View Full Version : Kerr McGee Fountain Shutting Down



The Old Downtown Guy
05-22-2006, 08:13 AM
The semi-circular fountain on the south side of the Kerr McGee Corporate Tower at 123 Robert S. Kerr is in the process of being converted into a planter. It seems that the fountain has developed several leaks and has other problems that Kerr McGee has deemed too expensive to correct. Their solution; fill it with dirt and plant shrubs. This is a major loss to the street-scape on Robert S. Kerr, and not the best solution for downtown OKC's vastly improving pedestrian environment.

I think that a little public pressure might be sufficient to get Kerr McGee to rethink this decision and a few phone calls to Luke Corbet at 405.270.1313 or, better yet, a snail-mail letter to him at 123 Robert S. Kerr, OKC 73102 might turn the tide in favor of repairing their beautiful fountain rather than filling it with dirt. There is also a "contact" link on their website for e-mail at http://www.kerr-mcgee.com/resources/contactkmg.htm

Patrick
05-22-2006, 09:27 AM
I personally don't think it's such a bad idea converting it into a planter. Everytime I drove by there the fountain was never on anyways. And when it was on, it never seemed to work right....there was always water out in the street. We'll still have all of the fountains over in Kerr Park. Personally, I think the south side of Kerr McGee tower needs some color. It looks pretty dull. I think some plush landscaping will really color up the main entrance to the tower.

Other opinions?

Luke
05-22-2006, 10:05 AM
Speaking of fountains not working properly... Patrick, being in contact with Penn Square Mall, have you addressed their broken fountain? Only 4 or 5 spouts work. It's still pretty cool watching it, but it would be better if all the spouts worked.

Sorry to get off topic sort of.

Patrick
05-22-2006, 10:10 AM
Speaking of fountains not working properly... Patrick, being in contact with Penn Square Mall, have you addressed their broken fountain? Only 4 or 5 spouts work. It's still pretty cool watching it, but it would be better if all the spouts worked.

Sorry to get off topic sort of.

In the next few months, they're going to have a company come in and completely revamp that fountain. The problem with the fountain lies with the design.

I suggested to them that maybe they go with a set up similar to the one in Bricktown that would allow people to throw coins in the fountain. One of the main problems with the fountain now is that it wasn't designed for coins to be thrown into it, but people do it regardless. It clogs the system.

I'll contact them and see what the proposed timetable is on getting it revamped.

Patrick
05-22-2006, 10:14 AM
Here's the email I received Nov. 2005 on the issue at Penn Square. I'll contact them again.

"I have $50,000 budgeted next year to re-design the pump system for the fountain. Tim Johnson Engineers designed the fountain near the theater in Bricktown. The problem with the existing system is that it is controlled by high pressure air. Tim's design uses constant water pressure with diverter valves which still gives the effect, but without the "pop" caused by the air controls. The existing shooters actually pull the rebar mounts out of the concrete."

The Old Downtown Guy
05-22-2006, 11:01 AM
I personally don't think it's such a bad idea converting it into a planter. Everytime I drove by there the fountain was never on anyways. And when it was on, it never seemed to work right....there was always water out in the street. We'll still have all of the fountains over in Kerr Park. Personally, I think the south side of Kerr McGee tower needs some color. It looks pretty dull. I think some plush landscaping will really color up the main entrance to the tower.

Other opinions?

I can't say that I agree with anything you say Patrick. As with every water feature in OKC, this one is winterized and shut down when freezing temps are likely. For the past few years, I jog through there three days a week and have never seen the fountain shut down "in-season" except for an occasional repair and have never observed water running into the street. I also don't think that landscaping compares in any way to the effect provided by the fountain.

Patrick
05-22-2006, 11:06 AM
I can't say that I agree with anything you say Patrick. As with every water feature in OKC, this one is winterized and shut down when freezing temps are likely. For the past few years, I jog through there three days a week and have never seen the fountain shut down "in-season" except for an occasional repair and have never observed water running into the street. I also don't think that landscaping compares in any way to the effect provided by the fountain.

You know, the more I've thought about this, the more I think you're right. The fountain (or should I say fountains?) was incredibly unique. Landscaping wouldn't be unique. It would simply be like any other landscaping.

escan
05-22-2006, 11:52 AM
Speaking of fountains......has anyone seen the (formerly) beautiful old fountain at Memorial Park? It barely runs now and just isn't working properly. For at least a year, it lay dormant, then when OKC Beautiful moved in, it was "fixed", but I assume not correctly. Anyone have insight on this? I'm sure it will be fixed in the park revitalization, but sure wish it would happen before then.

