Good news on the teacher pay front. https://kfor.com/2019/04/29/oklahoma-dramatically-jumps-in-teacher-pay-rankings-study-says/?fbclid=IwAR2U8OsuJUp-0jNhOHfdnHNswD1ye11AgZ7fD9FhWZnioxGHFX8YqDxl5E0

This pay raise is a good start, but I feel like so many years of bad press require more efforts to change perceptions that will impact the teacher work force. Oklahoma education has a serious perception problems across the country and region. To use a business term, it's a failed brand because of decades of legislative and public neglect.

This pay raise is a good start, but I feel like so many years of bad press require more efforts to change perceptions that will impact the teacher work force. Oklahoma education has a serious perception problems across the country and region. To use a business term, it's a failed brand because of decades of legislative and public neglect.

Oklahoma probably needs about 10 years of not showing up on any lists of "bottom 10 education funding in the nation". Most people in other states aren't really paying attention and aren't going to remember for very long. Stop making the news for the wrong reasons and the perception of our state will improve a lot.

If we can keep teacher salaries in line with Texas and Colorado for the next decade or so, and if OU can start going back up in the school rankings (crack the top 100, get close to AAU status), we'll be in a much better position.

Very good news. OK certainly doesn't need to be at the top of the list but it should be middle. Now to get upper ed funding back where it was a few years ago.

If I had the money I would send my Kids to a Private School for sure. Too many cracks in these public schools. I'm glad I was able to go to a small oklahoma school and had teachers that cared, (not saying they don't anymore) but I guess its hard with all the Cell phone and Social media these days.

If I had the money I would send my Kids to a Private School for sure. Too many cracks in these public schools. I'm glad I was able to go to a small oklahoma school and had teachers that cared, (not saying they don't anymore) but I guess its hard with all the Cell phone and Social media these days.

I taught in OKC in a public school that I would put up against any private school in Oklahoma. More than anything, these broad statements are silly. There are terrible private schools and good ones. For some students, this can be the same school! When I was growing up, half the drugs in the city ran through the private schools. 😂 The same spectrum goes for public schools. Not sure why you think social media is a public schools issue. Anyway, f me, I’ll always be committed to public schools because they’re a commitment to our communities. The biggest problem today is that many adults are not committed to their communities, just their kids.

I taught in OKC in a public school that I would put up against any private school in Oklahoma. More than anything, these broad statements are silly. There are terrible private schools and good ones. For some students, this can be the same school! When I was growing up, half the drugs in the city ran through the private schools. 😂 The same spectrum goes for public schools. Not sure why you think social media is a public schools issue. Anyway, f me, I’ll always be committed to public schools because they’re a commitment to our communities. The biggest problem today is that many adults are not committed to their communities, just their kids.

It isn't just the education but the entire high school experience. WestMoore is a good school with good teachers but at 2300 students, the kids don't have the same experience as Mount St Mary with 600 kids. Only so many kids can be on the football team or be a cheerleader.

I would say that my commitment to the community is just as strong as I am still paying taxes to support public schools (which I am OK with as strong schools are better for everyone) while also supporting other educational alternative that works better for our family. It isn't a choice between commitment to our kids over the community as being committed to our kids makes for stronger future leaders in our communities. Being committed to the community also means being committed to our kids also. These go hand in hand and are not opposed to each other.

I taught in OKC in a public school that I would put up against any private school in Oklahoma. More than anything, these broad statements are silly. There are terrible private schools and good ones. For some students, this can be the same school! When I was growing up, half the drugs in the city ran through the private schools. �� The same spectrum goes for public schools. Not sure why you think social media is a public schools issue. Anyway, f me, I’ll always be committed to public schools because they’re a commitment to our communities. The biggest problem today is that many adults are not committed to their communities, just their kids. The problem today is that many people don't care about the community. They only want what is in it for themselves. Look what's happened to Putnam West high school. That place 40 years ago was one the top schools in the metro, now it has Free/reduced Lunch program for a majority of students. Another example is Northwest Classen (elizabeth warren alma mater) Look who came out of that school, and look now. Starts with Dad and Mom then your communities will become better. Until then just keep throwing Money at it, that always seems to work.:lol2:

Look what's happened to Putnam West high school. That place 40 years ago was one the top schools in the metro, now it has Free/reduced Lunch program for a majority of students.

