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mmonroe
09-30-2014, 01:40 PM
Midwest City has no real entertainment activities at all...

A recent discussion with a buddy who moved out of state resulted in the following thought process and fueled our discussion.

There is nothing to do in Midwest City. (Besides bowling at Plant Bowl or skating at the Skating Rink.)

We traded our movie theaters for nursing homes, open lots, empty buildings and a church. We even traded our putt-putt course for a funeral home.

Then, this realization came (I'm in my late 20's), Midwest City is perfect for anyone who is 40 years old or older. Why?

It feels like the City of Midwest City is getting the entire city ready to retire instead of fueling enthusiasm and growing our city for the future.

But wait, are there not new Thunder themed basket ball courts, or a large park with "newish" jungle gyms. Also, you can't forget the parks with walking trails, even the dog park. We also have a pool and spray parks! Then there are the golf courses. Those things are are all well and good if i'm age 2 to 18 or 40+, and most of those items that could be applicable to me are not what I would consider an entertaining evening out as much as they are just recreation.

In my opinion, there is an age gap in the entertainment options in Midwest City for anyone age 20 to 35. We have to drive out of Midwest City and invest our money through sales tax into other cities. Ultimately, most in this age range are moving out of the city to nearby cities with more entertainment options and living there. Money that could be reinvested back into our own city is being used to better the cities around us. Most recently, Midwest City went from being the 7th Largest city in the entire state of Oklahoma, to the 8th largest city, losing out only to Moore.

Moore has over the years increased it's stock of entertainment value for it's residents and the residents of nearby cities. I can only imagine the amount of sales tax dollars effecting the City of Moore's coffers.

I know the City of Moore has no direct control of what is built by private developers or the type of business that invests in their community. But, I wouldn't doubt if there were not some sort of incentives for doing so, or that the build and permit process is much easier, or some reason that we as a large community with no other entertainment options for EOC are not booming with options and investments.

It seems to me that Midwest City wouldn't just serve our residents, but also our neighbor communities and those who travel past Midwest City from the east for more entertainment attractions to the west of us. We could be the travel destination for EOC residents and not Moore, OKC, or Edmond.

Anybody else feel this way, or do I just have a bad attitude about this?

Jersey Boss
09-30-2014, 02:27 PM
Is Del City any better? It goes with the territory of the citizens not wanting to invest in the future. My guess is that MWC has a larger number than most of transient military families. If that is the case why would they want to invest in a town they are not settled in.

Filthy
09-30-2014, 02:45 PM
Midwest City has no real entertainment activities at all...

A recent discussion with a buddy who moved out of state resulted in the following thought process and fueled our discussion.

There is nothing to do in Midwest City. (Besides bowling at Plant Bowl or skating at the Skating Rink.)

We traded our movie theaters for nursing homes, open lots, empty buildings and a church. We even traded our putt-putt course for a funeral home.

Then, this realization came (I'm in my late 20's), Midwest City is perfect for anyone who is 40 years old or older. Why?

It feels like the City of Midwest City is getting the entire city ready to retire instead of fueling enthusiasm and growing our city for the future.

But wait, are there not new Thunder themed basket ball courts, or a large park with "newish" jungle gyms. Also, you can't forget the parks with walking trails, even the dog park. We also have a pool and spray parks! Then there are the golf courses. Those things are are all well and good if i'm age 2 to 18 or 40+, and most of those items that could be applicable to me are not what I would consider an entertaining evening out as much as they are just recreation.

In my opinion, there is an age gap in the entertainment options in Midwest City for anyone age 20 to 35. We have to drive out of Midwest City and invest our money through sales tax into other cities. Ultimately, most in this age range are moving out of the city to nearby cities with more entertainment options and living there. Money that could be reinvested back into our own city is being used to better the cities around us. Most recently, Midwest City went from being the 7th Largest city in the entire state of Oklahoma, to the 8th largest city, losing out only to Moore.

Moore has over the years increased it's stock of entertainment value for it's residents and the residents of nearby cities. I can only imagine the amount of sales tax dollars effecting the City of Moore's coffers.

I know the City of Moore has no direct control of what is built by private developers or the type of business that invests in their community. But, I wouldn't doubt if there were not some sort of incentives for doing so, or that the build and permit process is much easier, or some reason that we as a large community with no other entertainment options for EOC are not booming with options and investments.

It seems to me that Midwest City wouldn't just serve our residents, but also our neighbor communities and those who travel past Midwest City from the east for more entertainment attractions to the west of us. We could be the travel destination for EOC residents and not Moore, OKC, or Edmond.

Anybody else feel this way, or do I just have a bad attitude about this?

So.....I guess I will tread lightly on this one....but, what does MWC offer in regards to reasons why a company would want to bring viable entertainment to the area? I will admit, that I've never stepped foot in MWC/Del City...but coming from someone who has lived in the OKC metro for 35+ years, the generalized perception is that MWC isn't exactly a place you want to be. To the point where, if I had to travel Eastbound I-40 and my children needed to go to the bathroom really really bad....I'm not sure i'd exit to let them use a public restroom anywhere along that corridor. (Maybe If I could get on base. Maybe) I'm sure all of the regular posters here, can provide real useable statistics, and or urban development rhetoric, or other politically correct cool data..but at the end of the day...its not a desirable place to be.

Roger S
09-30-2014, 03:10 PM
...its not a desirable place to be.

That's quite a generalization for someone that's never been there in 35+ years. I can think of a lot less desirable places to be in the metro area.

I'm not sure what happened to entertainment in the area. I grew up in the EOC area and we had plenty to do back then. At that time we had one of the newer, nicer, theatres in the area, Bowling Green was always busy. The Putt-Putt always had a large crowd on the weekends and did pretty good business on weeknights. Heritage Park Mall had a theatre and was usually close to 100% full. As teens we had Jamaica Joes which is now 21+.

Then suddenly it all just kind of went away. Not sure why or what changed.

BBatesokc
09-30-2014, 03:23 PM
I lived in the Mid-Del area (SE 44 and Sunnylane area) for 15 years. Son went to MWCHS and many people we knew lived in MWC or Del City. Inlaws still live in MWC.

Filthy isn't very far off base IMO. The reputation of being an undesirable place to live is well earned. I was never proud to live there, but we had a plan - Live cheap, save up and MOVE (which we did in 2013).

