View Full Version : Looting in New Orleans



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Keith
08-31-2005, 05:27 AM
This is one of the most despicable(sp) acts that I can think of, especially after a city has gone through so much devastation. Looters have become a problem in New Orleans, and unfortunately, the police have been busy trying to rescue people, and haven't had much of a chance to catch looters.

If the National Guard is there, they need to really start patrolling the streets, and have no mercy on the looters. The news reported that even the people that were taking shelter in the Louisiana dome are leaving, and have started looting stores nearby. I feel these looters need to be prosecuted to the full extent of the law.

PUGalicious
08-31-2005, 06:22 AM
Some of the looters are people just trying to find food while waiting for help.

And the National Guard? Many of them are serving in Iraq.

Dungeon Master
08-31-2005, 06:40 AM
Shoot the looters. Everyone was told to leave. If they didn't leave they must either obey or pay.
Set the example now.

ibda12u
08-31-2005, 06:47 AM
I saw on the news last night, that some of the looters were cops. They had a camera crew in the store filming everyone looting, and not even one person seemed nervous, some of them even gave interviews. I was especially shocked at how calm the cops where as they looked at the camera then continued to fill up their shopping carts with stuff.

One of the people they interviewed said they were told it was okay to get what they needed from the stores, maybe most of them heard that, and they think they got some official okay to loot.

PUGalicious
08-31-2005, 06:54 AM
Shoot the looters. Everyone was told to leave. If they didn't leave they must either obey or pay.
Set the example now.
Not everyone had the means to leave. More than a quarter of New Orleans residents are poor or extremely poor. Some did not have transportation to relocate and some could not afford to go anywhere.

If we want to apply the shooting standard to looters (a standard, by the way, that violates each citizen's constitutional rights to due process), let us apply that equally across the board to those who profit off disaster in one way or another. We can start with the oil companies, then go down the line to all businesses who raise their prices because they can (because of demand).

I do not condone looting, but nor do I presume to judge the actions of those in a disastrous situation of which I'm completely removed.

Dungeon Master
08-31-2005, 07:20 AM
OK, so in times of need, rape is OK too?
Shoot the rapist too.

Dungeon Master
08-31-2005, 07:22 AM
I'm sorry but "Due Process" is what has messed this place up to begin with.
If you obey the law, you have rights.
If you break the law, your rights are revolked and you will pay.
I sure wish that's the way it REALLY was.

PUGalicious
08-31-2005, 07:27 AM
Fortunately for the rest of us, the Founding Fathers didn't agree.

Didaskalos
08-31-2005, 08:36 AM
OK, so in times of need, rape is OK too?
Shoot the rapist too.

A time of need for rape? There is an honest comparison made between looting (some who might be doing for need) and rape? Granted, there are those looting for gain but who is the appropriate judge to determine when theft is due immediate death? This is the law now? Part of the law is due process, the very thing you seem to be questioning. So, I am confused, you are supporting our current law or requesting that it be immediately changed to protect property over life?

The premise was that all were required to leave so anyone still there must automatically be a lawbreaker and now has no due process under the law? What about those who are poor enough to not have transportation or any money to use alternate transportation. Their ulitmate crime then must be being poor.

Anyone trying to selfishly gain from this disaster is committing a crime but do we honestly think the greatest gainers in this tragedy will be those that looted some food, clothes or even electronics? Will there be mandatory shootings for those price gougers as well?

MadMonk
08-31-2005, 09:08 AM
I can't fault those who are looting for food and fresh water. If you have a family to take care of you gotta do what you can, but those looting for TVs, jewerly, etc. are just dispicable. Equally dispicable are those who stoop to making political hay from a tragedy such as this, even as people are still trying to recover. :mad:
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2005/8/30/20833/9811
http://austinbay.net/blog/?p=515

Dungeon Master
08-31-2005, 09:12 AM
First, I really feel for the folks effected by the huricane and hate to see anyone suffer from a natural disaster like this.
Being in the military, we're now gearing up missions to support the victims.
Now
There is one thing in common with both. IT'S A CRIME.
And no, it's not law to shoot criminals, in the U.S. anyway.
Granite, this is a huge disaster and will be hard to recover.
But does that dismiss the law?
OK, I'm hungry. Do I have the right to break into someones home or business so I can get some food?
By us saying it's OK to steal food if your hungry is setting the stage for an even bigger problem.
OK, don't shoot em. Just sit back and let it happen.
From what I am seeing, things are quickly getting out of control.
If I lived in Houston, I would be preparing for looters being bussed there. It's not solving the problem, it's just moving it to another location. These people are already seriously upset, now your going to bus them out of their own state to a completely different state? What in the world are they going to do there? I have an idea.
OK, shooting might sound harsh to some, but as time passes we will wish we did something.
Maybe shoot them in the big toe.

