View Full Version : If you make



kelroy55
02-28-2014, 04:57 PM
https://scontent-a-sjc.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/t1/1779745_774670725877241_1765628332_n.jpg

Dennis Heaton
02-28-2014, 05:03 PM
How much of that $4,000 in corporate subsidies is filtered back as political contributions?

kelroy55
02-28-2014, 05:13 PM
Wish I knew

Plutonic Panda
02-28-2014, 07:04 PM
Yes, I'm pissed off at the right people.

mugofbeer
02-28-2014, 08:39 PM
It would be interesting to get a complete list of corporations getting "subsidies." But i would also be interested in knowing what constitutes a "subsidy" in this case.

Dennis Heaton
02-28-2014, 09:04 PM
Yes, I'm pissed off at the right people.

You and me both, Plutonic Panda. But, the one's I'm pissed off aren't listed!

Just the facts
02-28-2014, 09:10 PM
It would be interesting to get a complete list of corporations getting "subsidies." But i would also be interested in knowing what constitutes a "subsidy" in this case.

That would be a really long list.

gjl
02-28-2014, 09:17 PM
These corporate subsidies...is that like the Government writes a check and sends it to them? Or are these just corporations taking legal tax deductions that are in the tax code written by the people's representatives?

mugofbeer
02-28-2014, 09:20 PM
That would be a really long list.

Which makes me wonder if to some people "subsidies" = tax break. The numbers seem a wee bit inflated.

Servicetech571
03-01-2014, 08:17 PM
135 Million workers in this country (http://www.bls.gov/news.release/empsit.nr0.htm), SSI/SSDI costs $144 BILLION (http://ftmdaily.com/daily-briefing/end-social-security-disability-fraud/). That's a little over $1,000 per worker for what is rapidly turning into a "secret welfare system" (http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-18560_162-57606172/okla-sen-u.s-disability-system-being-gamed/). The people who really need it are having a hard time getting help due to all the able bodied people ripping off the system.Nobody ever questions the able bodied people who are ripping off the system (http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/social-security-disability-insurance-needs-major-reform/2013/09/21/6efb945c-222f-11e3-a358-1144dee636dd_story.html), and the "secret welfare" (http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-18560_162-57606172/okla-sen-u.s-disability-system-being-gamed/) continues...

kelroy55
03-01-2014, 08:31 PM
135 Million workers in this country (http://www.bls.gov/news.release/empsit.nr0.htm), SSI/SSDI costs $144 BILLION (http://ftmdaily.com/daily-briefing/end-social-security-disability-fraud/). That's a little over $1,000 per worker for what is rapidly turning into a "secret welfare system" (http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-18560_162-57606172/okla-sen-u.s-disability-system-being-gamed/). The people who really need it are having a hard time getting help due to all the able bodied people ripping off the system.Nobody ever questions the able bodied people who are ripping off the system (http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/social-security-disability-insurance-needs-major-reform/2013/09/21/6efb945c-222f-11e3-a358-1144dee636dd_story.html), and the "secret welfare" (http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-18560_162-57606172/okla-sen-u.s-disability-system-being-gamed/) continues...

I agree 100% the disability system needs overhauled. There are those who really need it but too many scammers are screwing it up.

mmonroe
03-01-2014, 08:47 PM
Thats the same way I feel about people who use handicap placards to park in handicap spaces then get out and are perfectly capable of walking and then, for example at the grocery story, carry out a handful of grocery bags and open their own door with out putting anything down... or people who take their actually handicapped grandparent's placards to use in their own cars just so they can park closer to the door.

Servicetech571
03-02-2014, 05:35 AM
Thats the same way I feel about people who use handicap placards to park in handicap spaces then get out and are perfectly capable of walking and then, for example at the grocery story, carry out a handful of grocery bags and open their own door with out putting anything down... or people who take their actually handicapped grandparent's placards to use in their own cars just so they can park closer to the door.

Some people get injured, then get better later on. Once they are better they don't give up their handicap placards or SSDI/SSI checks.
If you knew you you didn't have to go back to work for LIFE without ever being questioned would you? Would you give up unquestioned front of the store parking?