Sure there are a few nice areas and several okay areas - but none of that makes up for the rampant filth that is Mid-Del.

Maybe my perspective is totally skewed. Literally the cul-de-sac we lived on suffered from no less than 5 drive by shootings either on our street or within 1 single block. One drive by was repeated within 24 hours because the idiots shot at the wrong house the first time.

One was so close we had to call police about giving them a shell casing that went through our fence and stopped inside a bird feeder in our backyard.

I go through the jail blotters every day and the number of violent criminals who call that area home is very disturbing. Not to mention, when I'd ride along with local bounty hunters, things never got more dangerous than when we went to an apartment complex in the Mid-Del area or one that bordered it.

The area we lived in was so bad that until the On Cue was built at SE 29/Sooner we wouldn't patronize any of the gas stations in the area after dark and avoided them if we could during the day.

Personally, they could build a Warren Theater in Mid-Del and I wouldn't patronize it. To many gang problems there - again, IMO and from my perspective.

That said, I've never had a negative experience with MWC or Del-City police and have always found them to be very professional and courteous.

Stew
09-30-2014, 03:31 PM
So.....I guess I will tread lightly on this one....but, what does MWC offer in regards to reasons why a company would want to bring viable entertainment to the area? I will admit, that I've never stepped foot in MWC/Del City...but coming from someone who has lived in the OKC metro for 35+ years, the generalized perception is that MWC isn't exactly a place you want to be. To the point where, if I had to travel Eastbound I-40 and my children needed to go to the bathroom really really bad....I'm not sure i'd exit to let them use a public restroom anywhere along that corridor. (Maybe If I could get on base. Maybe) I'm sure all of the regular posters here, can provide real useable statistics, and or urban development rhetoric, or other politically correct cool data..but at the end of the day...its not a desirable place to be.

What is it that scares you? The Chili's, the chic-fil-a, or perhaps the oklahoma county sheriff's office? Well that's understandable. If you're heading east with a full bladder on I-40 through MWC the first "thug" free exit with services is Choctaw Road. Yeah, it's sort of rural but it's usually free of "them" people. I hope that helps.

Filthy
09-30-2014, 03:35 PM
That's quite a generalization for someone that's never been there in 35+ years. I can think of a lot less desirable places to be in the metro area.


Understood. Its hard to have a leg to stand upon, in making such a statement...since I've never been there. But I'm confident in my assessment. I can understand how you could see differently being that you grew up in EOC. Obviously there are light years of differences between NWOKC/Edmond, and East OKC/MWC/DelCity. Those differences are what keeps new businesses or entertainment from building new locations there.

Roger S
09-30-2014, 03:42 PM
What is it that scares you? The Chili's,.....

Well now that you mention it.... Yes, the Chili's does scare me. :wink:

Roger S
09-30-2014, 03:44 PM
Obviously there are light years of differences between NWOKC/Edmond, and East OKC/MWC/DelCity. Those differences are what keeps new businesses or entertainment from building new locations there.

I agree that it probably has a lot to do with wealth disparity.

Filthy
09-30-2014, 03:44 PM
Yeah, it's sort of rural but it's usually free of "them" people. I hope that helps. By "them" people, I'm sure you meant "those" people.

Roger S
09-30-2014, 03:50 PM
Personally, they could build a Warren Theater in Mid-Del and I wouldn't patronize it. To many gang problems there - again, IMO and from my perspective.

I knew about the gangs in the area but I lived in the area over half my life and never had a run in with a gang member and I hung out at some pretty seedy places in my teens and early 20s..... regularly snuck into the Purple Palace, not that it was hard to sneak into, and shot pool at 44th & Bryant several nights a week.

I can agree that it's not a place one would aspire to spend a lifetime in but I'll stand by my comment that I can think of worse areas of the metro than the Mid Del area that I wouldn't want to be in after dark.

Stew
09-30-2014, 03:51 PM
I lived in the Mid-Del area (SE 44 and Sunnylane area) for 15 years. Son went to MWCHS and many people we knew lived in MWC or Del City. Inlaws still live in MWC.

Filthy isn't very far off base IMO. The reputation of being an undesirable place to live is well earned. I was never proud to live there, but we had a plan - Live cheap, save up and MOVE (which we did in 2013).

Sure there are a few nice areas and several okay areas - but none of that makes up for the rampant filth that is Mid-Del.

Maybe my perspective is totally skewed. Literally the cul-de-sac we lived on suffered from no less than 5 drive by shootings either on our street or within 1 single block. One drive by was repeated within 24 hours because the idiots shot at the wrong house the first time.

One was so close we had to call police about giving them a shell casing that went through our fence and stopped inside a bird feeder in our backyard.

I go through the jail blotters every day and the number of violent criminals who call that area home is very disturbing. Not to mention, when I'd ride along with local bounty hunters, things never got more dangerous than when we went to an apartment complex in the Mid-Del area or one that bordered it.

The area we lived in was so bad that until the On Cue was built at SE 29/Sooner we wouldn't patronize any of the gas stations in the area after dark and avoided them if we could during the day.

Personally, they could build a Warren Theater in Mid-Del and I wouldn't patronize it. To many gang problems there - again, IMO and from my perspective.

That said, I've never had a negative experience with MWC or Del-City police and have always found them to be very professional and courteous.

Correct me if I'm wrong but that cul-de-sac was actually in Oklahoma City, no?

BBatesokc
09-30-2014, 03:54 PM
Yep. Exactly 2 blocks from the Del City city limits.

Whatever point you were trying to make doesn't change my opinion one bit. I lived in the Mid-Del area for 15 years, kid attended school in MWC, had to be within the city limits on a daily basis. The area and much of what surrounds it is extremely undesirable. Mid-Del is like a cancer and negatively effects those things within close proximity. Again, and as clearly stated..... based on my opinion and perspective.

Stew
09-30-2014, 04:06 PM
Yep. Exactly 2 blocks from the Del City city limits.

Whatever point you were trying to make doesn't change my opinion one bit. I lived in the Mid-Del area for 15 years, kid attended school in MWC, had to be within the city limits on a daily basis. The area and much of what surrounds it is extremely undesirable. Mid-Del is like a cancer and negatively effects those things within close proximity. Again, and as clearly stated..... based on my opinion and perspective.

