Global city - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Global_city)

I found this article interesting.

What does OKC have to do to be considered a global city

If NYC collapsed, the global economy would probably suffer a collapse as well. If OKC collapsed, the world would go on. OKC is not nor ever will be a global city. Dallas or Houston isn't even a global city, imo. The only "global city" in the U.S. is NYC, imo. L.A. is certainly a player, but I don't think the global economy would be much impacted except for some media, but most of that is even in NYC, so I don't think L.A. would be a global city, that is just my opinion of course. I see about two or three global cities in the world.

Keep in mind, I haven't read the article yet, so I'm not sure how many they include.

Global city - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Global_city)

I found this article interesting.

What does OKC have to do to be considered a global city

Transport to an alternative universe.

OKVision is that you?

No. I'm Mustangvision.

Sorry I was referring to OP

I think the question was more along the lines of how to get on the list, seeing as Tulsa and Des Moines are on the list under sufficiency and OKC isn't.

I think the question was more along the lines of how to get on the list, seeing as Tulsa and Des Moines are on the list under sufficiency and OKC isn't.

this

I think the question was more along the lines of how to get on the list, seeing as Tulsa and Des Moines are on the list under sufficiency and OKC isn't.

I've wondered this myself. The only thing I can think of is OKC may be either too reliant on DFW for sufficiency status or the deciders simply have a bias against OKC based off what this city was 20 years ago.

Sorry I was referring to OP

Oops. My bad.

Cities of Suffcien*cy
Italy Florence
South Africa Pretoria
France Toulouse
Denmark Aarhus
United States San Antonio
Germany Bremen
United States Nashville
Italy Bologna
Australia Canberra
Japan Nagoya
United States Sacramento
United States Providence
Angola Luanda
China Dalian
United Kingdom Liverpool
United States Jacksonville
Mexico Puebla
Taiwan Kaohsiung
Belarus Minsk
Austria Linz
Georgia (country) Tbilisi
United States Las Vegas
Mozambique Maputo
Zimbabwe Harare
United Kingdom Cardiff
China Xiamen
United States Birmingham
Mexico Leon
Trinidad and Tobago Port of Spain
Malaysia Penang
United States Memphis
United Kingdom Aberdeen
Nigeria Abuja
Germany Hanover
Indonesia Surabaya
Switzerland Bern
Canada Halifax
Mexico Ciudad Juárez
Egypt Alexandria
France Bordeaux
Cambodia Phnom Penh
Canada Winnipeg
Colombia Cali
United States Greensboro
Italy Genoa
Colombia Medellín
Spain Santa Cruz
France Montpellier
Argentina Córdoba
China Wuhan
Austria Graz
Israel Jerusalem
United States New Orleans
United States Rochester
France Nice
South Korea Busan
Namibia Windhoek
Saudi Arabia Dammam
New Zealand Christchurch
Brazil Recife
Uzbekistan Tashkent
Bermuda Hamilton
Iceland Reykjavik
Italy Naples
United States Tulsa
Germany Ludwigshafen
Jamaica Kingston
Brazil Brasília
Malaysia Johor Baharu
China Xi'an
Macau Macau
Japan Fukuoka
United Kingdom Sheffield
Turkey İzmir
United Kingdom Nottingham
United States Des Moines
Brazil Campinas
Moldova Chisinau
Israel Haifa
United States Madison
Armenia Yerevan
Philippines Cebu
Malaysia Labuan
Brazil Salvador

I've wondered this myself. The only thing I can think of is OKC may be either too reliant on DFW for sufficiency status or the deciders simply have a bias against OKC based off what this city was 20 years ago.
Yeah, Tulsa is a crappy city. It is truly one of the worst cities I've ever been. I'd prefer Memphis over Tulsa. The city really isn't going anywhere and has a few cool projects, but overall, Tulsa is garbage. That is just my opinion, and I've stated it before and was criticized because of it, and that's fine, but it sticks.

Las Vegas and Washington D.C. are two cities I would put under a "special" category.

Tulsa is hardly a "garbage city." The knock on Tulsa over the past couple of decades has been downtown stagnation and the urban/suburban economic divide, and that is certainly not the case either, these days. They have quite a few enviable projects in their core. They also have an outsized quality-of-life in a few areas such as their music scene and upscale shopping, playing well above where their population should dictate.