I... er... don't see the connection.

Public schools have the problem that they have to take everybody. Private schools can pick and choose, and generally the only kids who go there are the ones who have parents who care enough to pay money for it. A kid's chances of success skyrocket if mom and dad care enough to make sure he does his homework every night.

Your kid has a big time learning disability, or major behavioral problems? Public school has to deal with him. From the teachers I've spoken with, In public school 10% of the students generate 90% of the problems. A private school just doesn't have to accept that 10%. So a public school is almost always going to be less efficient than a private school. But really as far as quality of education, you get out of it what you put into it.

The problem today is that many people don't care about the community. They only want what is in it for themselves. Look what's happened to Putnam West high school. That place 40 years ago was one the top schools in the metro, now it has Free/reduced Lunch program for a majority of students. Another example is Northwest Classen (elizabeth warren alma mater) Look who came out of that school, and look now. Starts with Dad and Mom then your communities will become better. Until then just keep throwing Money at it, that always seems to work.:lol2:

Well, isn't it true that once your own kids leave public school, you shouldn't have to pay taxes to support those schools anymore? To me, that is the mentality of far too many out there. If I don't use it, I should not have to help support it.

What about home schooling? Doesn't the public school system hate for people to do this because the Money they lose?

What about home schooling? Doesn't the public school system hate for people to do this because the Money they lose?

First, I'm not sure a system has feelings... but other than that, huh?

What about home schooling? Doesn't the public school system hate for people to do this because the Money they lose?

Anything that takes the per student cash away from public schools is disliked by the public school system.

The problem today is that many people don't care about the community. They only want what is in it for themselves. Look what's happened to Putnam West high school. That place 40 years ago was one the top schools in the metro, now it has Free/reduced Lunch program for a majority of students. Another example is Northwest Classen (elizabeth warren alma mater) Look who came out of that school, and look now. Starts with Dad and Mom then your communities will become better. Until then just keep throwing Money at it, that always seems to work.:lol2:

The communities changed. A lot of those students who graduated 40 to 30 years ago moved to Edmond and their kids are probably moved or planning to move to Deer Creek taking their money and building higher value homes somewhere else. I went to Putnam City Schools about 15 years ago and it can be argued that they were higher tiered back then.

It isn't just the education but the entire high school experience. WestMoore is a good school with good teachers but at 2300 students, the kids don't have the same experience as Mount St Mary with 600 kids. Only so many kids can be on the football team or be a cheerleader.

I would say that my commitment to the community is just as strong as I am still paying taxes to support public schools (which I am OK with as strong schools are better for everyone) while also supporting other educational alternative that works better for our family. It isn't a choice between commitment to our kids over the community as being committed to our kids makes for stronger future leaders in our communities. Being committed to the community also means being committed to our kids also. These go hand in hand and are not opposed to each other.

My point wasn't to bag on anyone for making decisions for their kids. It's admittedly complicated. If apologize if my point came across that way.

I will point out that at even a lot of big schools like Westmoore, while maybe your children are less likely to the star on the football team or cheerleading squad, there are far more options for small group participation that are likely unavailable at smaller schools Mount St. Mary's. I mean, Westmoore has lots more teachers than Mount St. Mary's so that offers a lot of opportunities for students. When I taught at Westmoore, we had so many ways to be involved. Clubs included: anime, Gay-Straight alliance, environmental, anti-genocide coalition, Asian-American Society, robotics and on and on. In short, your kids would likely have had more opportunities for participation at Westmoore. If football and cheerleading prominence was the main goal then, yes, Mount St. Mary's may have been better. But size offers opportunities too. We had an incredible faculty when I was there. We all dedicated a ton of our time before/during lunch/after school to students and their interests.

