Not a solution, this is a question hahaha...


Men are so passive! The one that are aggressive are usually the ones that make me want to grab my kids, my purse and run!

I have had 3 "dates" in over 3 years... not a good record I must say!
But I have yet to meet anyone that stands out.
Are Oklahoma men born and raised to be passive aka "shy?"

Its not in my nature to just go up and talk to men. The ones that give me the signal to approach usually turn out to be Married!

Also, when I have been more aggressive, the men think your a 2-bit whore and a bar fly, even while not in a bar.

So what gives? Its hard enough being 32 years old, mother of 2 and being single in OKC. So now the men are overly passive now?
Where have all the freakin men gone? :tweeted:

I'm thinking you are much more mature and insightful than a lot of OK men here who wouldn't know the first thing to do with someone as 'trendy' or 'hip' ( and I say this in the nicest way - I've read some of your posts so this is what I am referring to) I think either you will need to hang out with either a more 'urban & insightful' group of people that understand and appreciate a more liberal outlook or go for an older or mature man that can communicate with someone of your intelligence. Maybe I'm over analyzing here, but I think you are insightful and intelligent and I don't think the good ole boys at the truck pulls will get your particular type of intellect. I see you hanging out at some poetry readings, museum gatherings, classes, cigar clubs or even the library -but I don't picture you at the watering hole conversing with the 'locals' and them having a clear understanding of who you are and what you are about.

Yeah, that seems to be true... but there is something about a man that can chop wood if he wanted to ya know *wink wink*

Im torn between the super smart guys (which I have tried) and the beer guzz'lerz who live and breath for sports, there is no happy medium dammit! And I dont care for beer at all!

Im not really "trendy" and Im not really financially able to rub elbows at cigar bars. The moment they find out I drive a 10 year old Toyota Corrolla and I dont make 6 digits, I am "trash" to them.
So, I dont just dont know. Its frustrating as hell, and im telling you now to purchase stock in Energizer!

I go out sometimes and men in bars (even the decent bars) look for 20 year olds in halter tops, no matter what age they are. Men are tempted by "slut", bottom line.

Where are these places you speak of? I can not stand yokels and girlie men.

Your not alone, I am now 29 separated with 2 kids, and I can't even find a girl to just hang out with and talk to. I am one of the shy ones but when I am aproached I will talk and carry on a conversation with. I don't like the bars never have really, I do see it that woman that are in bars and go to the guys want either drinks bought for them, money or a good romp in the sack. Guys in bars want to buy ladys drinks get drunk and look for a good romp in the sack, kinda why I stay away from the bars. I have been trying for a year to just be able to find friendship with a girl maybe even have some benifits but not neccassiaery(sp) :) any girls I have come across are either too far away or turn out wierd one way or another. One thing that gets me is when they see me or a pic of me they tell me I am cute but then quit talking to me or don't want to get together to have any fun. I have always wondered what I do wrong. But I haven't been around girls much and being married for 4 years, and now separated how do I aproach a girl to tell her hey I am only separted can we be just friends? And I am one that I really don't like to aproach the girl first afraid of what she will do or say if I try to talk her.

Oh, now,.....I can see this thread lasting a while. Good topic.

Where do women hang out besides night clubs to meet someone? Tell me, I'm there. I've thought about seminars, lectures, exhibits. But it'd have to be something that interest me or that I'm familiar with in order to strike up a conversation. I couldn't attend a poetry reading and then say, "Wow, that was great!".

I like the question, Spooky 'cause I'd really like anything close to a right answer.

There are VERY few women to meet in my profession and the bar chicks are always too something.....young, old, skanky, already with someone,...fill in the blank.

I'm just a regular guy. I like white bread, black coffee, blue jeans, and blonde, brunette or red hair. I like beer, I do and will go to truck pulls, car shows, baseball games (I've even coached little league) car races. But I dunno if I'd approach a woman who would go to those things un-escorted. (She might know more about it than I do.) I have a great job with great pay. I'm not as educated as those around me but I'm freakin' good at what I do and I do have the greatest amount of responsibility and leadership abilities. Hell, I just won an annual award today.....came home and had no one to tell about it.

I'm the happy medium, but I don't want kids. :P

Congrats on your award! :tiphat:

Not sure, I go to the grocery store hahahh And I go to 7-11 a lot.
I visit the park, but if I seen a guy there without children I would do that "running" thing, but Im sure the cops would be involved somehow.


I dont know where to meet people thats what Im asking. Are you what I would consider to be passive? Not getting past the friendly smile?

I hate that, a guy smiles at you and then he walks away. Then I start to get a complex thinking he was laughing at me!! :surrender

I have kids, not ever having any more.

I wish you luck!!!!

Congrats on your award! :tiphat:

Not sure, I go to the grocery store hahahh And I go to 7-11 a lot.
I visit the park, but if I seen a guy there without children I would do that "running" thing, but Im sure the cops would be involved somehow.