Actually, the worse of the worse neighborhoods in your old area were all in Oklahoma City city limits. Perhaps it is the Oklahoma City areas that are the cancer. Anyway, I'm not trying to change anybody's mind but merely pointing out all those drive by shootings in your original post happened in Oklahoma City and not in MWC or Del City. It seems like kind of an important point to be made.

BBatesokc
09-30-2014, 04:11 PM
Actually, the worse of the worse neighborhoods in your old area were all in Oklahoma City city limits. Perhaps it is the Oklahoma City areas that are the cancer. Anyway, I'm not trying to change anybody's mind but merely pointing out all those drive by shootings in your original post happened in Oklahoma City and not in MWC or Del City. It seems like kind of an important point to be made.

Three of the shooters were arrested and convicted - all lived in MWC.

But, hey, it was probably the target of the shooters fault ...

Like I clearly pointed out - many of the areas boarding Mid-del are cesspools. But it doesn't stop at the city limits. The scum doesn't care where the line is drawn, it is simply attracted to scummy areas and a lot of Mid-Del fits that bill. Do those same areas exist in OKC, Edmond, etc. Obviously they do.

rezman
09-30-2014, 04:55 PM
When I lived out in the eastern part of the county, I had a Harrah police seargent, who also used to be a patrol officer in Midwest City tell me you wouldn't believe the stuff that goes on in MWC. He said after so many years of chasing after gang members, he finally got tired of it and moved out out to Harrah for a little quieter carreer.

bchris02
09-30-2014, 05:14 PM
Not all of Mid-Del is bad. I think the area could definitely support a movie theater. If the Heritage Park Mall area could be completely bulldozed and redeveloped it would go a long way towards revitalizing the area. However, given the state of the school district I don't see a lot can be done. As has been discussed in the urban vs suburban thread, school district is everything when it comes to suburban growth and once the school district loses its reputation, the area goes downhill.

Stew
09-30-2014, 05:36 PM
,
Not all of Mid-Del is bad. I think the area could definitely support a movie theater. If the Heritage Park Mall area could be completely bulldozed and redeveloped it would go a long way towards revitalizing the area. However, given the state of the school district I don't see a lot can be done. As has been discussed in the urban vs suburban thread, school district is everything when it comes to suburban growth and once the school district loses its reputation, the area goes downhill.

East MWC compares favorably to the other metro suburbs. I doubt few would hesitate to send their children to Carl Albert schools. Most of MWC's bad rep is derived from the neighborhoods along NE 10th affectionately called "murder 1". I own several rent houses in the original square mile and never had any problems with tenants or the folks in the neighborhood. It seems like an okay place to live. One thing MWC should do is bulldoze that blighted semi vacated mall. That thing is just an eye sore and probably a drag on the neighborhood to the north. I just don't see MWC as the Compton of the Bible Belt.

JesStang
10-01-2014, 06:50 AM
,

East MWC compares favorably to the other metro suburbs. I doubt few would hesitate to send their children to Carl Albert schools. .
You're right on the mark there. I grew up in MWC (from '95 to '05) and my mom made sure I was in the Carl Albert school district. There was no way she was letting me go to MWC or Del City. East of Douglas Blvd. is not bad at all.
It's sad but the older and crappier the houses get, the worse the people who live in them seem to get. That's the problem with all of Del City and most of MWC.
Thankfully, they completely redid 29th St. in front of Tinker and it's WAY better than it was. If they built a nice movie theater in that area, it would do very well. I know Planet Bowl is in that area but it's still crappy so nobody wants to go. Airmen go to the one on base anyway, it's nice and cheap.

bombermwc
10-01-2014, 07:53 AM
Where MMonroe lived is OKC, and a rather rough part of it that continues to frustrate Del City residents because OKC wont police it properly. And that's about as far into a night/day comparison to MWC as you can get...they simply are nothing alike.

I grew up in MWC, both near Goodyear and then later over near Bowling Green, so I've lived in rough and very comfortable parts of MWC. I walked around both neighborhoods as a kid and played and had a great time. All the junk I hear being said here is just that. You won't stop to let your kid go to the bathroom.....are you kidding me? That's the kind of stuck-up Edmonite holier than thou bullcrap I hate. It just shows you know absolutely NOTHING about MWC other than the inaccurate bullhonkey you've been fed. You'd probably be surprised to know about how many neighborhoods have brand new million + dollar homes in them, or how many of those already exist in MWC. But I'm sure you're family is too good to be subjected to us poor people that grew up in EOC....because money is the thing that should be the end-all comparison anyway.

In fact, MWC is one of the strongest economies in the state. It's a top 10 in the list of the largest cities in the state by population. It has one of the best non-major city economic development groups working for it. You don't think 29th happened because of private developers do you? And what about the positive impact 29th had on the rest of the city?

Now, I'm not saying it's the same place it was 20 years ago when I was a kid. But it's never been the hell-hole people try to make it out to be. I personally made the decision to choose a house in the Moore district when I got married. That was a conscious decision based on what I thought things would be like 20 years later when my children were in high school. That 40 year gap leaves a lot of time for changes. Yes, socio-economically, things are trending down....like anywhere that's been around for any length of time. Heck, John Marshall was "the place to be" at one time and it was even in the sticks at one time. That's the trend of development...especially in OKC where it goes out with no interest to re-develop the innards. But come on....if after 35+ years, you've never even been there?

Filthy
10-01-2014, 09:17 AM
It just shows you know absolutely NOTHING about MWC other than the inaccurate bullhonkey you've been fed.

I guess, I will take the bait. Since your post seemed to be aimed towards my general vicinity. I don't recall ever being fed any "bullhonkey" about MWC. Actually I don't recall having many conversations at all about MWC/DC with anyone. So, I'm not sure what "bullhonkey" you are referring to. After giving it some thought, I have actually been to the Midwest City area. At least 2-3 times in junior high , and high school, when playing football. So obviously, my sample size was somewhat skewed by not having the opportunity to take a guided tour of the beautiful city of Midwest City. But, I can still recall that the overall feeling from the collective group of our football team, was that of...."Holy Crap...we're getting ready to go play the ghetto kids." So, its not something I'm fabricating in my old age. I'm not a one man, wrecking crew...slandering the Beautiful City of MWC on message boards, for self gratification.



But I'm sure you're family is too good to be subjected to us poor people that grew up in EOC....because money is the thing that should be the end-all comparison anyway. You are reaching, quite a bit. You shouldn't let your emotions post for you.


