Next month, Penn Square Mall should pass the $500 sales per sq. foot, making it one of the top profit-making in the southwest...similar to the Galleria in Dallas and The Houston Galleria. That is nearly double the national average and a big deal in the mall business. Mall management will be looking for even more upscale stores, as this data really puts the mall on the map. The mall is currently 97% leased with permanent tenants.

Cantina Laredo, a new upscale Mexican restaurant (check it out!!!) is no open!

http://cantinalaredo.com/

An Aldo shoe store will be opening in the present Dry Ice location.
http://www.aldoshoes.com/

Land has been cleared for the Elephant Bar and Restaurant that will be built on the far southeast corner of the property.

http://www.elephantbar.com/

No Cheesecake Factory?

Ahhh...I forgot. They're working out deals right now for a Cheesecake Factory and a Maggiano's on the north pads. Those would come in either 2006 or 2007.

Maggiano's in Denver was awesome

Maggianno's and Cheesecake Factory are great!

This is great news. I'll bet the Apple Store and Coach pushes that $500 per square foot even higher. I think it would be a good idea to build multilevel garages on the North side and using existing surface parking for mall expansion. Is there any talk on mall expansion? Also, you say that they're looking for even more upscale shops. Did they give any ideas as to who they were looking at? Lastly, when is Elephant Bar scheduled to open?

Thanks for the update Patrick!

aldo is a great store. i'm really excited to see that.

Since we landed the NBA, maybe we have more upside now in the minds of decision makers at Neiman Marcus or Lord & Taylor's. If they downplay what's happening at Penn Square, then they don't want to be in OKC. I think building more parking garages at PS is a good idea and they can use the existing parking for expansion. Now, if only something could be done about Crossroads. I really believe that if there was significant investment in Crossroads Mall, it would be the best performing mall in the state due to it's location and increasingly wealthy trade area. (Far S. OKC and Moore) Most out of towners don't know where Penn Square or Quail Springs are if they are just passing through OKC, but I would bet that if Crossroads was rebuilt into a mall similar to Penn Square, it would flourish in the future and the whole area around it would fill up with retail. I wish a developer would come to the plate and propose a new 1.5 million square foot Crossroads Mall. The land on the north and east sides of the mall that is just fields could be used in the development. Someone in the management of that mall needs to think outside the box. That area is the only part of South OKC that looks depressed right now and yet it is the most visible. The first thing that should be done is much better marketing of the mall. Then, I think the local management at Crossroads needs to get aggressive and have serious talks with whoever owns the mall and get them out of their chairs to get something constructive done to light a new fire and save Crossroads. I hope they are not waiting for the new interchange to get completed first. If that is what they are doing, then we are looking at another ten years of the status quo.

I agree about crossroads. It has a ton of potential that is being ignored. Is there actually plans to redo the Crossroad junction? Maybe we could get rid of the cloverleaf and have a more fluid interchange.

Paul

that is why they are re-doing the intersection, to get rid of the cloverleaf

Oh yeah!! The construction is supposed to start in 2007 and take 7 years. The apartment complex on the N.W. side will be razed and there will be flyovers going from I-35 to I-240. My only concern is why there aren't any flyovers going from I-240 to I-35. The timeline does seem too long though. Why 7 years?? By the time they get that done, it'll be time to widen I-35 again to 10 lanes. They need to do that right now to accommodate the rapidly increasing traffic between downtown and Norman. One thing that I'd like to see done if Crossroads were to be rebuilt would be to make it into a huge outlet mall similar to the one in Gainesville, Texas, but much larger. Or, they could build a Mills Mall similar to the one in Grapevine. That area has HUGE potential.

This is great news. I'll bet the Apple Store and Coach pushes that $500 per square foot even higher. I think it would be a good idea to build multilevel garages on the North side and using existing surface parking for mall expansion. Is there any talk on mall expansion? Also, you say that they're looking for even more upscale shops. Did they give any ideas as to who they were looking at? Lastly, when is Elephant Bar scheduled to open?

Thanks for the update Patrick!


did make some suggestions....namely, dump the 2nd Dillards when they can find an upscale anchor, and possibly dump JC Penney and replace it with an upscale anchor.

