High-point Budweiser products approved for Oklahoma | News OK (http://newsok.com/high-point-budweiser-products-approved-for-oklahoma/article/3883837)

A good article touching on the ramifications of this development and the possible effect it could have on craft brews.

this doesn't end 3.2 beer .. Budweiser could have always sold high point in Oklahoma they didn't as a matter of policy (and the ability to not have exclusive distribution licenses)

interesting policy choice for bud ..

I don't see this ending 3.2, but hopefully it leads to cold beer being available in liquor stores. That would also allow New Belgium beers to be sold in Oklahoma. Does anybody know if that would require a constitutional amendment? If not, I am sure a large brewer like Anheuser-Busch may have the weight to get it done.

Very Good. If this happens I am sure that Coors will follow soon after.

I always thought it funny that Bud did not offer higher percent beer in Oklahoma because it could not be sold cold. But then you go into all the grocery stores and see hot Budweiser satcked up everywhere. They seem to sell a lot of it that is not refrigerated.

One thing that is likely once Coors follows is for this to pretty much end 3.2 beer in bars and restaurants. I doubt they will continue to sell low-point when high-point is available.

I assume Oklahoma can't have 3.2% beer due to fear that the liquor stores will lose an obscene amount of profits, due to no longer being the only place to buy the next step up from 3.2% beer. But in return, let them try to make money off of being allowed to sell other products related to alcohol use.

Now that liquor stores can sell high point Bud, it may spur the grocery and convenient store lobby to push harder to be able to sell high point now that they have competition. I am a craft beer fan, not a Bud fan, but this is great because it sets the stage so that real change eventually may be a realistic possibility.

This has nothing to do with the end of 3.2 in Oklahoma. Bud has no desire to do that. They have the lions share of grocery and convenience store cold box space as it is now and going single strength would only open that up to increased competition. By going this route, they maintain the status quo in the 3.2 realm while going after the market share they're missing in liquor stores...

This may indeed lead to change Oklahoma beer laws. But it won't change beer that much. According to Budweiser regular Bud is 5.0% alcohol by volume. Oklahoma regular Bud is 3.2% alcohol by weight. According to Realbeer.com 3.2 by weight converts to 4.0% by volume. So there's only 1% difference between weak Bud and strong Bud.

O'Doul's Amber N.A. actually tastes better than either "Bud" or "Coors".
Now "Coors" is actually something like "United Beverage International".
I wonder if the new law will force "Coors" to stop serving it at "Banquets" or to change their misleading label . . .
(not the "Beer" part . . . the "Banquet Beer" part)

The first products to come in to liquor stores will be 8.0% Lime-a-rita, Straw-ber-rita and Cran-ber-rita and also, kegs of some of the beer in Nov. The other beers mentioned will come in in 6 packs either in Dec. or Jan.

This may indeed lead to change Oklahoma beer laws. But it won't change beer that much. According to Budweiser regular Bud is 5.0% alcohol by volume. Oklahoma regular Bud is 3.2% alcohol by weight. According to Realbeer.com 3.2 by weight converts to 4.0% by volume. So there's only 1% difference between weak Bud and strong Bud.

It is a 25% increase.

Nope... This all but assures that beer laws in OK. won't be changing in the foreseeable future... with Bud making the decision to sell their strong products in OK., expect Miller and Coors to follow soon after. They both sell products in liquor stores already anyway...

It is a 25% increase.

Yes. But a 25% increase in next to nothing . . .
which shouldn't affect the taste one way or the other.

Yes. But a 25% increase in next to nothing . . .
which shouldn't affect the taste one way or the other.

The watered down taste of 3.2 beer isn't because of the low alcohol content. It is the result of a stronger beer being literally watered down to 3.2. Beers, like Guiness, that are naturally 3.2 don't taste watered down, despite their low alcohol content.

