statement.

Somebody once told me to go love myself.

Or, um, something like that.

Not being sarcastic - I am serious - I read "love yourself" all the time and have no idea what that means. And I am female so you'd think it would be obvious! :bright_id Is it a feeling? Is it action? I know with a lot of my dysfunctional parents that they "love" their children (meaning they "feel" love) but they don't do much in terms of action that you'd expect from a parent who loved their child. I am always telling them that love is more than just a feeling. So what is meant by "love yourself?" And if you say it means both (action and feeling), ok, I expected that, but I am still at a loss as to what that means.

Does that mean I am supposed to feel good about myself even if I am a jerk? What does that fix? Does it mean that I should treat myself to something special? Even with children that should be used sparingly and I wouldn't want them to think that I love them because I give them stuff.

Does it mean that I go easy on myself when I am having a bad day? Take a bubble bath or get a pedicure when I am stressed? Be selfish even when it negatively affects others?

What does it mean? And how does that make anything better? I hear/read that all the time and usually just ignore it. The more I think about it, the less it makes sense (to me).

I'm confused.

To me, based on my experiences, it means to know and understand yourself first before trying to seriously connect with a mate/partner. I know that there were times when I was not happy with myself and my relationships were bad as a result. It's not a me first attitude. It's accepting and understanding that I have faults and great aspects as a person and I accept them. I try to change the faults, but I don't expect another person to be responsible for me changing.

It was a real revelation to me when I could allow myself to accept myself as an independent entity without the need for approval to be happy. Once this happened, I was much more understanding of others and my relationships improved. I don't expect everyone to like me and I accept that. I know that my personality is different and many people like it and some hate it. I don't try to change the ones that hate it.

I think many people settle for a bad relationship and would probably be better off being a free agent and work on 'Loving" themselves first. I know these things are complicated. I have also found that the "opposites attract" notion has been true in my experience. My current relationship would fail every Oprah, Dr. Phil, Joel Olsteen test in the world, but it is one of the richest relationships I have ever had. Maybe it comes with age, I'm not real sure.

Love yourself - I think it means meeting most of your own needs and not be too dependent on your partner to have all the responsibility for your happiness. Because it's a lifetime of disappointment to depend on someone else to know and meet all of your needs unless he is a mind reader or you give really good hints and cues!

I've been married 20 years this year.. ( I know, I can't believe I'm that old either - I refuse to accept it!) But I love my husband now more than ever and we've had a great life together.. we've had our ups and downs... who hasn't? But, he is by far, my very best friend who knows me and accepts all my flaws and imperfections and still loves me anyway. I don't think I could have picked a better person to do this thing called 'life' together.. and we met when we were pretty young.

In life and marriage, things change and you have to adapt and go with the flow.. when we first met, I worked full time, 8 years later, I stopped working to stay home and raise my babies, after they were a little older, I went back to work off and on part time ... for a few years.. now the kids are 10 & 15 and I still can't go back to work full time because now I really want to be with them after school and involved in their lives because I know I'll only have them for another few years.. oh gawd..boo,hoo!!!! I'm warning all of you in advance, I will be a complete and total mess when that happens.

But, anyway, pretty soon, I'll probably have to find more to do than help run our company to keep me busy. I get bored so easily!

So, my point is, to the guys looking for a ' label' maybe a professional wife or homemaker, you can't marry someone based on the fact that she will always be income producing or always a stay at home mom.. you have to adapt to the situation at hand and be atttracted to and fall in love with the person and personality...

This is truly and interesting discussion. Lots of good thoughts and lots of honesty.

My personal thought on actually somewhat works a little with Bailjumper's thought about "Until I met my wife I hadn't dated anyone that gave me that sick feeling if I thought about them not being in my life." And then he went on to say, "When I met a woman that liked me but obviously didn't 'need' me, I was hooked." BailJumper... THAT'S IT!

Dustbowl said:
I have a friend who says all women fall into one or more of these categories:
1. I want a baby.
2 I want money.
3. I want security.
4 I want to control you.

And he explained he entire "love yourself thing."

Maybe one works for one person and another works for the next person. Who knows why. Yes, you need to be whole as a person and love yourself. If you are not whole, you will be seeing to "take" from the other person. But when you are complete, love yourself and you still feel sick at the thought of not having the other person in your life, it is probably because your are sick at the thought of missing the best match of your life...someone who doesn't take from you, but who adds to your completeness...as you do to their life.

The one thing I know is that until you are secure and complete in yourself...to the point you don't "need" someone to complete your life, you are not ready to commit seriously and "find a mate."

Relationships are difficult. They are sometimes a struggle, even in the best of circumstances. But if you are not giving 100%, along with your mate giving 100%, it can't be a balanced relationship.

If you choose someone to commit to because they fulfill a need, then you are not ready. It is when you are completely secure in yourself, (a.k.a. "love yourself,) when you need no one to complete you or provide financially for you or to "validate" you, that you are ready for a relationship. When two people such as this come together, (just doing the math here.... 100% + 100% = an abundance) they keep their self worth, "need" nothing to complete themselves from the other, and then the relationship can be off the chart!