There's actually a website for fighting handicap placard fraud (http://www.handicappedfraud.org/)

BBatesokc
03-02-2014, 06:42 AM
Thats the same way I feel about people who use handicap placards to park in handicap spaces then get out and are perfectly capable of walking and then, for example at the grocery story, carry out a handful of grocery bags and open their own door with out putting anything down... or people who take their actually handicapped grandparent's placards to use in their own cars just so they can park closer to the door.

I 100% agree with your outrage over placard fraud - that said, I cringe when people use your examples as the measuring tool.... "people who use handicap placards to park in handicap spaces then get out and are perfectly capable of walking and then, for example at the grocery story, carry out a handful of grocery bags and open their own door with out putting anything down..."

I had a relative who had a disability that was often very debilitating (won't go into details as they know I post here) and more than once they have been confronted by individuals who used your rule of measure. It made him feel very uncomfortable and like he owed these buffoons and explanation of his medical history - yet his card and his handicapped status were very real.

My father (until he died last November) was in his 80's, was awarded three purple hearts and had a handicapped placard because of multiple hip surgeries and a heart condition. He could walk to and from the store and push and load/unload his own cart. However, he still needed to park close.

Unfortunately, so many people abuse the system now that many people assume everyone is an abuser unless they are unloading a hovaround in the parking lot or are uncontrollably contorting as they drag themselves into the store.

BBatesokc
03-02-2014, 06:44 AM
Which makes me wonder if to some people "subsidies" = tax break. The numbers seem a wee bit inflated.

I assume Social Security was lumped in there - making the number even larger.

GaryOKC6
03-02-2014, 07:12 AM
135 Million workers in this country (http://www.bls.gov/news.release/empsit.nr0.htm), SSI/SSDI costs $144 BILLION (http://ftmdaily.com/daily-briefing/end-social-security-disability-fraud/). That's a little over $1,000 per worker for what is rapidly turning into a "secret welfare system" (http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-18560_162-57606172/okla-sen-u.s-disability-system-being-gamed/). The people who really need it are having a hard time getting help due to all the able bodied people ripping off the system.Nobody ever questions the able bodied people who are ripping off the system (http://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/social-security-disability-insurance-needs-major-reform/2013/09/21/6efb945c-222f-11e3-a358-1144dee636dd_story.html), and the "secret welfare" (http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-18560_162-57606172/okla-sen-u.s-disability-system-being-gamed/) continues...

I know several people who get the assistance and are perfect capable of working. They are just lazy and want to sit around all day and get paid. One of them lives in a gated apartment community, gets his rent paid from one source, his utilities from another, groceries from another and receives 2 checks from different agencies. I also know a single mom who works hard to feed her 2 kids. She gets not child support and is really struggling to care for them. She is told that she does not qualify for food stamps.

kevinpate
03-02-2014, 07:38 AM
GaryOKC6: Some assistance for the mom, if she's willing. In just two words: food pantries.

I know some low low income folks. Can not drive themselves anywhere, though that is overall not a bad thing. The local bus is not an option for either (certain health issues and distance from stops.) Each eeks by on government assistance and an occasional, tiny amount of help from family.

I help with transportation when I can regarding store, doctors, etc., including local food pantries. If not for the pantries, I have no doubt each household would still today have times of choosing between food and power.

Dennis Heaton
03-02-2014, 07:56 AM
I also know a single mom who works hard to feed her 2 kids. She gets not child support and is really struggling to care for them. She is told that she does not qualify for food stamps.

I know ya can't squeeze blood from a turnip...but if this Mom hasn't done so yet, she really needs to get in touch with Oklahoma Child Support Services.

DHS - Child Support Program Information (http://www.okdhs.org/programsandservices/ocss/)

Servicetech571
03-02-2014, 10:04 AM
I 100% agree with your outrage over placard fraud - that said, I cringe when people use your examples as the measuring tool.... "people who use handicap placards to park in handicap spaces then get out and are perfectly capable of walking and then, for example at the grocery story, carry out a handful of grocery bags and open their own door with out putting anything down..."