I dont know where to meet people thats what Im asking. Are you what I would consider to be passive? Not getting past the friendly smile?

I hate that, a guy smiles at you and then he walks away. Then I start to get a complex thinking he was laughing at me!! :surrender


Not sure what you mean by 'passive'....I wouldn't try to feel anyone up within the first ten minutes. Depends on if the signs would be there. How long should it take to kiss the first time? I wouldn't move without a sign, at least her being within the 'personal' space. I think that's 12-18''

Good luck to you too!!

Leon- Congratulations on your annual award!!

Well, I don't know that I should even be giving my opinion since it's been a long time since I was on the dating scene and things have probably changed quite a bit -

I have strong feelings on this one. I used to tell myself and make myself believe that I wasn't going out strictly to meet someone. I was going out to enjoy my self with my friends. If I did meet someone, it was a perk, if I didn't I made some great memories with all of my friends and still had a good time. Nothing says desperation more than going out and feeling like you just have to meet someone and giving off that aura of wanting so badly to meet someone that night. It is obvious and sort of a turn off to some people who aren't wanting to get that serious. It's like telling someone on the first date that you want to marry him and have his babies! (But I do remember feeling that way sometimes, it's human nature to want to meet someone special, I guess you have to really psyche yourself out and change your mindset to just having a good time instead of going strictly to meet someone) .

I used to get together with girlfriends and go out to the lake, beach or dancing to the clubs or - we didn't wait to be asked to dance, or for someone to buy us a drink. We made a pact ( we were younger then) that we wouldn't go home with someone for a one night stand or leave anyone behind. We then proceeded to laugh, have fun and went out on the dance floor and danced the night away. Time and time again the guys would join in with us dancing and enjoying the evening. There were hundreds of more attractive available ladies out there but who do you think the guys wanted to hang out with? Not the beauty ice queen sitting in the corner alone and unapproachable.

Long story short, you will probably meet more people when you least expect it, while you are having fun and living life rather that being on the prowl and having high expectations.

How about a dance class - line dancing, ballroom? Swing? I think that would be fun or even a gym with co-ed aerobic classes - I've never had so much fun when a guy joins in on a step class and is a total cutie klutz but laughs and tries with gusto to learn the steps. How attractive is that ? Fun loving with a good sense of humor is so important.

How about starting a game night or card club like Texas Hold Em or something similar with your friends and inviting more friends and singles to join in?

Volunteer work is a good way to meet people and make a difference and make yourself feel good as well.

I know it must be harder in this day and age to find someone, it 's a bit more complicated but now you have technology and ways to get to know someone based on personality and not just looks.

The grass is always greener, many married people assume that the single people are having so much fun and having the time of their lives... and single people envision married bliss - reality check for everyone - we all have to make the best of our situations and work on being positive and happy - we only get one chance to live this life. This is what I'm trying to do, make the best of life with a positive and optimistic view and some days are harder than others, but I keep trying anyway. Best wishes to everyone ....

I agree %100!

I have been single over 3 years now, and I will admit in the past year I have developed the I dont care attitude. Im not "looking" on the level as some, because i am fine being single. I have a busy life and I dont dwell on the fact that I dont have someone at home waiting for me.

I personally used to be slightly bitter and offended when I went out and about, I dont care anymore I just go out to have fun these days. But on the other hand, men still do not approach me... But Im sure there will be a brave non-passive soul one of these days that will want to talk to me.

Its not easy being single these days at all! And if you think for a moment that you will be alone "forever" and use the words "never" and "cant" then its not a good thing.
I like the word "yet". Im sure it will happen one day. But im human, it gets frustrating at times, but its usually not that big of a deal when I wake up the next day.

I just stay busy, and try to squeeze in as much fun as I possibly can, either with my kids or my friends, or both!

I agree about the desperation factor when it comes to being single.
I have friends who fit into this catagory, they do pretty much everything but sell thier soul to get attention from the opposite sex, and im embarrased for them.
I recommend everyone who is single and having difficulties with it to go talk to someone about it. be it a close friend or a professional. It will help just to get things out and allow yourself to whine at times.

I would just like to find places to meet people, not for a boyfriend, but to just socialize mainly. Just tired of the same people at different places. Meat markets stink!


Have some fun! Go play at the park, white water or frontier city! I do it as much as I can!!!

I agree with Spookytourchick for the most part. Men seem to be more and more passive about the dating thing. I have been single for ages, ages. I'm 37 now, and don't care either way. What bothers me the most is the married men who think that you are single and so they might stand a chance-bored with their marriages or whatever. The insult of it! grrrr..

Oklahoma men are passive!

I was in Philidelphia not too long ago. And while I was there, I had countless guys approaching me (on the street, inthe hotel etc..), and a few of them wanted my # and actually asked me if I wanted to go on a date sometime... It was NOT a "sex" thing, it was a "I would like to get to know you thing"...I had to break it to them that I lived in Oklahoma :(

Its the men here, people will argue and they dont believe me! I have traveled slightly around enough to know there is a difference!

