The city council voted today to consider renaming part of Eastern "American Indian, Blvd." This section is in front of the future American Indian cultural center.

What do you think about the name change? Is it too much? Do you think the liberals will cry foul?

Why would "liberals" cry foul?

Personally, I have no problem with it. In my humble opinion, only non-Indian liberals who allow the tenets of PC to rule their lives will have a problem with it. Political correctness is a duel-edged sword with advantages and disadvantages. Unfortunately, it has run amok in today's society. I consider it a tip o' the hat to the new cultural center.

I was more curious as to why a simple question had to include a slam against people of a particular ideology.

Political correctness is not restricted to the left or liberal wing of the country.

I meant no slam at all. Sorry about that.

I was referring to the original question. It seemed a superfluous comment in the midst of a legitimate question.

To answer the main question, I think it's a nice tribute to the cultural center to rename that section of the street to American Indian Blvd.

Aha. Gotcha.

This would, I assume, be the stretch immediately south of Reno. (North of Reno, up to Wilshire, Eastern was long ago renamed for Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr.)

How far would this extend? 15th? 29th? I-240?

Political correctness is not restricted to the left or liberal wing of the country.

Exactly. And most people don't need to worry about political correctness because they're not a-holes to begin with.

I don't know why a liberal would be upset anyway. Wouldn't it be more like a conservative to not want a minority group to be honored or singled out for public recognition. I mean, as long as we're playing with ignorant stereotypes... :rolleyes:

My only suggestion would be that it might be nicer to honor a local Native American that has contributed a lot to his cultures development in OK. But it may be more appropriate to honor all American Indians this way. I think the real people to ask would be American Indians.

Exactly. And most people don't need to worry about political correctness because they're not a-holes to begin with.

I don't know why a liberal would be upset anyway. Wouldn't it be more like a conservative to not want a minority group to be honored or singled out for public recognition. I mean, as long as we're playing with ignorant stereotypes... :rolleyes:

My only suggestion would be that it might be nicer to honor a local Native American that has contributed a lot to his cultures development in OK. But it may be more appropriate to honor all American Indians this way. I think the real people to ask would be American Indians.

Please. This should not be a debate as to YOUR opinion of proper verbage. IF you want to discuss that, then I suggest a new thread. This is for opinions about that particular street being renamed.

What do you think about the name change? Is it too much? Do you think the liberals will cry foul?




This was in the original post and this is what is being discussed.

Everyone's so touchy lately! Chill everyone..........

Please. This should not be a debate about what's proper debate. If you want to discuss that, please start a new thread.

My only suggestion would be that it might be nicer to honor a local Native American that has contributed a lot to his cultures development in OK. But it may be more appropriate to honor all American Indians this way. I think the real people to ask would be American Indians.

So my question would be which name is more politically correct: Native American Blvd or American Indian Blvd?

I agree it would be nice to honor a local Native American, however it could be very difficult to get a concensus.

The city council voted today to consider renaming part of Eastern "American Indian, Blvd." This section is in front of the future American Indian cultural center.

What do you think about the name change? Is it too much? Do you think the liberals will cry foul?

The quote above is my original post. What I would like to know is where it mentions a term I loathe ("politically correct," which is a way of certain types DEMANDING I use phrases THEY want that I do not accept). It simpally asks if those certain people will protest the name change.

Thank you.

I think the point would be: why would the originator of the post single out a particular group who the author pre-judges might cry foul? Would not other ideology cry foul? Are liberal objections so abhorrent that it merits special attention? Couldn't the question have been asked without the follow-up question (meant to be an unprovoked slam at another's views)?

This should not be a debate as to YOUR opinion of proper verbage. IF you want to discuss that, then I suggest a new thread. This is for opinions about that particular street being renamed.

WTF? I did not offer any opinion of verbiage. You're crazy. I simply answered your question as to whether liberals would protest this. I see no reason to think that they would. I'm not even sure what being liberal would have to do with this. But, if we were going to go by ignorant stereotypes, then maybe we should be asking if conservatives would protest it because it honors a minority group.


So my question would be which name is more politically correct: Native American Blvd or American Indian Blvd?

I'm not sure if mranderson would like such discussion on his thread, but it's an interesting question. I don't think either term is generally offensive, even to mranderson. Native American is probably more accurate. The term 'American Indian' really just works to preserve the mistake of the Europeans who landed in America thinking it was the East. Given the choice, I'd go with Native American because it's more representative, imo, but I use them interchangeably as I did in my first post.