Regarding Des Moines, though I haven't been I think most of us would be surprised by it based on what I know about it. When I briefly worked for Downtown OKC Inc., I attended the International Downtown Association conference in Los Angeles in 2000. One of the things that I recall most about that conference is that a huge number of the presentations and breakout sessions were being conducted by people from the Des Moines downtown association, and that they were incredibly respected by everyone there.

They enjoyed an EXCELLENT reputation for the work they were doing downtown, and I recall sitting in sessions with people from places like the Times Square BID, downtown Seattle, The Downtown Denver Partnership and the LA Fashion District, all who were paying rapt attention to a bunch of hicks from little ol' Des Moines telling the story of their downtown revitalization. That stuck with me. I suspect it's probably a city much like OKC, with not a lot of national/international rep but with a bunch of great things going on downtown.

That said, it is puzzling why those cities would be included in this list and OKC not, and I would again think it goes back to reputation and the poor (or invisible) profile that OKC has suffered from for many years. I think that is rapidly changing though.

I agree. Tulsa isn't a garbage city at all. Like it or not, they are ahead of OKC significantly in a few but important quality of life issues, most namely live music and upscale shopping. With that plus their prestigious art museums, I can definitely see how they made the list. Des Moines on the other hand is a baffling one. Regardless of how much development is going on there, its still a metro area of less than 600,000 people. I have a hard time believing they have many amenities that OKC does not. One city I am surprised also didn't make the list is Louisville. Louisville is nicer than Tulsa and is the kind of city OKC is becoming but they are about 5-10 years ahead of us.

Tulsa is hardly a "garbage city." The knock on Tulsa over the past couple of decades has been downtown stagnation and the urban/suburban economic divide, and that is certainly not the case either, these days. They have quite a few enviable projects in their core. They also have an outsized quality-of-life in a few areas such as their music scene and upscale shopping, playing well above where their population should dictate.

Regarding Des Moines, though I haven't been I think most of us would be surprised by it based on what I know about it. When I briefly worked for Downtown OKC Inc., I attended the International Downtown Association conference in Los Angeles in 2000. One of the things that I recall most about that conference is that a huge number of the presentations and breakout sessions were being conducted by people from the Des Moines downtown association, and that they were incredibly respected by everyone there.

They enjoyed an EXCELLENT reputation for the work they were doing downtown, and I recall sitting in sessions with people from places like the Times Square BID, downtown Seattle, The Downtown Denver Partnership and the LA Fashion District, all who were paying rapt attention to a bunch of hicks from little ol' Des Moines telling the story of their downtown revitalization. That stuck with me. I suspect it's probably a city much like OKC, with not a lot of national/international rep but with a bunch of great things going on downtown.

That said, it is puzzling why those cities would be included in this list and OKC not, and I would again think it goes back to reputation and the poor (or invisible) profile that OKC has suffered from for many years. I think that is rapidly changing though.I disagree with you on this. Tulsa is garbage in my opinion. Of course, some could say the same thing about Dallas I suppose, so it is all in a matter of opinion.

Is this a list we really need to be concerned about being on. How many people reference this list? Of those that do, How many move past Alpha++ or the Alpha + section and go all the way down to find Tulsa and Des Moines? How many people base their perception of a city on this list? How many people are even aware of the list?

This list was posted awhile back I think. Although I agree with this first part, I would add Tokyo.

Other than that though, I really don't think this list is that important. I think it is much better to be on lists ranking you among bets cities to do business in, bets cities for young professionals, best cities to move to, fastest growing city etc.

I disagree with you on this. Tulsa is garbage in my opinion. Of course, some could say the same thing about Dallas I suppose, so it is all in a matter of opinion.

We all have opinions. Some opinions just happen to be worth less than garbage.

Alright, that to, would be an opinion. ;)

Is this a list we really need to be concerned about being on. How many people reference this list? Of those that do, How many move past Alpha++ or the Alpha + section and go all the way down to find Tulsa and Des Moines? How many people base their perception of a city on this list? How many people are even aware of the list?

True. The only place I've seen where this list really holds any weight is in the City vs. City section of City-Data. This list lines up pretty closely with the perception of various cities on City-Data. In reality, it doesn't matter and most people or businesses potentially looking to locate in OKC aren't even going to consider this list.