PUGalicious
08-31-2005, 09:47 AM
Equally dispicable are those who stoop to making political hay from a tragedy such as this, even as people are still trying to recover.
And equally dispicable are national politicians who "continue on with their life" with their political speechs and stumping for a political agenda while hundreds of thousands of their constituents suffer from the ravashing effects of one of the worse national natural disasters in recent memory.

MadMonk
08-31-2005, 11:34 AM
And equally dispicable are national politicians who "continue on with their life" with their political speechs and stumping for a political agenda while hundreds of thousands of their constituents suffer from the ravashing effects of one of the worse national natural disasters in recent memory.
I agree. Ted Kennedy has reached a new low. :LolLolLol



And the National Guard? Many of them are serving in Iraq.
I guess the nearly 70% that are there and not in Iraq isn't helping any huh? :rolleyes:

mranderson
08-31-2005, 12:17 PM
This is one of the most despicable(sp) acts that I can think of, especially after a city has gone through so much devastation. Looters have become a problem in New Orleans, and unfortunately, the police have been busy trying to rescue people, and haven't had much of a chance to catch looters.

If the National Guard is there, they need to really start patrolling the streets, and have no mercy on the looters. The news reported that even the people that were taking shelter in the Louisiana dome are leaving, and have started looting stores nearby. I feel these looters need to be prosecuted to the full extent of the law.

Shoot to kill and ask questions later. Here is the way it would go.

Person loots. A cop see's it. Rapid fire from an automatic rife breaks out. The looter hits the ground.

Cop: FREEZE!

Man lays in a pool of blood. Cop walks up to him and kicks him to see if he is alive.

Cop: You are under arrest. You have the right to remain silent... Oops. Too bad."

Karried
08-31-2005, 12:19 PM
I know when I see a group of what looks like young guys walking around with piles of stereos and tvs, it doesn't evoke a lot of sympathy. Of course, I know this is isolated and the people are very oppressed and possibly desperate ( if they were taking food, it wouldn't bother me as much as the piles of jeans and merchandise that they can't use right now), but I still don't think it is the right thing to do, it is a horrible representation of the city.

Citizens should be proud of the way they respond in emergencies, not ashamed. I know during the bombing, OKC was a stellar example of community and working together, giving and volunteering.

Of course, I also know there are thousands of misplaced people who are not contributing to the illegal activities and they are in desperate need.

The real tragedy in my mind is that people who would normally be very generous in their contributions, to assist those in need, may not feel like sending money now because if the media looting pics are any indication, some might feel they would just be aiding criminals and thugs.

I just hope people can differentiate between those who are in desperate need and continue to send money and necessities. I know I still will.

Karried
08-31-2005, 12:23 PM
Mr A,

What if it were a father or mother trying to get medicine or food for a sick/dying child?

Shoot, and then ask? 'oops too bad'???

OMG

I thought as a society we had come so far ... ~ sigh ~

PUGalicious
08-31-2005, 12:27 PM
I agree. Ted Kennedy has reached a new low. :LolLolLol
A clever argument doesn't make it an effective argument.

I don't believe Ted Kennedy's constituency includes Louisiana and the other Gulf states. However, our commander-in-chief's constituency does, but that didn't slow his political stump schedule much in the last few days.



