Public Meeting ( from OKC City news)

Citizens are invited to provide input on plans for the area impacted by the realignment of Interstate 40.. The first will be held December 13 @ 6:00pm... Watch The City of Oklahoma City (http://www.okc.gov) for the location.

The first phase of the Core to Shore plan covers the 590 acres from Reno to South 10th and much of the area east and west between 235 and Shartel.

The City anticipates the redevelopment will include a world- class boulevard. dense and inclusive housing, parks, live-work units, retail, office and commericial space.

how about a state of the art soccer facility with attendant youth soccer fields? the stadium could also be a concert venue as well.

think along these lines:

http://www.pizzahutpark.com/Portals/0/images/park_nolegend5.gif

That land is worth millions. Heck no.

replace the soccer fields with tennis courts and we'll talk! :P -M

we don't need nearly as many fields. 8 would be fine and you could cut out 9-17.

Exactly, m! Huzzah!

replace the soccer fields with tennis courts and we'll talk! :P -M

I would like to pass on both of those options please :Smiley199

Wouldn't something like that belong probably farther north of Heritage Hills or near the skate park instead of in this valuable land? I would've figured condos, hotels, (maybe mix-use skyscrapers to make me happy :-D ), and convention center expansions belong in the core to shore area.

I kind of agree. Hopefully, the civic and public use ideas will be focused on the river. All world class cities have great civics and park areas and I think the river is perfect for that. I think that the area between the river and downtown would be great for mixed use. This way the business and entertainment districts of downtown are cohesively linked to the (hopefully) recreational and civic parks areas on the river.

Seriously, if we have housing and urban neighborhoods from downtown to the river area and then have world class parks, amphitheaters, museums, and recreational areas on the river, you would have a city plan that would rival, on a smaller scale, some of the best cities in the country, imo.

BDP, this is exactly why you should go to the meeting - Represent!! lol

Good points, BDP. If that were to happen, what about any possible expansion of downtown business district?

I think it would be great for business to be a part of the expansion as well. I think we'll always need a strong business core, as many businesses feed of the synergy of resources that provides. However, I think it would be great to mix housing and businesses in the new district. This way we could have a real live/work/play area in our city for those who look for that kind of life. You'd have true neighborhoods where people live and work and socialize all within one small community that is based on interaction instead of isolation. I think such an environment could support real light rail or trolley public transit that could one day be connected to a commuter system if needed.

This, of course, all stems from people in the city wanting this kind of living option and being able to support it.

When I was in town last weekend, I drove up Robinson from Capitol Hill into downtown.

Man, is that area blighted. Almost exclusively junk yards and completely dilapidated homes.

At least it should be easy to acquire a lot of that property for higher and better use.

When I was in town last weekend, I drove up Robinson from Capitol Hill into downtown.

Man, is that area blighted. Almost exclusively junk yards and completely dilapidated homes.

At least it should be easy to acquire a lot of that property for higher and better use.

Ah, you drove through Brian Bates territory.

We should petition the City to pursue eminent domain on the properties then turn it over to Sooner Investments. This is a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity and that would be a sure-fire way to achieve quality developement .

:ohno:

A "Core to Shore" public meeting is scheduled for December 13th at 6PM in Room 16-18 of The Myriad (Cox) Convention Center. Russell Claus of the OKC Planning Department and Dave Lopez will do a Welcome and Mark Leese of the Core to Shore Team will facilitate the discussion. The agenda includes an update, discussion and Q&A followed by an Open House (what ever that means).

My suggestions on how to have an impact on this major redevelopment process:

1. Put your butt in a seat at the meeting.
2. Don't bitch about all of the buildings that have been torn down in OKC.
3. Ask questions.
4. Get aquainted with members of the STC Team and representives of the Planning Department.
5. Post your impressions of the meeting here.

I'd like to see a comprehensive urban plan developed and then have the City force developers to follow it. This should have been done for Bricktown and we can't make that mistake again. I think the new blvd. created by the I-40 move will be very important to the whole city and this area as it will link the existing downtown OKC to the "new" downtown OKC in Riverside. Department stores, the Harkins Theatre (with a new entrance on the blvd.), hotels, condo towers, restaurants, etc. should be lined along this blvd. from Bricktown to the Arts District.

