View Full Version : Panhandlers



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warreng88
06-04-2015, 09:04 AM
I know this has been discussed a lot on this site, but wanted to bring it up again. My wife and I went to San Antonio and Austin a few weeks ago stopping in Dallas as well and didn't see nearly as many panhandlers there as we do in OKC. Even Tulsa is much better than OKC.

At major intersections within the core of OKC (23rd and Penn, 23rd and Classen, 23rd and Broadway, I-44/Hefner Parkway and anywhere with a light, NW Expressway, in general, I-35 and major intersections and I-40 and major intersections) there seems to be at least two, sometimes four per intersection.

I drive 44 from 23rd to Expressway every day and see four panhandlers at both major intersections on my way to work every day.

Is there a ruling in the city that they need to have permits or is it just a free for all?

Why are there more panhandlers here in OKC versus other major metro areas in Texas? Is it simply that we are at the crossroads of 40 and 35 so it is easier to get here, make some money and go on their way?

adaniel
06-04-2015, 10:16 AM
I do tend to agree that OKC can be a bit lax on these things, but panhandling ordinances are largely toothless and difficult to enforce.

I'm also not sure I agree that OKC is far and above worse than Dallas, Austin, or SA. I can't speak for SA, but Dallas has a pretty serious panhandling issue along the exits off Central and 35E. Personally, I've been approached several times at gas stations.

Last time in Austin I was actually pretty surprised at the level of panhandling, and I was in a fairly nice part of town (Barton Creek mall area). The thing that stuck out to me was they definitely were "professional bums" and tweakers, not down-on-your-luck people you get in other cities. My guess is you may not see certain things like that because you probably stuck to the tourist areas in these cities.

One thing someone in law enforcement told me was that OKC does get a lot of hitchhikers, modern day nomads, and "end of the road" types that come and go through town just based on the city's location. Go to any of the big truck stops west of town along I-40 and you'll see what I'm talking about. I would be hard pressed to say that fact alone makes panhandling worse here.

sooner88
06-04-2015, 10:33 AM
Companies like Curbside Chronicle have helped, but they are designed to help the down-on-your-luck homeless vs. the "professional bums and tweakers". The easiest way to stop panhandling is to stop giving them money.

Achilleslastand
06-04-2015, 10:48 AM
I used to give to panhandlers quite frequently but after a couple of experiences with one in the parking lot of belle isle wal mart{same story several months apart} it soured it for me. If someone looks truly in need I have no problem with giving and that doesn't include men that look able bodied.

yukong
06-04-2015, 11:32 AM
I see the same people nearly every day on my route to work and then home again. One old boy has been at it for a couple of years now with a sign saying he lost all in a fire including his son. If it's one I don't recognize, I don't mind helping, but when it's the same ones day after day for weeks, months and yes, over a year, then it's obvious they are pros. And then I really loved the guy that I saw at I-40 and MacArthur that had a big key ring hanging out of his pocket with several keys along with a car key fob. Or the couple I saw way out east on I-40 that had a nearly new Mini Cooper hidden behind some trees across the road from where they were panhandling.

turnpup
06-04-2015, 11:38 AM
We don't give to panhandlers, but I have to say I found one of them fascinating. Well, actually it was her cat. This lady panhandles at the intersection of May and I-44 with her cat in tow. All that noise and clutter, and the little cat just sleeps on a pad next to her. It was crazy! I rolled down the window and asked her about it. She said she had it since it was tiny. It had been abandoned by its mother so she fed it with an eyedropper until it could eat solid food. She said the cat's always been that tame.

Stew
06-04-2015, 12:09 PM
I've noticed a new trend in panhandling. I've been hit up twice here recently inside a store shopping. Once at lowes and another time at target. The come on both times was a car broken down sob story. Yet another point in Amazon's favor.

okclee
06-04-2015, 12:51 PM
I've noticed a new trend in panhandling. I've been hit up twice here recently inside a store shopping. Once at lowes and another time at target. The come on both times was a car broken down sob story. Yet another point in Amazon's favor.

Within the last month this has happened to me twice as well. Once inside Walgreens and the other time was at Home Depot. And yes, same broken down car story.

Another note I tried to hire a "will work for food" person and they simply told me that they make more in a couple of hours than I could afford to pay them. I was offering $100 for a days work cleaning up a dirty warehouse.

traxx
06-04-2015, 01:27 PM
Anybody remember this from a few months back?