I'll try to find out the answers to the rest of your questions!

By the way, the fountain in center court won't be turned on again until after the holidays. They're going to spend $50,000 on the $250,000 fountain. Tim Johnson Engineers designed the fountain near the theater in Bricktown. The problem with the existing system at PS is that it is controlled by high pressure air. Tim's design uses constant water pressure with diverter valves which still gives the effect, but without the "pop" caused by the air controls. The existing shooters actually pull the rebar mounts out of the concrete.

I agree with you guys about Crossroads. Crossroads Mall management simply doesn't get it. I'm not sure what they're thinking, but they continue to blame their failures on poor access from the interstate. My response to that is that Mathis Bros. Furniture has NO access from the interstate, yet they're still able to be the #1 furniture store in OKC. Why? Because they offer a pleasant shopping atmosphere with affordable products.

The problem with Crossroads? The glazed concrete floors, the dark, warehouse appearance, the 1970's railings, the warehouse lamps, .....must I go on???
Inside and out, Crossroads looks like a dump. Macerich Properties doesn't maintain the facility. And there are no excuses. They have a huge facility in a very high traffic area. They could lure all sorts of tourists off the interstate with the right marketing and an improved shopping environment.

I encourage you guys to email mall management and complain. Tell them it's time to make a decision...improve the mall, or sell it.

I've already emailed them. Here are the addresses:

Christi_Parks@macerich.com, Senior Marketing Director
Jim_Swenson@macerich.com, mall manager

I would also encourage everyone to email both of the individuals mentioned by Patrick above. I emailed Swenson about 4-5 months back.. but will do so again. Even if we can get about 50 emails sent... it should send a wake up call. keyword, should.

I have a friend in the mall management business in Kansas City. He has always told me that Crossroad's biggest problem is it is a Macerich managed mall. Penn Square is managed by the best of the best in Simon Properties.

Luke and others, here's the latest. The 5 year plan for the mall includes expanding the existing parking garage, doubling the current parking space. Options after that may include building other garages on the north side. This will only up more roon for expansion in years to come. Will expansion occur? Well that depends on how leasing goes. right now it's good.

Elephant Bar should be complete late summer/fall 2006.

Yeah, but Simon also used to manage Heritage Park Mall, and we all know what happened to it.

I agree, though, that Macerich hasn't done much good for Crossroads.

Patrick, I am very glad to hear about Simon's plans for Penn Square. I hope they stick with it-- and don't sell it off.

We can sit here and dream about what could go in there. But, realistically, Patrick, do you (and the people you know there) think that:

1. Expansion will occur if the leasing continues at it's current pace (and the mall hits $500/sq ft in sales).
2. Simon would recruit at least 1 upscale anchor like Neiman Marcus, Nordstom, etc.
3. Additional stores like Kenneth Cole, Crate & Barrel, Brooks Brothers, etc.

What do they think Foley's changing to Macy's will do? I know that now when going to a department store in OKC (I prefer Nordstrom and Macy's-- but I can't do either here now), I will go to Dillard's 95% of the time. When Macy's opens, I will probably go there 95% of the time. Is it possible Dillard's will shrink to 1 location and an upscale anchor will go in the old Wards spot?

For the time being, I doubt Dillards will give up their spot (the old Wards space). They invested millions of dollars into that space, plus that's the flagship Dillards store for the state of Oklahoma.

I think #3 is the most likely, at least for the short term (over the next 5 years). #2 would come next, followed by #1. I could see an upscale anchor like Nordstroms building on the west side of the mall, by Pepperoni Grill.

Booting JC Penney out might be an option.

I'm not sure what their lease agreements are at the present time.

About Heritage Park, one thing you have to remember is that Simon was responsible for the heyday of Heritage Park as well. They built Heritage Park. Heritage Park's problem is 3 fold: 1. Location, 2. Demographics (MWC area), and size (regional malls simply aren't doing well). Also, the fact that Simon had the mall up for sale for 10+ years didn't help matters. Stores typically don't want to locate in a mall where ownership is uncertain.

To tell you the truth, Quail Springs has the demographics to go more upscale, but management chooses not to......their target is the working class family. That's what I was told by their management a few years ago.