I'd like to see a comprehensive urban plan developed and then have the City force developers to follow it. This should have been done for Bricktown and we can't make that mistake again. I think the new blvd. created by the I-40 move will be very important to the whole city and this area as it will link the existing downtown OKC to the "new" downtown OKC in Riverside. Department stores, the Harkins Theatre (with a new entrance on the blvd.), hotels, condo towers, restaurants, etc. should be lined along this blvd. from Bricktown to the Arts District.

You make some good points BG. I hope that you can attend Wednesday's meeting and share them with the people that are charged with developing the plans.

Just a reminder Core To Shore is tonight at 6pm. 2nd floor of the Cox Center.

how about a state of the art soccer facility with attendant youth soccer fields? the stadium could also be a concert venue as well.

think along these lines:

http://www.pizzahutpark.com/Portals/0/images/park_nolegend5.gif
Have you seen Frisco's Pizza Hut Park (that is the actual map of their facility)? It is amazing. The have a MLS team and a lot of tourism associated with it. Frisco is an upscale town with a lot of young, wealthy families. Do you know what the kids of young, weathly families do? Yep. Play soccer. I am not sure it is would be right for the downtown OKC area, or any part of OKC but it is an innovative concept and works very well in Frisco.

Frisco is a suburb...

This belongs on the Edmond or Norman boards

No, I think it is totally appropriate in the Core To Shore forum, especially if we would like to see one near the river. I think it would be awesome if one came to fruition. I was unable to go to the meeting last night unfortunately. Did anyone go? What was talked about?

I attended the meeting. There was a good crowd, and the organizers wisely gave ordinary folks plenty of opportunity to share their thoughts and ask questions.

Some points we learned:

- There will be a Central Park-type park running from the Myriad Gardens to the river. All three rough drawings presented have different versions of what that park would look like.

- The old post office is gone. Team members decided it took too much space and no one thought it was of historic value.

- All three drawings have a retail lifestyle center north of the boulevard, south of the Myriad Gardens and directly west of the Ford Center. The rough drawing had three rows of buildings covering about two blocks.

- The bulk of development south of the boulevard will be residential. Most of the other space will be parkland. But neighborhood retail will most likely in the mix.

- No grand plazas suggested thus far for the Great Lawn at Riverside's shore. But one of the drawings suggested (and reportedly popular with steering committee members) a square inlet from the river that would be surrounded restaurants and retail. It would be slightly to the west of that dip.

- Eminent domain would be the last resort for land assembly. Payouts from private developers are expected.

- There will be more meetings, with the next one I believe in March. For answers to some of our questions, we can check the city website sometime in the future.

- There will be a Central Park-type park running from the Myriad Gardens to the river.

Fantastic idea! That would really help connect downtown to the river, especially for recreation.

But that's a lot of property to acquire. Perhaps they are already confident of their prospects in that regard.

The bulk of development south of the boulevard will be residential. Most of the other space will be parkland. But neighborhood retail will most likely in the mix.

What type of residential did the plan propose? low, medium, or high density???

What type of residential did the plan propose? low, medium, or high density???

They just said "dense", which may mean at least medium, but IMO leans to high.

From OKC.gov:

What type of development can we expect and when will it happen?

The purpose of the Core to Shore Planning Study is to identify the right types of development opportunities and timing. One of the goals is to ensure the area south of downtown is developed to be complimentary to, not competitive with investments in downtown. In addition to development, the study will focus on mobility and flow, how people move around, and neighborhood quality.

The plan that comes out of this study will address the following goals:

-World class design for a new boulevard where original I-40 is brought to street level between Oklahoma and Walker Avenues
-New places for economic development in areas previously disconnected by the railroad and overhead freeway
-Dense, urban live-work community to promote the vitality for a 24/7 environment
-Assess alternatives and advantages for locating services to homeless persons
-Quality connections and improved access to places in the Core to Shore Planning Study area, highlighting the corridors and landmarks, linking the area internally and to its surroundings
-More effective traffic flow in and out of downtown
-Fewer impacts to neighborhoods from the freeway
-Good balance of complimentary land uses
-Increase the opportunities to walk safely throughout the area
-Create a transportation system that is friendly and safe for all modes of transit, such as people, bikes, and buses
-Create project strategies that are linked to viable funding mechanisms

The plan that comes out of this study will be a long-term plan with phases. Part of the study’s intent is to identify “catalyst” developments that come first, drawing interest to the area and spurring additional development. Many locations for development will be in the path of reconstruction until 2011.