My point wasn't to bag on anyone for making decisions for their kids. It's admittedly complicated. If apologize if my point came across that way.

I will point out that at even a lot of big schools like Westmoore, while maybe your children are less likely to the star on the football team or cheerleading squad, there are far more options for small group participation that are likely unavailable at smaller schools Mount St. Mary's. I mean, Westmoore has lots more teachers than Mount St. Mary's so that offers a lot of opportunities for students. When I taught at Westmoore, we had so many ways to be involved. Clubs included: anime, Gay-Straight alliance, environmental, anti-genocide coalition, Asian-American Society, robotics and on and on. In short, your kids would likely have had more opportunities for participation at Westmoore. If football and cheerleading prominence was the main goal then, yes, Mount St. Mary's may have been better. But size offers opportunities too. We had an incredible faculty when I was there. We all dedicated a ton of our time before/during lunch/after school to students and their interests.

It is complicated and you didn't come across bad. That is a valid point for the smaller activities as they have more teachers. What is funny is our son didn't want to go to MSM because he liked the cross country coach at Westmoore. (Brink X country worked out with the high school kids.) There is much more reliance on parents for small groups like robotics. My daughter decided she wanted to pole vault this year and had to go to Bishop McGuiness to train and workout as MSM didn't have it. If there is something you want to do at MSM, they generally will find a way.

There are pros and cons to both. The key is to figure out what works best for each kid. We were happy with Westmoore other than the sheer size of the student population at the high school level.

My brother in law is the co owner of Epic Charter Schools. They are 100% loathed by the public school system.

My brother in law is the co owner of Epic Charter Schools. They are 100% loathed by the public school system.

Ben or Dave?

My brother in law is the co owner of Epic Charter Schools. They are 100% loathed by the public school system.

Why do you think that is?

My brother in law is the co owner of Epic Charter Schools. They are 100% loathed by the public school system.

Deserved. They're pocketing 10% of the proceeds as "management fees" and graduating only about 1/3 of their high schoolers on time. Their high school is in the bottom 5% of public high schools in the state. They're trash.

And, yes, I do believe all for-profit school systems should be closed and honestly outlawed. The corruption in for-profit charters is astounding, which is no surprise. Think about the conflict of interests in making educational decisions when you have to consider turning a profit. I'm not saying public schools are perfect (the waste in corporate ed tech contracts as an example), but it's to such a smaller scale than the corruption we've seen in for-profit charters.

The charter model was originally conceived of as laboratories for innovative or community-serving school designs. However, now they've morphed into "no excuse" totalitarian (see KIPP), for-profit, political extremist, or just naive-I-bet-I-can-make-a-great-school-even-though-I-know-nothing-about-education charter models. Research suggests that charters are not more successful than public schools and often come with far larger failures. But people keep trying them because many public schools are set up to fail through underfunding, segregation, and accountability-reform that decimates working class schools in particular. And, a lot of people don't realize that many of the worst public school policies are pushed through by charter school extremists who are trying to dismantle public schools. [rant over]

...

The charter model was originally conceived of as laboratories for innovative or community-serving school designs. However, now they've morphed into "no excuse" totalitarian (see KIPP), for-profit, political extremist, or just naive-I-bet-I-can-make-a-great-school-even-though-I-know-nothing-about-education charter models. Research suggests that charters are not more successful than public schools and often come with far larger failures. But people keep trying them because many public schools are set up to fail through underfunding, segregation, and accountability-reform that decimates working class schools in particular. And, a lot of people don't realize that many of the worst public school policies are pushed through by charter school extremists who are trying to dismantle public schools. [rant over]

:Smiley173:Smiley173:Smiley173

And, yes, I do believe all for-profit school systems should be closed and honestly outlawed. The corruption in for-profit charters is astounding, which is no surprise. Think about the conflict of interests in making educational decisions when you have to consider turning a profit. I'm not saying public schools are perfect (the waste in corporate ed tech contracts as an example), but it's to such a smaller scale than the corruption we've seen in for-profit charters.