Patrick
05-22-2006, 12:26 PM
Speaking of fountains......has anyone seen the (formerly) beautiful old fountain at Memorial Park? It barely runs now and just isn't working properly. For at least a year, it lay dormant, then when OKC Beautiful moved in, it was "fixed", but I assume not correctly. Anyone have insight on this? I'm sure it will be fixed in the park revitalization, but sure wish it would happen before then.

My mind is lacking today.....where is Memorial Park? Is that the one off Classen and 36th?

escan
05-22-2006, 01:07 PM
That's it! I also heard they'll put a median down 36th Street to hopefully make it two lanes....that would be great with all of the kids who use it.

Patrick
05-22-2006, 03:31 PM
Here are pics of the circular fountain OTG was referring to.

http://www.okctalk.com/gallery/data/500/medium/DSCF0050.JPG

http://www.okctalk.com/gallery/data/500/medium/DSCF0053.JPG

http://www.okctalk.com/gallery/data/500/medium/DSCF0051.JPG

http://www.okctalk.com/gallery/data/500/medium/DSCF0054.JPG

http://www.okctalk.com/gallery/data/500/medium/DSCF0055.JPG

http://www.okctalk.com/gallery/data/500/medium/DSCF0056.JPG

writerranger
05-22-2006, 05:46 PM
Thanks for the pix, Patrick.
Kerr-McGee isn't lacking for money - just fix the fountain already.

------------

The Old Downtown Guy
05-22-2006, 06:01 PM
Thanks for the excellent pics Patrick. :tiphat: Glad you think differently about these fabulous fountains after taking a look. When these fountains are spraying full blast, they create a wonderful dense sound and the sun reflecting off of the water provides lots of rainbow effect color. They are a major asset to the street-scape.

I hope that some of you will join me in contacting Luke Corbet at 405.270.1313 or, better yet, a snail-mail letter to him at 123 Robert S. Kerr, OKC 73102 might turn the tide in favor of repairing their beautiful fountain rather than filling it with dirt. There is also a "contact" link on their website for e-mail at http://www.kerr-mcgee.com/resources/contactkmg.htm

Regarding the vintage fountain in Memorial Park; I believe that a car hopped the curb into the park and collided with the control box. The City is either having trouble obtaining the necessary parts or schedulingthe work, I'm not sure which, but I believe that OKC Beautiful Exec. Director, Jannie Dupree is bird-dogging these repairs. I will drop her an e-mail and inquire as to the status.

zuluwarrior0760
05-22-2006, 08:30 PM
One problem I heard approximately a year ago
regarding the fountains at KMG was that all the lighting
had fallen into disrepair (as most fountain lighting does),
but the cost to repair it was well over 25K to do it right....
plus a lot of electrical labor to boot....
and it was during that meeting I had with KMG's people that the comment was thrown out that they were considering filling it with dirt....I thought it was a joke, now I know it wasn't....

I had a fountain project in Ponca City where the entire fountain in front of city hall had sat broken, both in terms of lighting and the pumps for nearly a decade, and a man by the name of Forrest Mertz basically adopted the fountain and took a hundred grand out of his own pocket to renovate this fountain that was donated to the city by the Daughters of the American Revolution back in 1925. He outfitted it with unlimited Color LED lighting, vegas style and also put in pumps and electronics
that would last a long time......
Without his generosity, it would be a walking surface today.....
Whether the city itself couldn't have, or wouldn't have is irrelavent, the point is, someone stepped up!!and this is what they have now:

http://www.smithlighting.com/images/ponca/poncacollage.jpg

Fountains are expensive! Maintaining them costs a lot of money and lighting them costs a lot of money, but that is where I think "someone" needs to bring it to KMG's attention that in the first place, we care about it.

They are in a business that has afforded them some recent blessings that can and should be invested in their streetscape in a good and proper fashion.....I vote for the fountain to remain....

Patrick
05-22-2006, 08:47 PM
Skip the lighting. I don't think it's necesary anyways. It's just neat to look at during the daytime.

writerranger
05-22-2006, 09:29 PM
They are in a business that has afforded them some recent blessings that can and should be invested in their streetscape in a good and proper fashion.....I vote for the fountain to remain....