I had a relative who had a disability that was often very debilitating (won't go into details as they know I post here) and more than once they have been confronted by individuals who used your rule of measure. It made him feel very uncomfortable and like he owed these buffoons and explanation of his medical history - yet his card and his handicapped status were very real.

My father (until he died last November) was in his 80's, was awarded three purple hearts and had a handicapped placard because of multiple hip surgeries and a heart condition. He could walk to and from the store and push and load/unload his own cart. However, he still needed to park close.

Unfortunately, so many people abuse the system now that many people assume everyone is an abuser unless they are unloading a hovaround in the parking lot or are uncontrollably contorting as they drag themselves into the store.

I just don't see somebody harrasing an 80yr old about handicap parking, no matter what they see. Those are the people you go help load thier car for them. When you see a 20 something kid getting out of his lifted truck he parked in the handicap spot that's an issue.

Servicetech571
03-02-2014, 10:12 AM
I know several people who get the assistance and are perfect capable of working. They are just lazy and want to sit around all day and get paid. One of them lives in a gated apartment community, gets his rent paid from one source, his utilities from another, groceries from another and receives 2 checks from different agencies. I also know a single mom who works hard to feed her 2 kids. She gets not child support and is really struggling to care for them. She is told that she does not qualify for food stamps.

As do most people. People are so scared to call them out due to the "disability card", that the "secret welfare system" lives on. Reporting them does no good. the social security office could care less. Why shoudl they? It's not like it's thier own money being spent. SS should hire private investigators just like employers do for workers comp cases. Busting the con artists would go a long way to keep SS alive for those who really need it. Keep in mind we're talking about $1,000 per year per worker in potential savings. If 1/2 the claims are legit that's still $500 per worker saved.

But calling out people frauding the system would cost votes, no politician wants that...

BBatesokc
03-02-2014, 11:35 AM
I just don't see somebody harrasing an 80yr old about handicap parking, no matter what they see. Those are the people you go help load thier car for them. When you see a 20 something kid getting out of his lifted truck he parked in the handicap spot that's an issue.

Still think many people make assumptions that are often wrong. My relative that has one is only in his 50's (hardly 'elderly') and lots of young people have disabilities that could warrant a placard regardless if it fits some people's stereotype of who 'should have one' and who shouldn't. I have another friend who's only in his 50 and he has several asthma. He can walk, but and additional 50 feet could be a real issue for him in the weather.

Servicetech571
03-02-2014, 11:48 AM
Still think many people make assumptions that are often wrong. My relative that has one is only in his 50's (hardly 'elderly') and lots of young people have disabilities that could warrant a placard regardless if it fits some people's stereotype of who 'should have one' and who shouldn't. I have another friend who's only in his 50 and he has several asthma. He can walk, but and additional 50 feet could be a real issue for him in the weather.

The baby does tend to get thrown out with the bathwater. People see others working the system over and over, after a while its hard to know who is legit and who is not.
Handicapped Parking Fraud - Handicapped Parking Violators - Help Make a Difference (http://www.handicappedfraud.org/)

Jim Kyle
03-02-2014, 01:00 PM
My father (until he died last November) was in his 80's, was awarded three purple hearts and had a handicapped placard because of multiple hip surgeries and a heart condition. He could walk to and from the store and push and load/unload his own cart. However, he still needed to park close.I'm probably one of the people that mmonroe referred to, and my situation is very like that of your father, complicated by COPD and an oxygenh bottle that I don't always wear when going on a brief shopping mission...

One of my daughters-in-law is legally blind and as such qualifies for a handicap parking permit. My son refuses to use it unless Becky is with him. In fact, we often park in "normal" parking spaces if we see someone else obviously in worse shape than me looking for a place to park...

ctchandler
03-02-2014, 01:15 PM
BBatesokc and others understand people like my late wife, disabled due to chemo-therapy induced heart damage (and a heart transplant candidate). Examined and declared disabled by the SSA at age 60. She could walk, slowly and short distances and today you can see me parking in a handicapped spot, walking, carrying my oxygen tank, but stopping after about 50' to rest. Then looking for an electric cart, or sitting down waiting on availability. It's not always as it seems/looks. I hate the cheaters as much as you and always have, but I also know that you can't judge a book by it's cover. At least this week, things change when my son installs the electric lift I purchased (not Medicare) for my scooter that I purchased (not Medicare) and now you will see me ride from my handicapped parking to the store, or maybe I won't tie up a handicapped spot since I can now ride to the store. If you have seen me walking from the handicapped spot and wondered if I should be parking in it, just remember, I have C. O. P. D. and it is not a disability that is always visible, like my late wife's problems.
C. T.

