View Full Version : District Court Judge: Oklahoma Execution Law Declared Unconstitutional



Pages : [1] 2

OKCTalker
03-26-2014, 10:03 AM
Oklahoma judge tosses state execution law | News OK (http://newsok.com/oklahoma-judge-tosses-state-execution-law/article/3947179) The lead from the Associated Press story as reported by NewsOK.com:

An Oklahoma judge has ruled that the state's execution law is unconstitutional because it doesn't allow inmates access to the court system.

Under Oklahoma law, no one may disclose the source of drugs used in executions — even if an inmate sues and wants the information as part of the discovery process. Oklahoma County District Judge Patricia Parrish said Monday that provision violates due process rights guaranteed in the Constitution.

The story does not say if this means that all executions are on hold, or just for Lockett & Warner, scheduled to be executed on April 22 & 29 respectively.

kevinpate
03-26-2014, 10:50 PM
FWIW, there presently are no active execution dates for any OK inmates except for the recently rescheduled to April dates on Lockett and Warner.
Those dates are currently set as Lockett, April 22 and Warner, April 29.

In OK, and most if not all other death penalty jurisdictions, an execution date is set at the time of the original sentencing. However, that date is then stayed while a death row inmate's appeals are underway.
When the appellate process has been concluded in OK, the AG's office notifies the Court of Criminal Appeals, which then sets a new execution date for an inmate.

These days the time is usually set in early evening. In days gone by, it was common to set the time for midnight or 12:01 am on the date the execution was scheduled to be carried out.

MWCGuy
03-27-2014, 01:36 AM
In days gone by, it was common to set the time for midnight or 12:01 am on the date the execution was scheduled to be carried out.

I have always wondered if they had more do with the use of the Electric Chair. The high voltage had to cause a pretty good power surge back in the day. Fewer people would notice the surge at night because they were likely asleep long before midnight.

mkjeeves
03-27-2014, 08:20 AM
I have always wondered if they had more do with the use of the Electric Chair. The high voltage had to cause a pretty good power surge back in the day. Fewer people would notice the surge at night because they were likely asleep long before midnight.

I don't know about Oklahoma, but I do know Arkansas used their own generator at one time. (60's) The story being the utility refused to serve power for that purpose. It doesn't take much power to kill someone, even though they probably overdo it.

OKCTalker
03-27-2014, 08:45 AM
Have previous methods of execution - electric chair, firing squad, gallows - been eliminated, or do they remain possibilities?

trousers
03-27-2014, 08:51 AM
Per the always reliable Wikipedia...
Method[edit]Since executions resumed in 1990 Lethal injection has been the standard method for execution. However if lethal injection is ever outlawed the state has two optional methods outlined in its state constitution. The first being Electrocution by electric chair which was used before the national moratorium began in 1967, with shooting by firing squad as the second option should both lethal injection and electrocution be outlawed.[13]

I wonder if you still get that last cigarette with the firing squad option or does that violate state rules for smoking in a state facility?

kevinpate
04-01-2014, 08:07 PM
The AG has provided information on the drugs that are planned to be used in the executions set later this month.
Attorney General reveals drugs to be used - News9.com - Oklahoma City, OK - News, Weather, Video and Sports | (http://www.news9.com/story/25133176/attorney-general-reveals-drugs-to-be-used)

kevinpate
04-22-2014, 06:54 AM
The two executions set this month have been stayed ... by the state supreme court, quite unusual all in all.



The 5-4 ruling came after the state Supreme Court had twice told the Oklahoma Court of Criminal Appeals it had the jurisdiction to delay the executions. Both times, the criminal appeals court denied it had that authority. In total, the request for a stay bounced between four different state and federal courts.
“Here, the Court of Criminal Appeals’ refused to exercise its rightfully placed jurisdiction, and left this Court in an awkward position,” the justices wrote in their decision. “We can deny jurisdiction, or we can leave the appellants with no access to the courts for resolution of their “grave” constitutional claims. As uncomfortable as this matter makes us, we refuse to violate our oaths of office and to leave the appellants with no access to the courts, their constitutionally guaranteed measure.”



