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Plutonic Panda
01-26-2014, 06:57 PM
Yes growing to 2 mil means an added 700k people, or 1,000 a day. Not going to happenLet me say this again


The point I was making, was that OKC could experience a population boom that could blow projections out of the water.

Plutonic Panda
01-26-2014, 06:58 PM
If you guys also haven't heard Dallas is starting it's 2nd signature bridge. This one will be on I 30 crossing the Trinity River. The bridge frame is already hard at work at their Florida facility and will be shipped to Dallas once they have all there pieces made.

From a steel plant in Tampa, Florida, a very, very early look at Dallas? second Calatrava bridge | Dallas Morning News (http://cityhallblog.dallasnews.com/2013/07/from-a-steel-plant-in-tampa-florida-a-very-very-early-look-at-dallas-second-calatrava-bridge.html/)Yes, that will be beautiful bridge.

Plutonic Panda
01-26-2014, 07:00 PM
Nashville has not been a population boomtown. Never has been. Sorry. Here are Nashville's numbers (http://recenter.tamu.edu/data/pop/popm/cbsa34980.asp). Nashville has only added 40,000 or more people once since 2000. Just once. Also, from just looking, that year seemed to be the result of Hurricane Katrina, when many southern cities saw large gains of new residents from New Orleans.

Nashville also only added 30,000+ three times since 2000.

It's growing nicely, but its not a "boomtown". A boomtown has to achieve atleast 25% or higher growth during a decade.

Yes, downtown/urban development wise, yes, it's having a boom.

You're right, Charlotte is a boomtown, and I should have said a misunderstood boomtown instead of saying it isn't a boomtown. Again, Charlotte's big jump in population occurred from the addition of new populated counties added to its defined metro area and then gaining CSA recognition.

As an example, it would be like OKC and Tulsa forming a CSA and the OKC metro overnight jumped to 2.4 million people. 1.1 million people didn't relocate to OKC overnight. You get it?

On a yearly basis, Charlotte adds about 35-40,000 people a year. That's not bad.



Sure, but it could also start raining candy next year too but historically and from what we know, that's not going to happen.Alright, fair enough then, I was wrong about that. I just see Nashville high up on a lot of best cities rankings lists and know they have a ton of development going on, so I figured they'd be a boomtown.

I understand what you are saying about MSA and CSA, I get what happened to Charlotte, but it seems Charlotte really improved itself prior to 2000.

Now, I understand it is incredibly unrealistic for OKC to add 400,000 people a year, but I don't think it is bad to assume OKC might become a boomtown.

Plutonic Panda
01-26-2014, 07:02 PM
Greater Austin population from 1960.Wow, those are amazing numbers. Didn't realize how long they have really been on a ball.

Plutonic Panda
01-26-2014, 07:03 PM
No offense to Plutonic, but I get the vibe that he's incredibly young,I'm now 20.

JoninATX
01-26-2014, 07:30 PM
It's cool I'm in my 20's and loving every single bit of it. It's hard to actually take in on what they mean through a computer, than just simply talking to a person.

josh
01-26-2014, 08:22 PM
Alright, fair enough then, I was wrong about that. I just see Nashville high up on a lot of best cities rankings lists and know they have a ton of development going on, so I figured they'd be a boomtown.

I understand what you are saying about MSA and CSA, I get what happened to Charlotte, but it seems Charlotte really improved itself prior to 2000.

Now, I understand it is incredibly unrealistic for OKC to add 400,000 people a year, but I don't think it is bad to assume OKC might become a boomtown.

It's unrealistic in the sense of projections because historically and currently, there's nothing to indicate that would happen. Could OKC improve a percentage point or two decade wise, sure, but that would still wouldn't get OKC anywhere near boomtown status.

I think you should be happy that your metro is growing and isn't stagnant or decreasing like other metros.

josh
01-26-2014, 08:23 PM
Wow, those are amazing numbers. Didn't realize how long they have really been on a ball.

In 1960 San Antonio had a population of 587,718. Today the population is 2.3 million.

josh
01-26-2014, 08:25 PM
I'm now 20.