Absolutely. I like the lighting too. I remember the lights adding a "big city" feel at night. Things like a dark fountain say we've rolled up for the night.

Also, if someone at KM was concerned at the 25k cost, all I can say is WOW. That is basically an extension of a building that cost a lot of money to build and maintain. To allow part of the building (and by extension its exterior) to fall into disrepair over 25k is ludicrous.

----

zuluwarrior0760
05-22-2006, 09:49 PM
I agree.....skip the lighting...
let people eat their lunch there...and they
can barricade themselves in their houses with Friends
reruns after the sun goes down.....

OR

We could light it like a landmark, creating a gathering point downtown, a place for all the future condo dwellers to get together, look at some art, patronize some street vendors, peoplewatch etc.....

on second thought, they'll come out anyways....and it will be the dark, dirt filled shrub planter as the focal point that draws them.....

writerranger
05-22-2006, 09:54 PM
I agree.....skip the lighting...
let people eat their lunch there...and they
can barricade themselves in their houses with Friends
reruns after the sun goes down.....

OR

We could light it like a landmark, creating a gathering point downtown, a place for all the future condo dwellers to get together, look at some art, patronize some street vendors, peoplewatch etc.....

on second thought, they'll come out anyways....and it will be the dark, dirt filled shrub planter as the focal point that draws them.....

:) :) :)

escan
05-23-2006, 08:07 AM
Thanks ODG! I'll look forward to hearing what Jannie says.

The Old Downtown Guy
05-24-2006, 07:20 AM
No dirt yet. The main water line with the spray jets seen in the photos Partick posted has been removed from the center south facing, and largest, fountain, but no work was going on this morning. If you are planning to enjoy a little shopping at the Couch Park Farmers Market today, take a look at the sad empty fountains just to the north across Robert S. Kerr Avenue at Kerr McGee's tower, and if you are so inclined, give them a quick e-mail off of their website "contact" link.

http://www.kerr-mcgee.com/resources/contactkmg.htm

Patrick
05-25-2006, 08:57 AM
Speaking of fountains not working properly... Patrick, being in contact with Penn Square Mall, have you addressed their broken fountain? Only 4 or 5 spouts work. It's still pretty cool watching it, but it would be better if all the spouts worked.

Sorry to get off topic sort of.

Luke, here's the reply I got:

"I just received the bid to renovate the fountain. Our "shoot from the hip" budget was $50,000 because we thought we could just change the controls and modify the shooters. The bid came in over $200,000. The complexity of all the pumps, plumbing and controls is amazing. It appears that we have to start over or continue to band-aid the current system. The fountain cost over $400,000 in 2000, and everything is already worn out. I'll try to keep you posted."

John
05-25-2006, 11:30 AM
Luke, here's the reply I got:

"I just received the bid to renovate the fountain. Our "shoot from the hip" budget was $50,000 because we thought we could just change the controls and modify the shooters. The bid came in over $200,000. The complexity of all the pumps, plumbing and controls is amazing. It appears that we have to start over or continue to band-aid the current system. The fountain cost over $400,000 in 2000, and everything is already worn out. I'll try to keep you posted."

Hey, Mr. KerrMcGee, we see your quarterly reports. Things aren't exactly beans and toast over in the oil & gas industry right now.

As for a comparison, Devon spent what 6-8 Million on renovating the exterior of their main tower (which looks great, btw), but KerrMcGee won't drop $200,000 on the main element of their entryway?

:stars:

AFCM
05-25-2006, 11:56 AM
Screw it, make a parking lot. We need more of those downtown.

writerranger
05-25-2006, 12:12 PM
Hey, Mr. KerrMcGee, we see your quarterly reports. Things aren't exactly beans and toast over in the oil & gas industry right now.

As for a comparison, Devon spent what 6-8 Million on renovating the exterior of their main tower (which looks great, btw), but KerrMcGee won't drop $200,000 on the main element of their entryway?
:stars:

John.....Actually, I think Patrick was responding to Luke's question about the Penn Square fountain. I agree with your sentiments though. It seems silly to look at the dollars involved in maintaining what, to me at least, is basically an extension of the building.

The Old Downtown Guy
05-25-2006, 01:18 PM
Thanks ODG! I'll look forward to hearing what Jannie says.