Source:
Oklahoma Supreme Court stays executions of two inmates | News OK (http://newsok.com/oklahoma-supreme-court-stays-executions-of-two-inmates/article/4190708)

CuatrodeMayo
04-22-2014, 07:07 AM
From what I understand, this just became a really big deal.

Jeepnokc
04-22-2014, 07:48 AM
Most people don't realize our appellate system in OK. All criminal cases are appealed to the Oklahoma Court of Criminal Appeals. There is no appeal to the OK Supreme Court on criminal cases. The Court of Criminal Appeals is basically the Criminal Supreme Court in OK or Court of last resort in OK for lack of better definition. On the civil side, you do not appeal to the Court of Civil Appeals but to the Oklahoma Supreme Court directly and they either keep jurisdiction or send down to the Court of Civil Appeals. If you don't like the decision from the Court of Civil Appeals, then you can file a Petition for the Supreme Court to review it.

I have not followed this that closely but from what I am gathering, the Supreme Court basically said they didn't have jurisdiction and that the Ct Of Criminal Appeals had to review it but they said they didn't have jurisdiction and kicked it back to the Supremes. I have not read the opinion but my take from the paper was that the Supremes issued the stay because they wanted to make sure that the defendants had their constitutional right to access to the courts provided to them and it wasn't being done when the two appellate courts in OK were both saying that it wasn't them.

That is a very brief run down off the top of my head. Some of the other legal beagles on here like Kevin or Midtowner may be able to give more detail if they have read the opinion. We have an interesting situation with two different appellate branches. We sometimes will get conflicting opinions from the different courts interpreting the same statutes. For example, in DUI cases, the Crims will interpret the meaning of public parking lot for purpose of whether you can get a DUI there in criminal cases. However, with DUIs. you also have the drivers license case which is a civil case and we have case law from the Civil appellate courts that provided a different interpretation of what public parking lot meant for DUIs when dealing with taking the license for DUI.

kevinpate
04-22-2014, 08:12 AM
If memory serves, only OK and TX currently utilize a separate criminal appellate court of last resort. A while back there was a third state that did as well. Possibly it was LA, but I do not recall right off.

I haven't seen any of the briefs or the orders here. From the press, it appears the current litigation over the drugs and protocols is presently on appeal to the state supreme court. The state court kicked the question about a stay of execution to the criminal appellate court, apparently twice. Court of Criminal Appeals decided each time it lacks authority to act on a stay, notwithstanding the state supreme court advising it does have the authority. So, the state supreme court decided they do not like it much, but they stepped in and issued a stay on a 5-4 decision. The stay is in place until the litigation pending with the supreme court is resolved.

The AG is unhappy. Neither appellate court seems particularly happy. The DR inmates and their attorneys are undoubtedly more happy.

And, somewhere, over on the 4th and 5th floor of the capitol, it is possible certain folk who desperately want to meddle in the independence of the judiciary may be licking their chops and hoping to feast on the matter.

kevinpate
04-23-2014, 09:11 PM
And now NewsOK reports that in a unanimous decision today the state supreme court decided to dissolve the stay it put into place earlier this week.
The article is a stub really. Not much detail at all. Perhaps more will come by morning.

source: Supreme Court rules executions can proceed | News OK (http://newsok.com/supreme-court-rules-executions-can-proceed/article/4412355)

on edit: I have not seen the order and am uncertain from the docket whether the court dissolved their own stay, or dissolved the one week only stay purported granted by the gov. to Lockett only.

So yeah, hopefully more to follow.

on edit part deux: Since the docket is listing an opinion and not simply an order, I think they have dissolved their own stay, which had covered both inmates.

Dubya61
04-24-2014, 10:54 AM
I understand that there should be no part of government void of checks or balances, but I hope these judges didn't decide to / weren't persuaded to dissolve their own stay to avoid becoming political fodder for some.

kevinpate
04-24-2014, 12:14 PM
No. There is a more complete article on NewsOk now. Just been too busy to review til now.