I LOVED PA, well the men in it! It ROCKED!


Yeah, whats the deal with the married men? Im tired of that. Thats the first question I ask these days, ring or not, I ask then ask again.

It seems like from your experiences that married men seem to be very straight forward and open with single women. They are not afraid of rejection b/c they are already in a relationship. It is probably because they aren't out seeking a relationship or looking for their "soul mate". Instead they are looking for a little fun for the night or evening. Which is VERY WRONG but, it does seem like it happens all the time. I wonder if married women come across the same way to single men.

I wonder if married women come across the same way to single men.
The answer is yes, I have never had a single woman come up to me and want to dance, or do anything else, but I have had a few married women come to me for just sex. I think married women are just as bad at that as married men. It is so easy to cheat thesedays and get away with it, as long as they meet someone in a bar one night and dont exchange numbers and both parties know it is just a one night stand they seem to think it is ok. I dont understand people thesedays.

The answer is yes, I have never had a single woman come up to me and want to dance, or do anything else, but I have had a few married women come to me for just sex. I think married women are just as bad at that as married men. It is so easy to cheat thesedays and get away with it, as long as they meet someone in a bar one night and dont exchange numbers and both parties know it is just a one night stand they seem to think it is ok. I dont understand people thesedays.

I travel a LOT. Overall, I think VERY few people actually cheat on their spouse or lovers. Oh, I can say there are 1/2 dozen instances I'm aware of over 24 years of traveling. Maybe I'm an ugly MF, but it's never happened to me.

Damn, folks!!......Companionship!!!!....That's what's needed! Good companionship equals the world's BEST sex.

This place is starting to depress me. Hell, I'd be happy just to talk with someone for a while. I think it's best for me to bow out of here for a few days. Black and white letters on a PC screen aren't cutting it. I'll check the other threads before signing off, then, that's enough. This **** hurts!

[QUOTE=okcgoddess]I wonder if married women come across the same way to single men.
QUOTE]

Maybe not as much, but I've been propositioned by a couple of married/serious relationship women.

[QUOTE=okcgoddess]I wonder if married women come across the same way to single men.
QUOTE]

Maybe not as much, but I've been propositioned by a couple of married/serious relationship women.


I think women are much more likely to cheat.

Imagine any nightclub, let's say the mix is 50/50, men/women. how many women will get hit on by men? I'd say 45....how many times per woman that night, 5?
So 45 women get five chances each.


How many men will get hit on by women. I'd say 10....how many times per man, 2? so ten men get two chances each.

What I'm saying is: a higher number of women get a greater number of chances to cheat with more choices of who to cheat with.

I might agree that a higher number of men would cheat, but a higher number of women actually do.

I spend about 25% of my life living in Embassy Suites hotels. With the exception of the morbidly obese, no woman walks into a hotel bar alone and leaves without a chance to get laid.

[QUOTE=travich]


I think women are much more likely to cheat.

Imagine any nightclub, let's say the mix is 50/50, men/women. how many women will get hit on by men? I'd say 45....how many times per woman that night, 5?
So 45 women get five chances each.


How many men will get hit on by women. I'd say 10....how many times per man, 2? so ten men get two chances each.

What I'm saying is: a higher number of women get a greater number of chances to cheat with more choices of who to cheat with.

I might agree that a higher number of men would cheat, but a higher number of women actually do.

I spend about 25% of my life living in Embassy Suites hotels. With the exception of the morbidly obese, no woman walks into a hotel bar alone and leaves without a chance to get laid.
I am gonna have to agree with you leon.

I would have to disagree. I've been in plenty of bars and haven't had a single hit. And surprisingly, I'm not obese! Actually, I've always thought I was pretty attractive. Perhaps I don't look needy enough?

Or could it be the passive nature of the men in OKC???

Would LOVE to know the secret to getting a date with an attractive SINGLE man in OKC.

Leon, sorry hate to make it two in a row, but.. again have to disagree with you.

I think men and women BOTH are equally likely to cheat.

I have spent 98% (the other 2% I was in college) of my life working at a hotel (parents own a few), and yes women do walk into a hotel bar alone and leave without a chance to get laid.

Daisy, I've read the term 'passive men' in these forums several times recently. Can you tell me a little more about what that means?.....They wont approach you?....They wont try to kiss you?....They wont repeatedly ask you for a dance?.....What's that mean? It takes a lot of nerve to approach a woman. What is passive? What is agressive? When do you ask for a phone number?

You wanna get approached, let the man see you smile at him and don't look away the instant he looks at you.

Im with you sweetdaisy!

There is nothing wrong with my appearance at all.Im far from "fat" and I look nice and fun. When I go to bars men are oblivious to me and a couple of my friends. So, we sit and talk and have a good time, we get up and dance & act silly & everything. No "hits", i think its a mix between men being passive and men even the older ones who want 21 year olds in halter tops. Men are too media influenced? I observe people, not watch them, observe them. Thats what I like to do, and this is what I see.