Not as young as I assumed (16 or 17) but still young and naive/idealistic to a fault. I was like that at that age as well so I mean that as no insult. I didn't have a full understanding. You'll get there. I'm in my late 20s now.

bchris02
01-27-2014, 09:38 AM
It's unrealistic in the sense of projections because historically and currently, there's nothing to indicate that would happen. Could OKC improve a percentage point or two decade wise, sure, but that would still wouldn't get OKC anywhere near boomtown status.

I think you should be happy that your metro is growing and isn't stagnant or decreasing like other metros.

I agree. It's really awesome OKC is growing as much as it is, but we are a good ways off from boomtown status. In order for OKC to become a boomtown, two things need to happen.

1. Much higher rate of job growth than we are currently seeing, especially middle and high income
2. Increased and improved amenities so that choosing OKC over other cities doesn't result in significant sacrifices in quality of life, and may in fact have advantages other than low cost of living

If those two things happen, everything else will take care of itself and we can watch the 25 story condo towers spring up.

progressiveboy
02-13-2014, 09:25 AM
More accolades for Dallas. The only question is if this happens, who would move from beautiful San Diego with perfect weather to the plains of Texas?




California tech firm could relocate up to 1,000 jobs to Dallas in biggest move since Comerica | Dallas Morning News (http://www.dallasnews.com/business/commercial-real-estate/headlines/20140211-california-tech-firm-could-relocate-up-to-1000-jobs-to-dallas-in-biggest-move-since-comerica.ece)

JoninATX
02-14-2014, 02:54 AM
People who want to be employed by there company. Lots of California businesses have moved to the Lone Star state. Most of them seem to like it even during the brutal hot summers. Btw Dallas is a mecca area for California transplants.

progressiveboy
04-29-2014, 08:20 AM
Dallas to gain "US Headquarters" for Toyota! What a "catch" with 4,000 new jobs. This is a corporate relocation from California. Looking to locate in Plano, a upscale suburb of Dallas.



Toyota moving U.S. base from California to Texas | News OK (http://newsok.com/toyota-moving-u.s.-base-from-california-to-texas/article/4569148)

ou48A
04-29-2014, 09:24 AM
Texas has a far friendly business environment than California.
In the long run the move will be profitable for Toyota and for those individuals who make the move.

California has very serious long term problems.

HangryHippo
04-29-2014, 01:06 PM
Dallas to gain "US Headquarters" for Toyota! What a "catch" with 4,000 new jobs. This is a corporate relocation from California. Looking to locate in Plano, a upscale suburb of Dallas.



Toyota moving U.S. base from California to Texas | News OK (http://newsok.com/toyota-moving-u.s.-base-from-california-to-texas/article/4569148)

Damn, that's a good catch for Texas. They are gaining new employers like they're growing on trees.

onthestrip
04-29-2014, 01:53 PM
Texas has a far friendly business environment than California.
In the long run the move will be profitable for Toyota and for those individuals who make the move.

California has very serious long term problems.

While CA probably takes the cake for most expensive place to do business Im not sure what long term problems you are talking about. They did have a multi-billion dollar surplus last year. They have some debt but they must not be doing that bad.

PWitty
04-29-2014, 07:10 PM
I don't personally know much about California's fiscal shape, but every article I have seen for quite awhile has had California in the bottom five if not dead last when they rank the states against each other. These are just the first two that popped up on Google. I've heard that California is improving, but I suppose it takes more than one year of a budget surplus to right the ship.

Ranking of States by Fiscal Position (http://www.cnbc.com/id/101345437)

The Best and Worst Run States in America (http://247wallst.com/special-report/2013/11/21/the-best-and-worst-run-states-in-america-a-survey-of-all-50-2/)

Snowman
04-29-2014, 07:34 PM
While CA probably takes the cake for most expensive place to do business Im not sure what long term problems you are talking about. They did have a multi-billion dollar surplus last year. They have some debt but they must not be doing that bad.

One of their hardest things is going to be can they keep being bailed out by new industries spinning up or stem the long bleed of companies relocating. The aviation and defense manufactures migrated several decades ago, fortunately for the state those corporate campuses fit well for the start up that had grown near that time semi conductor manufactures and computer OEMs (most have moved or scaled back what is done in California), largely replaced by major software companies (some are still their, some have left), expanding from that has been internet companies.