The charter model was originally conceived of as laboratories for innovative or community-serving school designs. However, now they've morphed into "no excuse" totalitarian (see KIPP), for-profit, political extremist, or just naive-I-bet-I-can-make-a-great-school-even-though-I-know-nothing-about-education charter models. Research suggests that charters are not more successful than public schools and often come with far larger failures. But people keep trying them because many public schools are set up to fail through underfunding, segregation, and accountability-reform that decimates working class schools in particular. And, a lot of people don't realize that many of the worst public school policies are pushed through by charter school extremists who are trying to dismantle public schools. [rant over]

I'm not asking to be argumentative (other than you seem to paint a pretty broad brush) but to see the stats and who is behind them. I know OKC and Denver are distantly separated but there are a number of charter schools around here that are outstanding. Several specialize in STEM and aim to keep girls interested in the subjects, while at the same time allowing boys to escape athletic pressures. One is a music specialty school and one, where a colleague has his 3 mixed-race children pushes business and multi-lingual education.
I wonder if this might be a case of the source of the stats making the outcome what the source wants them to be?

Deserved. They're pocketing 10% of the proceeds as "management fees" and graduating only about 1/3 of their high schoolers on time. Their high school is in the bottom 5% of public high schools in the state. They're trash.

Man, I'd love to hear what you think about the actual public school system? I'm actually pretty neutral and can see both sides. But to call them trash? Cmon now. I'm sure you are OK with the way too many administrators and top officials in the public schools making six figures while their kids have 10-15% proficiency in English and math?

Man, I'd love to hear what you think about the actual public school system? I'm actually pretty neutral and can see both sides. But to call them trash? Cmon now. I'm sure you are OK with the way too many administrators and top officials in the public schools making six figures while their kids have 10-15% proficiency in English and math?

Epic's high school is in the BOTTOM 5% of public high schools in the state. 95% of schools in Oklahoma score better than Epic. Epic's owners aren't making six figure salaries. They're turning millions in profit while you begrudge administrators salaries competitive with surrounding states.

I guess I don't know what to tell you as I haven't said anything about their scores or how good they are. Epic isn't for everyone. From what I have seen it's full of kids that are behind their grade level and didn't do well in traditional setting and need a different pace. maybe that has something to do with it? Beats me.

What I DO know is teachers love teaching there. Overall consensus is parents enjoy the curriculum and pace. Ditto for the kids. Their current enrollment is just under 24,000, next year should be about 35,000. If it was so horrible why are parents flocking there from the traditional school setting? It's a legitimate question.

I'm not asking to be argumentative (other than you seem to paint a pretty broad brush) but to see the stats and who is behind them. I know OKC and Denver are distantly separated but there are a number of charter schools around here that are outstanding. Several specialize in STEM and aim to keep girls interested in the subjects, while at the same time allowing boys to escape athletic pressures. One is a music specialty school and one, where a colleague has his 3 mixed-race children pushes business and multi-lingual education.
I wonder if this might be a case of the source of the stats making the outcome what the source wants them to be?

Yes, I was painting and broad brush and I agree that there are excellent charter schools. And, yes, the charters that specialize in an area are more in line with the original vision for public charters and can be effective. I do not have a problem with that model. My larger point is that I disagree, and I believe there is a lot of evidence at this point, that charter schools are not better than traditional public schools. For the most part, just like public schools, charter schools succeed in the accountability-reform model when they have resources and, more generally, educated, wealthier parents. This is not to say that any individual students cannot succeed, but just that standardized tests will always tilt towards families with more social, financial, and educational resources.

When people ask me my recommendations for improving our education systems I tell them it's pretty easy: diminish for-profit influence (e.g., testing companies, for-profit charters), eliminate standardized accountability-reform, and re-commit to school integration.

