Pete, did this development come after the plans for hotel was announced, or did the 21c people get wind of this and thats why they chose that location?

I don't think it's true Steve said anything about Bricktown.

I think that was discussed here.

I'm sure you are correct. Honestly I never read Steve or his chat comments, only things that I see are here.
Okctalk is my only source for news and info for all things Okc.

The only one I know that is being built in the US is the Meadowlands Xanadu development in NJ, which is hideous if you want to look at it online. It was a victim of the 2008 bust and I don't believe they've started construction back but are trying. .

Yep. Total planning/construction disaster, and hideous to boot. Everyone back home makes fun of it and no one I know is remotely excited.

Pete, did this development come after the plans for hotel was announced, or did the 21c people get wind of this and thats why they chose that location?
Excellent question.
The 21c development has always puzzled me with the location, but it would make more sense if these two developments were working together.

Maybe since it will be next to the museum hotel it might a museum itself. Maybe a childrens one, possibly with an aquarium attached.

Excellent question.
The 21c development has always puzzled me with the location, but it would make more sense if these two developments were working together.

If the plan is ambitious enough we could be looking at fully bridging the gap between the CBD and Film Row within just a few years. That would be spectacular.

I would love if this included a redevelopment of the jail and proposing a new jail outside of the city limits. It would also make the development of the cool, older buildings that are currently bail bonds doable.

I'm going to post more on this later today.

It has to do with the property around 21c Museum Hotel owned by the Hall family.

Basically, they have very ambitious plans and the investment will be more than the $52 million budgeted for 21c.

http://abload.de/img/50centlol5aq1q.gif

This thread is really starting to piss me off. 9526

I probably won't post details until tomorrow.

I know the full scoop but have to be careful about what I share due to my sources.

I probably won't post details until tomorrow.

I know the full scoop but have to be careful about what I share due to my sources.

OK, but it had better be good.:p

*cough*


;)

Here's the post:

Hall Capital - OKCTalk (http://www.okctalk.com/showwiki.php?title=Hall%20Capital)

This thread is really starting to make me jealous of those that know what's going on. 9526

http://i.imgur.com/gTZ5i.gif

Want to point out once again that I'm not sure this is what Steve has been hinting at with his now infamous 'jealous' comments, but I suspect it might be.

I don't see how downtown living units would make those cities jealous...

I don't know how jealous it will make them, but it looks like it has the potential to be really cool.

I don't see how downtown living units would make those cities jealous...

Kind of my initial thoughts too. Although, it would be really cool to live near a hotel with a museum and also a live music venue.

Steve was likely largely being hyperbolic. It would be next to impossible for anything to be built in OKC that would genuinely make Dallas jealous. It's doable to make Kansas City jealous but that is still difficult. Nonetheless, this is HUGE for OKC! Just imagine those blocks, fully developed with vibrant street scenes.

Steve was likely largely being hyperbolic.

I've heard this from others and I think even Steve has backed off of his original comment. I get the feeling he regrets having used those words. But what ever happened to a newspaper man saying what he means and meaning what he says? If there's some mega development going on that you can't reveal but you say it will make Dallas and KC jealous, then we have nothing else to go on but the words you used. How are we to know it was hyperbole? If Steve's going to speak in hypberbole and we can't take him at his word, he might as well go to work for the Sports Animal.

https://pbs.twimg.com/profile_images/2509555956/CornBall_Lge.jpg

Isn't there still something "ambitious" planned for the Chevy Center parking lot? I think this will be an awesome development, but I'm not sure it is what Steve has hinted about.

nonetheless, this is huge for okc! Just imagine those blocks, fully developed with vibrant street scenes, of homeless people wondering about, underneath the shadows of the towering Oklahoma County jail.

I'm glad we see eye to eye on this one.

This is great news it will be great to see this develope.

As for the "make dallas and KC jealous". Can we let that die already. It's become annoying.

I don't really care what Dallas and Kansas City think about OKC, but if there is an ambitious development in the works for downtown, I am definitely interested.

I don't really care what Dallas and Kansas City think about OKC, but if there is an ambitious development in the works for downtown, I am definitely interested.

Bingo.

I'm glad we see eye to eye on this one.

Luckily you never have to set foot in this development.

Well now that I have been properly let down I can move on in life.