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NWOKCGuy
06-04-2015, 01:27 PM
They're at all intersections at 39th/44 and May as well. I guess the corners got full there bc I see them at 36th and May now too.

warreng88
06-04-2015, 01:32 PM
I work out at Gold's Gym on 23rd and Penn and have for about a year. About once a month I get hit for money in the parking lot. One time, a lady asked me for money for groceries for her three kids. I told her I would not give her money, but would be willing to buy her whatever she wanted to up to $50 at the Wal-Mart Neighborhood Market which is in the same parking lot. She said she needed to buy somewhere else, closer to home. As I pressed she walked about cussing me.

Bullbear
06-04-2015, 01:37 PM
The two and 39th/44 and May are a couple. they have worked it for a good while and they are a mess. they have a dog and a cat and I have a lengthy story I don't think is appropriate to post but of them taking advantage of someones kindness and basically squatting in their home and robbing them blind.

I'd say Dallas has as many or not more. but I think ours is on the rise. I have seen turf wars on 23rd and penn of them fighting over the corner or median. its crazy

whatitis
06-04-2015, 02:56 PM
Yeah. To everyone who says they occasionally give. Don't.

Give to a homeless shelter, give to organizations that help homeless people. Giving it directly to the person is the worse thing you can do. The ones that really need the help are very rarely actually panhandling. I have been approached a lot and I always tell them I don't have cash but I can go and fill up their car or get them food/groceries and they never want that. People truly in need will take whatever you offer. There are a lot of organizations out there that really do help, just find some.

Bullbear
06-04-2015, 03:00 PM
well how people give is a personal choice.

Mel
06-04-2015, 04:06 PM
If they have kids or critters with them I am an easy touch. It is a personal choice that no one should have to defend their actions. For or against.

hoya
06-05-2015, 08:32 AM
And here I thought this thread was going to be about people from Guymon.

OKCretro
06-05-2015, 09:18 AM
Some places ban panhandling with a dog or a cat because the pandhandlers know that people will feel more sorry for them and the animal. Its a classic ploy

kevinpate
06-05-2015, 09:34 AM
I stopped counting long ago the broken down car folks from out of town, and the part was delayed and the motel has drained them so no food or diapers, etc. Exceptionally rare for one to accept the offer to let's go in and get you and child something to eat then go get diapers.

As far as folks coming, staying a bit and moving on, I've seen many folks who are regulars at certain spots and not appearing to be the least bit transient.

TexanOkie
06-05-2015, 09:42 AM
Last time in Austin I was actually pretty surprised at the level of panhandling, and I was in a fairly nice part of town (Barton Creek mall area). The thing that stuck out to me was they definitely were "professional bums" and tweakers, not down-on-your-luck people you get in other cities. My guess is you may not see certain things like that because you probably stuck to the tourist areas in these cities.

Having lived in Austin for 4.5 years (recently--within the last 10 years), I agree that Austin panhandling is significantly more widespread there than it is here and it is much more organized. The pastor of my church in Austin used to reach out to the Austin homeless population. They are quite organized; while there are some stragglers, etc., a good chunk operate on a shift schedule at key intersections that they set up themselves, and in some cases they split their daily earnings with each other. A couple of the leaders of the homeless community were quite well known, and at least one has tried to run for Austin City Council in the past.

jn1780
06-05-2015, 11:48 AM
Its pretty bad along Penn from 122nd all the way to the Quail Springs mall. Same people everyday. Only people on the street I will give money to is a firefighter with a boot. One time I saw a lady with kids at the Penn Walmart and I just happen to need to stop at the Moore Walmart and saw the same lady. How did she afford to travel all the way to Moore if she needed money?

kevinpate
06-05-2015, 02:33 PM
Why, by using a portion of the money she collected while at the Penn Wal-mart of course :)

jccouger
06-05-2015, 03:37 PM
Unless if they physically attack you I don't see why they are a problem. Sure its annoying being approached (people talking to you in general is usually annoying these days) but its really easy to just say no and move on. Its a lot harder being homeless than it is being asked for spare change.

kevinpate
06-05-2015, 04:49 PM
aye, but that presumes one is being approached by someone who is homeless, and that is very often not the case.

Snowman
06-05-2015, 05:56 PM
I've noticed a new trend in panhandling. I've been hit up twice here recently inside a store shopping. Once at lowes and another time at target. The come on both times was a car broken down sob story. Yet another point in Amazon's favor.

Probably more an indication of the temperature it is outside, outside they get more traffic and less chance of being kicked out by security, but with highs in the 90s this week much of the time would be pretty miserable.