Now, I'm not saying it's the same place it was 20 years ago when I was a kid. But it's never been the hell-hole people try to make it out to be. But come on....if after 35+ years, you've never even been there?

And that's what makes this slightly more humerous to me. Because it WAS about 20 years ago, that I did have the privilege of visiting MWC...and those thoughts/opinions posted above, were formed at that time. So, I would assume if its not the same place it was, when you were a kid.......that its fair to say.....**** has declined even more so in that time. I mean.....You said so yourself.

Some of you are taking this way too personal. These are the conversations needed when discussing the title of the thread. These are the real reasons, why there will never be a new development, offering cutting edge entertainment, or new up and coming restaurant trends built in the MWC/DC area. It's not a desirable place to be. Period.

It's obvious that we all come from different backgrounds, and areas of the city. So, you have to realize, if someone lives a good portion of their life in a certain area of a city...that's what they become accustomed to. Some of you, that were born/raised in East OKC/MWC/DC area want to say that its not that bad...because you are use to being in that area. Just like people from South OKC, are use to that area as well. You become oblivious to your surroundings, and there is nothing else to compare with to quantify what is good, bad, better, or worse. Look no further than some people in this thread, saying that Carl Albert is the "good" school district to be in. WTF..I mean REALLY? REALLY? So, yes...some areas of the city might seem ok to you...but for others, driving around that same area, it might seem like a 3rd World Country. And that makes some people uncomfortable. Get over it.

Drake
10-01-2014, 12:56 PM
I guess, I will take the bait. Since your post seemed to be aimed towards my general vicinity. I don't recall ever being fed any "bullhonkey" about MWC. Actually I don't recall having many conversations at all about MWC/DC with anyone. So, I'm not sure what "bullhonkey" you are referring to. After giving it some thought, I have actually been to the Midwest City area. At least 2-3 times in junior high , and high school, when playing football. So obviously, my sample size was somewhat skewed by not having the opportunity to take a guided tour of the beautiful city of Midwest City. But, I can still recall that the overall feeling from the collective group of our football team, was that of...."Holy Crap...we're getting ready to go play the ghetto kids." So, its not something I'm fabricating in my old age. I'm not a one man, wrecking crew...slandering the Beautiful City of MWC on message boards, for self gratification.


You are reaching, quite a bit. You shouldn't let your emotions post for you.



And that's what makes this slightly more humerous to me. Because it WAS about 20 years ago, that I did have the privilege of visiting MWC...and those thoughts/opinions posted above, were formed at that time. So, I would assume if its not the same place it was, when you were a kid.......that its fair to say.....**** has declined even more so in that time. I mean.....You said so yourself.

Some of you are taking this way too personal. These are the conversations needed when discussing the title of the thread. These are the real reasons, why there will never be a new development, offering cutting edge entertainment, or new up and coming restaurant trends built in the MWC/DC area. It's not a desirable place to be. Period.

It's obvious that we all come from different backgrounds, and areas of the city. So, you have to realize, if someone lives a good portion of their life in a certain area of a city...that's what they become accustomed to. Some of you, that were born/raised in East OKC/MWC/DC area want to say that its not that bad...because you are use to being in that area. Just like people from South OKC, are use to that area as well. You become oblivious to your surroundings, and there is nothing else to compare with to quantify what is good, bad, better, or worse. Look no further than some people in this thread, saying that Carl Albert is the "good" school district to be in. WTF..I mean REALLY? REALLY? So, yes...some areas of the city might seem ok to you...but for others, driving around that same area, it might seem like a 3rd World Country. And that makes some people uncomfortable. Get over it.

So the has been new development in the Mid/Del area? Ted's. The Garage, McAlisters, Panera, Dicks Sporting Goods, Old Navy and many more have opened or are opening in the last 5 years.

A 3rd world country? Seriously Mr drama queen.

Get out a little more, because you don't come across as the sharpest knife in drawer

Plutonic Panda
10-01-2014, 02:39 PM
For me and everyone I know: MWC is not a place you want live, work, or play in.

Stew
10-01-2014, 02:49 PM
For me and everyone I know: MWC is not a place you want live, work, or play in.

Yet on the other hand it's a great place to buy a car since it's home to absolutely the best auto dealership (Hudiburg Auto Group) in the state. That's just fact.

Plutonic Panda
10-01-2014, 02:51 PM
I will say I believe MWC has a lot of potential. I look it like Guthrie, it just needs new leadership.

Filthy
10-01-2014, 02:56 PM
So the has been new development in the Mid/Del area? Ted's. The Garage, McAlisters, Panera, Dicks Sporting Goods, Old Navy and many more have opened or are opening in the last 5 years.

Bravo. Those are really super nice top shelf organizations. Cookie Cutter chain restaurants, and bargain bin clothing stores are not what we are discussing here.


A 3rd world country? Seriously Mr drama queen. I appreciate the name calling, but at the end of the day, yes...it is somewhat of an exaggeration. But it is still amazing to see how some people live, yet don't realize that they are living in such a fashion. I'm not sure of it is because of pride....or just a deliberate act of ignoring the signs and symptoms that everyone else is able to see.


Get out a little more, because you don't come across as the sharpest knife in drawer Once again, I appreciate the feeble attempt to belittle me, but I am actually both well traveled, and well educated. So, your comments lack merit.


Its sad, that this thread has taken a turn in such a way, that the original topic cannot be discussed/debated without getting peoples feelings hurt.

Stew
10-01-2014, 03:41 PM
How can one even pretend to take the high ground when they post, "Holy Crap...we're getting ready to go play the ghetto kids". So, exactly how does one get the designation ghetto kid? Is it the color of the uniform? The color of the shoe? Or perhaps the color of something else?

Filthy
10-01-2014, 03:54 PM
How can one even pretend to take the high ground when they post, "Holy Crap...we're getting ready to go play the ghetto kids". So, exactly how does one get the designation ghetto kid? Is it the color of the uniform? The color of the shoe? Or perhaps the color of something else?

I'm not one to define, such a term. But, as I understood it then (You know...when I was a 17 year old kid in high school) It was typically used to describe a low income, impoverished, neglected, or otherwise disadvantaged area. If you are insinuating anything else, it would be wise to stop while you are ahead.