What are we calling the cultural center? Native American or American Indian? Maybe we should just ask the Native Americans about whom this whole project is. And if they protest the name, I'm pretty sure they'll be doing it as Native Americans, not liberals.

Personally, I really don't care what Mr. Anderson thinks about the discussion. If he doesn't like it, he can go read something else.

Regarding the center, I guess it's called the American Indian Cultural Center, so it'd make sense that the road would match the name. I just thought everyone had worked so hard to find more "appropriate" verbage than to use the name "Indian".

I'm confused.:dontgetit

The term that is offensive is "politically correct." That is a liberals atempt to dictate what expressions I can use.

In addition. To add. I am a Native American. I wa born on US soil which makes me a native american. The other people are Indians. That is what I mean. I have the right to choose the expressions (with VERY rare exceptions)

I don't think it is a liberal attempt to use terms that are politically correct. These are terms that are becoming acceptable in an effort to show more sensitivity to people who may be different than others.

These terms are trying to remove the negative connotations associated with certain names and labels that might offend and hurt someone else.

In addition. To add. I am a Native American. I wa born on US soil which makes me a native american. The other people are Indians. That is what I mean. I have the right to choose the expressions (with VERY rare exceptions)
You know, I heard that same statement from a member of the KKK in a documentary I watched recently.

To add. I am a Native American. I wa born on US soil which makes me a native american. The other people are Indians.

So where do you think these people were born... India? :LolLolLol

I also loved your diatribe that liberals are making you use certain expressions, then you yourself go on to explain what expressions should be used. :LolLolLol

I just thought everyone had worked so hard to find more "appropriate" verbage than to use the name "Indian".

I don't even know if it's a discussion of appropriateness as much as accuracy. I think some people are just stuck in their ways and think that if you make the same mistake enough times, it becomes right.

So where do you think these people were born... India? :LolLolLol

I also loved your diatribe that liberals are making you use certain expressions, then you yourself go on to explain what expressions should be used. :LolLolLol

That is not the point. Any person, regardless of ethnicity, born on American soil is an native american. That term is NOT limited to American Indians. THAT is why it is offensive to me to have people demand I referer to an Indian as a Native American.

Oh, By the way. As an American, the US Constitution and the Bill of Rights gave me the freedom to choose the expression I use. It is called the first amendment. Yes. You also have that right. However, it does not extend to telling me what expressions to say just because the offend you. (general comment. This is not directed at any certain person)

That is not the point. Any person, regardless of ethnicity, born on American soil is an native american. That term is NOT limited to American Indians. THAT is why it is offensive to me to have people demand I referer to an Indian as a Native American.

:LolLolLol :LolLolLol

You don't even get it! You're so funny.

You admit that anyone born on American soil is a Native American, but you want to call them Indians. Like you said they were born in America, not India. So are you saying that anyone born in America is an Indian, too. :LolLolLol

Look, I don't have a problem with the term American Indian, but you have to admit its etymology comes from a big mistake. But like you said they are Native Americans, they were born here, so why not call them that.

We are getting off track. We need to get back on topic. The topic was about the street being renamed, not about opinions as to expressions.


:backtotop

I find it fascinating when the weakness or hypocrisy of a comment is exposed, we suddenly are "off topic."

The topic was about the street being renamed, not about opinions as to expressions

The topic was about the street being renamed "American Indian Blvd". We are discussing that. You were the first to even mention that some may protest it. What were you suggesting when you asked that, and specifically when you questioned whether the liberals would be worried about it? What did you think had the possibility of being protested? You left that open for everyone else to interpret and they seem to have done so well within topic.

You are the one who has gone off topic to complain about being victimized by the mean old liberals. So, please tell us, why did you think this street name change was an issue to begin with and what was that issue?

I did not intend for it to be a blast furnace for a group of liberals who foam at the mouth at an opportunity to insult and belittle people who do not share their feelings about expressions. It was to be isolated to that street.

Plus, I believe I posed the question as a direct question, which means answer yes or no only.

"Do you think the liberals will cry foul?" The word "do" indicates a direct question requiring a yes or no answer only. Not an essay.

What a joke. It's so very transparent that you were baiting people and then you cowardly turned tail and ran when it back fired. You singled out the liberals for a reason, but you are too cowardly to admit what that reason was, probably because you can't justify it now and have been more guilty of laying out a correctness mandate than anyone else here.