I suppose Crossroads management's target crowd is low life. I'm not sure why they set their target so low. It didn't used to be that way.

Yeah, it's ashame that Crossroads has gone to the cellar. I guess those in charge locally just want to show up and get their eight hours in and go home. You would think that with all the success that the other two northside malls are enjoying, that it would be a wake up call for management at Crossroads. I guess it's the same mindset that the powers that be at the airport are under. I just don't get it. I think Crossroads should be torn down and rebuilt into an upscale 21st century mall. The affluent crowd will then flock to Crossroads in droves, therefore, driving out the troublemakers that now frequent the mall. The mall could be closed for a year while the rebuilding takes place.

I'm not a big fan of tearing things down when it's unnecessary, but I would say that Crossroads is beyond saving at this point if something drastic isn't done. And that may mean tearing it down and building something new. It really is a lot better location than Penn or Quail as far as interstates go (at least once construction is done). It's a shame it's in such crappy shape. It really is a black eye on the city in my opinion. I would never send a tourist or visiting friend there.

i'd like to see a crate & barrel (or something along those lines) at 50 penn place. i think that is a unique destination store that oklahoma city could support. and as far as expansion goes at penn square, some sort of 'lifestyle' area would be nice with outdoor shops and the like connected to the main mall. i'm not sure if that would work, but commercial developers seem to maximize small areas.

i'd like to see a crate & barrel (or something along those lines) at 50 penn place. i think that is a unique destination store that oklahoma city could support. and as far as expansion goes at penn square, some sort of 'lifestyle' area would be nice with outdoor shops and the like connected to the main mall. i'm not sure if that would work, but commercial developers seem to maximize small areas.

When I was in Fresno last summer we went to a mall that was being added onto but it was a more "lifestyle center" or village concept but still attached to the current mall. I think that could easily be done to Penn Square between the two Dillards and there are already two mall entrances there and several shops that already open to the outside including Garcia's (or its replacement), Mr. Ooleys, and Jos. A Bank.

About Heritage Park, one thing you have to remember is that Simon was responsible for the heyday of Heritage Park as well. They built Heritage Park. Heritage Park's problem is 3 fold: 1. Location, 2. Demographics (MWC area), and size (regional malls simply aren't doing well). Also, the fact that Simon had the mall up for sale for 10+ years didn't help matters. Stores typically don't want to locate in a mall where ownership is uncertain.

yeah i really wish they would do something with this mall... i live right behind it and it is an eyesore everyday driving by the thing... its amazing how much publicity that MWC is getting with all the new businesses being built on 29th street and the new Walmart being built, but yet this thing is just still sitting there unkept... do you know what the new owners are going to do with it?!

The Woodlands Mall just north of Houston just added a lifestyle center connected to it with shops and restaurants. It can be done, and done well.

the woodlands is pretty swell.

Ditto The Woodlands. Nice.

I was at Penn Square on Sunday, and parked in the garage. They had the whole section north and west of the ramps (inside the garage) blocked off. Is this the beginning of adding onto the garage? I sure hope so. With Patrick confirming in another thread that Cheesecake Factory will be moving in on a pad site by the bank on Penn, they need the additional parking.

I was at Penn Square on Sunday, and parked in the garage. They had the whole section north and west of the ramps (inside the garage) blocked off. Is this the beginning of adding onto the garage? I sure hope so. With Patrick confirming in another thread that Cheesecake Factory will be moving in on a pad site by the bank on Penn, they need the additional parking.

Nope....levels won't be added to the garage for a few more years. I think the section you're talking about is roped off for Valet Parking. They have Valet Parking year round now.

I forgot to mention one thing. While at the mall in Banana Republic, the salesman helping me said that they had just had a sight visit from senior management. They are getting ready to remodel the store. Also, he said they weren't happy so much merchandise was crammed into the little store. He said they told them they would considering separating the men and women's stores to expand.

It was from a salesman, not a manager, but interesting info at least.

I forgot to mention one thing. While at the mall in Banana Republic, the salesman helping me said that they had just had a sight visit from senior management. They are getting ready to remodel the store. Also, he said they weren't happy so much merchandise was crammed into the little store. He said they told them they would considering separating the men and women's stores to expand.