Plutonic Panda
10-01-2014, 04:11 PM
How can one even pretend to take the high ground when they post, "Holy Crap...we're getting ready to go play the ghetto kids". So, exactly how does one get the designation ghetto kid? Is it the color of the uniform? The color of the shoe? Or perhaps the color of something else?When I was middle school back in Dallas, we'd make fun of the black kids when we played Oak Cliff one time. Let me tell you, racist remarks were made and the n word was thrown out more than once. I'm not going to sit here and lie by saying I didn't participate in it. It was immature, but what the hay. It happened and I guarantee you we weren't the only kids doing it. I even had some black friends that joined in on it. Even if they were white, we'd still call them the ghetto savages of d town. Not exactly something I'm proud of doing, but it happened.

Like I said, MWC does NOT have a good reputation around the metro. They have a very cool shopping center that I go to from time to time close to Tinker.

I really think MWC has the potential to become a great town as Guthrie. There are places, and sorry if I offend anyone, that I don't think will be much of anything, namely Choctaw, but MWC is a place that can come back. They have a bunch of old homes that are cool and could be restored to become historic neighborhoods, an air force museum could be placed near Tinker that could feature and world class flying simulator of all different kinds of aircraft among other sorts. I-40 desperately needs a makeover in that area. The service roads are the worst problem and either need to be removed or changed to one way. A monument should also be erected over I-40 to let people know of Tinker's presence.

A change of leadership is need, imo. Like Guthrie, it pains me to see what it could be, but holy crap what a garbage can that town is. Guthrie has so many cool views of rolling hills, it's amazing.

bchris02
10-01-2014, 05:08 PM
The first thing Midwest City should do, and this is realistic, is to demolish Heritage Park Mall along with the abandoned strip malls surrounding it and in their place, build a nice mixed-use development that includes not only retail and restaurants but a movie theater, Dave & Busters or something like it, and housing options.

Stew
10-01-2014, 06:12 PM
The first thing Midwest City should do, and this is realistic, is to demolish Heritage Park Mall along with the abandoned strip malls surrounding it and in their place, build a nice mixed-use development that includes not only retail and restaurants but a movie theater, Dave & Busters or something like it, and housing options.

Totally agree about the mall. If I was emperor of Midwest City (or any metro suburb) I would follow OKC's lead and initiate a sales tax hike dedicated to capital improvements. It's hard to argue with the success of MAPS. And of course the first capital improvement would be nuking that mall. Addition by subtraction.

Oh GAWD the Smell!
10-01-2014, 09:18 PM
I can see where Filthy is coming from. I grew up in Moore, and when going out as a teen, we never even considered MWC as a place to go...So that's how it was always in my head. Even after I moved to Virginia, California, Colorado, and eventually back to OK.

When I moved back to OK, I moved close to Moore, and again...Never even gave MWC a thought...That was the ghetto.

Then I got married, and the best bang-for-the buck place, that met our needs and wants, was in Choctaw. So that's where we live. That left MWC as the place to go to do most of our shopping. I braced myself for what I was going to have to tolera....Hey waittaminute...IS THAT JERSEY MIKE'S?!?!

In the last 5 years or so, I've had nary an issue with anything in Midwest City. People are friendly, shopping is...Well...Shopping. Most of my needs as a suburbanite slob are easily met by the businesses in the area. I don't have a clue about gangs or other problems of that sort, because I've never seen even a hint of any of that. Just regular folks going about their day.

I don't expect the next Red Prime to go in next door to McAlister's, or a second Warren Theatre to be built next to Sears. But I can't really find anything to complain about, as far as MWC goes.

Mel
10-01-2014, 09:24 PM
Maybe there will be a much needed boost there since Tinker is getting more Boeing jobs. Investors can get over their fears about Tinker getting shut down. Way overdue to construct more entertainment for the younger Military and Civilian employee's and their families. Keep the Tax dollars home.

Oh GAWD the Smell!
10-01-2014, 09:27 PM
Oh...I should also say that I agree with the premise of the thread. There isn't jack sh*t to do in MWC. And I'm in my 40's lol. :D

RadicalModerate
10-01-2014, 09:41 PM
Back in The Day, (that would be in the early '70s) I lived at a mobile home park in Crutcho--not technically MWC, yet close enough. Later I lived in Rolling Oaks Apts., just down the street (Air Depot) from Crutcho (I nicknamed the place Rolling Roach Apts. and this was back in the pre-gansta era). After that, I did a couple of years in a rent house, with my ex-wife of many, many years, down in the old part of MWC, just north of 29th Street, and just off of Air Depot (immediately north of the old Hideaway Club). In my personal opinion, MWC began its decline, entertainment-wise, when they closed the Sooner Twin Drive-In. Still . . . there was that theater in the strip mall just north of Heritage Park Mall (in its pre-mausoleum days) and Pelican's is still one of my favorite restaurants (about once or twice a year). I can't think of a single reason to go to MWC except for some event at Oscar Rose (or whatever it's been rebranded). The restrooms in there are extra spiffy.

I guess I agree with the original premise of this thread as well.
Still,MWC has a nice library complex . . . =)
Right in back of the Cop Shop.

Oh! I forgot to add: Del City makes MWC look like Gaillardia.
And The Oasis in that entire section of Sprawlburg, OKC is Smith Village.
I did some work for the Former Mayor of Smith Village.
He was very entertaining. From Cincinnati. In the Pest Control Industry.

He let me build an entire addition onto his house to provide a home for his elderly parents who (or is that whom? what?) he was importing from back in Ohio. They were surrounded by Del/Midwest City for about a month and started walking back to Ohio with all of their possessions. They were probably miffed about the lack of cinnamon in the local version of spaghetti.

But I digress . . .
I guess the real question here is why and when The Atkinson Cartel lost their vision . . . metaphorically . . . image and entertainment-wise . . .

bombermwc
10-02-2014, 08:29 AM
Drake - yeah i'm going to take it personal because that's where i grew up. If you played football at MCHS' field, then yes you went to the oldest and most depressed part of MWC. Congratulations for making a snap judgement from your 100 yard view of the area. Did you also miss the massive economic development going on around that same area? In fact, i think you made my very point for me about how misinformed the population of OKC is.

Do you have any reason to go to Yukon or Mustang? There's even LESS to do there than in MWC. If you judged Mustang on going to their football field, you should have similar views compared to MWC. And if you're basing your opinions off of your jr high and high school self, then i see no point in even discussing it.