Rover
04-29-2014, 08:01 PM
Cal has the highest bus tax burden of all states and DC

bluedogok
04-29-2014, 08:14 PM
Public pension obligations are what is going to do in California, it is pretty bad when Jerry Brown seems to be one of the "most reasonable" and "responsible" politicians in the state now. He is one of the few who publicly acknowledge the looming problem.

City Journal - California (http://www.city-journal.org/california/)

BG918
04-29-2014, 09:28 PM
Silicon Valley is still the center for technological innovation for the entire WORLD, and that isn't changing anytime soon. California has its problems but is still one of key drivers of the American economy.

Just the facts
04-30-2014, 06:29 AM
Public pension obligations are what is going to do in California, it is pretty bad when Jerry Brown seems to be one of the "most reasonable" and "responsible" politicians in the state now. He is one of the few who publicly acknowledge the looming problem.

City Journal - California (http://www.city-journal.org/california/)

That problem is not unique to California though. The unfunded portion of Oklahoma's teacher pension is larger that the entire Oklahoma state budget. The Oklahoma legislature should have fun trying to figure that one out. It makes the AICC funding issue seem like childs play.

The Shortfalls of Oklahoma's Defined Benefit Public Pension Plans > Publications > State Budget Solutions (http://www.statebudgetsolutions.org/publications/detail/the-shortfalls-of-oklahomas-defined-benefit-public-pension-plans)

ou48A
04-30-2014, 09:22 AM
While CA probably takes the cake for most expensive place to do business Im not sure what long term problems you are talking about. They did have a multi-billion dollar surplus last year. They have some debt but they must not be doing that bad.
A multi-billion dollar surplus is not a very significant factor in major business relocation’s.

In both 2012 and 2013, Texas was ranked the best state for business in a survey conducted by Chief Executive.
California was ranked 50th.

Things like “Taxations & Regulations, Workforce, Quality Living Environment” are far more important to high quality jobs.
This trend of good jobs leaving California has been going on for several years. Things like this don't normally change very quickly.

This is just one place where we can see the real world cost and impact of the numerous excessive California laws and regulations that has caused a flow of wealth and many high end jobs to leave California.

Report: Toyota Says 'Later' To California, 'Howdy' To Texas | The Daily Caller (http://dailycaller.com/2014/04/28/report-toyota-says-later-to-california-howdy-to-texas/#ixzz30NhAVSLK)

Occidental Petroleum (OXY) recently announced they were moving it's headquarters out of L. A. to Houston with 6000 jobs.
These are more high quality jobs packing up and leaving California.
Nissan moved thousands of jobs out of California in 2005

ou48A
04-30-2014, 09:34 AM
Silicon Valley is still the center for technological innovation for the entire WORLD, and that isn't changing anytime soon. California has its problems but is still one of key drivers of the American economy.

As more corporations relocate they will either take or eventually take all or parts of their research and development staff with them..... California will need to adapt soon or they will increasingly lose major elements of their “technological innovation” ability. Without big change, increasingly California will lose it's desirability as a place to live and over 20 or so years many high skilled people will want out.

Right now Texas is just one place getting great California jobs

progressiveboy
05-02-2014, 08:57 AM
As more corporations relocate they will either take or eventually take all or parts of their research and development staff with them..... California will need to adapt soon or they will increasingly lose major elements of their “technological innovation” ability. Without big change, increasingly California will lose it's desirability as a place to live and over 20 or so years many high skilled people will want out.

Right now Texas is just one place getting great California jobs According to the Dallas Morning News, looks like Dallas possibly gain another California company. Why can't Oklahoma gain some of these "white" collar jobs? Oklahoma to heavily dependent on the oil industry. Another boom and bust cycle for OK.





Real estate brokers buzz about possible office move by San Francisco-based Charles Schwab | Dallas Morning News (http://bizbeatblog.dallasnews.com/2014/05/real-estate-brokers-buzz-about-possible-office-move-by-san-francisco-based-charles-schwab.html/)

HangryHippo
05-02-2014, 09:44 AM
According to the Dallas Morning News, looks like Dallas possibly gain another California company. Why can't Oklahoma gain some of these "white" collar jobs? Oklahoma to heavily dependent on the oil industry. Another boom and bust cycle for OK.