Since this has turned into the "all fountains" thread; here's the latest on the Memorial Park Fountain. The repairs have been made but the fountain still doesn't work properly. Janie Dupree of OKC Beautiful has been in touch with the OKC Parks Department advising them of the improper operation and encouraging them to get the contractor responsible for the repairs back to get the fountain operating properly. She will continue to follow up until it is completely repaired and working perfectly. I can assure you, from my personal experience, that it will get fixed.

The Old Downtown Guy
05-25-2006, 01:22 PM
. . . It seems silly to look at the dollars involved in maintaining what, to me at least, is basically an extension of the building.

I totally agree writerranger. I hope you have made your sentiments known to Luke Corbet at Kerr McGee. If not, you can zip him an e-mail off of this link:

http://www.kerr-mcgee.com/resources/contactkmg.htm

The Old Downtown Guy
05-25-2006, 01:30 PM
Screw it, make a parking lot. We need more of those downtown.

Free speech, open forum, say whatever you like, and all of that sort of thing considered; IMO your comment is childish and not constructive to the issue or public dialog in general.

Patrick
05-25-2006, 02:37 PM
Free speech, open forum, say whatever you like, and all of that sort of thing considered; IMO your comment is childish and not constructive to the issue or public dialog in general.

I think he was being sarcastic.

John
05-25-2006, 03:22 PM
John.....Actually, I think Patrick was responding to Luke's question about the Penn Square fountain. I agree with your sentiments though. It seems silly to look at the dollars involved in maintaining what, to me at least, is basically an extension of the building.

...so I didn't read every post. ;)

It's their front entrance, it should look nice.

AFCM
05-25-2006, 04:31 PM
Free speech, open forum, say whatever you like, and all of that sort of thing considered; IMO your comment is childish and not constructive to the issue or public dialog in general.

I'm sorry. What response do you think would be best for the thread?

Patrick
05-26-2006, 07:05 AM
I'm sorry. What response do you think would be best for the thread?

I think ODG wanted this to be a constructive thread discussing ways to try to save the KerrMcGee fountain....mainly writing administration in the company trying to change their current decision.

AFCM
05-30-2006, 06:10 PM
I think ODG wanted this to be a constructive thread discussing ways to try to save the KerrMcGee fountain....mainly writing administration in the company trying to change their current decision.

Patrick, I understand what he's saying but I think he should explain exactly what he wants me to write if he's going to call me out like that. Perhaps he could define precisely what he regards as "constructive" and "childish".

ODG, I'm not here to ruffle any feathers. I totally respect you as I do every one else on this board. You're very wise and knowledgeable, but I disagree with your comment. Still, you have to keep in mind; I'm in my early 20's. I have only two years of college under my belt and I don't understand a lot about politics. I won't always have the perfect solution, but I feel a part of the community by contributing my two cents...even if it may be satirical. I respect you a lot but I won't censor my thoughts for any reason (with the exception of board rules).

Until I return home, this is my gateway to Oklahoma. By keeping up with news and events I maintain my sanity. I miss home a lot and this board is a way to interact with my fellow Okies. This is a community I'm happy to be a part of. I'm sorry if some of my posts don't have a lot of substance. I'm not dumb by any means, I'm just new to this. Regardless, I just want to be here and I want to be heard.

BricktownGuy
05-31-2006, 04:40 AM
Who all has contacted KMG??

The Old Downtown Guy
05-31-2006, 11:23 PM
No offence taken AFCM and most of my feathers are in a permanent state of ruffled it seems. I was just chiding you, for what came across to me, as a thoughtless remark. Simply an old guy yanking a young guy up short. It happened to me more than once, but didn't happen as often as it should have. I'm just passing along the favor. If your post was just supposed to be funny, I missed the joke. Sorry.

I was trying to bring attention to what I considered a rather serious issue. I hoped that a few phone calls and e-mail contacts might be enough to get Kerr McGee to take another look at their decision.

Glad you’re interested in what goes on here in Okie City AFCM and glad to have your views on the forum, whatever they are. Hope College is going well and I look forward to having you back in OKC when you decide to settle down. This is a terrific place to live and keeps getting better. I just hate it when I see a step backward being taken by people that know better, as is the case with Kerr McGee and the water feature component of their damn nice, important to downtown Oklahoma City, well designed, tower.