Radical - there's a lot to that. The current Atkinsons are a shadow of WPBill. They can't develop to save their life..just look at all the flops North Star has come up with. Uptown is a joke in terms of what they finised with in so-called phase III, which actually LOST them tenants. Copper Creek on 240 didn't happen. And now those things are going in elsewhere...like the Neighborhood Market they were supposed to have in it. They have no vision and i personally feel are too comfy in the trust. At the same time, Atkinson came in when the place was a field of grass and could get land super cheap. With Tinker opening, he had a major advantage to boom the place, which it did. The oil bust caused a major hiccup in MWC and like a lot of placed, Edmond-flight sucked away a lot of potential buyers. But lets be clear to the skeptics, you have not seen a population decrease in MWC...ever. You have not seen an economic decrease in MWC either. It's a fiscally stronger city than it's ever been with the amount of tax revenue coming in.

MWC needs a movie theater back and other things to DO for sure though! If only we could doze Heritage and get the city to spur some entertainment development. It would be great to see incentives on that to get something going because it would be a win for the city for the returned tax money. Just dont do any of the ad-valorum bull crap like Home Depot.

adaniel
10-02-2014, 09:54 AM
This is an interesting read.

As someone who grew up in a military household and moved around a lot as a kid, MWC is pretty much in line with most army/air force towns. The highly transient nature of the military can make nearby towns seem a bit rough. And there are indeed a lot of rough rental properties, especially on the North Side between NE 23rd and 10th Street (I just learned this area is called Murder 1...yikes) With that in mind, I do think MWC suffers from an unfair reputation. At the end of the day its a blue collar suburb that isn't much different than other similar towns in Central OK. People from Moore and Yukon talking down on MWC reminds me of the time I met people from Indiana and Nebraska making fun of Oklahoma....I'm just like, "do you really think where you come from is so special?" Please show me a suburb around here outside of Norman that is a mecca for fun and entertainment.

If I had to place a bet on a suburb in this area, I would pick (in this order) Norman, Edmond, then MWC. It's proximity to a major employment center will always give the city a good level of stability in its tax base, whereas places like Moore and Yukon are bedroom towns and highly susceptible to decline.

JMO, and I hope nobody takes offense to this, but I would put MWC far and above Del City. In fact MWC probably suffers due to its proximity to DC, NEOKC, and Spencer, which have all earned their reputation. With that in mind, outside of the rougher areas, Eastern Oklahoma County is very diverse and has a fairly large black middle class. Probably the largest in this state.

One other thing about this area. It has TREES! Seriously, if I was looking for land for a new home and on a budget, I'm heading to Eastern MWC/Choctaw vincinity. Its really quite pretty in certain areas. Given this, the Choctaw Schools, and the access to Tinker, I'm a bit surprised that this area has not grown as much.

If I were in charge of MWC, I would start getting serious about cleaning up blight on the Northside, maybe look into a MAPs style public works program, and let everything else work itself out. It has the bones to be a really nice town.

jerrywall
10-02-2014, 10:08 AM
Is it a simple case of proximity? Edmond, doesn't have (decent) movie theaters either. If I was building a north side high end theater, I'd put it on the border, near quail springs or something. But not in Edmond itself. I can get from my house in Edmond to the Harkins in Bricktown in about 10 minutes on a good day, or similar time to Quail Springs AMC. From MWC you've got Bricktown that is as close, or Moore, which feeds from OKC and Norman.

tfvc.org
10-02-2014, 03:47 PM
~15 years ago my friend lived off of 44th and Sooner, and I took my A+ / Net+ training at MidDel votech. I never had an issue with that area. I still go into that area often when I go with my friend to eat or when she takes her kids to the barber. To me Mid-del isn't really that bad, but then again, when I lived in Denver I had friends I visited in the day and night in 5 points, and lived for a while in South St Pete and ventured into East Tampa a few times. Never had a problem with anyone.

mmonroe
10-02-2014, 04:10 PM
CrimeMapping.com - National Map (http://www.crimemapping.com/map/ok/midwestcity)

bombermwc
10-03-2014, 07:59 AM
adaniel, you hit a major sore spot in MWC. North of 10th is OCPS, Star Spencer high....one of the lowest scorings schools in OCPS. It's amazing what a trip across a street can make. It's a major chicken-egg situation of what caused the AMAZINGLY RAPID downfall of that area. In the 70s/80s, a number of people built very nice homes there, only to learn they were on the wrong side of the line. Had it stayed in Mid-Del, I feel like the area would never have fallen like it has. And the city has put so little effort into that area, it's quite sad. I would agree that SOMETHING needs to happen. I just don't know what can be done.

I should note that Star Spencer High is actually in Spencer. MWC jogs around Spencer limits. And I believe was severely neglected by Maps for Kids.

JesStang
10-03-2014, 08:43 AM
Look no further than some people in this thread, saying that Carl Albert is the "good" school district to be in. WTF..I mean REALLY? REALLY? So, yes...some areas of the city might seem ok to you...but for others, driving around that same area, it might seem like a 3rd World Country. And that makes some people uncomfortable. Get over it.
I don't get it...? Carl Albert is a great school and it doesn't take a lot of googling to figure that out. There's a reason people call it the prep school of MWC. It's not uncommon to see new BMW, Mercedes, and Lexus in the student parking lot.
There are very good neighborhoods in MWC. I definitely think Del City brings MWC down since they always get lumped together. Hell, I grew up in MWC and work there now (Tinker actually, close enough) and I would pass right by the 7-11 on Scott St. to go a little further to the Shell on Air Depot for a potty break.

TaoMaas
10-05-2014, 07:13 PM
Its hard to have a leg to stand upon, in making such a statement...since I've never been there. But I'm confident in my assessment.

Sorry, but this is the height of arrogance and stupidity. LOL

Wambo36
10-05-2014, 07:36 PM
Some of you are taking this way too personal. Well, let's see. You basically described MWC as such a hell hole that if faced with the choice of having to stop there for a rest room break for yourself or your family, you'd probably just sh!t yourselves and keep driving. Yeah, nothing there to take personal.