I wonder that myself. Dallas seems to be raking in white collar jobs in massive numbers, but OKC doesn't benefit nearly as much when these huge relocations happen.

bchris02
05-02-2014, 10:41 AM
According to the Dallas Morning News, looks like Dallas possibly gain another California company. Why can't Oklahoma gain some of these "white" collar jobs? Oklahoma to heavily dependent on the oil industry. Another boom and bust cycle for OK.





Real estate brokers buzz about possible office move by San Francisco-based Charles Schwab | Dallas Morning News (http://bizbeatblog.dallasnews.com/2014/05/real-estate-brokers-buzz-about-possible-office-move-by-san-francisco-based-charles-schwab.html/)

In my opinion, there are a few reasons.

1. Momentum - OKC's momentum isn't very impressive when compared to almost any Texas city
2. DFW's airport
3. DFW's massive educated talent pool - like it or not there is still brain drain out of Oklahoma and OKC

BG918
05-02-2014, 11:01 AM
Interesting about Charles Schwab. The company I work for does a lot of work for them, and they are in the process of completing a huge new campus for 2,500 employees in Lone Tree, CO. We have been hearing about an even bigger campus in Austin that is in the works, but nothing about Dallas.

ou48A
05-02-2014, 11:58 AM
According to the Dallas Morning News, looks like Dallas possibly gain another California company. Why can't Oklahoma gain some of these "white" collar jobs? Oklahoma to heavily dependent on the oil industry. Another boom and bust cycle for OK.





Real estate brokers buzz about possible office move by San Francisco-based Charles Schwab | Dallas Morning News (http://bizbeatblog.dallasnews.com/2014/05/real-estate-brokers-buzz-about-possible-office-move-by-san-francisco-based-charles-schwab.html/)
Why?

It's because our business model isn't near as business friendly and we are not nearly as aggressive with incentives... particularly at the local levels.
We have far too many people too worried about the fairness of corporate handouts when the rest of the competitive world does far more of this....As a result our growth, diversity and prosperity lags behind where it needs to be.

In places like Norman that do have a lot to offer they don't do nearly enough locally to attract the very high end jobs in the numbers that are needed to redevelop the community in ways that many want.

Get the jobs right (very high end)................ and most of the other stuff will follow on its own... As always, follow the money!

bluedogok
05-02-2014, 10:13 PM
Interesting about Charles Schwab. The company I work for does a lot of work for them, and they are in the process of completing a huge new campus for 2,500 employees in Lone Tree, CO. We have been hearing about an even bigger campus in Austin that is in the works, but nothing about Dallas.
The company that I worked for in Austin used to do a bunch of Schwab offices (not the major back end type) and I think Charles Schwab may even have a residence in Austin.

I also don't think there will be a 1980's type bust in the future, there is just so much more world demand for oil and gas than there was 30 years ago. There will always be peaks and valleys but a total collapse is unlikely and if it does there will be much more than the just the energy industry in energy states affected.

adaniel
05-02-2014, 11:35 PM
I wonder that myself. Dallas seems to be raking in white collar jobs in massive numbers, but OKC doesn't benefit nearly as much when these huge relocations happen.

I'm a bit confused by this statement. OKC doesn't need "big" relocations because we have a smaller population. Boeing moving 1,000 people from Long Beach and Wichita has a greater effect on our economy than Toyota moving 4,000 since DFW is over 5x the size. And you can't just look at raw job numbers. Continental only moved 400 positions to this area but they were at an average salary of well over 100K. That's the same as 2,000 jobs moving to Dallas.

soonerguru
05-03-2014, 12:41 AM
Why?

It's because our business model isn't near as business friendly and we are not nearly as aggressive with incentives... particularly at the local levels.
We have far too many people too worried about the fairness of corporate handouts when the rest of the competitive world does far more of this....As a result our growth, diversity and prosperity lags behind where it needs to be.

In places like Norman that do have a lot to offer they don't do nearly enough locally to attract the very high end jobs in the numbers that are needed to redevelop the community in ways that many want.

Get the jobs right (very high end)................ and most of the other stuff will follow on its own... As always, follow the money!

Talent pool. This state is not producing enough educated workforce. It doesn't even seem to value common or higher education. Also, transportation is lacking for a major international firm. Very few direct flights and mostly on second-rate, tiny jets. Texas actually charges hefty franchise taxes to businesses; they don't just give away the farm like our current overdorks are doing. Texas is bigger.