I guess the nearly 70% that are there and not in Iraq isn't helping any huh? :rolleyes:

"The Pentagon has sent about 40 percent of Mississippi's National Guard force to Iraq and 35 percent of Louisiana's -- a combined total of about 6,000 troops... Unlike soldiers in the part-time Army Reserve, made up of federal troops, those in the National Guard serve under the control of state governors usually for roles like disaster relief in their home states. They can be summoned to active-duty Army service in times of national need. Some state governors have worried that the Pentagon's deployment of so many Guard troops has eroded their states' abilities to respond to disasters like wildfires and hurricanes." (Source: Reuters (2555%20E.%20Cambelback%20Rd,%20Suite%20760%20%20% 20%20Phoenix,%20AZ%20%2085016))

Seems to me that 6000 is a significant number that could be helping in the relief effort.

Dungeon Master
08-31-2005, 12:27 PM
Shoot to kill and ask questions later. Here is the way it would go.

Person loots. A cop see's it. Rapid fire from an automatic rife breaks out. The looter hits the ground.

Cop: FREEZE!

Man lays in a pool of blood. Cop walks up to him and kicks him to see if he is alive.

Cop: You are under arrest. You have the right to remain silent... Oops. Too bad."

That's what the brits did.

PUGalicious
08-31-2005, 12:29 PM
That's what the brits did.
And they turned out to be tragically wrong.

PUGalicious
08-31-2005, 12:29 PM
I thought as a society we had come so far ... ~ sigh ~
I think we have evidence now that it has not.

Didaskalos
08-31-2005, 12:33 PM
There is one thing in common with both. IT'S A CRIME.
That is nearly all they have in common. So is speeding and jay walking. I think I understand now, start shooting every criminal (anyone who has ever committed any crime) and we will have less crime (of course practically no one would be alive). It would reduce the problem of crime.

There is a notion that the punishment should fit the crime. Not sure that any form of shooting is appropriate for theft but I am just a softy that way.


And no, it's not law to shoot criminals, in the U.S. anyway.
Granite, this is a huge disaster and will be hard to recover.
But does that dismiss the law?
No, and the law is exactly the point. The same law they are breaking grants them due process and innocence until their guilt is proven in a court of law. If criminals are caught, they should be prosecuted. Charge anyone stealing and then anyone charged can stand in front of a judge or jury and defend their 'just' reasons for stealing. Anything short of that would hardly be upholding "the law".


OK, I'm hungry. Do I have the right to break into someones home or business so I can get some food? No but it would seem more reasonsable to me than shooting people without due process.


By us saying it's OK to steal food if your hungry is setting the stage for an even bigger problem. There is a difference between condoning an act and understanding the reasons behind it.

OK, don't shoot em. Just sit back and let it happen. These are the only two options? I would think they could try and stop the looting and not resort to capital punishment.

OK, shooting might sound harsh to some, but as time passes we will wish we did something.
Maybe shoot them in the big toe.
Shooting sound harsh to me (no matter where they are shot). It is an expedient solution but might not hold up to the tenets of our law system.

Karried
08-31-2005, 12:42 PM
Not to mention New Orleans and Mississippi are in a State of Emergency and the biggest natural disaster ever to occur in the US is unfolding, so possibly shooting someone for looting is a tad uncalled for given the dire circumstances they are faced with.

Dungeon Master
08-31-2005, 12:46 PM
Very well broken down Didaskalos,

Can't respond much on that one.

All this time I forgot to mention what to shoot them with. It's all my fault.
I left out the weapon of choice.

"THE RUBBER BAND GUN"

Sorry, my fault.

mranderson
08-31-2005, 12:50 PM
That's what the brits did.

Maybe if we smoke a few looters, the others will get the message and think first. THAT is our point.

Dungeon Master
08-31-2005, 12:55 PM
Maybe if we smoke a few looters, the others will get the message and think first. THAT is our point.

I'm with ya. I have a full box of rubber bands I've been holding for the perfect opportunity.

The mission code name. "Looters - Up in Smoke"

Didaskalos
08-31-2005, 03:05 PM
Maybe if we smoke a few looters, the others will get the message and think first. THAT is our point.
And anyone that gets "smoked" unfairly (since the one doing the "smoking" can choose to be just or not) are just collarteral damage in this vast "war on looting".

As I said before, if crime is crime and crime needs to be reduced, no more speeding tickets - cops should just shoot em'. (No chance to give a reason or excuse, if you are accused, you are guilty). This would definitely reduce the number of speeders. Maybe then, speeders will get the point and the world will finally be safe from speeders.