The Supreme court decided the underlying claims, and the decision was not favorable to the claims raised by the two inmates.

The court reversed the district court decision regarding the constitutionality of the challenged statute. The case being resolved, the reason for granting the stays of execution, which were granted pending a resolution of the case, was no longer in play.

So the court dissolved the stays. Both inmates are now set to be executed on next Tuesday.

source: Oklahoma Supreme Court lets executions go forward | News OK (http://newsok.com/oklahoma-supreme-court-lets-executions-go-forward/article/4412423)

Of Sound Mind
04-24-2014, 01:43 PM
I understand that there should be no part of government void of checks or balances, but I hope these judges didn't decide to / weren't persuaded to dissolve their own stay to avoid becoming political fodder for some.
The Oklahoma Supreme Court doesn't care, especially when it comes to the legislature.

TheTravellers
04-24-2014, 02:46 PM
The Oklahoma Supreme Court doesn't care, especially when it comes to the legislature.

Actually, I think they do, they've smacked down the OK legislature many times.

Of Sound Mind
04-24-2014, 02:55 PM
That was my point. They aren't scared of the legislature or their politics.

TheTravellers
04-25-2014, 10:08 AM
That was my point. They aren't scared of the legislature or their politics.

Ah, right, I read it as "they don't care about doing their job", sorry, carry on... And they got their own reprieve with the killing of SJR21, just recently, which is nice to see the OK legislature doing something right for a change!

TheTravellers
04-29-2014, 07:03 PM
Front page of Huffington Post, above the fold. Just f-ing great, way to go, OK!

Oklahoma Botches Clayton Lockett's Execution (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/04/29/oklahoma-clayton-lockett-execution_n_5236297.html)

Just stop the death penalty, be civilized....

zookeeper
04-29-2014, 07:10 PM
Life in Prison with No Parole is a far bigger punishment than death. We shouldn't be in the execution business in 2014. These men don't deserve to live, but they don't deserve to die and end their pain either.

Breaking all over the major news sites:
CNN: Oklahoma authorities stopped one execution and postponed another after botching the delivery of drugs. (http://www.cnn.com/2014/04/29/us/oklahoma-botched-execution/index.html)

From Channel 4...a timeline...

NewsChannel 4′s Courtney Francisco was a witness to the scheduled execution, she provided the following time line:
6:23 PM – Prison officials raise the blinds. Execution begins.
6:28 PM – Inmate shivering, sheet shaking. Breathing deep.
6:29 PM – Inmate blinking and gritting his teeth. Adjusts his head.
6:30 PM – Prison officials check to see if inmate is unconscious. Doctor says “He’s not unconscious”. Inmate says “I’m not.” Female prison official says, “Mr. Lockett is not unconscious.”
6:32 PM – Inmate’s breathing is normal, mouth open, eyes shut. For a second time, prison officials check to see if inmate is unconscious.
6:33 PM – Doctor says, “He is unconscious”. Prison official says “Mr. Lockett is unconscious.”
6:34 PM – Inmate’s mouth twitches. No sign of breathing.
6:35 PM – Mouth movement.
6:36 PM – Inmate’s head moves from side to side, then lifts his head off the bed.
6:37 PM – Inmate lifts his head and feet slightly off the bed. Inmate tries to say something, mumbles while moving body.
6:38 pm – More movement by the inmate. At this point the inmate is breathing heavily and appears to be struggling.
6:39 PM – Inmate tries to talk. Says “Man” and appears to be trying to get up. Doctor checks on inmate. Female prison official says, “We are going to lower the blinds temporarily”. Prison phone rings. Director of Prisons, Robert Patton answers the phone and leaves the room – taking three state officials with him.
Minutes later – The Director Of Prisons comes back into the room and tells the eyewitnesses that there has been a vein failure. He says, “The chemical did not make it into the vein of the prisoner. Under my authority, we are issuing a stay of execution.”