True. The only place I've seen where this list really holds any weight is in the City vs. City section of City-Data. This list lines up pretty closely with the perception of various cities on City-Data. In reality, it doesn't matter and most people or businesses potentially looking to locate in OKC aren't even going to consider this list.I can promise you, about 90% of people that relocate to cities don't use forum websites to make a decision. So there is no reason we should be worried about whether or not OKC looks good on city data.

I can promise you, about 90% of people that relocate to cities don't use forum websites to make a decision. So there is no reason we should be worried about whether or not OKC looks good on city data.

I completely agree. Probably more like 99.5%.

I completely agree. Probably more like 99.5%.yeah, I was being conservative lol

It's funny how we'll dismiss certain lists as irrelevant while praising certain lists in that cast okc in a favorable light.

Instead of downplaying the importance of a Wikipedia list that has Des Moines and Tulsa and Madison in esteem why can't we accept it and strive for better? I think the former does nothing for our civic development. Just sarong "they're bias, using our perception for the last 20 years" does nothing. I've been to many of the 'sufficient' cities and they mostly feel more urban and cultured than the home town. What can we do to improve?

True. Birmingham is 'sufficient' and it is closer to Atlanta than OKC is to DFW. Would you say however that Birmingham feels more vibrant and cultured than OKC? What about Des Moines? Jacksonville? My guess would be yes but that may be my own bias and I haven't spent enough time in those cities to say for sure one way or another.

I wonder what role retail plays into this list. Oklahoma City's shopping especially on the upscale end is an absolute joke for a city this size. If that is taken into account I am sure that knocks some points off our overall score. The criteria for a city to be 'sufficient' is, per the article, "cities that have a sufficient degree of services so as to not be obviously dependent on world cities." If you live in OKC, chances are you take regular trips to Dallas to shop or to Tulsa to see a concert or live band play. I am sure that doesn't bode well for getting us on this list.

If you live in OKC, chances are you take regular trips to Dallas to shop or to Tulsa to see a concert or live band play. I am sure that doesn't bode well for getting us on this list.

I don't agree with this. Maybe some people do, but the large majority of my friends don't. The only time I make trips to either of those places is to see friends.

People in this city have a complex for lists. It ranks up there with the whole child minded complex I mentioned on the airport expansion thread with the whole "big league city" stupidity.


I don't agree with this. Maybe some people do, but the large majority of my friends don't. The only time I make trips to either of those places is to see friends.

I'm with you here. I go to Dallas for work and that's about it. Did the Dallas on the weekend thing plenty while younger...it's nothing special. I'll go to Chicago or Seattle if really need culture.

Yeah, let's make sure we get our culture fix not even understanding where or how culture even comes to be. That's real original, huh?

I don't agree with this. Maybe some people do, but the large majority of my friends don't. The only time I make trips to either of those places is to see friends.he said "chances are" and he's right. I know people that will even go to Tulsa(believe it or not) for a weekend shopping experience. Bchris is right and quite a bit of people go to Dallas at least once or twice a year strictly for a shopping experience.

he said "chances are" and he's right. I know people that will even go to Tulsa(believe it or not) for a weekend shopping experience. Bchris is right and quite a bit of people go to Dallas at least once or twice a year strictly for a shopping experience.

He said regular trips. Once or twice a year is not a regular trip. What stores do you refer to when you say weekend shopping trip to Tulsa?

He said regular trips. Once or twice a year is not a regular trip. What stores do you refer to when you say weekend shopping trip to Tulsa?I personally never have gone to Tulsa to shop, but I've quite a few people say they're going to Tulsa for a day of shopping. Why they would choose to go to that city, I'll never understand, but people do.

For regular, I don't know anyone who goes regularly though. I just thought Bcrhis meant like a few times a year. That is pretty bad for a city of 1.4 million people. We could and should have better shopping options here. It is only a matter of time though before stores like Nordstrom's open up here.

He said regular trips. Once or twice a year is not a regular trip. What stores do you refer to when you say weekend shopping trip to Tulsa?

I would say a few times per year is "regular trips." I never go to Tulsa and rarely go to Dallas but know a lot of people who do quite often.

I lived in the OKC area all of my life and I have never known anyone who told me anything about going to Tulsa to shop. The only people I ever hear say anything about shopping in Dallas were already going there for some other reason.

I lived in the OKC area all of my life and I have never known anyone who told me anything about going to Tulsa to shop. The only people I ever hear say anything about shopping in Dallas were already going there for some other reason.