I will admit that I have the occasional 23 year old frat boy hit on me, here is thier "line" how old are you, I slightly tell them then they are all over me. Ummm, im nobody's "sexual teacher and I have no patience with 23 year old frat boys who are looking to "hook up" with an "older" woman.

Like I said, the late 30's to early 40's men who still have some damn life in them (not sucked out by bitter relationships and divorce) are seeking 20 year olds, they all having a mid-life crisis'?

Perhaps I shouldn't use the word passive. Like spookytourchick, I tend to observe men going after the youngest, drunkest, sluttiest-dressed girls in the bar. Again, I guess this is not "passive" behavior, it's more along the lines of a predator looking for the weakest prey. My bad.

And I'm not looking for a man to try kissing on me right away. I'm just wondering why it's such a difficult thing for a guy to try to get to know a girl for a few minutes before diving onto the dance floor or asking for a phone number. I'm not going to do either if I can't at least chat for a few minutes.

I know it's a VERY difficult thing for a guy to get up the nerve to go up to a complete stranger. I have a lot of respect for guys who can do it without being completely boozy.

I agree %100! I have always said, that if there is a guy out there with enough balls to attempt to get to know me, then he will be worthwhile.


Passive to me is men just not approaching women, and like you stated, there are those who are just predators. Personally when I go out, I look for guys who look like they were dragged there by thier friends lol

That is too funny, Spooky! Nothing like trying to have a conversation with someone who doesn't want to be there! HA HA HA HA!!!

Hey Spookychick, I know totally off the subject, but do you have a website for your spooky tours? Would love to check it out!

hahah im serious, I hate "bar guys" they all wear crisp white Ambercromie shirts and spikey hair, they all look like overly trendy robots with no individuality, like leg humping dogs! Step away from the guy in the Amercrombie shirt, jeans and flip flops!


Yeah, here is my website. www.ghouli.com
I just updated the Tour information, and email me if your interested in a "singles" tour. ;)

I tend to stay away from any guy who wears Abercrombie or flip flops. YUCK. Maybe when I was in college. No pretty boys for me, thanks!!!!

on your website, and I'm already "scared"! ;-)

hahah why are you scared? Im a skeptic believe it or not. I thrive on past legends and Ghost Stories lol Im writing a book about them, and I will have a chapter in a book that will be released early 2006 "Ghostly Tales of Americas Jails". Its about the Guthrie territorial prison! I love spooky stuff and my kids think im crazy! :)


Ambercrombie... yeah, not my cup of tea at all. I like guys with mystery to them, but then again, this is Oklahoma, there are not that many mysterious looking guys available. When I say mysterious im not meaning "ninja like" or anything lol Just have a dark and passionate presence to them, aka sex appeal.

hahah why are you scared? Im a skeptic believe it or not. I thrive on past legends and Ghost Stories lol Im writing a book about them, and I will have a chapter in a book that will be released early 2006 "Ghostly Tales of Americas Jails". Its about the Guthrie territorial prison! I love spooky stuff and my kids think im crazy! :)


Ambercrombie... yeah, not my cup of tea at all. I like guys with mystery to them, but then again, this is Oklahoma, there are not that many mysterious looking guys available. When I say mysterious im not meaning "ninja like" or anything lol Just have a dark and passionate presence to them, aka sex appeal.

I imagine a lot of us are scared for the following reason. I know that is why I am all but affraid to appraoch. It is called "no." When you have heard that word out of the mouths of women right and left for years, you get so scared it is almost like being like Barney Fife.

the word "no" gets to you? What kind of women are you approaching?

One of the biggest complaints from me and all of my single female friends is that men approach women who are way out of their league. Its not an offensive statement, its just the truth.
Having confidence is a great thing, but like I stated before the mass majority of men want "maximum mag" type of women, way younger than themselves, if the woman is hanging out with a younger frat boy crowd, there is a %100 chance she is not interested in you, same goes with women.

Physical appearance and being attracted to the way a person looks is totally normal, but in a room full of singles this is whats observed by me and many other single women.

I have a friend that has a great body, bog boobs and she's blonde and she flaunts it. But, bless her heart, she's a total friggin idiot when it comes to life in general and what she wants. She is a bar fly.
We went to the KYIS singles mingle and we MADE her tone down on the way she dresses.... ALL NIGHT long men of EVERY age approached her asking her for her # and practicing the tips they were teaching us. I and another friend we actually enjoying the mingle, smiling and attempting to be sociable with EVERYONE.
Get this, my friend didnt even want to go, she was being rude to the majority of the guys there, because why? They were what we call "the average guy" (which I like) But these average guys *****' do all the work for them and they were oblivious to the couple hundred nice, attractive single "women" at the mingle.
There were a handful of girls like her, mainly because those types do not have the social issues the average person has.
So, those "average" guys were crapped on by her and the other "hot" girls and the others including myself and my friend were totally ignored.