Inmate dies of massive heart attack 30-minutes later. Second execution scheduled for tonight is cancelled.

kevinpate
04-29-2014, 08:52 PM
I want to claim shock and surprise at tonight's execution being fubar. Alas, I can not.

Like his current counsel, I have great difficulty with the vein explanation as the source of the problems earlier this evening.

soonerguru
04-29-2014, 09:24 PM
This is a black eye for Oklahoma. We are going to be the subject of many breathless national news stories, and we will deserve it. Thank you Mary Fallin.

Achilleslastand
04-29-2014, 09:41 PM
Not that I have one iota of sympathy for the executed but this is embarrassing for the state.

LocoAko
04-29-2014, 11:16 PM
This is a black eye for Oklahoma. We are going to be the subject of many breathless national news stories, and we will deserve it. Thank you Mary Fallin.

Yep. I already see people nationwide talking about what a barbaric, backwards state we are, furthering their already held low opinions of us.

The article I read on this was disturbing from top to bottom. The criminals, the way this transpired, everything. Very unnerving. Even the fact that there was a $15 maximum on a final meal made me uncomfortable. The entire process is just awful.

MsProudSooner
04-30-2014, 06:25 AM
I'm not an 'anti-death penalty' person, but if you are going to execute someone, do it quickly. We put down rabid animals more humanely than what was described on the news.

Jeepnokc
04-30-2014, 06:41 AM
Although I don't believe anyone is claiming either Warner or Lockett was innocent, this article was released just a few days ago.

http://www.newsweek.com/one-25-executed-us-innocent-study-claims-248889

Head
04-30-2014, 07:32 AM
Oklahoma steps on it's conservative dick, again.

SoonerDave
04-30-2014, 07:51 AM
Given that the entire evolution of the "lethal drug cocktail" as a means of "humane" execution, I recall reading many years ago that military firing squads were trained to aim specifically at the heart of a condemned individual such that termination would be at or nearly instantaneous as a means to make the execution, in some vein, humane. Was wondering if anyone knew how this was eventually found to be inhumane? Surely seems preferable to the debacle that occurred last night.

Midtowner
04-30-2014, 08:47 AM
On the one hand, Karma is a b****. On the other hand, even the convicted murderer has a right not to be tortured to death. From what I've picked up, now that the cocktail itself has been disclosed, a lot of medical experts are saying that there are problems with the particular drugs the state was using. Hopefully, we all remember Fallin and the legislature's hand in forcing this execution forward when the condemned were merely exercising their constitutional right to know what they were being executed with and to have a court determine whether it was permissible under the 8th Amendment.

onthestrip
04-30-2014, 09:12 AM
I rail on the Oklahoma political climate quite a bit but this has to be the biggest black eye on our state. The state taking someones life is something that should not be taken lightly. The criminal was an evil killer, the state is not.

jn1780
04-30-2014, 09:34 AM
Given that the entire evolution of the "lethal drug cocktail" as a means of "humane" execution, I recall reading many years ago that military firing squads were trained to aim specifically at the heart of a condemned individual such that termination would be at or nearly instantaneous as a means to make the execution, in some vein, humane. Was wondering if anyone knew how this was eventually found to be inhumane? Surely seems preferable to the debacle that occurred last night.

Right, we made it less "humane" trying to be "humane".

BBatesokc
04-30-2014, 05:08 PM
Cash-Strapped Oklahoma To Conduct Executions By Hammering Squad | The Onion - America's Finest News Source (http://www.theonion.com/articles/cashstrapped-oklahoma-to-conduct-executions-by-ham,21233/?utm_source=Facebook&utm_medium=SocialMarketing&utm_campaign=LinkPreview:NA:InFocus)

kelroy55
04-30-2014, 05:25 PM
Cash-Strapped Oklahoma To Conduct Executions By Hammering Squad | The Onion - America's Finest News Source (http://www.theonion.com/articles/cashstrapped-oklahoma-to-conduct-executions-by-ham,21233/?utm_source=Facebook&utm_medium=SocialMarketing&utm_campaign=LinkPreview:NA:InFocus)

Don't give them any ideas.

kelroy55
04-30-2014, 05:26 PM
Cash-Strapped Oklahoma To Conduct Executions By Hammering Squad | The Onion - America's Finest News Source (http://www.theonion.com/articles/cashstrapped-oklahoma-to-conduct-executions-by-ham,21233/?utm_source=Facebook&utm_medium=SocialMarketing&utm_campaign=LinkPreview:NA:InFocus)

Don't give them any ideas.