You didn't want the thread to be about expressions, but you had no problem belittling others on their ideas about expressions. If it looks like a hypocrite, walks like a hypocrite, and talks like a hypocrite, well, you know the rest.


The word "do" indicates a direct question requiring a yes or no answer only. Not an essay.

:LolLolLol Where do you get this stuff? It's a freaking message board. Do you understand the concept of conversation? Are all your conversations multiple choice/true or false ones? You must be thrilling at parties.

Just, in the future, if you don't want to talk about something, don't bring it up and then jump on everyone else when they actually talk about it. And if you have a manifesto to share, just share it.

Mr. A

It wasn't direct question, this would be a direct question:

"What do you think of changing the street name..." Instead you felt it necessary to drop in a backhanded comment about liberals.

What a joke. It's so very transparent that you were baiting people and then you cowardly turned tail and ran when it back fired. You singled out the liberals for a reason, but you are too cowardly to admit what that reason was, probably because you can't justify it now and have been more guilty of laying out a correctness mandate than anyone else here.

You didn't want the thread to be about expressions, but you had no problem belittling others on their ideas about expressions. If it looks like a hypocrite, walks like a hypocrite, and talks like a hypocrite, well, you know the rest.

:LolLolLol Where do you get this stuff? It's a freaking message board. Do you understand the concept of conversation? Are all your conversations multiple choice/true or false ones? You must be thrilling at parties.

Just, in the future, if you don't want to talk about something, don't bring it up and then jump on everyone else when they actually talk about it. And if you have a manifesto to share, just share it.

Mr. A

It wasn't direct question, this would be a direct question:

"What do you think of changing the street name..." Instead you felt it necessary to drop in a backhanded comment about liberals.

http://www.okctalk.com/images/Smailies%2001-28-08/congrats.gif

I couldn't have said it better myself, BDP.

Mr. A

It wasn't direct question, this would be a direct question:

"What do you think of changing the street name..." Instead you felt it necessary to drop in a backhanded comment about liberals.

Let's not get into a debate over questioning. Whatever term you want to use, the point is, the way I phrased the question requires a yes or no answer only. In rules of courtroom procedure, this is known as a direct question. Yours would be an essay quesion or compound question.

This is really for another topic as is the direction this thread has gone.

"The city council voted today to consider renaming part of Eastern "American Indian, Blvd." This section is in front of the future American Indian cultural center.

What do you think about the name change? Is it too much? Do you think the liberals will cry foul?"

No part of this question requires a yes or no answer. Stop backpedeling. If you want this discussion to end...stop posting

Here's a direct question:

Can someone ask a direct question without prejudging how certain people will react?

If yes/no answers were all Mr A wanted, why didn't he pose it in the form of a poll?

"The city council voted today to consider renaming part of Eastern "American Indian, Blvd." This section is in front of the future American Indian cultural center.

What do you think about the name change? Is it too much? Do you think the liberals will cry foul?"

No part of this question requires a yes or no answer. Stop backpedeling. If you want this discussion to end...stop posting

"DO YOU". THAT SAYS YES OR NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

"DO YOU". THAT SAYS YES OR NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Except that the first question asks "What do you think..."

Whatever...once again your logic escapes me.

Oh and there is no need to yell

Man, for once, I wished I lived in OKC, in Ward 5, where ever that is, so that I might too have the chance to vote against Mr Anderson.

In rules of courtroom procedure, this is known as a direct question.

That is so weak and you couldn’t be farther from correct. I'm beginning to wonder if you think that we can't see your first post, like if you pretend it says something else then it will actually say that.

!) You asked us what we thought about the name change. This is in no way a “direct” question requiring only a yes or no answer. In fact, a yes or no answer would have made no sense. Do you still need help, let’s role play:

Attorney: Mranderson, what do you think about renaming the street?

Mranderson: No.

What does that mean? It is perfectly acceptable in most communication that if you ask someone what they think, they are allowed to tell you, even if that requires an explanation in essay form. Again, if you can’t handle the discussion, don’t bring it up.

2) “Do you think the liberals would protest” it is not a direct question. Within context of your asking the board population what they think of the name change, it is a leading question that actually requires a speculative answer. In all likelihood, there is a strong possibility that such a question would not even be allowed in a court room.