Man, I'd love to hear what you think about the actual public school system? I'm actually pretty neutral and can see both sides. But to call them trash? Cmon now. I'm sure you are OK with the way too many administrators and top officials in the public schools making six figures while their kids have 10-15% proficiency in English and math?

The best part about public schools is that you as a citizen can address administration and superintendent salaries. Charters are not democratic and thus you can't address these issues.

As to the low scores, there's no evidence that charter schools are any better at helping students pass the tests. Proficiency tests are not educational and we shouldn't use them at all to measure schools. They tell you very little about teacher effectiveness. The system is broken. The entire accountability-reform standardized test system is built on the myth of the Houston miracle schools that used accountability measures to make amazing test score jumps... and then an investigation found that it was all fraud. It's a bull**** system and we should quit referencing flawed models to try to describe which schools are "failing" or "succeeding." I taught in suburban OKC schools where I could have slept through all my classes and my students would have tested well. We've got to quit using these tests as our way to talk about schools.

I invited Ben Felder on to my podcast a while ago and I think his insights were really helpful in how pointless our education metrics are. He chose a C school for his kid only because he's an education reporter. It's a great school. It would never have been rated a C if the system wasn't broken.

You can find Ben Felder's episode here: https://visionsofed.com/2016/10/25/episode-29-education-reporting-with-ben-felder/

And here's another good episode on school evaluation systems from an expert: https://visionsofed.com/2017/03/14/episode-48-measuring-school-quality-with-jack-schneider/

What I DO know is teachers love teaching there. Overall consensus is parents enjoy the curriculum and pace. Ditto for the kids. Their current enrollment is just under 24,000, next year should be about 35,000. If it was so horrible why are parents flocking there from the traditional school setting? It's a legitimate question.

I'm glad parents like it and I'll say it could be a well run school. I don't know the details. But as to why parents are flocking there, it's very likely there children are in segregated or low-income schools and, since we're in Oklahoma, we also know the schools are underfunded. Again, some legislators have been working for years to strip state support from public schools so they could then offer charters as an alternative. It's part of their design.

I'm glad parents like it and I'll say it could be a well run school. I don't know the details. But as to why parents are flocking there, it's very likely there children are in segregated or low-income schools and, since we're in Oklahoma, we also know the schools are underfunded. Again, some legislators have been working for years to strip state support from public schools so they could then offer charters as an alternative. It's part of their design.

Really, this seems a bit far-fetched. I could see 1 or 2 fringe players who may have totally lost faith in public schools - and in some cases l can see why.

I'm glad parents like it and I'll say it could be a well run school. I don't know the details. But as to why parents are flocking there, it's very likely there children are in segregated or low-income schools and, since we're in Oklahoma, we also know the schools are underfunded. Again, some legislators have been working for years to strip state support from public schools so they could then offer charters as an alternative. It's part of their design.

You know I respect your opinion and insight so i will ask this. I don't agree with anything above you are saying. I will add that Epic gets 60 cents on the dollar per traditional public school pupils. They are on pace to be the 3rd largest state district next year. So if the states 3rd largest district is only getting 60 cents on the dollar don't you think the state would want to push (edit: maybe not push, but welcome a parents choice? it's free to to there btw) kids their way? Or any other charter school for that matter? Teachers get paid drastically more on that 60 cents too with an average pay in the $60k i think.Yes I know they don't have the overhead of buildings, ect, but still an interesting discussion.

You know I respect your opinion and insight so i will ask this. I don't agree with anything above you are saying. I will add that Epic gets 60 cents on the dollar per traditional public school pupils. They are on pace to be the 3rd largest state district next year. So if the states 3rd largest district is only getting 60 cents on the dollar don't you think the state would want to push (edit: maybe not push, but welcome a parents choice? it's free to to there btw) kids their way? Or any other charter school for that matter? Teachers get paid drastically more on that 60 cents too with an average pay in the $60k i think.Yes I know they don't have the overhead of buildings, ect, but still an interesting discussion.