Why don't men commit? Maybe they are not there yet, or the women they date are not there yet. Why don't women commit? Same reason. And when both people are secure, they are usually looking for that one person, mind-heart-and soul, who adds to their life, and whose life whom they can add to, so it is not a burden, or uneven, or anything less than that 200% And when both people are secure in that, it doesn't matter that they have their own lives within their couple's life. It all fits, like a key in a lock.

Just and opinion. But one that has taken years to realize and live by.

Read a great article recently about "Social Capital" and I thought it completely nailed 95&#37; of the average realtionhips out there.

For my two cents:

What are the reasons why we fellas don't commit?
1. Youth (Why here, why now, why her?)
2. Fear
3. Selfishness (What does she do for me?)
4. Insecurity

We're still looking elsewhere?
What about for those who aren't looking?

Don't feel it's reciprocated?
Fear of rejection? I feel that...

She's still shopping around/looking?
Situation I'm in is that a girl found me, we became friends, I fell in love, and from the moment I told her I had "feelings" for her, she began closing herself off. This girl doesn't look like she's shopping, more like she's waiting for someone better. I'm no prize, believe me, but for this girl and for myself, I wonder if we will ever find someone better.

Where do we get our security?
I suggest ADT, maybe Broadview.

It might not be that she is looking for "better." I bet she is looking for "Mr. Right." Speaking as a female, if I am not on board, completely, when a man wears his heart on his sleeve and wants more, it is the kiss of death. It is probably that way for many men, too. But not everyone is like that.

I was married for 20 years, then chased around the country to different women and hotels...lived with someone, etc.

The chasing around thing was best. There's the constant anticipation of someone new, everyone knows what they're in it for and everyone goes home when they're done.

Shallow, maybe, but compared to the mind-numbing boredom of long term marriage, shallow is fine.

Dang, if long term marriage is supposed to be mind numbing boring,
I must be doing something wrong.
:sofa:

Dang, if long term marriage is supposed to be mind numbing boring,
I must be doing something wrong.
:sofa:

Bless you, Kevin! :yourock:

Holy 2 year old thread resurrection Batman.

I fall into the over 40 and never been married crowd. Funny thing is, my whole life I've always said I want to get married and have kids. Why am I still single? Haha it's complicated.

I'm not at all afraid of commitment but when I was younger I was really stupid. I chased off some really great women. Now that I'm ready to get married, I'm not finding compatible women. Of course, I haven't been looking too hard just going with the flow.

I'm in the single and over 40 crowd, too. To me, if you haven't owned a dog or a cat since you were a kid, that's a sign you don't need a close relationship with the opoosite sex very much, anyway. I fall in that category. Besides, also being selfish, lacking in sex appeal and a keen sense of humor. I don't complain much since I don't need someone trying to make me something I'm not, or try to meet the standards of being a human being for someone else. But I do try to enjoy life by discovering new interests to learn more about, perhaps to make into a new hobby.

My husband was forty two when we got married. Since he had a dog, I guess he was capable of a relationship. <vbg> Bunty, I suspect if you wanted a partner, you'd find one. I certainly think you are smart to not want someone to try to make you into something you aren't.

I have been single for 17 yrs and I'm happy. Did the marriage 2 times. The last one was great until we married then she wanted to change me to someone else. That lasted 1 yr and I was gone. I have dated many women over the years. None older that 48. He is what I had, a drama queen, a whiner, a drunk, a liar and the workaholic. I'm still looking. I have women friends that I call to go to the movies, dancing or out riding the harley or to the car shows. No we are not FB, just friends. I go out to have a good time, If I find someone that good if not I had a good time anyway. I have noticed that women want a relationship right away. I need time, what is time. Lets see 6 months, 1 yr, 6yrs who knows. Something about that piece of paper and ring that changes people. My Grandmother lived to be 102 and was widowed and happy for 65yrs. I guess I'm heading that direction too.

I have been single for 17 yrs and I'm happy. Did the marriage 2 times. The last one was great until we married then she wanted to change me to someone else. That lasted 1 yr and I was gone. I have dated many women over the years. None older that 48. He is what I had, a drama queen, a whiner, a drunk, a liar and the workaholic. I'm still looking. I have women friends that I call to go to the movies, dancing or out riding the harley or to the car shows. No we are not FB, just friends. I go out to have a good time, If I find someone that good if not I had a good time anyway. I have noticed that women want a relationship right away. I need time, what is time. Lets see 6 months, 1 yr, 6yrs who knows. Something about that piece of paper and ring that changes people. My Grandmother lived to be 102 and was widowed and happy for 65yrs. I guess I'm heading that direction too.

You're biggest problem, Mr Bob, is that you look like Gabby Hayes. :doh:

Yer Darn Tootin, Young Whipper Snapper, Yessiree Bob