Mel
06-05-2015, 06:54 PM
Unless if they physically attack you I don't see why they are a problem. Sure its annoying being approached (people talking to you in general is usually annoying these days) but its really easy to just say no and move on. Its a lot harder being homeless than it is being asked for spare change.

When the Harkins Theatre first opened the grifters were pretty aggressive.

soonermike81
06-06-2015, 10:41 PM
Panhandlers make me sick. Majority of them are con artists. I will not give them a single dime ever. As for those that are truly homeless and down on their luck, I do empathize with them. However, how long does it take someone to get on their feet? Jobs are out there if one is willing.

Bits_Of_Real_Panther
06-07-2015, 01:00 AM
Panhandlers make me sick. Majority of them are con artists. I will not give them a single dime ever. As for those that are truly homeless and down on their luck, I do empathize with them. However, how long does it take someone to get on their feet? Jobs are out there if one is willing.

The sentiment is understood. There is a guy in a roll-a-bout wheelchair thing-a-mah-gib who frequents the 23rd and Pennsylvania intersection whose legs are chopped off below the knees. I don't know what else a guy like that can do.

BBatesokc
06-07-2015, 05:48 AM
The sentiment is understood. There is a guy in a roll-a-bout wheelchair thing-a-mah-gib who frequents the 23rd and Pennsylvania intersection whose legs are chopped off below the knees. I don't know what else a guy like that can do.

I'm fairly certain the thousands of hard working Americans in wheelchairs could probably give the guy you mentioned a few ideas.

Considering a huge percentage of workers sit most of their day, I think being in a wheelchair is not that large of an obstacle to the goal of simply being employed.

When I had my T-shirt shop (many, many years ago) one of my sale's people was actually in a wheel chair.

Heck the greeter at the Edmond Sam's is usually a really nice guy in a wheelchair that appears to have a disability that goes beyond simple paralysis.

NWOKCGuy
06-07-2015, 06:23 AM
The sentiment is understood. There is a guy in a roll-a-bout wheelchair thing-a-mah-gib who frequents the 23rd and Pennsylvania intersection whose legs are chopped off below the knees. I don't know what else a guy like that can do.

This guy lives in the Vegas neighborhood. I've seen he and his wife going home several times.

Brett
06-07-2015, 07:23 AM
Isn't there a law on the books that requires anyone working on a highway or interstate has to wear a day-glo or fluorescent colored vest? I've noticed many panhandlers in dangerous intersections that should be wearing safety vests.

kevinpate
06-07-2015, 10:26 AM
I grew up next door to a man who was confined to a wheelchair. Didn't keep him from being a medical professional, nor from driving, camping or boating. He and his dear wife, one of my early teachers, were truly great people. Both were so friendly and cheerful in all the years I knew them. I never once knew about the pain he lived with.

The first I learned of the intensity of his struggle was after he could no longer endure the pain and left this world. I felt horrible that I never noticed even a hint of his pain and struggles. But other than when weather interfered with a chance to go out on his boat, I can not say I ever heard him complain about anything. It's been three decades now, and I still miss him.

workman45
06-07-2015, 04:26 PM
I know of an individual who was, and is, homeless. He's sober now and looking for a job. He lost everything so has no ID, no social security card and no birth certificate. What is the best way for him to proceed?

Snowman
06-07-2015, 05:10 PM
I know of an individual who was, and is, homeless. He's sober now and looking for a job. He lost everything so has no ID, no social security card and no birth certificate. What is the best way for him to proceed?

on the ID side:
Probably calling or just going into the Oklahoma Department of Public Safety (aka Oklahoma DMV) to see how to proceed, they normally want some form of ID but it happens enough they should they should at least be aware of the process of what to do, if not the start of the process. The location near 36th and MLK is the best equipped to handle any request, it looks like it is $20 to file for the basic ID Card, I do not see anything listed on the website for if missing all ID, but given how long they have been requiring fingerprints it seems like that ought to be convincing proof in most cases. After that the social security card and birth certificates should be strait forward to replace with a State issued ID Card.

zookeeper
06-07-2015, 05:41 PM
I get this far into this thread without metal health being mentioned? It's easy to judge. I do it too. But, many of these people suffer from mental illness of one kind or another. In fact, many of these same people would have been institutionalized before the '80s dump into the streets.

mugofbeer
06-07-2015, 06:55 PM
Mental illness and substance addiction.

boscorama
06-07-2015, 08:56 PM
I usually have some dog treats in the car, which come in handy at times. Still, always mindful of the necessity of water for my four-legged friends.