Dungeon Master
08-31-2005, 03:09 PM
I'm going to get my windows bullet proof so I don't have to worry about it when I'm speeding.

Now, back to looters. Shootem

Didaskalos
08-31-2005, 03:11 PM
All this time I forgot to mention what to shoot them with. It's all my fault.
I left out the weapon of choice.

"THE RUBBER BAND GUN"

Sorry, my fault.
Understand now. It's all about the clarifying. Looters beware, a rubberband might be in your future. :LolLolLol

Dungeon Master
08-31-2005, 03:22 PM
Understand now. It's all about the clarifying. Looters beware, a rubberband might be in your future. :LolLolLol

Don't forget, I use heavy duty paperclips with my rubber bands. Those things sting really bad too.:fighting3

mranderson
08-31-2005, 03:35 PM
I hate to say this because I am part of it, but we have taken a sad situation and had fun with it.

Being serious, I feel bad about that. It is a true shame that people have to profit from the misery those people feel.

I say arrest them all, prosecute and if convicted, give them the max. Enough said... Seriously.

Didaskalos
08-31-2005, 03:39 PM
Don't forget, I use heavy duty paperclips with my rubber bands. Those things sting really bad too. That would be enough to deter me but then again, I have never been much for looting.

Didaskalos
08-31-2005, 03:43 PM
Being serious, I feel bad about that. It is a true shame that people have to profit from the misery those people feel.
It is a shame and although I am not big on Karma, I sincerely hope that anyone who tries to take advantage or proft from this kind of disaster gets what they deserve in the end.


I say arrest them all, prosecute and if convicted, give them the max. Enough said... Seriously.
Couldn't agree more

Dungeon Master
08-31-2005, 03:47 PM
mranderson. your absolutely right. But it is frustrating to hear others (looters) making the problem worse by the crimes the commit.

Karried
08-31-2005, 05:18 PM
I agree 100% Mr A. - the ones who are taking things and trying to profit - they are criminals and should be prosecuted. It is a terrible shame - looting is a horrible thing - this whole tragedy is horrible. "But for the grace of God" ...

I feel so fortunate that we are all okay and going about our lives, safe and sound -

I'm wondering, where is all the help for these people ??

Keith
08-31-2005, 08:11 PM
I agree 100% Mr A. - the ones who are taking things and trying to profit - they are criminals and should be prosecuted. It is a terrible shame - looting is a horrible thing - this whole tragedy is horrible. "But for the grace of God" ...

I feel so fortunate that we are all okay and going about our lives, safe and sound -

I'm wondering, where is all the help for these people ??
Folks, we have it made here in Oklahoma. I was watching CBS world news this evening, and they were interviewing many of the people who were stranded on bridges. People were lined up on highways and bridges, trying to find help, shelter, food, water, and anything else that would help them survive. They could not get over to the dome for assistance unless they swam to it. Many people were stranded with absolutely nothing, and many of the very ill are stranded.

One lady told a reporter that she held her husband last night as he was dying. The police came by and she asked for their help and they just went on. This morning, her husband died. When th epolice came back by, she asked what they could do to help her with the body. They told her to push the body about 5 feet away from her so that she wouldn't smell it, and then they left.

Another lady told a reporter that one man was so distraught at losing everything and getting very sick, that he actually committed suicide by jumping off a bridge onto the concrete below. Somebody came by and laid a mattress over the body, however, people were walking back and forth over the dead body as if it wasn't even there.

There have been numerous reports of dead bodies floating in the water, however, the rescuers are focusing on getting to the survivors right now.

As far as the looters are concerned.....although, I do not condone looting, and feel that looters should be punished to the full extent of the law, if I had a family that was suffering, and they needed food or water, and it was "available," I could see myself getting some...just to stay alive. As far as the ones that ar stealing TV's, electronics, and other things they can pawn off, they are complete SCUM.

Dungeon Master
08-31-2005, 08:40 PM
That would be enough to deter me but then again, I have never been much for looting.

That's a good thing. They really do hurt.

Curt
08-31-2005, 08:49 PM
Shoot the looters. Everyone was told to leave. If they didn't leave they must either obey or pay.
Set the example now.