It is a 25% increase.

or oklahoma 3.2 beer has 20% less alcohol than texas beer

I dont see this doing much for changing our liquor laws. Its still going to take a huge legislative effort or for it to be put on the ballot. All this will probably do is take away shelf space from better craft beers. Who is really going to go buy hot Budweiser from a liquor store just because there is a minimal more amount of alchohol content?

or oklahoma 3.2 beer has 20% less alcohol than texas beer
so, how much alcohol is in texas 3.2 beer?
(i'd bet not much . . . or drink neither--or is that either, if it refers to Coors or Bud?)

I always thought it funny that Bud did not offer higher percent beer in Oklahoma because it could not be sold cold. But then you go into all the grocery stores and see hot Budweiser satcked up everywhere. They seem to sell a lot of it that is not refrigerated.

that is not why bud didn't /doesn't offer high point beer ..

they don't/didn't because they can't control the distribution ie they would have to share the money

that is not why bud didn't /doesn't offer high point beer ..

they don't/didn't because they can't control the distribution ie they would have to share the money

Yep... That and their concern over losing an element of control over quality control issues...

I dont see this doing much for changing our liquor laws. Its still going to take a huge legislative effort or for it to be put on the ballot. All this will probably do is take away shelf space from better craft beers. Who is really going to go buy hot Budweiser from a liquor store just because there is a minimal more amount of alchohol content?

This does nothing to change liquor laws, if anything, it takes away one of the reasons for changing them.

Don't kid yourself... this is a huge get for liquor stores. Most Bud drinkers would much prefer full strength over the watered down 3.2 version... it doesn't take that long to bring it down to temp...

i don't care about the alcohol content - as long as it somehow gets us the opportunity in the future to be able to buy good-tasting beer not currently available in the state (new belgium, dogfish head, kona brewing...)

The first products to come in to liquor stores will be 8.0% Lime-a-rita, Straw-ber-rita and Cran-ber-rita and also, kegs of some of the beer in Nov. The other beers mentioned will come in in 6 packs either in Dec. or Jan.

Pure speculation on my part but IMHO...this is the reason for the move. My wife and all of her friends are bootlegging lime-a-ritas into OK by the cases. There have been several times we have had to go to more than one store because the store was sold out and the manager told us it was because all of the Okies coming down and buying it. (btw...they are 8%).

Under our system....it has to go through a liquor distributor before it goes to liquor store which means that Bud would have to add in another middle man which isn't required when supplying directly to c-stores in 3.2%. 3.2% could be sold 24 hrs a day up until the law change a while back and can still be sold cold 7 days a week until 2 am. whereas the supply times are more limited with liquor stores. C-store sales are hugely profitable. How else can you explain several imports adding 3.2 version over the last several years. You can get Dos XX and Heineken at c-store in 3.2 and also at liquor store at higher %.

I dont see this doing much for changing our liquor laws. Its still going to take a huge legislative effort or for it to be put on the ballot. All this will probably do is take away shelf space from better craft beers. Who is really going to go buy hot Budweiser from a liquor store just because there is a minimal more amount of alchohol content?

You mean real beer drinkers never buy beer unless it's already cold?

As a brewer, and friend of many "craft brew" drinkers, I can tell you that Budweiser is not going to take any customers away from the microbreweries. At least, not with it's American piss water beer. People that have tasted the craft of artisan brewers, have long since left behind, the mass produced swill that these mega corporations sell. If this is a "moral gateway" law that allows the sale of alchohol to be governed in a more adult fashion, then GREAT! I'd love to get a bottle of Chardonnay on Sunday for my onion soup. But I suspect that the religious right will knee-jerk some kind of bulls#it ordinance, to make sure we're still protected from ourselves and the devil rum. Aren't we tired of being the 48th, or 49th state to come around on such juvenile issues?

As a brewer, and friend of many "craft brew" drinkers, I can tell you that Budweiser is not going to take any customers away from the microbreweries. At least, not with it's American piss water beer. People that have tasted the craft of artisan brewers, have long since left behind, the mass produced swill that these mega corporations sell. If this is a "moral gateway" law that allows the sale of alchohol to be governed in a more adult fashion, then GREAT! I'd love to get a bottle of Chardonnay on Sunday for my onion soup. But I suspect that the religious right will knee-jerk some kind of bulls#it ordinance, to make sure we're still protected from ourselves and the devil rum. Aren't we tired of being the 48th, or 49th state to come around on such juvenile issues?