Robert_M
06-08-2015, 09:01 AM
Another note I tried to hire a "will work for food" person and they simply told me that they make more in a couple of hours than I could afford to pay them. I was offering $100 for a days work cleaning up a dirty warehouse.

My former boss use to tell me a story like this. He was traveling in the 80's doing construction work all across the country and came across a man with a sign saying the same thing. Was physical work picking up trash and carrying materials to where they were needed but good money ($15.00 / hour) for an inexperienced worker and the man told him he makes much more an hour then what was being offered and he just had to stand there.

The dishonest ones ruin it for the people that truly do need the help.

Bullbear
06-08-2015, 09:08 AM
I wouldn't dare pretend to know peoples circumstances and judge them or make assumptions that they could work if they wanted and there is a place for them. we all know there are cons out there but I don't think they are all bad people who are lazy and just taking generosity for a ride. Mental health I believe is one of the biggest factors leading someone to stand on a corner for money.

hoya
06-08-2015, 02:06 PM
I know of an individual who was, and is, homeless. He's sober now and looking for a job. He lost everything so has no ID, no social security card and no birth certificate. What is the best way for him to proceed?

City Rescue Mission
800 W California Ave
405-232-2709

There is a lot of help available for people who are homeless. It is not necessary to give them hand-outs. I'm sure that there have been people who just needed ten bucks for gas, or were broken down, and they panhandled once and then were on their way. But the vast majority of them have ready access to all sorts of help.

Yes, most of them suffer from drug addiction and mental illness. For many they aren't ever going to be able to hold a job. But you aren't helping them by giving them cash.

SoonerDave
06-08-2015, 02:40 PM
The I-240 interchange is one of the city's worst spots for them, and it wasn't too long ago that I think perhaps the Oklahoman or someone in the media did some investigative work and found that a surprising number of them work in teams and actually schedule which specific intersections they're going to work, how often they hit the area, the whole thing. Not saying everyone does that, but some of it is a lot more orchestrated than you'd think. And some friends of mine experienced precisely the same thing re offering someone a job and transportation - they made more pandhandling, and it was all cash. And that was a long time ago.

I'm fuzzy on the details, but I think this same issue rolls over to some of the benevolence programs/ministries some churches try to offer in support of the needy in that area. Some would offer limited support for things like a tank of gas, or some groceries (back when there was a grocer in the area), something of that nature, but then noticed the same people were coming repeatedly, working the system, and just taking advantage. Very frustrating for the folks *trying* to help, and as someone else noted, just making it harder on the folks who need the help.

Wish there were a brilliant solution.

Midtowner
06-11-2015, 05:41 AM
While some are scammers, some are also not. It is extremely difficult to break out of homelessness even if you do have a job. There are many working homeless out there. Unless you know their situation, it's not right to judge. Panhandlers though are a blight on the city. Right next to the homeless shelters, you'll find a Workforce Oklahoma office whose principle mission is to line up the jobless with jobs and skills. There are paths out of homelessness, but let's not pretend it's an easy path.

Just the facts
06-11-2015, 10:16 AM
I don't give money to anyone. I did buy dinner for a guy in Bricktown last week though. He approached me and asked, "I don't want any money but could you buy me something to eat?"

EX_aC_KxYLs

mugofbeer
06-11-2015, 11:27 AM
While some are scammers, some are also not. It is extremely difficult to break out of homelessness even if you do have a job. There are many working homeless out there. Unless you know their situation, it's not right to judge. Panhandlers though are a blight on the city. Right next to the homeless shelters, you'll find a Workforce Oklahoma office whose principle mission is to line up the jobless with jobs and skills. There are paths out of homelessness, but let's not pretend it's an easy path.

I totally agree with this. Its a complicated issue made more difficult when the courts ruled the mentally ill and addicted can choose to live on the streets rather than be forced into treatment that could take them out of the homeless life. To give them money on a street corner is essentially giving an alcoholic a bottle of Hot Damn 100. It may seem compassionate, but it is damaging the person you seek to help.

turnpup
06-11-2015, 12:25 PM
This is tongue in cheek but I've thought it would be interesting to go head to head up against a panhandler by having my kid with me in her school uniform holding a sign that says "private school tuition".

BBatesokc
06-11-2015, 01:33 PM
While some are scammers, some are also not. It is extremely difficult to break out of homelessness even if you do have a job. There are many working homeless out there. Unless you know their situation, it's not right to judge. Panhandlers though are a blight on the city. Right next to the homeless shelters, you'll find a Workforce Oklahoma office whose principle mission is to line up the jobless with jobs and skills. There are paths out of homelessness, but let's not pretend it's an easy path.