Under certain circumstances I can agree, but if it truly a matter of survival I dont agree. It's a hard line to define here. If you need food and water you need food and water, but you dont need a t.v set right now.

Dungeon Master
09-01-2005, 05:31 AM
Well now they are calling off rescue and recovery to tend to the looters. And the looters are shooting at police. If my loved one was missing and they had to stop the search to tend to looters........
I'll say it again. Shoot the looters.


NEW ORLEANS -- With thousands feared dead and the city's remaining residents told to evacuate for weeks, conditions deteriorated further in submerged New Orleans as looting spiraled out of control.

Mayor Ray Nagin ordered virtually the entire police force to abandon search-and-rescue efforts and stop thieves who were becoming increasingly hostile.

"They are starting to get closer to heavily populated areas _ hotels, hospitals, and we're going to stop it right now," Nagin said Wednesday.

Tempers also were starting to flare. Police said a man in Hattiesburg, Miss., fatally shot his sister in the head over a bag of ice. Dozens of carjackings were reported, including a nursing home bus and a truck carrying medical supplies for a hospital. Some police officers said they had been shot at.

PUGalicious
09-01-2005, 05:45 AM
What does it say about our priorities as a society when property takes precedence over people's lives?

Things can be replaced. A person's life cannot.

MadMonk
09-01-2005, 07:45 AM
I hope that someone somewhere is documenting all the looters taking items unnecessary for survival. Then, when New Orleans gets back on its feet, have it rebroadcast on TV and the Internet to track them down and prosecute them. :wink:

mranderson
09-01-2005, 08:04 AM
I hope that someone somewhere is documenting all the looters taking items unnecessary for survival. Then, when New Orleans gets back on its feet, have it rebroadcast on TV and the Internet to track them down and prosecute them. :wink:

Call it "Lootvision."

PUGalicious
09-01-2005, 08:23 AM
I wonder with all the flood damage how much of these electronics would be any good or sellable by the merchants being looted anyway.

mranderson
09-01-2005, 08:29 AM
I wonder with all the flood damage how much of these electronics would be any good or sellable by the merchants being looted anyway.

It would be poetic justice if they do not work. Maybe the one to whom the looter fences will have a certain type of party after being conned.

PUGalicious
09-01-2005, 09:54 AM
It would be poetic justice if they do not work. Maybe the one to whom the looter fences will have a certain type of party after being conned.
I agree, but I don't think the theft of flood-damaged goods rises to the level of deserving capital punishment without the benefit of our judicial process i.e. "shoot 'em all, let God sort them out."

Dungeon Master
09-01-2005, 10:38 AM
What does it say about our priorities as a society when property takes precedence over people's lives?

Things can be replaced. A person's life cannot.

That's exactly whats going on right now. LOOTERS ARE SHOOTING AT OTHER PEOPLE. Lives are being taken by looters. Police are being shot at. Military is being shot at. The priorities are the same, they're having to deal with the looters shooting at them so they can go back to rescue and recover and save lives.
SHOOT THE LOOTERS BEFORE THEY SHOOT YOU!!!

PUGalicious
09-01-2005, 01:59 PM
Shooters should be dealt with differently than the average looter. Shooters are endangering the lives of others so deadly force is justifiable. Theft does not, in and of itself, rise to that level. Not all the looters are shooters. Additionally, not all the "looters" are taking luxury items; many are indeed simply trying to find food.

Faith
09-01-2005, 02:56 PM
I agree many are just simply trying to find the necessity items that it will take in order to survive until aid can make it their way. I believe if I was in the situation I would want to have a gun as well for protection from the other citizens. The shooters are people that have obviously just snapped or our suffering a mental breakdown from all the chaos. They need to be dealt with immediatly by the police or military. They are endangering everyone's lives as well as causing conflicts with the aid being administered.

Didaskalos
09-01-2005, 03:59 PM
That's exactly whats going on right now. LOOTERS ARE SHOOTING AT OTHER PEOPLE. Lives are being taken by looters. Police are being shot at. Military is being shot at. The priorities are the same, they're having to deal with the looters shooting at them so they can go back to rescue and recover and save lives.
SHOOT THE LOOTERS BEFORE THEY SHOOT YOU!!!
And we are often referred to as a gun happy nation. Where would anyone get that idea? If anyone says that in the future, I say we shoot em.