Men are seeking Barbie dolls, then they complain when they get shot down and used. On the other hand, there were about 100 other regular nice, attractive and fun women that were overlooked entirely.

Yeah, I will admit I look at yung hot guys, but I do not approach them at all. I just admire. Its not a low self esteem thing, but the truth is, they are out of my league entirely.

I think men these days are media influenced more than anything. It doesn’t matter to me how old or young the guy is, they are going to overlook the cute girl dancing with her friends having a blast outside of the mean & narcissistic drama queen shakin her money maker for attention.

It seems like every woman I approach, no matter what she is like, tells me no. I could even go to a street corner and ask a working girl, making a cash offer and she would tell me no. No particular type. It is almost like their is a Mr. Anderson alert sent to every woman on the planet, with an incorrect message that says "loser."

I have taken the exclusive approach of Yahoo and Match.com. On Match, I let them "wink" at me, then I email them. On Yahoo, I am sslowly making headway. I dated two women (one date and three respectively) that are now members of OKC Talk. One active, one not.

Should I limit myself? No. Why do I? I am deathly affraid of the word no. That word has destroyed my self esteem and confidence. I am just now building it back.

Now. How else do I get a date? "set-up's" and singles organizations. I would love to start OKC Talk singles with organized events and speakers. In other words, a support group.

In the mean time what are you doing to build up your esteem?
I give you kudos for actually approaching women! Perhaps the women here in OKC are so accustomed to losers only approaching them that they have thier gaurd up?

Personally if a woman tells you "no" when you simply ask her to dance, thats RUDE and you should be lucky she said no, because she is not a decent person in the first place.
If any guy asks me to dance, I accept, no matter what he looks like. If they ask me nice, I will dance. Unless I just go there and sat down of course.
On the other hand a friend of mine doesnt like to dance much at all, so she will invite the guy to sit down and chat... and ya know what? most of them dont why is that?

What kinds of places do you go to Mr. Anderson?

I know 99% of the women like to dance, but frankly, I do not care for it. I have aske women out after talking to them about a pethera of subjects.

I like a variety of restaurants mainly, but it could be anywhere. A mall, an airport, a park, wherever I happen to be.

I do not do these "trendy" places because I am not trendy. I do not do "flip-flops," (I do not even know what a "flip-flop" is except for a reversal) expensive clothing, fashion restaurants, Starbuck's (I think $5.00 for a cup of coffee is a ripoff, plus it all tastes the same), or clubs (except comedy clubs).

I would rather find a nice place that does not cost a lot and is quiet like IHOP or Denny's and on occasion go to a higher end place such as Red Lobster. (I dropped $50.00 there one night and got nothing but dumped two dates later, so that was a waste of money) and a second run theater. For recreation, bowling.

Spookytourchick, I am not sure if that answers your question the way you were wanting an answer. You may also PM me if you want more detailed information.

Lots of $$ in your post!

Well this the type of guy I am, I am a average guy, like to drink a beer every so often, like to sit and have a conversation, sit by the fire on a cold night, I do not dress in highly price name brand clothes whats the point in wearing a 100 dollar shirt when I can buy something better and cheaper at walmart adn look just as good. Hell I will even wear hand me downs or get soemthing at a garage sell and be just as happy. I don't like big rowdy partys maybe a get togther with friends hang out drink a few adn enjoy the night is fun enough for me. I like anything can be happy doing anything. I don't aproach women cause I don't know what they are wanting, I get mixed signals. And the looks some women give can get confusing, some smile at you but when asked to talk they ignore and say oh I was just being nice for example I aproach a girl a few years back at a music store and to ask her on a date she said no and wouldn't say why I told her well she smiled alot when I came in here her response was she had to casue it was her job, then others look at you like they are ready to kill like a termanator on a mission. So I stopped trying to talk to women and wait for them to come to me. I like any type of women big small don't matter its how they are in person and how they treat me.

Next time you in a location and a girl smiles at you and your not in a retail store and she has a name tag on, APPROACH HER. Dont be passive.

Not a solution, this is a question hahaha...


Men are so passive! The one that are aggressive are usually the ones that make me want to grab my kids, my purse and run!

Are Oklahoma men born and raised to be passive aka "shy?"


We are usually passive because you dont know how hard it is for a man to have to ask ten women out before getting one to say yes, we get tired of being shot down all the time, I think women should ask the guys they are interested in for a change. Of all the women I have asked out, just this year alone, I have not had one date, I aint that ugly either, LOL. I am just too nice and show too much respect, and up here that will get you nowhere.

I love to make eye contact, and they make it back and they never approach or even attempt it. Its even harder for women to step up to the plate, so we are all in the same boat.


Its not easy, Im really working on it, and yeah, being told no stinks, but thats not the person who sees you for who you are. <--- awww *grabs the Rum*

I am what I am, and thats all that I am. (Popeye) 1950 something. By the way, Popeyes nephews were Peepeye, Poopeye, Pupeye, and Pipeye......now you know why I cant find a date, LMAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Mariner, you are a goob, but you crack me up.