People go to Tulsa all the time for live music and concerts, probably much moreso than shopping. If you are going to take a road trip to shop, you might as well go to Dallas.

People go to Tulsa all the time for live music and concerts, probably much moreso than shopping. If you are going to take a road trip to shop, you might as well go to Dallas.

I wasn't debating the music aspects, just the shopping.

I moved to OKC from Austin in 2005 and have been to Tulsa once in 2006 (to see Interpol at Cain's). I heard how great Tulsa was from my friends who were native to the NE part of the state and to say I was not impressed by my trip up there would be an understatement. IMO, Tulsa still lives off it's past reputation from longtime residents but OKC has way more going for it.

Also, I really don't know anyone that goes shopping in Dallas. I have a few friends that make a trip to IKEA once a year but for the most part, any retail OKC doesn't offer, we purchase online.

That Interpol show was actually Sept 2005. Best show I've ever seen at Cain's (of dozens) and one of my favorite of all time (of many hundreds, likely close to 1K).

Agree about Tulsa living in the past - especially when it comes to Tulsa/OKC comparisons - but it has seen a dramatic uptick in downtown redevelopment of late and is much-improved since you were last there. You owe yourself (and Tulsa) another visit.

I moved to OKC from Austin in 2005 and have been to Tulsa once in 2006 (to see Interpol at Cain's). I heard how great Tulsa was from my friends who were native to the NE part of the state and to say I was not impressed by my trip up there would be an understatement. IMO, Tulsa still lives off it's past reputation from longtime residents but OKC has way more going for it.

Also, I really don't know anyone that goes shopping in Dallas. I have a few friends that make a trip to IKEA once a year but for the most part, any retail OKC doesn't offer, we purchase online.

Yeah, in my experience IKEA is the only thing that specifically draws my friends down to Dallas in terms of shopping.

Coming from a larger city with much better retail, Costco, Harris Teeter, and IKEA are the stores I miss most. Unfortunately I believe the OKC metro would probably need to increase its population by 50% before there would be a chance of IKEA opening here.

It's funny how we'll dismiss certain lists as irrelevant while praising certain lists in that cast okc in a favorable light.

Instead of downplaying the importance of a Wikipedia list that has Des Moines and Tulsa and Madison in esteem why can't we accept it and strive for better? I think the former does nothing for our civic development. Just sarong "they're bias, using our perception for the last 20 years" does nothing. I've been to many of the 'sufficient' cities and they mostly feel more urban and cultured than the home town. What can we do to improve?

I take all lists with a grain of salt.

I definitely think we should try to make this city better but not with the end game of getting on some list. If we just chase list and try to put a check next to every box on a list's criteria then we won't be doing what's best for our city and for us. We'll be doing what someone else deems is best or important.

Make our city better and if we land on a list because of it, great.

I take all lists with a grain of salt.

I definitely think we should try to make this city better but not with the end game of getting on some list. If we just chase list and try to put a check next to every box on a list's criteria then we won't be doing what's best for our city and for us. We'll be doing what someone else deems is best or important.

Make our city better and if we land on a list because of it, great.

I think this list is a little different than something like a Forbes list which really don't amount to much other than positive (or negative) press. This list ranks all major cities worldwide based on set criteria, and if we were to go by this list, OKC compares unfavorably to the likes of Des Moines, Tulsa, and Birmingham Alabama. The question is why?

I think this list is a little different than something like a Forbes list which really don't amount to much other than positive (or negative) press. This list ranks all major cities worldwide based on set criteria, and if we were to go by this list, OKC compares unfavorably to the likes of Des Moines, Tulsa, and Birmingham Alabama. The question is why?

Which brings me back to my original question; How many people are going to notice that? Who's going to know that OKC ranks lower than those cities on this list? I looked at the list and after NYC and London, I stopped reading. And that's an honest question. If it turns out most people are aware of this list and read it through to the end, then I can see the conern for OKC not being on it. If OKC does get on that list, what will it do for the city? In what ways will it help?

Which brings me back to my original question; How many people are going to notice that? Who's going to know that OKC ranks lower than those cities on this list? I looked at the list and after NYC and London, I stopped reading. And that's an honest question. If it turns out most people are aware of this list and read it through to the end, then I can see the conern for OKC not being on it. If OKC does get on that list, what will it do for the city? In what ways will it help?

