View Full Version : Downtown intervention needed NOW



Spartan
06-11-2012, 10:15 PM
Downtown planning and civic leadership has gotten so inept and inefficient it is embarrassing. Everybody needs to drop their hard hats and walk away before more damage is done.

I think a very serious intervention is needed. We may never again successfully pull off a public works project until Wenger and Couch are long gone and nobody is promoted from within. I personally think a grassroots effort is needed to find a more innovative city manager and especially a more competent public works director.

I personally think we need Steve Mason to be our Public Works Director. Wenger is not working out. And of course, the biggest problem is when you have a city of 600,000 people where all the shots in City Hall are called by civil engineers and traffic engineers for whom a "tree" is a "fixed hazardous object." I think it's especially telling that the new central park consultants were chosen by a committee without a single urban planner on it.

MAPS3 has been bastardized to the point that many people who wanted quality of life and civic innovation, and not necessarily a chamber junta convention center, will probably never again support the renewal of the sales tax because the city broke its promise to put the convention center last.

I'd also like to bring Jeff Speck and the ULI panel back in to have them examine developments like the convention center separating two landmark green spaces, the City Arts Center locating as far as possible still within downtown from the Arts District, the demonstrative P180 screwups (now even the Myriad Gardens, where nothing works anymore, is fomenting buyer's remorse), demolishing historic buildings at a pace unprecedented since the 60s, and especially the planned I-40 Business Route through downtown, or as we like to call it, the "boulevard."

I just can't believe the fire storm of bad planning, mistakes, inept leadership, corrupt projects, and wasted opportunities. And I don't think we can wait long enough for a new generation to take over. We need immediate changes if we're going to rescue this thing.

The straw breaking the camel's back for me is how embarrassing it is to have P180 projects breaking down everywhere, those few that have been completed on time that is, while national TV crews are canvassing our city taking shots for the coming NBA finals. The past reaction to failed project management, ie MAPS1 coming in nearly $100 million over budget, was to promote Wenger to Public Works Director. I think it's time that the response for failure change from a promotion to a firing.

Laura Story is the city engineer responsible for P180. Wenger was the M3 project manager until the project had been bastardized enough to move the convention center ahead at the expense of other projects, and all the other MAPS projects under his watch came in massively over budget. Couch has been the longest-serving City Manager in OKC history and I think it's time for that to end. The problem is that all of this incompetent leadership is just following precedent, banishing new ideas, and can hardly be called "big league" in any sense of the phrase. These guys are little league and in waaaay over their heads.

If they're going to screw up every single project they touch, they should go to Tulsa instead, or anywhere.

soonerguru
06-11-2012, 10:37 PM
Wow. You echo many of the points I made in the Myriad Gardens thread, and you're spot on. We need big league city leadership if we're going to attain big league status anytime soon. The situation seems dire, but you're right to suggest an intervention, because I don't believe it's too late to prevent further screwups.

Couch needs to go and he needs to be replaced with someone who is more transparent in his leadership and more knowledgeable about urban development concerns.

Spartan
06-11-2012, 10:45 PM
Well it's just that these guys don't know how to react to a downtown where every night thousands of people ARE going to bed, and several more thousands of people are flocking to restaurants and entertainment downtown and NOT Memorial Road. This is new to them. They don't understand why so many people care all of a sudden, it's just beyond their level of comprehension. Why can't we just shut up and let them do their jobs to build a replica of I-240 in lieu of the boulevard we were told about.

Then the mayor cracks me up when he says..

Mayor Mick Cornett said he has known for several years that the boulevard would have to go above grade near that intersection, and that it would help concentrate development.

“I know it’s not necessarily been communicated throughout the community because not everybody cares that much about a road that’s several years away,” Cornett said.
http://www.okgazette.com/oklahoma/article-15372-street-heat.html
http://www.esreality.com/files/placeimages/2012/86181-ORLY.jpg

Seriously, Mick?!? "Relax everybody, it will be okay, because I've actually known about this for years, no decades." People don't care about this boulevard so your City Hall is just going to lie and do whatever you want to and think there are no public repercussions for your legacy of utter failure and wasting ridiculous sums of money on projects that do more harm than good, then failing to find resources to commit to the projects that will help. How bout that railroad quiet zone that Humphreys promised as mayor, that the city identified as a key downtown priority back in 2000 for crissakes.