Mariner, you are a goob, but you crack me up.
LOL, thanks, me thinks, hmm. I had to know one day what his nephews names were, see, little things like that bug me until I find out the answers, so I had to look it up. Now, again, who was Carly Simon singing about, but that is another thread, dont want to get off track here.

I've just read about 20 new posts in here since I last logged on.....Lotsa stuff about men approaching women, how difficult it is, why they wont do it more, etc.

I don't think I saw a single post about one of you ladies approaching a man. Be happy in the fact that you don't have to in order to meet somebody. Be happy knowing that you don't have to be half as concerned that a relationship goes bad because another is waiting just around the corner. Men don't have that luxury. If our relationships fail it could be months or years before we get another chance at ANYTHING.

Next time you go out with your female friends, make a pact, for a learning experience....each of you must approach two men and ask to talk or ask for a dance. And remember, you have a much less chance of getting shot down than we do. Imagine only a favorable outcome one out of five times. Imagine getting snickered at as you walk away. It wont take long to get discouraged.

If you don't want to dance with him, then at least dance with the courage it took to ask you.....It's like opening a door for a lady, but being unappreciative, she opens the next door over for herself.

As for passiveness, we're passive because the vast majority of the time we're unsuccessful, even for a simple conversation. Don't blame the passivity on the men, blame it on the 90% of your gender that has shot them down of which 20 percent have done so rudely.

If I go to a club, I DO NOT approach a woman, any woman, not if she's sitting at a table with friends. I know I wont before I get there, I plan not to. I'm not looking for a dance, I'm looking for someone to have lunch with one day the following week. If there's occassion to say hi to one while shooting pool or standing in line for a drink I will....there's seldom rejection there. But I will certainly never ask a woman to dance because if the answer's "no", then 100 people just saw you get shot down. And believe me they're watching and that's humiliating. We're not afraid of the word 'no'. we're afraid of the humiliation that comes with it. Besides, if she's at a table with friends, then at best you're interrupting a conversation to go there. Some say no because they don't want their friends to be left out.

Now, you ladies mentioned, they ask you to dance mainly because they want to get in your pants, us guys have repeatedly told you that's not always true. If you ladies can be strong enough to ask five guys to dance, guess what reputation you will have....."She wants to get laid."

No matter who asks who, the asker will be perceived as a desperate, horny, dog while the askee gets 100% of the power and a very slim chance of looking bad, desperate, or otherwise.

Please, go see how nerve-racking it is.

Now, I'd be happy to meet any of you at Hudson's on 240 for a beer tonight, maximum three beers then call it a night. No phone number, no feeling up, no kissing, just talk an hour and leave. Now, who could say "no" to that?

Ok.. so here's what happened to me this past weekend. I like to two-step. I currently know very few people who do, and most of my "going-out" friends live in Tulsa. So, in a fit of boredom/courage, I ventured out on the town by myself. Going two-stepping w/o somebody to dance w/ or friends to hang out w/ took a lot of courage for me. So, I went kind of early to avoid walking in alone in the middle of huge crowds, grabbed a drink and sat down at a table. There was hardly anyone around given the early hour. So, I sat and sat and watched people and sat some more. So, I'm thinking I'm just about the only person who came alone, and I didn't think I was ever going to get a dance. Well, the radio station people happened to set up next to me, and they asked me what I was doing there alone, yada, yada, yada. So, being the fun-loving radio personalities that they were, a couple of them decided to give me "pointers". Told me that I should change locations, move around, "get seen". And, if all else fails... ask a guy, myself. Now, I know that there are alot women out there who aren't afraid of asking a man, I however was terrified enough just being there alone... There was no way on God's green earth that I would have sauntered up to a guy to ask him out on the dance floor! Needless to say, I did have some guys approach me eventually... most of them wanting to know why I was alone (please, guys, don't ask a girl that... can't someone just be at a place alone!!). But none of them ever asked me to dance. They would just come up, chat for a little while and then leave. Then a guy finally asked me to dance, and we ended up having so much fun (he didn't get mad when I stepped on his foot!), that now I have somebody with whom to go two-stepping! I guess the point of my ramblings would be to go do the things that you enjoy, even if it means stepping outside of your comfort zone. And hold your head up high when they say "no", because you never know when it's going to be a "yes", and then you'll end up with a friend who enjoys the same things as you... and who knows, maybe something more!

Regular Two-step or Texas two-step? I'm good at the regular but don't care for the Texas.

BTW, Where'd you go?

Regular Two-step or Texas two-step? I'm good at the regular but don't care for the Texas.

Just plain ole two-step. I'm still working on the texas two-step and really think it would be fun to learn line dances (south side shuffle, etc). I went to Graham's around Reno and Portland?. I had been a couple of times in the past, so I knew what it was like (not quite as daunting as going to a new place alone!).

Im with you sweetdaisy!