The end goal shouldn't be getting on this list because ultimately like you said, this isn't a list very many people care about so nobody is really going to know whether OKC is or is not on it except for statistics geeks. That said, improving quality of life in OKC to the point that I, and probably most others here would like to see should land us a place on the list by default. Des Moines is "sufficient" and their entire metro population is smaller than OKC's city population. I would be interested to know what metrics were used and where OKC falls short. From what I've gathered, this list appears to be more heavily focused on economics rather than cultural amenities. If anybody is familiar with Des Moines, it is a very sophisticated, white collar city and thus pulls well over its weight for its size.

Richmond is a very close peer city to OKC and they have achieved "high sufficiency" status. If anybody has been to Richmond its easy to see why, but there is no reason this city can't strive to reach that standard.

improving quality of life in OKC ...should land us a place on the list by default.

That's my point.

And I agree that it seems to focus almost entirely on economics. After reading that Wikipedia page again it looked as if that was the primary criteria. So having museums and neat places to eat etc. isn't going to have much if any impact on where you place on this list.

That Interpol show was actually Sept 2005. Best show I've ever seen at Cain's (of dozens) and one of my favorite of all time (of many hundreds, likely close to 1K).

Agree about Tulsa living in the past - especially when it comes to Tulsa/OKC comparisons - but it has seen a dramatic uptick in downtown redevelopment of late and is much-improved since you were last there. You owe yourself (and Tulsa) another visit.

Agree - it was a great show and Cain's is a good venue! I'll have to take your word on the rest. ;)

It's funny how we'll dismiss certain lists as irrelevant while praising certain lists in that cast okc in a favorable light.

Instead of downplaying the importance of a Wikipedia list that has Des Moines and Tulsa and Madison in esteem why can't we accept it and strive for better? I think the former does nothing for our civic development. Just sarong "they're bias, using our perception for the last 20 years" does nothing. I've been to many of the 'sufficient' cities and they mostly feel more urban and cultured than the home town. What can we do to improve?

Because some of those other lists people reference make meaningful comparisons based on the economies and the quality of living across different US cities.

This list gives hardly any justification for how it determines its rankings and is done by a random think tank based in the Geography department at Loughborough University in England. The only justification it gives for how it determines its rankings is "how these cities interact with each other in the context of globalization". Anything past the top 20 or so "global cities" is meaningless IMO. I mean come on, follow the link from the Wikipedia page to the GaWC website. It looks like it was designed by a 5th grader in the 90's.

Any city should always strive to improve, but this list shouldn't be the reason. This is a pretty meaningless list. Just my $0.02.

If you live in OKC, chances are you take regular trips to Dallas to shop or to Tulsa to see a concert or live band play. I am sure that doesn't bode well for getting us on this list.

You perpetuate this stereotype on here so much. I'm not from OKC, so I'll admit that I haven't grown up around people from OKC all my life, but I have to agree with andrewmperry. The people I know from OKC rarely take trips to Dallas and when they do it is to visit their college friends who live there. I don't know why you think upscale shopping is the be-all-end-all requirement you make it out to be anyways. How often do you think people shop? Heck, I would say that most people I know order things online more often than they buy them in the store these days.

You perpetuate this stereotype on here so much. I'm not from OKC, so I'll admit that I haven't grown up around people from OKC all my life, but I have to agree with andrewmperry. The people I know from OKC rarely take trips to Dallas and when they do it is to visit their college friends who live there. I don't know why you think upscale shopping is the be-all-end-all requirement you make it out to be anyways. How often do you think people shop? Heck, I would say that most people I know order things online more often than they buy them in the store these days.

I already explained that when I said "regular" trips I mean 2-3 times per year. I know quite a few people who do that. I personally have only been to Tulsa and Dallas once since moving to OKC.

I know people who make multiple trips to Europe every year. It doesn't mean it's a common practice for the majority of people in OKC.

Of course I'm a cheapass so luxury shopping means nothing to me. But you can still buy expensive crap in Oklahoma City. Hell you can buy a Patek Philippe watch at BC Clark if you really want. You know if you've got a spare quarter million dollars.

I'm much more interested in quality of life measurements. Better public transportation, better schools, things like that. With a strong economy and a growing population, if we increase those basic things, we'll get the other stuff you want. Make this a city where lots of people want to live.