Unlike Jim, I can't leave my oxygen bottle in the car unless I am going into a convenience store for one or two items, and I leave it when I fill my tank with gas. I can't be without it for more than about 5-10 minutes.

mmonroe
03-03-2014, 05:21 PM
Sorry if my example seemed to put a 'blanket/umbrella' over ascertaining fraudulent use of a handicap placard by those who 'seem' to be perfectly able-bodied. No one has absolute knowledge on one's disability or level of disability upon visual inspection. What I do know are a few qualifying factors, so when I see someone acting adverse to those factors, it makes me question in my mind why the person has the placard.

Here are a few examples i've seen around the OKC metro:
1. Pulled into handicap spot with placard rather abruptly, hops out with the music turned up, dances around the car to the back passenger door to get purse, booty bumps door closed, dances to building door.
(Homeland near Midtown)
2. Parks in handicap with placard displayed, gets out and jogs into the YMCA.
(Midwest City YMCA)
3. Woman pulls into handicap spot, gets out two small children, places one on each hip and walks to the door. She never once dropped her cell phone.
(Moore Walmart)
4. A former manager used her mothers for parking in Bricktown all the time.
(Bricktown)

These are the types of actions that make me question if those people need them or not. I don't think the nice lady who waved me by and smiled then pulled into her handicap parking, pulls out her placard to put on the rear view mirror and then gets out and walks to the door, is the type I would question.

Servicetech571
03-03-2014, 07:16 PM
Sorry if my example seemed to put a 'blanket/umbrella' over ascertaining fraudulent use of a handicap placard by those who 'seem' to be perfectly able-bodied. No one has absolute knowledge on one's disability or level of disability upon visual inspection. What I do know are a few qualifying factors, so when I see someone acting adverse to those factors, it makes me question in my mind why the person has the placard.

Here are a few examples i've seen around the OKC metro:
1. Pulled into handicap spot with placard rather abruptly, hops out with the music turned up, dances around the car to the back passenger door to get purse, booty bumps door closed, dances to building door.
(Homeland near Midtown)
2. Parks in handicap with placard displayed, gets out and jogs into the YMCA.
(Midwest City YMCA)
3. Woman pulls into handicap spot, gets out two small children, places one on each hip and walks to the door. She never once dropped her cell phone.
(Moore Walmart)
4. A former manager used her mothers for parking in Bricktown all the time.
(Bricktown)

These are the types of actions that make me question if those people need them or not. I don't think the nice lady who waved me by and smiled then pulled into her handicap parking, pulls out her placard to put on the rear view mirror and then gets out and walks to the door, is the type I would question.

I wonder how many of them are also drawing SSI or SSDI checks.

ctchandler
03-03-2014, 07:49 PM
Mmonroe,
No reason to be "sorry", I have a huge problem with anyone that's not truly eligible. This thread kind of veered off in another direction and I didn't help it any with my post. I just wanted to remind everyone that not all disabilities are visible. I wish I knew the answer. I have learned to accept those with legal hang tags, but I really get irritated at folks that think they are disabled with a sore leg and park illegally in a handicapped spot. They should apply for a temporary hang tag (red in color) if they have a temporary problem. I will shut up now because this really should be a thread of it's own.
C. T.
Sorry if my example seemed to put a 'blanket/umbrella' over ascertaining fraudulent use of a handicap placard by those who 'seem' to be perfectly able-bodied. No one has absolute knowledge on one's disability or level of disability upon visual inspection. What I do know are a few qualifying factors, so when I see someone acting adverse to those factors, it makes me question in my mind why the person has the placard.
I don't think the nice lady who waved me by and smiled then pulled into her handicap parking, pulls out her placard to put on the rear view mirror and then gets out and walks to the door, is the type I would question.