Uncle Slayton
04-30-2014, 05:48 PM
Knowing I'll probably have to endure gratuitous comments about justice v. revenge, I'll say up front, I'm OK w/ revenge being exacted. This guy was a four time felon who shot a 19 year old with a sawed off shotgun and watched as she was buried alive. (this leaves off the discussion of forcible oral sodomy, rape, kidnapping and armed robbery). I can't seem to muster up even a single tiny iota of "give a sh*t" about whether he felt discomfort or fear. In fact, I hope the sensation he felt was some combination of boiling battery acid in which was suspended broken glass and salt.

If there's a hell, I hope his nuts are the main course at a demonic barbecue.

And the baby raper who got a two week stay? Substitute the chemical they gave the first guy with Liquid Plumr and insert the needle in a vein somewhere much lower than his arm.

Cocaine
04-30-2014, 06:23 PM
Yeah this execution should never had happened with the drugs they chose. Especially considering this just happened in Ohio a few months ago. I didn't even know they went ahead with the execution until I heard about how they totally messed it up. O well I guess that's what happens when elect idiots to office who think it's okay to test new ways to execute people. I'm also pretty sure this qualifies as a cruel punishment. I'm not even against the death penalty but it was apparent before this execution happened that it might not be a good idea to use the drugs the state chose.

Also anyone that cries about the rights of the victim that Lockett killed her rights were violated but that doesn't mean the state Oklahoma has the right to violate Lockett's rights by the way they executed him. Okurahoma Shu Hitoshi Lockett Je Nai Desu.


Oklahoma decided to lethally inject Lockett and Warner with midazolam ,which acts as a sedative and is also used as an anti-seizure drug, followed by vecuronium bromide and potassium chloride. Florida has used a similar method but it employed a dose of midazolam five times greater. Ohio used midazolam alongside a different drug, hydromorphone, in the January execution of Dennis McGuire, which took more than 20 minutes.

Oklahoma execution: Clayton Lockett writhes on gurney in botched procedure | World news | theguardian.com (http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/apr/30/oklahoma-execution-botched-clayton-lockett)

So did anyone ever find out which pharmaceutical company the state bought these drugs from?

ljbab728
04-30-2014, 11:24 PM
Another disturbing account of what may have happened in this farce of an execution.

How Oklahoma's execution drugs work | News OK (http://newsok.com/how-oklahomas-execution-drugs-work/article/4744785)


The three drugs used in a botched execution of convicted killer Clayton Derrell Lockett on Tuesday likely did not perform as intended, potentially leaving him “paralyzed and burning” until his death, one pharmacology expert said Wednesday.
“The drugs, as the order in which they’re given, serve two purposes: for one, it is to cause minimal pain and suffering to the person being executed, but two, it's also for the audience to not observe any distress in the person being executed because it can be interpreted being cruel,” pharmacologist David Kroll said.


Kroll said he assumed that Lockett got an incomplete dosage of the three drugs.

“I'm inclined to assume that one of the veins blew during the midazolam injection — he would've gotten a substandard dose of midazolam, mostly in only one arm, leaving him partly conscious. Then, the subsequent vecuronium and potassium chloride would’ve only gone in via one arm. So he would’ve been partly conscious of the (partial) respiratory paralysis and felt the burning and muscle effects of the partial potassium chloride overdose. That would explain the account that he ‘kicked his right leg and his head rolled to one side’ and then ‘began writhing and bucking’ as though he were trying to get up,” Kroll said, quoting media reports of what happened during the execution.