It was from a salesman, not a manager, but interesting info at least.

That's cool....both that they're considering expanding, and that they're renovating.

What is going in upstairs across from Fast Forward and just east of Starbucks?

it's time for a newer banana republic.

I always thought it was very small for a Banana Republic.

What is going in upstairs across from Fast Forward and just east of Starbucks?

Possibly the Aldo shoe store, since the accessory store is set to open soon.

Possibly the Aldo shoe store, since the accessory store is set to open soon.

That's actually going in next to Kirkland's.

Not sure what's going in where Naturalizer used to be. Management hasn't told me yet.

I'm thinking Fossil is going to locate a store somewhere since they recently opened one at Woodland Hills.

I'd like to see an Armani Exchange, any word on that Patrick?

It's crazy to see how much Crossroads mall has deteriated. At least I could remember going to thier Gap until 2002. Ever since the mid-90s has the place been going down. The remodling they did in the interior was barely anything. They took out the water fountain and ramp to just carpet floor and elevator.

I'm not young enough to remember this but my parents said once that (mid to early 80s maybe) Penn Sq. mall was pretty outdated and since they had remodled in the 90s the place has been flourishing ever since. Especially after they remodled again in the late 90s and early 2000s.

Armani Exchange is actually starting to locate in fairly small markets. Their newer stores are pretty small.

yeah i really wish they would do something with this mall... i live right behind it and it is an eyesore everyday driving by the thing... its amazing how much publicity that MWC is getting with all the new businesses being built on 29th street and the new Walmart being built, but yet this thing is just still sitting there unkept... do you know what the new owners are going to do with it?!

My father is fairly high up in MWC municipal government, and from what he has told me, the feeling there is that Heritage Park Mall should become Heritage Park Lake.

My father is fairly high up in MWC municipal government, and from what he has told me, the feeling there is that Heritage Park Mall should become Heritage Park Lake.

i really wish they would whipe out the ghetto ass apartments on 10th between air depot and midwest blvd.. it just breeds drugs and gangs... and makes our city look bad.. i live in mwc...

I'd like to see an Armani Exchange, any word on that Patrick?

They're not telling me anything else at this point. Although there will be a new upscale retailer new to the Oklahoma market moving into the old Casual Corner space. That will happen later this fall. Not sure what it is yet.

My father is fairly high up in MWC municipal government, and from what he has told me, the feeling there is that Heritage Park Mall should become Heritage Park Lake.

Can you explain further.....are you being serious or sarcastic? I didn't realize there was a creek running around there anywhere.

I'm not young enough to remember this but my parents said once that (mid to early 80s maybe) Penn Sq. mall was pretty outdated and since they had remodled in the 90s the place has been flourishing ever since. Especially after they remodled again in the late 90s and early 2000s.
They are right. Penn Square was an outdoor development, (which, btw, if it was built today, we would all think was pretty cool), and was completely turned around with the mall conversion. I remember going to Crossroads when it first opened. People drove from many miles around to see the mall. It truly was impressive at the time.

--------------------

Patrick, with all the talk in the Cheesecake Factory thread I thought we could talk about Penn Square updates here. Any other updates on new stores coming to Penn?

Can you explain further.....are you being serious or sarcastic? I didn't realize there was a creek running around there anywhere.

yeah i live in the neighborhood behind it and there are several creeks that run thru the neighborhood and i believe if you walk in one of them you will reach a tunnel that goes under the mall... had friends go in there when i was younger and say its pretty creepy..

I prefer Quail Springs Mall. The parking at Penn Square is so inadequte.

Sephora is coming to Penn this Fall. Fossil is looking at possibly locating there next Spring.

I've never had a problem parking at Penn Square. But then again, I've never had a problem parking in Bricktown either.

Quail Springs Mall has set itself in a very dangerous position. If a mall locates in Edmond, I'd really begin to worry about the future of the mall. The AMC movie theater is already a turn off to many shoppers, as it's become a big teen problem. Also, if Warren Theatres does choose to locate down Memorial Rd., I think they'd give AMC a good run for the money. I'd personally go to Warren for the reasons already mentioned in other threads.