And as for Mick saying it's okay because he's known about this for years and he doesn't think anyone else cares - well maybe if he could sit us plebes down and inform the public without charging them $100 for a roundtable event catered by McAlister's, then "people would care" about the boulevard design process. Unbelievable. :Smiley130

As for "concentrating development," nothing does the trick for that like preventing the development altogether and eliminating the best opportunities for private development. Guess he is at least right there.

blangtang
06-11-2012, 10:49 PM
Okay so we are gonna get rid of Mayor McCornett and this Public Works director and the City Manager. I don't have a problem with that.

Spartan
06-11-2012, 10:54 PM
I thought this was a really profound quote from another thread, although I would never say anything this strong myself:


This really is dumbfounding. The city is constantly willing to delay services (e.g., lighting, fountain) weeks for a later date as if NOW (which coincides with the most publicity the city will ever receive) doesn't matter. This city is run like a corrupt 3rd world country.

Whether you would insult corrupt 3rd world countries like that or not, the point is that if the public image of City Hall is this bad, some changes are needed.

mmonroe
06-12-2012, 08:21 AM
:Smiley122

HERE HERE!

BoulderSooner
06-12-2012, 12:33 PM
huge overreaction

LakeEffect
06-12-2012, 12:34 PM
huge overreaction

Nick is too young to know what tact is.

Larry OKC
06-12-2012, 02:00 PM
Somewhere between Spartan's in-your-face (although I agree with the sentiment) response and the City's/Thunder ownership over-reaction to the Thunder Alley solution.

I have never been a fan of Couch and agree he should have been dismissed from when he was in charge of the original MAPS projects and everything came in significantly over budget. Then somehow he got promoted to City Manager. Nothing against Mr. Wenger personally as he seems to be a nice enough guy, but I questioned his ability when Couch made him MAPS 3 program manager citing his successes as program manager of a couple of the MAPS projects, saying he had a track record with those of being on time and on budget (neither were true). Then there have been the multiple mis-steps with MAPS 3 and somehow Wenger gets promoted yet again? I'm not sure if it is all Wenger's fault, but rather since he answers to Couch, that may be where the blame really lies. If couch was removed, then maybe Wenger could do his job???? So I am still willing to give Wenger the benefit of a doubt.

To those that think an intervention isn't needed, maybe you thought the Thunder's first coach was fired hastily? Then we wouldn't have had Brooks as head coach and maybe we wouldn't be in the NBA Finals right now??? Same here, MAPS 3 is to crucial to the City to wait until it is a royal cluster**** and beyond saving.

Spartan
06-12-2012, 02:30 PM
Why do you guys accept and rationalize these things?

Just the facts
06-12-2012, 05:30 PM
Spartan - I feel your pain. Unfortunately, old habits die hard and OKC is just starting down a road the other cities have been on for centuries. In the end basic economics will win the day and we simply won't be able to afford to keep facilitating and expanding suburbia. Keep the faith.

On a related note – Jacksonville has very similar setup to what OKC is planning. On the eastside of downtown Jax we have two approach ramps that funnel traffic onto the Hart Bridge. The elevated freeway has done nothing to concentrate development. People traveling in that direction have only one thing on their mind – get home as fast as they can. They have zero interest in slowing down for yellow lights or doing any window shopping from the driver’s seat.

Spartan
06-12-2012, 05:36 PM
Well I just don't think I'm the only one for whom these slip ups causes pain. I tend to think there are a lot of people who are getting tired of watching this City Hall screw up everything for so many years. That said, I think I've been very good at labeling some things a success and some things a failure - the point I'm making is that not everything has been a "failure," the incidence of failed projects has just been out of control since MAPS3 began, but there is no reason we shouldn't expect better of every single project. We shouldn't have to just shake our heads and hope City Hall gets the next project right when their track record has gotten truly atrocious lately.

MustangGT
06-13-2012, 09:27 AM
The solution is simple. Vote Mayor Mick out at the next election and vote any continuance of MAPS taxes DOWN until he, Couch, Wegner, and the complete city council is gone.

Now wasn't that easy?

lindsey
06-13-2012, 09:32 AM
I would NEVER vote no on MAPS taxes - just saying.

Larry OKC
06-13-2012, 09:40 AM
MustangGT: But that wouldn't be an immediate intervention...would take time and the damage already done...Cornett won't be up for re-election (presuming he will run again) until 2014(?)...a MAPS 3 continuance/MAPS 4 vote wouldn't happen until 2017...various Council seats will be up, but I think it is same timing as Cornett for the earliest(?)...then there is the matter of Couch & Wenger, they aren't directly responsible to the voters...if not mistaken, Couch reports directly to the Council and Wenger reports to Couch...only by applying pressure to the COuncil & Mayor to change those other things (until they can be replaced at the ballot box), can things change sooner rather than later

kevinpate
06-13-2012, 09:48 AM
I would NEVER vote no on MAPS taxes - just saying.