Kroll said some media outlets have reported that what happened Tuesday night was due, in part, to the “untested” or “secret” drug combination used.

TheTravellers
05-01-2014, 09:35 AM
Knowing I'll probably have to endure gratuitous comments about justice v. revenge, I'll say up front, I'm OK w/ revenge being exacted. This guy was a four time felon who shot a 19 year old with a sawed off shotgun and watched as she was buried alive. (this leaves off the discussion of forcible oral sodomy, rape, kidnapping and armed robbery). I can't seem to muster up even a single tiny iota of "give a sh*t" about whether he felt discomfort or fear. In fact, I hope the sensation he felt was some combination of boiling battery acid in which was suspended broken glass and salt.

If there's a hell, I hope his nuts are the main course at a demonic barbecue.

And the baby raper who got a two week stay? Substitute the chemical they gave the first guy with Liquid Plumr and insert the needle in a vein somewhere much lower than his arm.

Why don't we just go to a method where the victim's family kills the accused/killer? Take the "state" out of it entirely, sort of like a duel in the old days. That way, it's pure revenge if you want it so bad. Which is all the death penalty is, it's not a deterrent to other criminals, it's not less expensive, there is pretty much absolutely no positive aspect to the death penalty except "I got my revenge".

Jeepnokc
05-01-2014, 09:49 AM
Knowing I'll probably have to endure gratuitous comments about justice v. revenge, I'll say up front, I'm OK w/ revenge being exacted. This guy was a four time felon who shot a 19 year old with a sawed off shotgun and watched as she was buried alive. (this leaves off the discussion of forcible oral sodomy, rape, kidnapping and armed robbery). I can't seem to muster up even a single tiny iota of "give a sh*t" about whether he felt discomfort or fear. In fact, I hope the sensation he felt was some combination of boiling battery acid in which was suspended broken glass and salt.

If there's a hell, I hope his nuts are the main course at a demonic barbecue.

And the baby raper who got a two week stay? Substitute the chemical they gave the first guy with Liquid Plumr and insert the needle in a vein somewhere much lower than his arm.

Revenge has no place in the judicial system

TheTravellers
05-01-2014, 10:41 AM
Inhofe says executions should not be postponed until the investigation is over, and Coburn says he thinks the death penalty is still a deterrent.
So wrong. Be nice if we could get Inhofe out, since Coburn's leaving. I'm scared sh**less that Mike Turner (“Second Amendment Rights are sacred in Oklahoma, and there’s no negotiation.”) will get elected and would expect Inhofe's replacement to be just as bad. Kill, baby, kill!!!!!

Jersey Boss
05-01-2014, 10:42 AM
Revenge has no place in the judicial system

Exactly right about that. We do not have the state burn down the house of a convicted arsonist, nor does the state have a designated procedure to rape a rapist.

TheTravellers
05-01-2014, 06:02 PM
And now it's world news...

Oklahoma inmate Tasered by prison staff on day of botched execution | World news | The Guardian (http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/may/01/oklahoma-clayton-lockett-tasered-before-botched-execution)

They talk about "getting it right" and "proven execution protocols" - sick and disgusting. Meanwhile, the rest of the civilized world doesn't execute people, and we're in the company of Iraq, North Korea, Somalia, Iran and other wonderful countries, and 18 states have abolished it, and of the 32 left, not that many actually execute people, and studies now show that innocent people have likely been executed. How about instead of finding better ways to kill people "humanely", we just stop?

zookeeper
05-01-2014, 10:18 PM
And now it's world news...

Oklahoma inmate Tasered by prison staff on day of botched execution | World news | The Guardian (http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/may/01/oklahoma-clayton-lockett-tasered-before-botched-execution)

They talk about "getting it right" and "proven execution protocols" - sick and disgusting. Meanwhile, the rest of the civilized world doesn't execute people, and we're in the company of Iraq, North Korea, Somalia, Iran and other wonderful countries, and 18 states have abolished it, and of the 32 left, not that many actually execute people, and studies now show that innocent people have likely been executed. How about instead of finding better ways to kill people "humanely", we just stop?