They've lost out on all of the upscale national retailers to Penn and Edmond. Many of the stores Quail is now attracting are either local or traditional mall stores. Unfortunately, I don't see traditional lower end national stores doing so well. They're simply not competing well with Wal-Mart and Target. Penn Square is way above the national average in sales, while Quail continues to stay near average or below. It's all a domino effect. Once national retailers see your sales reach a certain figure, everything starts falling into place. That's why Penn Square has a waiting list.

I live near Quail Springs and shop there ocassionally, but if I'm doing any serious shopping I usually go to Penn Square.

My wife tends to like stores like Georgiou, White House-Black Market, J. Jill, Pottery Barn, Williams-Sonoma, and J. Crew, which Quail Springs simply doesn't have.

Ahh, I miss Penn Square Mall. It is very stylish, commmunity oriented, not to mention upscale. The Woodlands Mall here in Texas is great, but it has a dash of the Quail Springs Mall feel... not so much in the teen problem, just the fact that 70% of the mall is upscale, then you have this bulk section with nothing but traditional lower-end stores. Of course last time I was there, twelve spaces were under conversion.

I actually really like the Woodlands Mall. By the way, okcpulse, how is the new canal system working in that area? Water Taxi is operating there, and Norm Bekoff, former manager here, is running the operation there.

I will agree though. Woodlands Mall reminds me more of Woodland Hills Mall in Tulsa. It has a dash of everything. I'd say Woodlands Mall is more of a mixture of Quail Springs and Penn Square.

I will agree with one thing that has already been stated. Parking is easier at Quail Springs Mall. But, I think that's more due to the fact that it was originally designed to be a mall. Penn Square's parking is more spread out, and tight, mostly due to the fact that it was originally developed as an outdoor open air shopping center.

I like the parking at Penn much better. You don't have to park out in a wheat field.

But, like Patrick, I don't seem to have a problem parking there are bricktown.

I've never liked going to Quail Springs...the stores are just normal, run-of-the-mill mall stores. Penn has better stores, and just "feels" better.

By the way, okcpulse, how is the new canal system working in that area? Water Taxi is operating there, and Norm Bekoff, former manager here, is running the operation there.

The canal, called Woodlands Waterway, is actually very nice. It's very wide, and deeper, will a longer length than Bricktown's. The water taxis there are actually water taxis, not just tour rides. People are taxied from the Woodlands Marriott to the mall and outdoor shopping square that is connected to the mall. However, the waterway does not attract much foot traffic, and the entire setup is very suburban. Everything along the waterway is spread out, whereas the upper canal in Bricktown has a very urban feel since it meanders along the old California Avenue along old warehouses. There isn't much of any other kind of activity, no restaurants, with the exception of the waterway's starting point at the mall. All of the live bands, or concerts, rather, are at the Pavilion, which is several blocks east of the mall.

I've never liked going to Quail Springs...the stores are just normal, run-of-the-mill mall stores. Penn has better stores, and just "feels" better.

Yeah, I guess that's what I was trying to say. Quail Springs just has your general everyday mall stores. They don't really have any upscale stores. It's the upscale specialty stores that make Penn Square unique. My wife likes Penn Square better...the reason she told me is that it has everything Quail has and then some.

Her favorite stores are actually the upscale specialty stores like Georgiou, Cache, White-House Black Market, Williams Sonoma, Pottery Barn, J. Jill, J. Crew, Kirklands, and now Aldo. She wishes she could afford Coach! LOL! She still likes New York and Company, Express, and Limited, but they're found anywhere.

I will agree with one thing that was said about Quail Springs. I notice that I have to walk further from the parking lot. The parking lots at Penn aren't as deep but they're more spread out.

FYI...I just talked to one of my contacts in the corporate offices of GAP in San Francisco. I advised him to help push for a store in downtown OKC since he is in store development. Unfortunately GAP is not expanding anywhere right now but are working on remodeling efforts.

I'm told to look for an all-new GAP Adult in Penn Sq. and Quail in mid 2007. Thankfully an Oklahoma native is designing these two stores so hopefully they will put more effort into these stores than others.