NEVER is such a big word in a world full of potential for bait and switch.

Midtowner
06-13-2012, 11:47 AM
Okay so we are gonna get rid of Mayor McCornett and this Public Works director and the City Manager. I don't have a problem with that.

Your big problem is that politically, the only folks running against the mayor are these wacked out conservabots who want to eliminate all but "core functions" of city government. Okay, so we have Shadid. I think he's one of the good guys, but the focus shouldn't be on the mayor, but rather the Council. The Council is the only group which has the ability to replace the City Manager, and frankly, I'm not all that convinced we have a problem. MAPS III has barely just begun. To bemoan the failure of these projects is a tad premature.

OklahomaNick
06-13-2012, 12:09 PM
To bemoan the failure of these projects is a tad premature.

Couldn't agree more.. Another over reactive emotional post from Spartan.

Spartan
06-13-2012, 12:50 PM
MAPS III has barely just begun. To bemoan the failure of these projects is a tad premature.

I disagree. We know the plans and we want better plans. What I don't understand is that virtually every single person who knows anything about urban planning is in agreement that this is a disastrous CC site. Once you spend $250 million to realize a bad plan, that is too late.

I agree that the conservabots are an issue as well, but even they get that if you eliminate the best sites for private development (esp a site where a developer, Fred Hall and Bob Howard, announced plans to build a huge private development) you're screwing the pooch. Mike Carrier, who has been calling many of the shots on the CC project, thinks that all of the wives of attendees in his CC palace will go to Penn Square to shop.

That's the level of decision making here. The problem is that these disastrous plans have to be stopped or we will be writing books about them 30 years from now, just like Lackmeyer has his books about urban renewal and the Skirvin, just as people have written books about Robert Moses tearing down much of NY for highways. We will spend $250 million to do major harm to downtown, and get a worthless CC out of it, if we don't stop these guys who have broken every single MAPS3 campaign promise and changed the deal - it's 4 or 5 guys who are calling the shots, and Mick serves them, not us.

Midtowner
06-13-2012, 01:53 PM
The mayor is just the chairman of the Council and a hugely popular one at that. I'm not sure why you focus your ire on him. Here's the Catch 22 you find yourself in--the majority of our Council is dominated by what I would call Chamber-of-Commerce Republicans. These are gentlemen who for the most part go where the OKC Golf & Country Club crowd tell them to. Trouble is, as you have pointed out, neither the OKC G&CC folks nor their pet councilmen (and woman) understand or see the value of urban planning, but I don't agree that they can't be educated. Get rid of them and you're not going to elect progressive urbanites, your alternative is going to be the Fairview Baptist crowd. Nutters who have run on a 'cut government to the bone' platform. Want to usher in the next dark age for the city?

Instead of going to war and trying to go all tabula rasa with our municipal government, I'd rather just press for the Alliance folks hire a real live urban planning consultant. The benefits of good planning speak for themselves. I don't see a malicious intent, just an ignorant one which is for some reason hostile to outside input. See lower Bricktown.

rcjunkie
06-13-2012, 04:32 PM
I disagree. We know the plans and we want better plans. What I don't understand is that virtually every single person who knows anything about urban planning is in agreement that this is a disastrous CC site. Once you spend $250 million to realize a bad plan, that is too late.

I agree that the conservabots are an issue as well, but even they get that if you eliminate the best sites for private development (esp a site where a developer, Fred Hall and Bob Howard, announced plans to build a huge private development) you're screwing the pooch. Mike Carrier, who has been calling many of the shots on the CC project, thinks that all of the wives of attendees in his CC palace will go to Penn Square to shop.

That's the level of decision making here. The problem is that these disastrous plans have to be stopped or we will be writing books about them 30 years from now, just like Lackmeyer has his books about urban renewal and the Skirvin, just as people have written books about Robert Moses tearing down much of NY for highways. We will spend $250 million to do major harm to downtown, and get a worthless CC out of it, if we don't stop these guys who have broken every single MAPS3 campaign promise and changed the deal - it's 4 or 5 guys who are calling the shots, and Mick serves them, not us.

Just curious, from what Unversity did you receive your planning degree ?

OKCisOK4me
06-13-2012, 05:51 PM
I think if Nick has the skills necessary to facilitate his vision then he should do his best to become a visionary urban planner for our great city. Problem is, I think he's a generation or two too late and by the time he gets in there, it'll be worthless (thru his eyes).