There are 15 other states with more strict liquor laws. I'll bet we are 40th.

There are 15 other states with more strict liquor laws. I'll bet we are 40th.

Curious as to your comment. What are you basing the fact that there are 15 states with stricter liquor laws? Or for that matter, 10?

This Budweiser news, in my opinion, is just one more small domino to fall. Personally, though I long for the better grocery and retail options modern laws would get us, as far as personal convenience getting cold beer is the #1 change to the laws I wish for. It makes absolutely no sense, being that you can buy a "to go" shot of Jack Daniels at the counter at nearly every liquor store, that the laws against cold beer for the purpose of preventing people from chugging it in their car stay on the books.

I think I asked this before but didn't get an answer. Would a constitutional amendment be required to allow liquor stores to sell cold beer?

This Budweiser news, in my opinion, is just one more small domino to fall. Personally, though I long for the better grocery and retail options modern laws would get us, as far as personal convenience getting cold beer is the #1 change to the laws I wish for. It makes absolutely no sense, being that you can buy a "to go" shot of Jack Daniels at the counter at nearly every liquor store, that the laws against cold beer for the purpose of preventing people from chugging it in their car stay on the books.

I think I asked this before but didn't get an answer. Would a constitutional amendment be required to allow liquor stores to sell cold beer?

No, It would be a fairly easy law to change... it would only take changing one statute that requires all products in liquor stores be sold at room temperature. Unfortunately, most small liquor stores are against it because they don't have the space nor do they want to bare the expense...

The big dogs in the fight to prevent it would be the grocery and convenience store lobbiest, who would fight it vehemently especially now that the major domestics are reentering liquor stores...

I wish a wealthy person, who wants to make history in Oklahoma, would organize a petition drive to get state questions on the ballot to make alcohol laws less prohibitive. Such an effort would probably only cost around a million dollars. Maybe none will do it, due to fear of death threats, or liability issues. Anyway, isn't the petition to allow grocery stores to sell wine supposed to start going around next year and be concluded in time for the Nov. 2014 election?

I wish a wealthy person, who wants to make history in Oklahoma, would organize a petition drive to get state questions on the ballot to make alcohol laws less prohibitive. Such an effort would probably only cost around a million dollars. Maybe none will do it, due to fear of death threats, or liability issues. Anyway, isn't the petition to allow grocery stores to sell wine supposed to start going around next year and be concluded in time for the Nov. 2014 election?

You significantly underestimate the expense. In addition to the petition drive, and I am uncertain your mil covers even that, add in expense for legal challenges, which would surely come from both those vested in status quo and those who are anti spirits in genera. Presuming that all goes as hoped by proponents of change, even once it is ballot time, the expense of funding a vote in favor of change campaign will require some significant amounts. It's not a Ballot it and they will Pass.

There be a lot of anti-spirits Gandalfs in this state.

Seriously, the only real problem with our laws:

1. No cold-serve
2. Liquor stores can't open Sundays
3. Liquor stores have to close at 9

Change those 3 things, and I don't think a single person in this state, that's even remotely educated and worth listening to, would have a problem with the setup.

Most liquor retailers support allowing cold beer in their shops. It really is just the grocery and oil/gas lobby that fights against it. Additionally MADD is a major factor in this, as well as 7 days a week and closing time issues.

As a brewer, and friend of many "craft brew" drinkers, I can tell you that Budweiser is not going to take any customers away from the microbreweries. At least, not with it's American piss water beer. People that have tasted the craft of artisan brewers, have long since left behind, the mass produced swill that these mega corporations sell. If this is a "moral gateway" law that allows the sale of alchohol to be governed in a more adult fashion, then GREAT! I'd love to get a bottle of Chardonnay on Sunday for my onion soup. But I suspect that the religious right will knee-jerk some kind of bulls#it ordinance, to make sure we're still protected from ourselves and the devil rum. Aren't we tired of being the 48th, or 49th state to come around on such juvenile issues?