OKC is this state's only hope (and Tulsa to a lesser degree). Norman isn't even a factor. The rest of the state is turning into Mississippi.

progressiveboy
05-03-2014, 10:50 AM
I'm a bit confused by this statement. OKC doesn't need "big" relocations because we have a smaller population. Boeing moving 1,000 people from Long Beach and Wichita has a greater effect on our economy than Toyota moving 4,000 since DFW is over 5x the size. And you can't just look at raw job numbers. Continental only moved 400 positions to this area but they were at an average salary of well over 100K. That's the same as 2,000 jobs moving to Dallas. Sorry, disagree. OKC does need big relocations like Dallas because it will bring high salaries and educated people with lots of money. OKC needs residents with "high incomes" with lots of disposable income to have high end stores that OKC seems to covet. While Boeing and GE will have a small impact, looking long term OKC is just going to need to be more aggressive in attracting educated, "great" paying jobs. If Dallas can do it, then why can't OKC get some of these desireable , coveted HQ"s? OKC cannot rest on it's laurels!

bchris02
05-03-2014, 03:41 PM
Sorry, disagree. OKC does need big relocations like Dallas because it will bring high salaries and educated people with lots of money. OKC needs residents with "high incomes" with lots of disposable income to have high end stores that OKC seems to covet. While Boeing and GE will have a small impact, looking long term OKC is just going to need to be more aggressive in attracting educated, "great" paying jobs. If Dallas can do it, then why can't OKC get some of these desireable , coveted HQ"s? OKC cannot rest on it's laurels!

I agree. Like I've said before though, OKC just isn't as attractive of a location for large companies to do business as DFW. The reasons for that ranges from the size of the airport to brain drain to the policies at 23rd and Lincoln. Question is what can be done about it and is Oklahoma willing to make the political decisions necessary to attract some of those companies.

soonerguru
05-03-2014, 04:26 PM
I agree. Like I've said before though, OKC just isn't as attractive of a location for large companies to do business as DFW. The reasons for that ranges from the size of the airport to brain drain to the policies at 23rd and Lincoln. Question is what can be done about it and is Oklahoma willing to make the political decisions necessary to attract some of those companies.

This has stopped. It's not that we're losing lots of smart people, it's just that we need to recruit more -- or educate more of our people to create more of them.

OKC is a far more attractive place for smart people to live than it used to be, but the idiocracy running our state and demanding media attention (Fallin, Inhofe, Kern, etc.) substantiate negative stereotypes about our state and do not make our state an attractive place to relocate for smart people.

adaniel
05-03-2014, 04:56 PM
This has stopped. It's not that we're losing lots of smart people, it's just that we need to recruit more -- or educate more of our people to create more of them.

OKC is a far more attractive place for smart people to live than it used to be, but the idiocracy running our state and demanding media attention (Fallin, Inhofe, Kern, etc.) substantiate negative stereotypes about our state and do not make our state an attractive place to relocate for smart people.

Thank you. Said poster should look at the thread where OKC ranks 12th in the increase in millennials in the past 5 years. But don't let facts get in the way.

With that in mind, it is becoming apparent that for all the great things lining up in OKC the state is increasingly getting in the way. Since I have no hope of them changing anytime soon, I really believe that urban legislative members should start pushing for a constitutional convention that allows for more local control. Texas IMO is even more right wing in some ways at the state level, but localities here have more power in raising revenue and setting their own guidelines vs municipalities in OK.

Jersey Boss
05-05-2014, 02:53 PM
As more corporations relocate they will either take or eventually take all or parts of their research and development staff with them..... California will need to adapt soon or they will increasingly lose major elements of their “technological innovation” ability. Without big change, increasingly California will lose it's desirability as a place to live and over 20 or so years many high skilled people will want out.

Right now Texas is just one place getting great California jobs


Was Toyota driven out of California? Not so fast - latimes.com (http://www.latimes.com/business/autos/la-fi-toyota-economy-20140502,0,1647755.story#ixzz30sOSr0AS)
Toyota's plan to close its Torrance headquarters and ship 3,000 jobs to a Dallas suburb has triggered a new round of hand-wringing among those who see business-friendly Texas gaining at the expense of regulation-choked California.