There is nothing wrong with my appearance at all.Im far from "fat" and I look nice and fun. When I go to bars men are oblivious to me and a couple of my friends. So, we sit and talk and have a good time, we get up and dance & act silly & everything. No "hits", i think its a mix between men being passive and men even the older ones who want 21 year olds in halter tops. Men are too media influenced? I observe people, not watch them, observe them. Thats what I like to do, and this is what I see.

I will admit that I have the occasional 23 year old frat boy hit on me, here is thier "line" how old are you, I slightly tell them then they are all over me. Ummm, im nobody's "sexual teacher and I have no patience with 23 year old frat boys who are looking to "hook up" with an "older" woman.

Like I said, the late 30's to early 40's men who still have some damn life in them (not sucked out by bitter relationships and divorce) are seeking 20 year olds, they all having a mid-life crisis'?

I feel your pain. Every older woman that's good looking that I talk to won't talk to me because I'm younger. They assume I'm immature or irresponsible. Boy are they wrong. I'm working on my MBA and I bought my first house at 19. I guess if they're going to assume the worst in me, I don't want to be with them anyways.

I'm also sick of running into women of any age, that already have three kids. I want kids, but I don't think I'd even know where to begin with someone elses kids. Fun stuff...

hahah im serious, I hate "bar guys" they all wear crisp white Ambercromie shirts and spikey hair, they all look like overly trendy robots with no individuality, like leg humping dogs! Step away from the guy in the Amercrombie shirt, jeans and flip flops!


Yeah, here is my website. www.ghouli.com
I just updated the Tour information, and email me if your interested in a "singles" tour. ;)

Tour information? Sounds interesting...

You're my type of woman. I hate those bar guys when I see them in bricktown. I'm a programmer, so I don't have a chance to look like guys that look like Ryan Seacrest. LOL

I feel your pain. Every older woman that's good looking that I talk to won't talk to me because I'm younger. They assume I'm immature or irresponsible. Boy are they wrong. I'm working on my MBA and I bought my first house at 19. I guess if they're going to assume the worst in me, I don't want to be with them anyways.




You're alright, every older woman I meet wont talk either, kids or not. I think I'm a bit to casual for them. They're looking for someone who 'appears' to be a provider. I'm a jeans and tennis shoe guy with a white collar salary looking for a jeans and tennis shoe woman. Accept that Travich for your own good....if they learn your salary, thel'll be a bigger BS'er than the mackiest of mac-daddies. You'll never trust another word they say. Never disclose your profession the first night. If they ask, just say it's a techincal field or something like "I'm in aviation."
On the flip side, buy a t-shirt that says, "My salary is $XXX,XXX" They'll pay attention then.

I've just read about 20 new posts in here since I last logged on.....Lotsa stuff about men approaching women, how difficult it is, why they wont do it more, etc.

I don't think I saw a single post about one of you ladies approaching a man. Be happy in the fact that you don't have to in order to meet somebody. Be happy knowing that you don't have to be half as concerned that a relationship goes bad because another is waiting just around the corner. Men don't have that luxury. If our relationships fail it could be months or years before we get another chance at ANYTHING.

Next time you go out with your female friends, make a pact, for a learning experience....each of you must approach two men and ask to talk or ask for a dance. And remember, you have a much less chance of getting shot down than we do. Imagine only a favorable outcome one out of five times. Imagine getting snickered at as you walk away. It wont take long to get discouraged.

If you don't want to dance with him, then at least dance with the courage it took to ask you.....It's like opening a door for a lady, but being unappreciative, she opens the next door over for herself.

As for passiveness, we're passive because the vast majority of the time we're unsuccessful, even for a simple conversation. Don't blame the passivity on the men, blame it on the 90% of your gender that has shot them down of which 20 percent have done so rudely.

If I go to a club, I DO NOT approach a woman, any woman, not if she's sitting at a table with friends. I know I wont before I get there, I plan not to. I'm not looking for a dance, I'm looking for someone to have lunch with one day the following week. If there's occassion to say hi to one while shooting pool or standing in line for a drink I will....there's seldom rejection there. But I will certainly never ask a woman to dance because if the answer's "no", then 100 people just saw you get shot down. And believe me they're watching and that's humiliating. We're not afraid of the word 'no'. we're afraid of the humiliation that comes with it. Besides, if she's at a table with friends, then at best you're interrupting a conversation to go there. Some say no because they don't want their friends to be left out.

Now, you ladies mentioned, they ask you to dance mainly because they want to get in your pants, us guys have repeatedly told you that's not always true. If you ladies can be strong enough to ask five guys to dance, guess what reputation you will have....."She wants to get laid."

No matter who asks who, the asker will be perceived as a desperate, horny, dog while the askee gets 100% of the power and a very slim chance of looking bad, desperate, or otherwise.

Please, go see how nerve-racking it is.