I'm yes and no on this statement. For some, homelessness is very difficult to overcome and becomes a lifelong struggle. That said, every report on homelessness I've read actually makes it very clear that one of the problems with calculating the number of homeless in any given city is due to the fact homelessness is most often a temporary situation. This is a positive thing, because, in my experience the majority of homeless work to get out of being homeless and eventually succeed. The homeless we see panhandling and homeless we often see loitering about actually represent a tiny portion of the homeless population, but, because we see them most often, they've become the stereotype.

Midtowner
06-11-2015, 10:07 PM
Often, the "homeless" we see panhandling are not homeless at all. There are labor opportunities for the homeless, but those jobs don't always translate into being able to afford a home. I have zero respect for panhandlers. But disparaging the homeless in general is painting with an awful broad brush.

Tritone
06-11-2015, 10:32 PM
Several years back I ws approached by a thirty-something man on a bicycle who wanted money for lunch. There were a few places to eat nearby so I asked him his name and where he wanted to eat. He named a place and I told him I'd meet him there in a few minutes. He rode off and I drove there. When I walked in I called him by name, shook his hand, and said it was my turn to buy. We had burgers and some good conversation.

Some times that maneuver works. Other times I've been spat at and cussed out. You never know.

White Peacock
06-12-2015, 12:41 PM
I've noticed a new trend in panhandling. I've been hit up twice here recently inside a store shopping. Once at lowes and another time at target. The come on both times was a car broken down sob story. Yet another point in Amazon's favor.

"Hey man, my sister's real sick and I gotta get to Tulsa tonight and I'm just about four bucks short of gettin' enough gas to get up there."

Heard that same f*cking story so many times.

Just the facts
06-12-2015, 12:48 PM
"Hey man, my sister's real sick and I gotta get to Tulsa tonight and I'm just about four bucks short of gettin' enough gas to get up there."

Heard that same f*cking story so many times.

You should have asked how he is going to get back.

Anonymous.
06-12-2015, 01:14 PM
Got "need to pay my cellphone bill" story last night @ PennSquare.. Honestly have never heard that one, what a terrible lie. I mean at least try.

FighttheGoodFight
06-12-2015, 01:17 PM
When I was in St. Louis a while back I saw an interesting sign. It said that people could not panhandle at night, or within a certain distance from an ATM. There are ATMs on every corner so I assumed it was a clever way to stop panhandling. The whole time in the district we were in we weren't asked for money once. We saw homeless by the library and they didn't even bother asking.

Martin
06-12-2015, 01:18 PM
http://thisainthell.us/blog/wp-content/uploads/2014/04/Ninjas.jpg

kevinpate
06-12-2015, 01:20 PM
I dunno. I know some younger folk where losing cell service would resonate far better than ill relatives or baby needs diapers or soooooo hungry.

Urbanized
06-12-2015, 01:23 PM
Got "need to pay my cellphone bill" story last night @ PennSquare.. Honestly have never heard that one, what a terrible lie. I mean at least try.

Hey, I need a trip to Acapulco. Can anyone spare a few bucks?

Bellaboo
06-12-2015, 02:09 PM
This reminds me of the fat guy with the megaphone at the Thunder games. He started a go fund me account so he can afford to buy his expensive season tickets behind the goal. Nooooo.

Just the facts
06-12-2015, 02:09 PM
Kind of on topic.

oG3sZp7W414

turnpup
06-12-2015, 02:29 PM
This reminds me of the fat guy with the megaphone at the Thunder games. He started a go fund me account so he can afford to buy his expensive season tickets behind the goal. Nooooo.

So he's not being paid to do that? The way he walks around so authoritatively, I figured he had some sort of arrangement with management.

Bellaboo
06-12-2015, 02:34 PM
So he's not being paid to do that? The way he walks around so authoritatively, I figured he had some sort of arrangement with management.

His excuse was he had taken a lesser paying job and needed help buying his ticket. He's just after attention as far as I'm concerned.

rezman
06-14-2015, 05:41 PM
Something that I saw today that was somewhat ironic, if not humerous, was a group of Dairy Queen employees occupying the panhandlers corner on Penn & Quail Springs avertising "Now Hiring" at the new location just north of there.

RadicalModerate
06-20-2015, 02:47 PM
I called the police after an encounter with an aggressive panhandler on my way to work today. It made me feel real good. I hope the prick resisted arrest.