I'm from South Carolina and been living in Oklahoma City since February 1996. In South Carolina you can't buy any alchohol at all on Sundays.

I'm from South Carolina and been living in Oklahoma City since February 1996. In South Carolina you can't buy any alchohol at all on Sundays.

Apparently the laws have changed since 1996. Alcohol laws of South Carolina - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alcohol_laws_of_South_Carolina)

"Today, the retail sale of liquor statewide is permitted from 9 a.m. until 7 p.m. Monday — Saturday, and Sunday sales are banned by state law. However, counties and cities may hold referendums to allow Sunday sales of beer and wine only. Eight counties currently allow Sunday beer and wine sales; Richland, Lexington, Georgetown, Charleston, Beaufort, Horry, York, and as of 2012 Newberry. Cities and towns that have passed laws allowing Sunday beer and wine sales include Columbia, Spartanburg, Greenville, Aiken, Rock Hill, Summerville, Santee, Daniel Island and Tega Cay.

While there are no dry counties in South Carolina, and retail liquor sales are uniform statewide, certain counties may enforce time restrictions for beer and wine sales in stores (e.g., no sales after 2 a.m. in Pickens County) while others do not (in-store beer and wine sales are allowed 24 hours a day, 7 days a week in Charleston). Columbia, the state's capital, largest city, and the home of the University of South Carolina, took one of the more relaxed stances on alcohol sales in bars compared to other cities in the state. Many bars, especially those catering to younger crowds in the busy Five Points district, served alcohol until sunrise, and it was not unheard of for bars and clubs to serve alcohol until 7 or 8 a.m., although the legality of this practice is questionable. In 2011, however, Columbia City Council voted to force bars to close at 2 a.m., requiring a special permit to stay open further. Requirements for the permit involved having trained security staff and no events that violate "the public peace" (wet t-shirt contests, etc.)"

Seriously, the only real problem with our laws:

1. No cold-serve
2. Liquor stores can't open Sundays
3. Liquor stores have to close at 9

Change those 3 things, and I don't think a single person in this state, that's even remotely educated and worth listening to, would have a problem with the setup.

You don't want wine available in grocery stores?

Most liquor retailers support allowing cold beer in their shops. It really is just the grocery and oil/gas lobby that fights against it. Additionally MADD is a major factor in this, as well as 7 days a week and closing time issues.

I don't see how selling cold beer is any worse than single shots of Jack Daniels at every liquor store counter. If somebody wants a cold road beer, they could get just as impaired off a cold 3.2, sold single at every gas station. Out of all the laws governing liquor here, this one has to be the dumbest.

I don't see how selling cold beer is any worse than single shots of Jack Daniels at every liquor store counter. If somebody wants a cold road beer, they could get just as impaired off a cold 3.2, sold single at every gas station. Out of all the laws governing liquor here, this one has to be the dumbest.

It actually was fairly recent that they legalized those small bottles.

MADD doesn't' care about consistency. They support anything that limits/hinders liquor sales. And 7-11 doesn't want to lose the cold beer business.

It actually was fairly recent that they legalized those small bottles.

MADD doesn't' care about consistency. They support anything that limits/hinders liquor sales. And 7-11 doesn't want to lose the cold beer business.

I think I recently read somewhere that the founder of Drunks Against Mad Mothers ("DAMM") was shot to death by a Madman--who may have once visited a 7-11--over some sort of Facebook posting. I'm not sure if that report is consistent or inconsistent . . .

I remember when liquor stores in Oklahoma were open until 10:00 and the change to 9:00 (in the 80's) caused an uproar. I also remember when there was no time restriction on buying grocery store beer. I think both things changed around the time that liquor by the drink was approved.

I remember when liquor stores in Oklahoma were open until 10:00 and the change to 9:00 (in the 80's) caused an uproar. I also remember when there was no time restriction on buying grocery store beer. I think both things changed around the time that liquor by the drink was approved.

That would be nice.

Except for the ban on cold beer, Oklahoma's laws concerning liquor stores are hardly the strictest in the nation. However, most states with stricter liquor store laws allow strong beer/wine in grocery stores, so overall their laws are less intrusive.