Now, I'd be happy to meet any of you at Hudson's on 240 for a beer tonight, maximum three beers then call it a night. No phone number, no feeling up, no kissing, just talk an hour and leave. Now, who could say "no" to that?
Leon, very well put and all so true. Good luck tonight at Hudsons also. I am going to see if I can get shot down again tonight, LOL.

Please ladies, dont take this wrong, but you ALWAYS have the upper hand in dating, you can either make us feel like complete idots when we ask you out, or you can make us feel like complete winners, usually it is like complete idiots.

Even if she didn't have a name tag it isn't that easy. This how hard it is for me I can't even as much make friendship with any girl, I don't know what it is about me or maybe I am just that bad looking or something. I mean all I want is a female friendship not even a date and I can't even get that much. I have even tried going into chat rooms and just for heck of it stiking up a chat or im'ed one and hi wanna chat? and the take off running and leave. So what does that mean? Was that not the right question? What is a guy just wanting a friendship and a chat partner supose to do?

In the mean time what are you doing to build up your esteem?
I give you kudos for actually approaching women! Perhaps the women here in OKC are so accustomed to losers only approaching them that they have thier gaurd up?

Personally if a woman tells you "no" when you simply ask her to dance, thats RUDE and you should be lucky she said no, because she is not a decent person in the first place.
If any guy asks me to dance, I accept, no matter what he looks like. If they ask me nice, I will dance. Unless I just go there and sat down of course.
On the other hand a friend of mine doesnt like to dance much at all, so she will invite the guy to sit down and chat... and ya know what? most of them dont why is that?

What kinds of places do you go to Mr. Anderson?

Spooky, what if you're like me and you can't dance?

Next time you in a location and a girl smiles at you and your not in a retail store and she has a name tag on, APPROACH HER. Dont be passive.

God I'm such an idiot. I had a girl say hi TO ME at Starbucks the other day... I thought she was just being friendly. You make it sound like if they actually talk to you, then they want you... :)

You're alright, every older woman I meet wont talk either, kids or not. I think I'm a bit to casual for them. They're looking for someone who 'appears' to be a provider. I'm a jeans and tennis shoe guy with a white collar salary looking for a jeans and tennis shoe woman. Accept that Travich for your own good....if they learn your salary, thel'll be a bigger BS'er than the mackiest of mac-daddies. You'll never trust another word they say. Never disclose your profession the first night. If they ask, just say it's a techincal field or something like "I'm in aviation."
On the flip side, buy a t-shirt that says, "My salary is $XXX,XXX" They'll pay attention then.

Yeah, great point. I'm definitely a TSHirtts and jeans guy... looking for that type of woman too!

My two cents for what its worth........ I am not the typical woman that you guys are describing. However, I think it is all in your approach. If a guy was to approach me and ask how I was doing and start up a casual conversation then I would speak with them. I don't want a guy walking up to me and giving me a cheesy pick up line. That always makes it seem like they just want to get in my pants. But if they want to have a conversation then I will talk with anyone. I haven't been seperated long to be an expert on this but I know I will talk to a nice guy for a friendship and not just shoot him down. If I guy looks desperate and makes me feel uneasy I will turn away and run!

I fit your description as being the 24 year old halter top girl but I don't fit the personality or type of person you are describing. I like to look nice when I go out and have a fun time. Bottom line if a man approached me no matter what age or how he looked I would have a friendly conversation and then go from there. I am probably to "passive" or "shy" most of the time to do the approaching.

My two cents for what its worth........ I am not the typical woman that you guys are describing. However, I think it is all in your approach. If a guy was to approach me and ask how I was doing and start up a casual conversation then I would speak with them. I don't want a guy walking up to me and giving me a cheesy pick up line. That always makes it seem like they just want to get in my pants. But if they want to have a conversation then I will talk with anyone. I haven't been seperated long to be an expert on this but I know I will talk to a nice guy for a friendship and not just shoot him down. If I guy looks desperate and makes me feel uneasy I will turn away and run!

I fit your description as being the 24 year old halter top girl but I don't fit the personality or type of person you are describing. I like to look nice when I go out and have a fun time. Bottom line if a man approached me no matter what age or how he looked I would have a friendly conversation and then go from there. I am probably to "passive" or "shy" most of the time to do the approaching.

My t-shirt and jeans comment was not intended as what I look for when I go out....but the TYPE I'm seeking. It's not how I look either when I go out. It means I want someone who doesn't act like they're better than everyone around them, who appreciates an act of kindness not demands it. I want one who plants her own flowers, would at least try to help with a home improvement project, appreciates the money saved if I change the oil in her car.....COULD mow the grass if I was out of town. There has been chat in here about single mothers and men running from them....hell, "Leon" recognizes how difficult it is to be a single mom. "Leon" can appreciate that they have too much to do and too little time to do it. "Leon" was raised by a single mother.

My two cents for what its worth........ I am not the typical woman that you guys are describing. .
Thank GOD your not like most of the rest, where are all the other women like you, ones you can trust and ones who would love to have a nice guy, not in Michigan, thats for sure.