In Austin, Texas Gov. Rick Perry took a victory lap, crediting his state's low taxes and hands-off policies. Lawmakers and business lobbyists from Torrance to Sacramento said the Golden State must unravel red tape and increase incentives if it hopes to compete for jobs. They ridiculed Gov. Jerry Brown for not even knowing about Toyota's plans to abandon his state.

The trouble is that taxes, regulations and business climate appear to have had nothing to do with Toyota's move. It came down to a simple matter of geography and a plan for corporate consolidation, Toyota's North American chief told The Times. And in the big picture, California's and Texas' economies are growing at a similar pace, with corporate relocations — in either direction — representing only a tiny slice of job growth in both states.

"It may seem like a juicy story to have this confrontation between California and Texas, but that was not the case," said Jim Lentz, Toyota's North American chief executive.

Toyota left California to move its company's brainpower, now divided among offices in three states, into one headquarters close to the company's manufacturing base, primarily in the South.

"It doesn't make sense to have oversight of manufacturing 2,000 miles away from where the cars were made," Lentz said. "Geography is the reason not to have our headquarters in California."

In the big picture, Texas and California are seeing strong job growth. Since they bottomed out in the recession, both states have added about 1.2 million jobs. That represents a 12% gain for Texas but only 8% for California because of its larger job market. Texas also suffered fewer losses in the downturn.

Average wages, adjusted for inflation, have fallen in both states since 2007. But they have fallen 3.8% in Texas, compared to 2.1% in California, according to Labor Department data.

For companies that do move, corporate strategy often plays a bigger role than a state's tax or regulatory climate.

When Northrop Grumman moved its headquarters and 300 jobs to Virginia from Century City three years ago, the company aimed to get closer to Pentagon power brokers who decided on big contracts for the company, the company's chief executive, Wesley B. Bush, said at the time.

Los Angeles-based Occidental Petroleum, which announced earlier this year that it would move its headquarter to Houston, wants to be closer to the profitable Texas oil patch.

Toyota's thinking is similar.

Lentz said the move grew from a conversation a year ago with Toyota global President Akio Toyoda, about how to structure North American business "for the next 50 years." The current setup, with corporate affiliates spread across the U.S., no longer made sense for a company that builds and sells millions of cars a year here.

Toyota began looking for a place to consolidate, comparing everything from climate and direct flights to Japan to cost of living and schools in 100 metro areas. It then narrowed the list to four finalists: Atlanta, Charlotte, N.C., Denver and Plano, an affluent suburb of Dallas. Torrance was never on the list, in part because Lentz wanted to avoid a culture clash between different arms of corporate management.



Was Toyota driven out of California? Not so fast - latimes.com (http://www.latimes.com/business/autos/la-fi-toyota-economy-20140502,0,1647755.story#ixzz30sP1uiir)

Snowman
05-05-2014, 03:16 PM
Seems like a slightly contradictory message, going on and on about it was not a factor but at the end discussing the metrics they used for site selection which just from a cursory glance, would have likely knocked keeping it in the same location in the list of locations considered.

Just the facts
05-05-2014, 03:25 PM
For companies that do move, corporate strategy often plays a bigger role than a state's tax or regulatory climate.

Unless that company is GE and opening an office in OKC because we have been told the Quality Jobs program and local incentives is what sealed that deal.

BG918
05-07-2014, 09:40 AM
Article about the "unprecedented" office market in Dallas right now. Really staggering numbers of large corporations needing millions of SF of space and several potential high profile HQ relocations. Dallas is on such a different level than anything here. The question our leaders should ask is how do we capitalize from having a Top 4 US metro less than a hundred miles from the OK border and the challenges/opportunities ahead (transportation, higher education, water..)

D Real Estate Daily » Blog Archive » Chase, Caterpillar, Google, Amazon?Breaking Down Other Big Deals in the Market (http://realestate.dmagazine.com/2014/05/mega-deals-in-the-market-breaking-it-down/)

HangryHippo
05-07-2014, 09:48 AM
Article about the "unprecedented" office market in Dallas right now. Really staggering numbers of large corporations needing millions of SF of space and several potential high profile HQ relocations. Dallas is on such a different level than anything here. The question our leaders should ask is how do we capitalize from having a Top 4 US metro less than a hundred miles from the OK border and the challenges/opportunities ahead (transportation, higher education, water..)