To answer these questions I'd have to know a lot more. For example, does EPIC serve all students, including students with severe disabilities? A lot of people don't realize that the U.S.' commitment to students' with disabilities raises the costs of public schools significantly. I am proud of IDEA legislation and our incredible special education teachers. This raises costs by a lot. Most private schools, for example, often refuse to serve students with severe disabilities. There's a lot of factors like that which can greatly affect costs. I'd have to do more research to know. But, I'd be highly skeptical of any charter that claims to dramatically outperform public schools serving similar students. There are usually simple explanations for differences in state performance. Most "miracle schools" that claim to raise test scores serving similar students end up being frauds. It's happened over and over again. Now, I'm not saying EPIC isn't a good school. It could be slightly "outperforming" schools with similar students using the flawed ways we collect educational data, but it's likely to fall within the norms of other schools.

Are these the same Epic Charter Schools we were discussing in this thread? https://oklahoman.com/article/5634862/epic-charter-schools-far-above-state-average-for-students-dropped-after-absences

Virtual charter schools almost always have huge drop out rates. Online learning is really challenging to get right and requires talented educators with a specific skill set. Anyway, all these alternatives to public schools hardly ever produce better results that can't just be attributed to socioeconomic indicators (in which case public schools with the same indicators do just as well).

You know I respect your opinion and insight so i will ask this. I don't agree with anything above you are saying. I will add that Epic gets 60 cents on the dollar per traditional public school pupils. They are on pace to be the 3rd largest state district next year. So if the states 3rd largest district is only getting 60 cents on the dollar don't you think the state would want to push (edit: maybe not push, but welcome a parents choice? it's free to to there btw) kids their way? Or any other charter school for that matter? Teachers get paid drastically more on that 60 cents too with an average pay in the $60k i think.Yes I know they don't have the overhead of buildings, ect, but still an interesting discussion.

Does Epic have any extracurricular activities that traditional schools do? Sports? Drama? Music? Debate?

It’s easy to have less cost if you provide less services.

I didn't realize Epic was largely online. Is this correct? Of course, it's cheaper, but online schooling (except for in very narrow and specific situations) is such a McDonaldization approach to education: cheaper, more efficient... and low quality generally.

For more info, here's a list of stories Oklahoma Watch has done on Epic:

https://oklahomawatch.org/?s=epic

Their High School is ranked in the bottom 5% in the state. They reportedly have a 25% turnover rate. Several times that of a brick and mortar. It's a garbage school which may work for a small minority, but only a small minority of students. It's a poor use of our tax dollars.

Hmmmm, according to greatschool.org, they ranked towards to top of the pack in OKC though their scores were a little below average. Niche.com ranks them C+ overall, A- for teachers and diversity. Certainly not good but not bottom 5%. I wonder if the online nature of the school keeps them ranked low?

Greatschools.org uses a formula that is.... basically just test scores, which studies have repeatedly shown are just a reflection of parental socioeconomics more than school quality.

Hmmmm, according to greatschool.org, they ranked towards to top of the pack in OKC though their scores were a little below average. Niche.com ranks them C+ overall, A- for teachers and diversity. Certainly not good but not bottom 5%. I wonder if the online nature of the school keeps them ranked low?

Here's their report card from last year. Overall, they received an "F" rating, meaning they are within the bottom 5% of Oklahoma high schools. I am sure several OKCPS schools also fell within that range as well. As benchmarks, U.S. Grant received a "D," as did NW Classen.

What really sets Epic apart in a bad way is its graduation rate--44%, about half of what the statewide average and still well below the OKCPS high schools I looked at. They also perform abysmally in the area of academic achievement--32%, compared to 52% for the State, and in the area of post-secondary opportunities, they scored 11%, four times lower than the state average.

It would probably be interesting to sort out the students going to Epic who would be going to OKCPS, assuming that's a fairly representative cross section, in order to get a real apples v. apples comparison. We pretty much already do have that comparison though when you look at the State as a whole. Their student performance is poor, reflecting weak academics, and if you want your child going to college, Epic is not for you, according to the data.

https://www.oklaschools.com/school/1908/

Here's the recent reports on Epic's practices...