I'm curious how they plan to create a park from Myriad Gardens to the river? You have Union Station and the new I-40 both as obstacles and I feel something like that would "split" the district into two parts when it should be just one. I would instead advocate high density commercial/residential in the areas south of Myriad Gardens by the Ford Center and along the new downtown blvd. Another downtown hotel, preferably something highrise, would work well here as well as a number of retail options including a department store and a bookstore. South of this area they could create another park to "mirror" Myriad Gardens on the other side of the downtown blvd. Another park could be created as a centerpiece of the potential residential area south of the new I-40. Make it more like a string of parks rather one long park.

Aerial of district
http://www.okladot.state.ok.us/public-info/i40-okc/pictures/new-i40.jpg

The way I see it the area around the new blvd. should be high density commercial/retail/residential. The areas south of the blvd. should be more medium density commercial/retail/residential while lower densities would be acceptable south of I-40. Medium density would be considered 3-5 story lofts with street level retail/restaurants and the lower densities would be a mix of townhomes and houses with minimal lot lines, front porches, and sidewalks. The north shore of the river should be medium density mixed-use with development coming up to the water. The south shore should be more park and open space, and would serve as a buffer between Capitol Hill and Riverside. Lower Bricktown could be expanded into the areas south of the new blvd. along the canal east of the tracks.

If there is a lifestyle center south of Myriad Gardens, then how does the Myriad Gardens connect to the river with a park?


That question notwithstanding, BG, I would rather see one huge, long park going all the way to the river. We've got all this space, why not make a good chunk of it a nice planned park. That's how NYC did it. Central Park has numerous buildings, including the Met and Belvedere Castle. Union Station would be great to have on park grounds and could eventually be home to a museum of some sort. Perhaps the OKCMOA could keep their more modern collections at the current location and move more classical works to a new location in "Central Park".

Having I-40 cut it in half is not ideal, but I believe that the plans inclued a large pedestrian causeway crossing it around Union Station. This would certainly be unique. The story of NYC's Central Park is so similar to what this could become in 100 years. It was an undesirable area with shantytowns housing the poor and homeless. The city hired two designers who planned the whole park to have various different elements and features to serve different purposes. Lakes and Ponds, the Great Lawn, the Terrace, the Mall, etc. They even created areas to feel like untouched forest, but were actually painstakingly created. This is what we can do.

If there is a lifestyle center south of Myriad Gardens, then how does the Myriad Gardens connect to the river with a park?


I should have been clearer. It's underneath or south of the Gardens. Depending on the final plan, it will run from the boulevard (or housing just south of it) to the river. But none of the drawings had it contiguous. Rather, the parkland will consist of two or three greenspaces.

You still have to realize that these are rough visions and may change. Core to Shore will not produce a binding document.

It's a good plan so far.

I was pleased with the concept. While they do remove the Post Office, Union Station remains in most concepts, as well as dividing the park into two or three different pieces. I think the masterplan is to involve a decorative facade on the boulevard south of the planned lifestyle center to tie it in nicely with the boulevard and Myriad Gardens.

It's also nice to note that they seem to really have this planned out meticulously in their slides. They draw many comparisons with cities of similar concepts, such as Denver, St. Louis, New York, and Salt Lake City. They have different housing options available, seemingly based on reaction of the public.

It's also notable that two of the designs call for a football stadium and all three call for a major convention center. This should be very interesting to see.

^ Football stadium? I would highly doubt that would ever happen. And why build a new convention center, is the Cox too small already? I just hope the "lifestyle center" is extremely urban with a good mix of retail and residential space. And all parking either in a garage or underground, NO SURFACE PARKING. This should be the case for all new development in this area, north of the new I-40. All development along the new blvd. should come up to the sidewalk and the sidewalks should be larger than most to accomodate sidewalk seating for restaurants. There is definitely a lot of potential in this area, it's quite exciting.