D Real Estate Daily » Blog Archive » Chase, Caterpillar, Google, Amazon?Breaking Down Other Big Deals in the Market (http://realestate.dmagazine.com/2014/05/mega-deals-in-the-market-breaking-it-down/)

It's really incredible. I just don't see what they're doing so differently that we can't capitalize on some of that being so close. Why can't we get these companies to look at us instead?

BG918
05-07-2014, 10:31 AM
The only thing that could potentially slow them down is access to water. DFW can't support the 8 million that they are projecting will be living there in a decade with current water sources. That is why they have been trying to tap into Oklahoma water for years, and will continue that fight. As long as Oklahoma doesn't give in and sell the water we will have the upper hand in the near future when DFW becomes increasingly expensive and congested.

Having better connections to the Metroplex will be essential. Expanded I-35 from OKC and the construction of a limited access highway (likely tolled) on Hwy 75 from Tulsa. Also passenger rail from Tulsa and OKC into Dallas, not just Ft Worth.

One of the biggest factors is higher education. Already the Metroplex sends thousands of students each year to OU and OSU, and that share will probably get larger. This is good for the universities as these students pay higher tuition, but until recently most went back to Texas after graduation. Retaining more of these students with job opportunities in Oklahoma will be key. I also think there will be a time when OU, and to a lesser extent OSU, will be majority Texas students and higher achieving Oklahoma students. More Oklahoma students will go to OCU, NSU, etc as an alternative to an increasingly expensive OU or OSU education.

Snowman
05-07-2014, 10:34 AM
There MSA population growth alone is crazy, they pretty much have had a group the size of Norman or more mover there every year since WW2 ended.

adaniel
05-07-2014, 11:04 AM
If you are curious, OKC MSA actually grew a tad bit faster than DFW's last year. 1.717% vs 1.613%.

And I would argue that DFW's growth is starting to spill into SE OK, if I am not mistaken Durant is now part of the DFW consolidated area. The local government down there has been very progressive in marketing to logistics firms who want to avoid TX's high property taxes but have easy access to the DFW market. Bryan county grew at around 1.745% last year. In comparison, Grayson County TX, the county just across the border from Durant grew at about 0.55%. There has been similar success on a lesser scale in Ardmore and Marietta.

If the OK state government were smart it would start studying what Durant is doing.

bchris02
05-07-2014, 11:19 AM
Other than the usual culprits i.e. the airport, brain drain, office space, etc, I think if OKC was in Texas and not in Oklahoma I think it could see more benefit from the current boom. Every Texas city other than maybe El Paso has a huge amount of momentum right now. Oklahoma is reaching a point where the state government is holding the city back and until there is a change of leadership, which is unlikely, OKC will continue to play fifth fiddle behind San Antonio, Austin, Houston, and DFW.

BG918
05-07-2014, 12:14 PM
Texas has a swagger that Oklahoma lacks. People not in Texas call it arrogance but it has worked tremendously well for their overall image and business development. Just being close to Texas won't do it, you have to have a greater advantage than that. Arkansas, Louisiana and New Mexico are adjacent to Texas and none of those states are high performers.

Plutonic Panda
05-07-2014, 03:12 PM
Other than the usual culprits i.e. the airport, brain drain, office space, etc, I think if OKC was in Texas and not in Oklahoma I think it could see more benefit from the current boom. Every Texas city other than maybe El Paso has a huge amount of momentum right now. Oklahoma is reaching a point where the state government is holding the city back and until there is a change of leadership, which is unlikely, OKC will continue to play fifth fiddle behind San Antonio, Austin, Houston, and DFW.El Paso, Lubbock, and Amarillo don't really have much going on.

DFW, Houston, Austin, and SA are really Texas's main cities and as far as Midland, that won't last. The place is a dump and once they go through the energy boom there, I highly doubt it is a city people will want to stay in. Just go look at pictures of it.

HangryHippo
05-07-2014, 03:15 PM
Texas has a swagger that Oklahoma lacks. People not in Texas call it arrogance but it has worked tremendously well for their overall image and business development. Just being close to Texas won't do it, you have to have a greater advantage than that. Arkansas, Louisiana and New Mexico are adjacent to Texas and none of those states are high performers.