Story by Oklahoma Watch on enrollment manipulation: Former Epic Teachers Describe Pressure to Manipulate Enrollment (https://oklahomawatch.org/2019/06/26/former-epic-teachers-describe-pressure-to-manipulate-enrollment/)

Here's Oklahoma's Watch about Epic's joke of response from their hired "journalists" in their "Epic News Network" (what a big joke): Oklahoma Watch Response to Epic Commentary (https://oklahomawatch.org/2019/06/30/oklahoma-watch-response-to-epic-schools-commentary/)

Critique of Epic trying to recruit away public school teachers (Note: I even recieved one of these emails): To add hundreds of faculty, Epic Charter Schools obtained personal information of thousands of Oklahoma public school teachers (https://www.readfrontier.org/stories/seeking-to-add-hundreds-of-faculty-to-its-ranks-epic-charter-schools-obtained-personal-information-of-tens-of-thousands-of-oklahoma-public-school-teachers/)

Here's the pattern: Charter schools claim to be able to do better than public schools. They fail. So they lie, manipulate their numbers, or demand that their teachers become full time missionaries who work absurd hours and scream their students into submission like it's the military (see KIPP). Some charter schools are fine, some are terrible, but on the whole, the charter mission damages our public institution of public schools, encourages segregation, and fails to deliver on promises.

I have a co-worker who strongly sings the praises of Epic Charter schools. They're very well off and live in a good school district, but chose Epic because of the teacher interaction and flexibility.

My understanding is that, as a parent you must be heavily involved. You work with your teacher 30 min a day, and then schedule the rest of your day at your leisure. You can schedule additional time with the teacher if you'd like. Even though the lessons are online, that's just for convenience. The teachers are local and can meet in person if needed. The rest of it is just like home-schooling. You can join home-school groups or other daytime activities.

I was shocked at how little instruction time there is, but the way my co-worker explained it is that his kids are all elementary aged, so the material isn't really that complex. Eliminating the corporate learning environment and making it more of a tutoring session helps his kids understand and practice much faster than in a public school setting. I don't know much about testing or other requirements. He and his wife love being involved like this, but I can definitely see how it isn't for everyone.

The biggest advantage to all of this really is time. They can travel when they want. Schedule appointments or activities without factoring an 8a-3p daily commitment. I get why people may love it and why some may hate it.

^^^
So, basically, as long as parents have the time and economic privilege to do most of the teaching themselves then it's a great school. Lol. I'm not saying it can't work for some very select and well off families who want to take vacations without worrying about school, but your entire description is more of an explanation why it won't work for most. If your parents are working class and will often be gone trying to put food on the table then this sounds like an awful option.

By the way, I prepare elementary teachers and the lessons my teacher candidates write are actually very complex and require a level of skill, expertise, and practice that a lot of non-educators don't understand and are also difficult to deliver online.

There is so much lost in online schooling from gaining social skills to participating in clubs or extracurriculars to not having a school in your community. Again, there are select, very specific cases where online learning can be a good option, but they should just operate within existing public school systems.

Lmao.

Epic Charter Schools embezzled millions with 'ghost students,' OSBI says (https://www.tulsaworld.com/news/education/epic-charter-schools-embezzled-millions-with-ghost-students-osbi-says/article_0ea064e8-9631-5d3e-893e-2f61370b6aa9.html)

It looks like Epic is beyond corrupt. At the expense of the taxpayer.

My brother in law is the co owner of Epic Charter Schools. They are 100% loathed by the public school system.

Sounds like OSBI thinks he made out like a bandit.


OSBI warrant: 'Ghost students' at Epic (https://oklahoman.com/article/5636395/epic-embezzled-millions-with-ghost-students-osbi-says)

In its search warrant, OSBI alleged between 2013 and 2018, Chaney and Harris unlawfully received $10 million in profits from Epic Youth Services and split the total.

If he did something wrong then yeah, he should pay the price.