One thing that I did notice in the NewsOK article about this issue, A-B submitted Ziegenbock for approval by ABLE. That has previously only been available in Texas, some of my Texas co-workers had me bring some back when we were driving back and forth between Denver and Midland. I still prefer Shiner Bock over Ziegen.

Short answer is no, this alone won't change '3.2 beer' laws in OK. As a craft beer fan and homebrewer I'd like to think this is a step in the right direction but ultimately this is just another tactic from Carlos Brito to push sales.


IMO the difference now versus back then is when AB made the decision to not sell 'high-point' beer in states that took away their ability to store/ship/sell cold or more importantly, self-distribute, the company was still family-owned and despite what people may have felt about the Busch's, they did have integrity with a quality product. Now on the other hand the greatest importance is sales and curbing the continual decline of market share to smaller craft breweries. Simply put, AB Inbev sees the potential for sales increasing whereas otherwise people would be traveling and bootlegging the products from surrounding states. On that note, my guess is this recent news is probably the worst news many bordering wet states/counties have heard coming out of OK in a very long time.

In terms of this ending '3.2 sales', another reason I can't see restaurants opting for the higher abv products is that they will either have to pay the higher taxes and eat the cost or pass it onto the customer, neither seem likely to me, especially considering the little difference. Lastly, people are comparing TX bud to OK bud whereas the clear seller for AB in draft is Bud Light. When you factor in that 'high-point' BL is 4.2ABV and 'low-point' is 4.0ABV the decision to put up with the additional middle man, un-chilled product, and higher taxes it doesn’t make much sense to me.

Not sure where to post this but this seemed as good a thread as any...

Bud Light Platinum's initial roll out in liquor stores in Oklahoma will occur this Monday. It's a stronger version of regular Bud Light with an ABV of 6%. It'll be available in 6 packs and 12 packs.

Do any of you know people who will get almost giddy at getting AB or MillerCoors products from Texas because of the higher alcohol content? Seems like the effort to get it is not worth the reward.

Do any of you know people who will get almost giddy at getting AB or MillerCoors products from Texas because of the higher alcohol content? Seems like the effort to get it is not worth the reward.

Every time I come back up from here in DFW I bring a friend some Bud Light.

Every time I come back up from here in DFW I bring a friend some Bud Light.

That seems silly since Bud Light in Texas and Oklahoma are almost exactly the same alcohol content....

That seems silly since Bud Light in Texas and Oklahoma are almost exactly the same alcohol content....

Some people just like that extra 1%

Some people just like that extra 1%

It's not even 1%. It's about .2%. Now, there may be some slight taste difference as well, with different bottlers and all (I know I have regional preferences on my Dr Pepper).

Regular Bud or other domestics it makes more sense on, but I don't get it with the light beers.

It's not even 1%. It's about .2%. Now, there may be some slight taste difference as well, with different bottlers and all (I know I have regional preferences on my Dr Pepper).

Regular Bud or other domestics it makes more sense on, but I don't get it with the light beers.

I'll be sure to pass along your concerns to them the next time I go up.

Regular Bud or other domestics it makes more sense on, but I don't get it with the light beers.

I agree. I am more of a craft beer person, but I can drink a full-strength Budweiser in other states and enjoy it. In Oklahoma, it tastes so watered down I don't even bother if that's all that's available. When it comes to Bud Light and Miller Lite however, I can't tell a difference, period.

I agree. I am more of a craft beer person, but I can drink a full-strength Budweiser in other states but in Oklahoma it tastes so watered down I don't even bother. When it comes to Bud Light and Miller Lite however, I can't tell a difference, period.

It's been a while since I've had a Bud or Bud Light and like you usually drink craft beers so the 3.2 law didn't bother me that much unless I was someplace that didn't have a lot of selection.

3.2 by weight is 4.0 ABV so the Bud Light sold in Oklahoma is 4.0 ABV VS. 4.1 ABV Bud Light sold in Texas and the rest of the country. Regular Budweiser is 5.0 ABV.

Bud light Platinum which will now be available in liquor stores in Oklahoma is 6.0 ABV