And my god are they arrogant. Texans are obnoxious as hell about being from Texas. I'm hesitant to attribute their economic successes to that swagger, but maybe that really does help them.

ou48A
05-07-2014, 04:59 PM
Texas has a swagger that Oklahoma lacks. People not in Texas call it arrogance but it has worked tremendously well for their overall image and business development. Just being close to Texas won't do it, you have to have a greater advantage than that. Arkansas, Louisiana and New Mexico are adjacent to Texas and none of those states are high performers.

It does help them a lot.
They have a by god we can do that attitude and unlike some of our local leaders in Norman they don't easily let problems and naysayers stand in the way of a better quality of life for the vast majority.

The behind the scenes power is far more diluted, so a few powerful people can't as easily control the agenda of what we do with public tax money like we see so many times in Oklahoma.

progressiveboy
05-17-2014, 10:48 AM
Another coup for the DFW area! Another corporate relocation to the area. Who say's HQ moves do not happen very often? Dallas is a prime example of HQ's moving quite frequently.




Cargo carrier Ameriflight to relocate HQ, operations to D/FW Airport - Dallas Business Journal (http://www.bizjournals.com/dallas/news/2014/05/15/cargo-carrier-ameriflight-to-relocate-hq.html)

JoninATX
05-17-2014, 08:57 PM
Every major city in Texas which includes El Paso is going through some type of economic growth. Oklahoma City has alot of potential to grow like Austin, you have to find something that says "OKC is the place to be"!

bchris02
05-17-2014, 10:26 PM
Every major city in Texas which includes El Paso is going through some type of economic growth. Oklahoma City has alot of potential to grow like Austin, you have to find something that says "OKC is the place to be"!

Interesting. I wasn't aware El Paso was experiencing a boom. I know for the longest time they've been somewhat of the "black sheep" metro of Texas.

bchris02
05-17-2014, 10:27 PM
Double post.

JoninATX
05-18-2014, 01:35 AM
El Paso is growing at a steady pace, as well with the expansion of Ft. Bliss. It may not be the rapid growth that Austin is experiencing but it's growing nonetheless.


Here's a link to what's happening in El Paso.
El Paso Development News (http://www.elpasodevnews.com/)

bluedogok
05-18-2014, 08:07 PM
Interesting. I wasn't aware El Paso was experiencing a boom. I know for the longest time they've been somewhat of the "black sheep" metro of Texas.
Most people in Texas consider El Paso part of New Mexico...jokingly. They really could extend the Texas-NM border south and most in Texas wouldn't mind.

Snowman
05-18-2014, 09:00 PM
Most people in Texas consider El Paso part of New Mexico...jokingly. They really could extend the Texas-NM border south and most in Texas wouldn't mind.

I have heard several stories similar both in the Texas panhandle and far south Texas, like there may be a Texas Triangle verses the rest of the state sort of thing going on.

warreng88
05-19-2014, 09:45 AM
This might be one of the funnier reads I have ever seen:

4 Driving Tips For Surviving Dallas | Dallas Observer (http://blogs.dallasobserver.com/unfairpark/2014/05/4_driving_tips_dallas.php)

SOONER8693
05-19-2014, 10:42 AM
Chicago is one of my favorite cities. Love it, love it, love it.
I concur. Chicago is a world class city.

Plutonic Panda
05-19-2014, 12:19 PM
This might be one of the funnier reads I have ever seen:

4 Driving Tips For Surviving Dallas | Dallas Observer (http://blogs.dallasobserver.com/unfairpark/2014/05/4_driving_tips_dallas.php)That is pretty funny/ I do want to say though, I was in N Dallas this weekend and the 'cars' treated the 'peds' pretty good. I saw plenty of people completely stopping for pedestrians waiting for them to cross when the light was green, so it isn't that hostile to pedestrians.

bluedogok
05-19-2014, 08:42 PM
That is pretty funny/ I do want to say though, I was in N Dallas this weekend and the 'cars' treated the 'peds' pretty good. I saw plenty of people completely stopping for pedestrians waiting for them to cross when the light was green, so it isn't that hostile to pedestrians.
They were awestruck (or bumfuzzled) and trying to figure out what they were seeing.....