Doug Loudenback
06-01-2006, 12:33 AM
Who all has contacted KMG??
Me did

davido
06-03-2006, 03:33 PM
I loved the fountain,Skateboarders have torn it up kicking the spouts and breaking them off, completly marring the exterior, chipping and breaking the stone work, waxing the stone work to slide down the rails,nothing will remove the skateboarders wax(NOTHING)acid, power washing etc. why spend all that money to fix it all the time, the police don't hardly do anything to the skaters. sorry to get on a rant, but skaters have really torn up Downtown OKC, look at steps and benches around BC Clark, they ride up the red sculpture at Leadership square, if you see skaters downt town follow them and see what they tear up...

The Old Downtown Guy
07-12-2006, 09:29 AM
Between 7:15 AM on Friday June 30th and about the same time on Monday July 3rd, the deed was done. Perhaps even under the cover of darkness; I did not see the dirt being dumped into the once beautiful fountains at Kerr McGee's Tower or the shrubs being planted there, it was quietly accomplished. I don't know if they choose the weekend because there would be fewer witnesses or for other reasons. The goings on in that once bustling building have been kept totally under wraps for quite a while now.

My home town got a little smaller last weekend. Loosing that cool and refreshing water feature from the Robert S. Kerr streetscape, though not as monumental a loss, feels a lot like the demolition of the YMCA building a few years ago; an asphalt parking lot being Mark Moore's final contribution to the downtown OKC landscape. In the midst of a dramatic downtown revitalization, there are still small minded people leaving destruction in their wake. Fortunately the thoughtless acts are becoming fewer and farther between. I guess I will accept that as progress.

metro
07-12-2006, 10:38 AM
I think the KM fountain is the least of our concerns now. I bet Kerr and McGee are rolling in their graves.

writerranger
07-12-2006, 10:52 AM
Between 7:15 AM on Friday June 30th and about the same time on Monday July 3rd, the deed was done. Perhaps even under the cover of darkness; I did not see the dirt being dumped into the once beautiful fountains at Kerr McGee's Tower or the shrubs being planted there, it was quietly accomplished. I don't know if they choose the weekend because there would be fewer witnesses or for other reasons. The goings on in that once bustling building have been kept totally under wraps for quite a while now.

My home town got a little smaller last weekend. Loosing that cool and refreshing water feature from the Robert S. Kerr streetscape, though not as monumental a loss, feels a lot like the demolition of the YMCA building a few years ago; an asphalt parking lot being Mark Moore's final contribution to the downtown OKC landscape. In the midst of a dramatic downtown revitalization, there are still small minded people leaving destruction in their wake. Fortunately the thoughtless acts are becoming fewer and farther between. I guess I will accept that as progress.

I agree 100%, ODG. Very well said and nothing to add.

--

Patrick
07-12-2006, 12:34 PM
As metro said, the fountain is the least of our worries at this point. We have a completely vacant KerrMcGee campus to fill.

The Old Downtown Guy
07-12-2006, 02:02 PM
Kerr McGee has been dying a slow death for years, we just didn't take note until recently. Only 190 execs and staff left in the ivory tower and a lot of those folks will be retiring; no big loss there. Their production in Oklahoma will just be taken over by Anadarko; no change there. They have unloaded most of their real estate; big gain for the urban housing market. Their Class A building, which is managed by Tramell Crow will be (is and has been) on the market and there is a shortage of Class A space downtown; another gain.

All in all, I would say that the absorption of what's left of KM by Anadarko, at this point is a break even for OKC, and the state as a whole. Certainly no major loss IMO. Oh yes, I almost forgot; there will be some vacant space available at the Petroleum Club.

The shoes that need filling are those of the giants that built Kerr McGee; Robert S. Kerr and Dean A. McGee. We have suffered through a void of leadership at that level for at least a generation. Some are coming forward; Aubry McClendon, Larry Nichols and a few others. But there doesn't seem to be the cooperation of the past.

I know one damn thing. As soon as a new owner of that building is announced, they'll be getting a letter from some old fart wondering when they are going to dig the dirt and shrubs out of their fountains.

Moving along. It's been years since the old creaky copper contraption at the southeast corner of the BOK building has had a drop of water in it. Since I'm going to have to change my jogging route, I guess I'll try to get Burns Hargis on the phone.

escan
07-12-2006, 02:27 PM
Hear Hear ODG! :)