I think it's always good to leave room for some major tenants in the area, so I think leaving room for a stadium is only practical. Who knows if a Chesapeake Bowl may come about? ;)

Lot Lines: 21st century land run in OKC

March 14, 2008

When it comes to real estate located just south of downtown Oklahoma City in the Core to Shore area, there is something of a 21st century land run transpiring.

Over the past few months the Core to Shore area has experienced a tremendous amount of activity by commercial brokers, property owners, investors and city officials all trying to figure out the various pieces of the property puzzle that will make up the expanded central business district. Activity has picked up pace due to work finally starting to relocate Interstate 40 to the south and following Oklahoma City residents’ vote of approval to renovate the Ford Center and to build an NBA practice facility.

A number of properties in this area have been placed on the market in recent months, some of which have exorbitant asking prices. While a majority of the properties in this are in horrible condition and are worth very little, owners and brokers are pricing these properties based upon their future value. With land values in Bricktown having risen anywhere from $35 to just over $112 per square foot for prime real estate, these owners are hoping to replicate those same values in the Core to Shore area.

Some owners are asking for relatively reasonable prices, but there are a growing number of land parcels asking for significantly higher rates ranging from $7 to more than $20 per square foot. It will be interesting to see if owners can achieve these prices once properties in the Core to Shore area start changing hands in the coming months. There is definitely increased value in this area, but it is still too early to determine how much value and if it will soar to Bricktown levels.

City officials are also busy working in this area to secure the properties they need for such public projects as the NBA practice facility, parcels that will be needed to support the revamped Ford Center and for the new city park that is being proposed.

Last week, the Oklahoma City Council gave their go-ahead for the city to acquire the U.S. Postal facility on SW Fifth Street for $3.68 million, marking the first major purchase in the Core to Shore area the city will make. Obviously, the city has limited funds to spend on property in the Core to Shore area and will not be willing to pay the exorbitant prices that are starting to be seen. Even though the city has the power of eminent domain in their back pocket to negotiate prices, city officials do not want to exercise that power. They have previously stated in situations like these that they want property owners to receive a fair value for their property without having to exercise any drastic options.

No matter how high values go in the Core to Shore area, this expansion of downtown is a once-in-a-lifetime occurrence that will shape downtown for generations to come.

So the practice facility will be in C2S then? Makes sense.

So the practice facility will be in C2S then? Makes sense.

That caught my eye as well. I would think it would be someplace visible, so that naming rights to the practice facility can go as high as possible. It would also make it convenient for the players. If the city came up with a lease allowing it to be used for other events too, such as practice for NCAA tournament teams if we've got regionals here, that would be great and a great location as well.

Most of the properties in that area are absolute disgraces to Oklahoma City. Most are completely neglected and the city could have stepped in a long time ago due to rampant neglect and tons of code violations.

Now, some of these owners want to cash in?

The good news is if they are unreasonable in their asking price the city can just use eminent domain and have an arbitrator set a fair price.

I wouldn't say most but all of the property is a complete disgrace! If you walk down there it is very other-worldly to say the least. On one hand you have visions of the C2S plans dancing through your head while on the other you are surrounded by complete and total squalor!

Example:
http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i90/JLCinOKC/C2S/DSC00053.jpg

One well-placed cigarette could solve that problem :D

Is it just me or is anyone else shocked and disappointed that there is no plans for a public square in the entire C2S proposal. Almost all great cities have a public square of sorts in addition to a large "central" or grand type of park. I was just re-looking through the C2S plans and found it odd there is no public square in the entire plans.

Is it just me or is anyone else shocked and disappointed that there is no plans for a public square in the entire C2S proposal. Almost all great cities have a public square of sorts in addition to a large "central" or grand type of park. I was just re-looking through the C2S plans and found it odd there is no public square in the entire plans.

Actually the Central Park is one of the first things to happen after I-40 is moved. The city has already gotten several of the plots of land for it. Just west of the Ford Center (where there are several car dealerships currently) is going to be the new two tower hotel and directly south of that will be the new Central Park. If i remember correctly, it is supposed to be two-three block east to west and then around four blocks north to south. it would include a new Event Center, lake, etc. There is also supposed to be a "Promenade Park" six blocks north to south and one block east to west that would stretch from south of the new I-40 to the shore of the Oklahoma River. If you go to okc.gov and search for Core to Shore, there is a Powerpoint presentation outlining all of the projects, timeline and everything else.