Look no further than some people in this thread, saying that Carl Albert is the "good" school district to be in. WTF..I mean REALLY? REALLY? I'd really like to hear your reasoning for this statement. An A+ rating puts it in pretty good academic standing and no one can argue with what they've done in athletics. By what standard are you judging them?

td25er
10-06-2014, 02:33 PM
Where MMonroe lived is OKC, and a rather rough part of it that continues to frustrate Del City residents because OKC wont police it properly. And that's about as far into a night/day comparison to MWC as you can get...they simply are nothing alike.

I grew up in MWC, both near Goodyear and then later over near Bowling Green, so I've lived in rough and very comfortable parts of MWC. I walked around both neighborhoods as a kid and played and had a great time. All the junk I hear being said here is just that. You won't stop to let your kid go to the bathroom.....are you kidding me? That's the kind of stuck-up Edmonite holier than thou bullcrap I hate. It just shows you know absolutely NOTHING about MWC other than the inaccurate bullhonkey you've been fed. You'd probably be surprised to know about how many neighborhoods have brand new million + dollar homes in them, or how many of those already exist in MWC. But I'm sure you're family is too good to be subjected to us poor people that grew up in EOC....because money is the thing that should be the end-all comparison anyway.

In fact, MWC is one of the strongest economies in the state. It's a top 10 in the list of the largest cities in the state by population. It has one of the best non-major city economic development groups working for it. You don't think 29th happened because of private developers do you? And what about the positive impact 29th had on the rest of the city?

Now, I'm not saying it's the same place it was 20 years ago when I was a kid. But it's never been the hell-hole people try to make it out to be. I personally made the decision to choose a house in the Moore district when I got married. That was a conscious decision based on what I thought things would be like 20 years later when my children were in high school. That 40 year gap leaves a lot of time for changes. Yes, socio-economically, things are trending down....like anywhere that's been around for any length of time. Heck, John Marshall was "the place to be" at one time and it was even in the sticks at one time. That's the trend of development...especially in OKC where it goes out with no interest to re-develop the innards. But come on....if after 35+ years, you've never even been there?

You want to know why Edmond has a MUCH better reputation than MWC?

Bachelor's Degree or higher age 25+:
Edmond-50.7%
MWC-20.2%

Crime index (neighborhoodscout.com)
MWC-5 out of 100. 100 is safest Midwest City crime rates and statistics - NeighborhoodScout (http://www.neighborhoodscout.com/ok/midwest-city/crime/)
Edmond-38 Edmond crime rates and statistics - NeighborhoodScout (http://www.neighborhoodscout.com/ok/edmond/crime/)


Crime rate (city-data.com) using 2012 data
Edmond-137.0 per 100,000 http://www.city-data.com/crime/crime-Edmond-Oklahoma.html
MWC-469.2 per 100,000 http://www.city-data.com/crime/crime-Midwest-City-Oklahoma.html

National Average-301.1
Del City-516.5
Moore-246.8

BBatesokc
10-06-2014, 02:55 PM
I remember when my son went to MWCHS - A majority of the school's students qualified for free college via 'Oklahoma's Promise' - however, very few parents ever bothered to enroll their kids in it according to the school counselor. FREE COLLEGE folks! How do you pass that up? When our son graduated they were reminding kids at the graduation that by simply graduating from a Mid-Del school they were already qualified for free college at Rose State.

ylouder
10-06-2014, 06:55 PM
I can see where Filthy is coming from. I grew up in Moore, and when going out as a teen, we never even considered MWC as a place to go...So that's how it was always in my head. Even after I moved to Virginia, California, Colorado, and eventually back to OK.

When I moved back to OK, I moved close to Moore, and again...Never even gave MWC a thought...That was the ghetto.

Then I got married, and the best bang-for-the buck place, that met our needs and wants, was in Choctaw. So that's where we live. That left MWC as the place to go to do most of our shopping. I braced myself for what I was going to have to tolera....Hey waittaminute...IS THAT JERSEY MIKE'S?!?!

In the last 5 years or so, I've had nary an issue with anything in Midwest City. People are friendly, shopping is...Well...Shopping. Most of my needs as a suburbanite slob are easily met by the businesses in the area. I don't have a clue about gangs or other problems of that sort, because I've never seen even a hint of any of that. Just regular folks going about their day.

I don't expect the next Red Prime to go in next door to McAlister's, or a second Warren Theatre to be built next to Sears. But I can't really find anything to complain about, as far as MWC goes.

We live in rural Choctaw after living in Moore, NW OKC, and most recently edmond. I would choose to shop at the shopping center across from tinker any day of the week.Its easy to get in and out and I have little need for higher end stores, if I need something special I'll order it online and save the headache and hassle.

My own personal experience is that people on the northern part of okc were on average ruder and more self involved than in moore or out east. I'll take some people not wanting to stop here to use the bathroom as a compliment.

bombermwc
10-07-2014, 07:38 AM
You want to know why Edmond has a MUCH better reputation than MWC?

Bachelor's Degree or higher age 25+:
Edmond-50.7%
MWC-20.2%

Crime index (neighborhoodscout.com)
MWC-5 out of 100. 100 is safest Midwest City crime rates and statistics - NeighborhoodScout (http://www.neighborhoodscout.com/ok/midwest-city/crime/)
Edmond-38 Edmond crime rates and statistics - NeighborhoodScout (http://www.neighborhoodscout.com/ok/edmond/crime/)


Crime rate (city-data.com) using 2012 data
Edmond-137.0 per 100,000 Crime rate in Edmond, Oklahoma (OK): murders, rapes, robberies, assaults, burglaries, thefts, auto thefts, arson, law enforcement employees, police officers statistics (http://www.city-data.com/crime/crime-Edmond-Oklahoma.html)
MWC-469.2 per 100,000 Crime rate in Midwest City, Oklahoma (OK): murders, rapes, robberies, assaults, burglaries, thefts, auto thefts, arson, law enforcement employees, police officers statistics (http://www.city-data.com/crime/crime-Midwest-City-Oklahoma.html)

National Average-301.1
Del City-516.5
Moore-246.8

Hey there Mr Highhorse. You know Edmond Santa Fe has more students on free/reduced lunches than MCHS? Edmond is also pretty heavily known for petty crime, which doesn't get reported the same. We can make statistics look as good/bad as we want.