No question we've killed innocent people in Oklahoma. Right here from Oklahoma County when a certain DA was more interested in conspiring with the forensics lady and setting up suspects, more interested in his cowboy image and re-election than justice. How those two stayed out of prison still boggles the mind. Macy withheld more evidence of innocence than maybe any DA from a city this size. It was scandalous. A lot of people knew it was going on, but it wasn't until he was old and sick that things began to dribble out. He had loyal ADA's that should have spoken out. They know who they are. Of course, those under his reign ended up getting caught later after thinking that was just how things were done. ADA Brad Miller is one I know went to prison, others come to mind.

hoya
05-02-2014, 05:25 AM
Brad Miller did not go to prison. He had his license suspended for one year.

zookeeper
05-02-2014, 10:02 AM
Brad Miller did not go to prison. He had his license suspended for one year.

It was a suspended sentence? And only a suspension? Who else am I thinking of?

hoya
05-02-2014, 10:45 AM
He wasn't ever charged with a crime, he just had his license suspended.

zookeeper
05-02-2014, 11:11 AM
He wasn't ever charged with a crime, he just had his license suspended.

You are right. The Oklahoma State Bar wanted Miller disbarred. The "Everyone Did It" defense came into play and Miller won out last year. His one-year suspension was considered scandalous in law circles all over the country. (Just Google it) Here is Jonathan Turley's blog post on the subject:
The Everyone-Did-It Defense: Oklahoma Supreme Court Refuses To Disbar Former Prosecutor Who Withheld Evidence in Capital Cases and Used False Subpoenas | JONATHAN TURLEY (http://jonathanturley.org/2013/07/01/the-everyone-did-it-defense-oklahoma-supreme-court-refuses-to-disbar-former-prosecutor-who-withheld-evidence-in-capital-cases-and-used-false-subpoenas/)

THERE is the ethics in the Oklahoma County DA's office regarding capital crimes. Yes, we've killed innocent people. How can Brad Miller (and others in that office under Macy) sleep at night?

In fairness disclaimer: I had dealings with Brad Miller in 1997 that showed me - up close and personal - just how corrupt that office was. It had nothing to do with me personally, but I was involved in the process. I saw it and it was disgusting. The fact that many of those from his office are now judges should shake us all up. There's still a big book to be written on the Bob Macy and associates years in Oklahoma County.

kevinpate
05-02-2014, 01:40 PM
... Yes, we've killed innocent people. ...

As definitive a statement as I have seen in print. Their names were?
No, you're not really expected to answer. That decision is for you to make, the same as your decision to make the above declaration.

Midtowner
05-02-2014, 01:48 PM
Messing with the process like Miller did should have resulted in his disbarment. Just last year, a defense attorney, Mark Clayborne got his ticket punched for being convicted (and is still out on appeal) of suborning perjury. What's the real difference?

KenRagsdale
05-02-2014, 02:22 PM
I have a layman's perspective on the judicial system, admittedly all civil proceedings. I am conservative politically, culturally and theologically. That stipulated, I don't want some government killing anyone on my behalf, except for those times of national preservation. As a conservative, I'm aware that governments can not only misuse power, but also make life-altering mistakes which significantly impact specific parties and the governed as a whole. If money or property are abused by government entities, redress is available in the courts or through the legislative process. Once an execution occurs, there is no "reset" button. I do not come to this decision lightly.

Stew
05-02-2014, 02:24 PM
I have a layman's perspective on the judicial system, admittedly all civil proceedings. I am conservative politically, culturally and theologically. That stipulated, I don't want some government killing anyone on my behalf, except for those times of national preservation. As a conservative, I'm aware that governments can not only misuse power, but also make life-altering mistakes which significantly impact specific parties and the governed as a whole. If money or property are abused by government entities, redress is available in the courts or through the legislative process. Once an execution occurs, there is no "reset" button. I do not come to this decision lightly.