3) How ridiculous is it to try and pretend this message board is your impression of a court room and that you are cross examining all of the other users?

And for those who actually want to discuss the issue mranderson brought up and then ran from, I think the only opinion that really matters is that of Native American Indians (you like that?). mranderson asked that we call him mranderson, and even if we think other names may apply, we still refer to him as such out of respect. And that is what this should be about. If the name is respectful to those to which it is reffering, I have no problem with it..

The question was "do you think the name of the street should be changed?" (paraphrasing) THAT is a DIRECT question that requires two answers and two answers only. Yes or no. In a court room, that is exactly what it is called.

When you are taking wedding vows, the minister asks a question. Will (sometimes do) you take this (gender) to be your spouse?" Do you (yes or no ONLY) say "In the course of the courship we have encountered this is a pratical plan?" Or is the answer you give "yes" or "no?" Think about that.

Now. Let's drop this. And drop it NOW!

Point of fact: The original question (as I read it at the beginning of this thread) was, "What do you think about the name change?"

This is an open-ended question. "What do you think about..." is not a "yes" or "no" question.

A more appropriate analogy to wedding vows as compared to the original question would be: "What do you think about taking this person to be your spouse?" It doesn't really lend itself to "yes" or "no."

Finally, feel free to drop it anytime. It seems that each time you post, you are continuing the discussion.

Once again, I have to laugh. That may be a direct question, but that question doesn't even appear in your original post.

mranderson's first post that started the whole thread (my emphasis):

The city council voted today to consider renaming part of Eastern "American Indian, Blvd." This section is in front of the future American Indian cultural center.

What do you think about the name change? Is it too much? Do you think the liberals will cry foul?

It is clear that you have no idea what you even asked. Since that is now clear, it is best that it be dropped. I just hope you have learned that message boards are for discussion and the sharing of ideas, not just for manipulative pseudo-cross examinations adhering to court room rules of direct questioning. So, in the future, when you ask a question and a conversation breaks out, have some respect and let the people here discuss it.

"Do you think the liberals will cry foul?"

Now...:backtotop :backtotop :backtotop

I think it's a stupid name, in the context that some, probably not most by far, but some, Native Americans will be offended by the Columbian term American Indian, don't you think it's a bad idea?

If you are going to name a street in tribute to a people, should you not try to avoid offending a segment of that population in that tribute? What would be wrong with Native American Blvd?

It even sounds better than American Indian blvd.

My two cents.

Why do you think the liberals will cry foul?

I cannot stop laughing! This is quite possibly one of the funniest things I've ever read.

You open yourself up to this debate when you add a little tagline of "Do you think the liberals will cry foul?". It was inappropriate and everyone knows it.

The first question most certainly warranted a discussion of what we thought, so we shared. It was an open-ended question asking for conversation.

Personally, I think the names "Native American Blvd" and "Native American Cultural Center" are quite appropriate. This way the original Native American population should be happy, and those humorous folks who refer to themselves as Native Americans b/c they were born in the U.S. will feel honored every time they see the street sign. LOL!!!

Ok, mrandreson, :backtotop

What do you think of the changing of the street name?

Rofl!!!!

BDP, I'm laughing so hard I'm crying! :yourock:

Actually, I have a new thought. Why not call it "Red Earth Blvd" (in reference to the Annual Red Earth celebration) and avoid political correctness altogether?

I like it sweetdaisy. It even sounds like a street name.

I'm with sweetdaisy on this one. I have not been this entertained by one thread in a very long time.

This thread has been reported at least 3 times in the last 6 hours. I was asked to close the thread.

Do you think the neophytes will cry foul?

Bummer... :( And I was finally getting creative.

FOUL!!!

What's a neophyte?

(just kidding)

This thread has been reported at least 3 times in the last 6 hours.

Was it the liberals?

Maybe we should start a new thread featuring "Yes or No" questions.

If you guys keep talking about foul. I'm going hunting..

http://www.i-hate-liberals.com/images/hunting.gif

Well I suppose as board admin I should attempt to keep this thread on topic. My apologies for not steering this thing back on course.

What was the original question?

The original question was: Do You Think The Liberals Will Cry Foul???

Oh, and some other stuff, too. :)

:LolLolLol

:LolLolLol

I can't breathe...

:LolLolLol

... too funny...

ROFL

... my sides hurt... please stop...

ROFLMAO