Metro, what do you mean by public square? When I think of that term I think small town or neighborhood squares. Can you give us some examples of what you are thinking about? I am really hoping this project is a real gathering place for our citizens so if a public square helps in that I am all for it.

I think he is referring to things like Union Square in San Francisco and Washington Square in New York. They are typically a city block that is developed as a public space but usually more paved than grassy.

Kerr Park really is more of a "square" than a park, and I think should be renamed Kerr Square.

Pershing Square in downtown L.A. is another example:

http://www.pps.org/graphics/upo-pages/pershing_square_large

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1073/532254489_639632e1cb.jpg

Exactly, Pete and jbrown know exactly what I'm talking about, again just to clarify for warreng and others, I'm NOT talking about the central park, but an actual public square, like Times Square, Union Square, Washington Square, 5 Points in Atlanta, etc.

Times Square isn't really a good example, because there really isn't a public space there, it's just a convergence of several streets.

Public Square in Cleveland

http://www.pps.org/imagedb/image-display?image_id=22505&size=md&hs=11686654

Education Plaza, Washington D.C.

http://www.pps.org/graphics/gpp/education_plaza_dc_03_xlarge

Logan Circle, Philadelphia

http://www.pps.org/imagedb/image-display?image_id=42306&size=md&hs=140382060

World's Best Public Squares
The World's Best Public Squares (http://goeurope.about.com/b/2006/01/13/the-worlds-best-public-squares.htm)

Yeah I was hoping for a big traffic circle/plaza like that last one somewhere on the new boulevard, perhaps at Classen.

Philly has several large traffic circles on their main boulevard, they are awesome. It sure would be nice if we had one at Classen and perhaps Robinson!!

Philly has several large traffic circles on their main boulevard, they are awesome. It sure would be nice if we had one at Classen and perhaps Robinson!!

I sketched something along those lines awhile back.

http://i153.photobucket.com/albums/s225/CuatrodeMayo/exchangecopy.jpg

That's a great plan, Cuatro. I guess you have Reno and Western going underneath?

I would probably have them as one long tunnel instead of 3 separate overpasses. Then you could have a nice, unbroken park area around the circle.

Thanks for the clarification on that. I'm glad to know that there are people in our city with great vision and creativity. Now if we can get you guys into some position of authority....

Bobby Boucher, traffic circles are the devil!

Bobby Boucher, traffic circles are the devil!

I agree! Oklahomans can not drive on straight roads. Put a circle in and the peopl will drive around that park until they run out of gas or have a wreck. Want to see an example? Go to the Mid Town Circle and just watch for awhile at some of the Idiots over there....

Looks great though!

on the lots that are already clear that we know were gonna use we should start planting trees especially along the river I think they should be fruit treess...we will never be as green as tulsa but we sure could b more intovative especially wit money mick telling us were going on a diet to lose 1 million pounds... imagine sitting in our central park eating fresh apples or oranges or ripe pecans falling from the trees ...it would definitely leave a lasting impression on visitors.....(is that 2 far fetch)

orange groves in Oklahoma? Now that's a pipe dream.

you're rite metro it is .....................but I definitely think we need more trees so the not all young and scrany when all of our other projects are completed.....ps are there any nut or fruit trees that can survive our brutal winters beside pecans ? we have a lot of pecan trees in OKC

Is it just me or should the city be actively trying to move a lot of this industrial crap away from downtown. On the other hand - maybe that is what Core to Shore is all about. Hey maybe after C2S is done we can work on other blighted areas around downtown and call it "Core to Shore - and then more".

We do need to get a head start on tree planting. The main thing is they need to be trees that will grow fast and stand up to our weather conditions (no BRADFORD PEARS!!). I suggest lots of Redbuds.

heck yeah jbrown trees trees and more trees redbuds are cool to ....I personally would put some trees in wit them that bloom white so we can get the whole O.U thing going but that's kinda to sinister to the other univ... and by the way they bet not be bullshisssing us wit the rooftop longe gardens and vegatation they proposed for the ford rentavations that will be a gr8t view of DT and C2S