There is no way you could pay me to live in Edmond and subject my children to the type of environment that exists there. And speaking with people that did grow up there, a LOT of them feel the same way. It's not exactly the amazing place Edmonites think it is. It's a bunch of over done strip malls, chain restaurants, and neuvo riche bullcrap.

Richard at Remax
10-07-2014, 07:55 AM
Well I grew up in Edmond and still live and work here. What kind of environment and I subjecting myself and my future kids to?

Oh GAWD the Smell!
10-07-2014, 08:19 AM
Snotty attitudes towards all that don't live there?

Richard at Remax
10-07-2014, 08:31 AM
I could give two craps if you do or don't live here. Sorry that you ran across people who think their self worth is higher than it should be. happen in every city in America

BBatesokc
10-07-2014, 02:32 PM
Snotty attitudes towards all that don't live there?

Which is total B.S. and is every bit as arrogant as the stereotype you'd project onto those who do live in Edmond.

jerrywall
10-07-2014, 02:58 PM
Hey there Mr Highhorse. You know Edmond Santa Fe has more students on free/reduced lunches than MCHS?

Umm, cite? Because every bit on information I can find puts MCHS at twice the percentage of students on the lunch program.

Stew
10-07-2014, 03:05 PM
If us east siders all agree that Edmond is the greatest city in the history of mankind and Edmondite poop doesn't stink then can we shift the discussion on this Midwest City thread back to entertainment options in Midwest City?

You're beautful Edmond and I was insane to think I ever had a chance with you. My bad.

Tylerwilliams16
10-07-2014, 03:09 PM
Agreed.

Tylerwilliams16
10-07-2014, 03:10 PM
If us east siders all agree that Edmond is the greatest city in the history of mankind and Edmondite poop doesn't stink then can we shift the discussion on this Midwest City thread back to entertainment options in Midwest City?

You're beautful Edmond and I was insane to think I ever had a chance with you. My bad.

Agreed.

jerrywall
10-07-2014, 03:32 PM
With all this agreement, I think MWC should pay a greatness proximity tax, which will benefit Edmond and help continue the greatness.

warreng88
10-07-2014, 03:37 PM
I worked as a loan officer at a bank in Spencer about ten years ago and many of our customers were MWC/DC residents. I never had a problem with any of the people in that area and have quite a few friends who still live out there. I think the movement has changed from people moving out to the burbs to people moving more back to the central core of OKC because that is where the action/entertainment is. There are obviously still people living in MWC/DC, but as school districts start to get better in other burbs and even the core, people (mostly young families) also tend to flock to where the best schools are. That would be my best guess as to why the entertainment isn't as good as it used to be.

Plutonic Panda
10-07-2014, 05:38 PM
Let me say this as someone who lives in Edmond, compared to other major cities with upscale suburbs, some might call Edmond ghetto. While Edmond is certainly a nice place to live, it has nowhere near the amount of wealth that other upscale suburbs do in a lot of other cities.

I still like Edmond, as it is my hometown, and think it has a bunch of potential, but I always laugh when people talk about how upscale it is.

bombermwc
10-08-2014, 07:58 AM
Stew - agreed. Circling back to MWC now......

So lets throw some random ideas around and see what we can come up with here as things to DO in MWC as potential development.

* LASER TAG! Hey there are still a ton of kids (and kids at heart) on the east side. Who else would love to be able to play some laser tag in MWC. Um hello...Heritage Park could be a massively awesome one. HAHAHAHA.

* Movie Theater - Well we lost two of them (Heritage 3 and Heritage Plaza 5) but they were both pretty pathetic and from the old school theater world. IF one was built, I would bet that Crossroads 16 or whatever would fold. If you haven't been to the old Crossroads 8 lately, it's actually an awesome deal. Freaking THX sound with digital projectors...for a few bucks with no crowds. It's definitely not your grandmas dollar theater. I don't know that EOC could support something like a 16 screen, but a 10 screen seems like it would be easily supported if it were placed in the right location. Heritage is NOT that location. It would really need to be positioned near a highway (40) and probably more on the east side of MWC so that it can pull more from the Choctaw crowd. The hard part there is putting it somewhere that has the potential for other development. Past Douglas going east, there really isn't anything on 40 until you get near Choctaw Rd...and that's simply too far out. Not enough population concentration there to do it. Totally talking out of my rear here, but the RV sales location on 29th/40 seems like a perfect location. The RV Sales place has been dozed for years, and I think it's actually an old mobile home community that was south of the plot, which I believe has been abandoned/closed (eastland hills park or something if googlemaps is right). But I haven't seen a For Sale sign up. Doesn't mean the owners wouldn't be interested if the right deal came by though. And THAT's proximity to the Douglas Corridor, with 29th just a mile away. https://www.google.com/maps/@35.433126,-97.3668743,534m/data=!3m1!1e3

* Arcade - we used to have Aladin's Castle at Heritage but it's long since gone. With places like Dave and Busters showing how an arcade can still function (and be geared towards ADULTS, why not try again? Make use of some of that million square feet of strip center space in MWC. Or better yet, tie it in with some sort of food option like Dave and Busters. Any one else seem like this one and the laser tag together spell HeyDay in Norman? LOL. The thing is, places like this turn a HUGE number of customers in a day and those people often tend to return to those locations. Remember Peter Piper Pizza in the Mazzios building? I couldn't tell you how many birthdays I had there as a kid.

* Bounce Gym - if you haven't been to one yet, you should. There is at least one in Edmond, but it's not terribly exciting. The first one I went to was a Pump It Up in San Antonio...is some random suburb. It was fun for our group of families that were there on vacation together from 3 years old up to 8 in kids AND the adults. The difference between the one in Edmond and Pump It Up was that it was actually encouraged for the adults to get on the stuff and it was fun for them too. It was a great experience for my 3 year old twin boys (at the time) because they got to climb up these things on their own. Hard to explain, but the multiple rooms had some stuff that was crazy high for a 3 year old (20-25' ceiling in the place to accommodate the slides). Kids Birthday Party Place | Kids Activities and Events | Pump It Up of San Antonio NE, TX | Serving Northeast San Antonio (http://www.pumpitupparty.com/san-antonio-ne-tx)

*Putt Putt - lets bring it back! Again, seems like HeyDay could cover quite a few of these in a single development. Again, appeals to all ages. That corridor on 29th could become an entertainment destination instead of an eyesore. And there is still room on Douglas to put this kind of stuff.


keep the thought train going....