As for the "make dallas and KC jealous". Can we let that die already. It's become annoying.

Look at tht title of this thread. You may be posting in the wrong place.

Look at tht title of this thread. You may be posting in the wrong place.

No I know where I am. But thanks.

No I know where I am. But thanks.

Well then, I don't understand your earlier post. I wouldn't go into the Connecting downtown to Health Sciences Center thread and tell people to stop talking about connecting downtown to the HSC because it's annoying.

The thread title kinda tells ya what you're going to get.

I think you know what I'm saying. But clearly you just want to be confrontational. The term has been overused to the point that it required a thread. And every thing announced has to be referenced regarding it. Then everyone has to comment how that isn't worthy of being jealous blah blah. But please go ahead and "put me in my place " again it must make you feel powerful. :congrats::congrats:

Luckily you never have to set foot in this development.

I appreciate the vote of confidence. I'm not sure why I wouldn't want to step foot into the development. It looks like a killer plan, and the Fred Jones building has always been one of my favorite buildings downtown. So, it would definately be someplace I would want to go.

I absolutely love this possible development but agree that it's unlikely what has been referenced previously. Now here is something that would make Dallas and KC jealous (not Orlando though). :wink:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1gK5MWQ__Ns&feature=player_embedded

I think you know what I'm saying. But clearly you just want to be confrontational. The term has been overused to the point that it required a thread. And every thing announced has to be referenced regarding it. Then everyone has to comment how that isn't worthy of being jealous blah blah. But please go ahead and "put me in my place " again it must make you feel powerful. :congrats::congrats:

You're such a bull bear, Bullbear!

Steve was likely largely being hyperbolic. It would be next to impossible for anything to be built in OKC that would genuinely make Dallas jealous. It's doable to make Kansas City jealous but that is still difficult. Nonetheless, this is HUGE for OKC! Just imagine those blocks, fully developed with vibrant street scenes.

1. I was not engaging in hyperbole. If the development I'm tracking takes place, I stand by what I said - and will make the case for why I said it. The Halls are not involved in what I was referring to.

Steve, thanks for posting this. If nothing more, it underscores just how many great projects are taking place in the City and there are more to come!

1. I was not engaging in hyperbole. If the development I'm tracking takes place, I stand by what I said - and will make the case for why I said it. The Halls are not involved in what I was referring to.

Steve, is the development you're talking about the impending relocation of the Waffle House Headquarters to OKC?

1. I was not engaging in hyperbole. If the development I'm tracking takes place, I stand by what I said - and will make the case for why I said it. The Halls are not involved in what I was referring to.

Oh, my. Let the forum speculation continue!

1. I was not engaging in hyperbole. If the development I'm tracking takes place, I stand by what I said - and will make the case for why I said it. The Halls are not involved in what I was referring to.

This is good news, as much as I like the Hall project, I don't feel like it is a game changer other than for the West side of the CBD. I want to see something that will make an impression like the Clayco development possibilities.

I think you know what I'm saying. But clearly you just want to be confrontational. The term has been overused to the point that it required a thread. And every thing announced has to be referenced regarding it. Then everyone has to comment how that isn't worthy of being jealous blah blah. But please go ahead and "put me in my place " again it must make you feel powerful. :congrats::congrats:
No, it doesn't make me feel powerful. Not sure why it would. It's just that for the life of me I can't understand why someone would take the time to click on a thread titled "Development that will make Dallas and KC Jealous?" and then complain to everyone about how this make Dallas and KC jealous speculation is stupid and annoying and that they should stop talking about it.

There's an easy solution to your problem. Don't click on this thread. Because there's several people in this thread who like discussing it so it's not going to be closed anytime soon.

That poster on skyscraperpage.com must be pooping in his pants these days.... I think his name is Cashville.

No, it doesn't make me feel powerful. Not sure why it would. It's just that for the life of me I can't understand why someone would take the time to click on a thread titled "Development that will make Dallas and KC Jealous?" and then complain to everyone about how this make Dallas and KC jealous speculation is stupid and annoying and that they should stop talking about it.

There's an easy solution to your problem. Don't click on this thread. Because there's several people in this thread who like discussing it so it's not going to be closed anytime soon.

:pat_head:

:pat_head:

Dribbling a basketball with a smiley face?