Dungeon Master
09-01-2005, 04:14 PM
And we are often referred to as a gun happy nation. Where would anyone get that idea? If anyone says that in the future, I say we shoot em.

There you go. At least you might live longer.

At least we aren't RPG (rocket propelled gernade) happy, whew, that would really be a mess. But then again, it might be fun.

Didaskalos
09-01-2005, 04:18 PM
At least we aren't RPG (rocket propelled gernade) happy, whew, that would really be a mess. But then again, it might be fun.
I am sure sooner than later the NRA will make the case that they are needed for hunting rabbit or quail. I wouldn't give up hope. :elmer3:

Dungeon Master
09-01-2005, 04:26 PM
I am sure sooner than later the NRA will make the case that they are needed for hunting rabbit or quail. I wouldn't give up hope. :elmer3:

Well, those little rascals are growing bigger it seems with each generation. It's gotta be the new and improved fertilizer.

Curt
09-01-2005, 04:30 PM
I am sure sooner than later the NRA will make the case that they are needed for hunting rabbit or quail. I wouldn't give up hope. :elmer3:
Thank GOD for the NRA, I am a proud member and proud to be able to own my firearms, and happy I have the right to carry.

PUGalicious
09-01-2005, 05:32 PM
Thank GOD or thank GOP?

Based on the teachings of His Son, I'm not sure God wants to be thanked for the actions of the NRA to arm more people. I don't think His solution is for more people to have the power to make foolish decisions with deadly consequences.

And given some of the comments that have been made in the post, I'm glad that more people haven't chosen or been able to exercise that "right."

Dungeon Master
09-01-2005, 05:49 PM
Thank GOD or thank GOP?

Based on the teachings of His Son, I'm not sure God wants to be thanked for the actions of the NRA to arm more people. I don't think His solution is for more people to have the power to make foolish decisions with deadly consequences.

And given some of the comments that have been made in the post, I'm glad that more people haven't chosen or been able to exercise that "right."

Scribe, you gotta relax man. Venting on-line helps to keep the gun in the safe (sometimes).

sweetdaisy
09-01-2005, 05:53 PM
While I am not a big fan of guns in general, you can bet I wouldn't hesitate to shoot someone who was trying to shoot me.

I agree not all of the looters are shooters, and they need to be dealt with in another manner. But the ones who are shooting at medics and hospitals and people who are trying to help? You can bet I'd set them in my crosshairs. And I think I might use something a little more powerful than a rubberband gun.

sweetdaisy
09-01-2005, 05:54 PM
Scribe, you gotta relax man. Venting on-line helps to keep the gun in the safe (sometimes).

:LolLolLol

Dungeon Master
09-01-2005, 05:58 PM
New Orleans in Anarchy With Fights, Rapes (http://oklahomacity.cox.net/cci/newsnational/national?_mode=view&_state=maximized&view=article&id=D8CBP43G2)New Orleans descended into anarchy Thursday, as corpses lay abandoned in street medians, fights and fires broke out and storm survivors battled for seats on the buses that would carry them away from the chaos. The tired and hungry seethed, saying they had been forsaken. "This is a desperate SOS," mayor Ray Nagin said. (http://oklahomacity.cox.net/cci/newsnational/national?_mode=view&_state=maximized&view=article&id=D8CBP43G2)

So will I offend anybody if I say

"SHOOT THE RAPISTS"?

or is that not right too?

Curt
09-01-2005, 07:15 PM
So will I offend anybody if I say

"SHOOT THE RAPISTS"?

or is that not right too?
Wont offend me.

Shoot the looters that are shooting at the rescue workers.

Curt
09-01-2005, 07:18 PM
Scribe, you gotta relax man. Venting on-line helps to keep the gun in the safe (sometimes).
Thank you!!!!!!!!!

Karried
09-01-2005, 07:23 PM
I never thought I would say this but at this point I might agree with shooting the rapists and the snipers shooting at hospital patients - what the heck is that all about?

I can't believe how bad this has gotten. Is anyone as amazed as I am by the images of third world country gone wrong, in our own backyard? I never thought I would see this and never imagined how terrible it could really become.