That's exactly how I see it. Well said.

Achilleslastand
05-02-2014, 03:13 PM
As Gomer Pyle would say "surprise surprise" look whos playing the race card.
racial bias?
uneven application of the death penalty?

Obama Asks AG Eric Holder To Review Oklahoma Execution - News9.com - Oklahoma City, OK - News, Weather, Video and Sports | (http://www.news9.com/story/25414334/obama-asks-ag-eric-holder-to-review-oklahoma-execution)

kevinpate
05-02-2014, 04:44 PM
Even in light of advances in science and technology, and some day soon, perhaps in spite of or because of scientific advances, errors can, and do, happen in the process we call the justice system.

Some errors are truly mistakes. Some are intentionally introduced. Science may reveal some errors. Hard work, and a fair amount of luck, may reveal other errors. And yes, it is possible some errors will either not be discovered in time, or at all.

I have shaken hands, conversed, listened to and embraced many individuals who once resided in a death row cell. Some have been executed. Some are no longer on death row, but are incarcerated on a different sentence or sentences. Some I have met have ultimately walked from prison and into society as free men. People who were wrongfully accused, tried, convicted, sentenced to death. People who as death row inmates were denied relief on appeal more than once in the court system. People who were spared from execution and incarceration because truth eventually emerged from the shadows of the lies.

For these latter individuals in particular, I am grateful the criminal justice system proceeds more slowly, and with more caution, than the take 'em out back and hang 'em in the courthouse parking lot crowd would clearly prefer.

Dennis Heaton
05-02-2014, 06:09 PM
7701

Cocaine
05-04-2014, 03:23 PM
Exactly I never understood why the state of Oklahoma would try to execute someone with an uproven method. O well I think the DOJ is looking for someone.

kevinpate
05-04-2014, 04:06 PM
In the interest of accuracy, the chemical agents designated for use in this most recent execution are, if memory serves, the same chemical combination already in use in Florida. I am not certain whether the OK protocols use the same concentration and volume of each chemical.

mugofbeer
05-04-2014, 09:12 PM
As Gomer Pyle would say "surprise surprise" look whos playing the race card.
racial bias?
uneven application of the death penalty?

Obama Asks AG Eric Holder To Review Oklahoma Execution - News9.com - Oklahoma City, OK - News, Weather, Video and Sports | (http://www.news9.com/story/25414334/obama-asks-ag-eric-holder-to-review-oklahoma-execution)

This would have garnered some low odds if Vegas were putting bets on this action being taken.

TheTravellers
05-29-2014, 01:46 PM
WARNING: GRAPHIC PHOTOS

I haven't seen the pics because our proxy at work sometimes blocks images, depending on where they're served from, but from the descriptions, they're probably pretty horrible. Turn image loading off if you don't want to see them, but everybody should at least read the article. As I've said before, why don't we just stop wasting time and money trying to find a better way to kill people and just not do it?

Lethal Injection Photos: Angel Diaz's Botched Execution in Florida | New Republic (http://www.newrepublic.com/article/117898/lethal-injection-photos-angel-diazs-botched-execution-florida)

Achilleslastand
05-29-2014, 02:17 PM
I am willing to bet the "graphic photos" pale in comparison to that of the victims....

Nothing to see here other then an article trying to turn a murderer into a "poor victim".

Bunty
05-29-2014, 02:27 PM
WARNING: GRAPHIC PHOTOS

I haven't seen the pics because our proxy at work sometimes blocks images, depending on where they're served from, but from the descriptions, they're probably pretty horrible. Turn image loading off if you don't want to see them, but everybody should at least read the article. As I've said before, why don't we just stop wasting time and money trying to find a better way to kill people and just not do it?



Surely, plenty of people believe that human evil can venture to such extreme extents and needs removed from the face of the earth so bad, that it is worth occasionally sacrificing an innocent person by mistake or false accusation.