Signing KD to a long term contract would make Dallas jealous. Well at least their bigmouth owner that tried to keep the Thunder out of OKC.

But seriously,I am sure that there could be many things that could make Dallas jealous. Some of you posters on here make Dallas sound like the land of Milk & Honey and it's simply not. I remember going to Dallas back in the 70s when it wasn't much more than what OKC is now.

I'm still hoping for a generous benefactor to fund an Oklahoma Land Rush Tower that is 1889 feet tall with the observation deck and restaurant at around 1250ft. Would be a few feet taller than the CN tower in Toronto.

gross

I've seen the development that will - or at least should - make Dallas and KC jealous...on a ULI trip to San Antonio.

Pearl Brewery : San Antonio, Texas (http://www.atpearl.com)

I've seen the development that will - or at least should - make Dallas and KC jealous...on a ULI trip to San Antonio.

Pearl Brewery : San Antonio, Texas (http://www.atpearl.com)

How does it relate to the link you posted?

How does it relate to the link you posted?
Did you bother to CLICK on the link? Or are you just going by the page title as rendered in my post by the BBS software?

Did you bother to CLICK on the link? Or are you just going by the page title as rendered in my post by the BBS software?

Yes I did, and I wasn't questioning your knowledge. I was asking for more details. Are we getting a development similar to the Pearl in SA or how does that relate to us. Sorry for the misunderstanding.

No sweat, sorry that my reply was a little bit snippy. Basically, at 22 carefully-planned acres, it is the most comprehensive adaptive reuse of a historic industrial property, combined with quality urban infill and locally-focused retail/dining/entertainment that I am aware of in the U.S.. I could be wrong about that, but certainly not aware of anything that compares. It makes the much-admired (though I'm not especially a fan) Power and Light District in KC look amateurish.

I'd encourage you to click around, to visit individual websites of some of the housing, restaurants and such, and even to plan a visit (though I would wait until the hotel opens next Spring). It's incredibly impressive already, yet far from finished (which explains why many are unaware of it).

It helps to have a billionaire (the founder of Pace Picante) fully invested in the patient-money, long-play, urbanist approach seen there. It's incredible.

I've seen the development that will - or at least should - make Dallas and KC jealous...on a ULI trip to San Antonio.

Pearl Brewery : San Antonio, Texas (http://www.atpearl.com)

Maybe something the Farmers Market can look to?

Perhaps. The scale of the intact history far exceeds FM. I was constantly reminded of the Belle Isle Power Plant and what a missed opportunity that was.

It's also interesting how they played to a local strength - Latin-inspired food - and lured only the third Culinary Institute of America (the others being in NYC and San Francisco) and now pluck CIA-trained chefs to open new concepts. ALL food is local. No chains. The same with the retail.

Belle Isle lake and power plant represents the biggest lost opportunity in modern OKC, IMO.

It was unique and cool and we traded it for a largely drained lake and an ugly Walmart shopping center.

Wasn't the disappointing redev of Belle Isle due to the economic collapse? They started the process and then when the economy tanked, they were forced to salvage what they could of their investment by opening a mid-range shopping center instead of a high-end destination.

^

Yes, that is largely true. But, of course, they could have merely waited to demolish the plant and develop the property until the economy recovered.

Think about how prime that property would be now.

True. However, I don't know if the developers felt they had too much already invested to wait out the downturn. Also no one knew when the economy would rebound. There was talk of a full blown depression in 2008 and early 2009. It looked like a complete meltdown for a while.

If I remember correctly, wasn't that Belle Isle Wal-Mart built around 2000? I know it was under construction right after I started college at OCU.

Wasn't the disappointing redev of Belle Isle due to the economic collapse? They started the process and then when the economy tanked, they were forced to salvage what they could of their investment by opening a mid-range shopping center instead of a high-end destination.

I think you are thinking of Tuscana. It was supposed to be a high-end mixed use lifestyle center. The economy tanked and it was downgraded to an apartment complex.

The Belle Isle power plant was redeveloped at the tail-end of the '90s boom. It too was supposed to be far more impressive than was actually built, but I blame OKC standards at the time moreso than the economy. It was developed around the same time Hogan won the bid for Lower Bricktown if that says anything. Belle Isle and Lower Bricktown are probably the two biggest lost opportunities in OKC development during the post-Pei era.