GaryOKC6
06-14-2012, 06:49 AM
Downtown planning and civic leadership has gotten so inept and inefficient it is embarrassing. Everybody needs to drop their hard hats and walk away before more damage is done.

I think a very serious intervention is needed. We may never again successfully pull off a public works project until Wenger and Couch are long gone and nobody is promoted from within. I personally think a grassroots effort is needed to find a more innovative city manager and especially a more competent public works director.

I personally think we need Steve Mason to be our Public Works Director. Wenger is not working out. And of course, the biggest problem is when you have a city of 600,000 people where all the shots in City Hall are called by civil engineers and traffic engineers for whom a "tree" is a "fixed hazardous object." I think it's especially telling that the new central park consultants were chosen by a committee without a single urban planner on it.

MAPS3 has been bastardized to the point that many people who wanted quality of life and civic innovation, and not necessarily a chamber junta convention center, will probably never again support the renewal of the sales tax because the city broke its promise to put the convention center last.

I'd also like to bring Jeff Speck and the ULI panel back in to have them examine developments like the convention center separating two landmark green spaces, the City Arts Center locating as far as possible still within downtown from the Arts District, the demonstrative P180 screwups (now even the Myriad Gardens, where nothing works anymore, is fomenting buyer's remorse), demolishing historic buildings at a pace unprecedented since the 60s, and especially the planned I-40 Business Route through downtown, or as we like to call it, the "boulevard."

I just can't believe the fire storm of bad planning, mistakes, inept leadership, corrupt projects, and wasted opportunities. And I don't think we can wait long enough for a new generation to take over. We need immediate changes if we're going to rescue this thing.

The straw breaking the camel's back for me is how embarrassing it is to have P180 projects breaking down everywhere, those few that have been completed on time that is, while national TV crews are canvassing our city taking shots for the coming NBA finals. The past reaction to failed project management, ie MAPS1 coming in nearly $100 million over budget, was to promote Wenger to Public Works Director. I think it's time that the response for failure change from a promotion to a firing.

Laura Story is the city engineer responsible for P180. Wenger was the M3 project manager until the project had been bastardized enough to move the convention center ahead at the expense of other projects, and all the other MAPS projects under his watch came in massively over budget. Couch has been the longest-serving City Manager in OKC history and I think it's time for that to end. The problem is that all of this incompetent leadership is just following precedent, banishing new ideas, and can hardly be called "big league" in any sense of the phrase. These guys are little league and in waaaay over their heads.

If they're going to screw up every single project they touch, they should go to Tulsa instead, or anywhere.

If you really want to change it then you should run for office. You and Ed Shadid can team up. Let me know if you would like information on how to filr and run a campaign.

OklahomaNick
06-14-2012, 09:27 AM
I think if Nick has the skills necessary to facilitate his vision then he should do his best to become a visionary urban planner for our great city. Problem is, I think he's a generation or two too late and by the time he gets in there, it'll be worthless (thru his eyes).

huh?

ljbab728
06-14-2012, 08:54 PM
huh?

The reference wasn't to you. It was to Spartan (Nick).

JohnH_in_OKC
06-14-2012, 11:04 PM
I have to agree with those of you asking why the New Boulevard is being elevated. There are only two places where our Boulevard cannot be flush with the surrounding streets. One is under the railroad. The other is over the canal. If we're going to have a world class Boulevard with a huge pedestrian median, we need road designers who think pedestrians first. We have far more streets than a city our size needs. One analysis showed we have enough downtown streets for a city the size of Chicago. So why not put pedestrians first in our New Boulevard? Someday, we might even make it pedestrian only like Barcelona did with The Ramblas. But ODOT has to build it first & ODOT still requires an automobile street before they would build our New Boulevard. But ODOT, please reengineer our Boulevard with pedestrians in mind & make it flush with the cross streets.

GaryOKC6
06-15-2012, 05:37 AM
I believe that for the most part that the city is doing a good job with the MAPS projects. Intervention? That is a little extreme! I have heard this all before. During MAPS 1 the popular complaint was "why do we need a new arena when we have the Cox center, it is a waste of money" Well look how it turned out today......NBA Finals. We all have ideas that we feel should be implemented and some make a lot of sense, but I say let them do their job. Besides there is absolutely nothing (except whine and point fingers). Those who really want to make a difference should do it the right way. Run for office. When you are in charge we can point fingers at and blame you.

OklahomaNick
06-15-2012, 08:48 AM
The reference wasn't to you. It was to Spartan (Nick).

Ahh man! Spartan's name is Nick too.. ugh! LOL

Larry OKC
06-15-2012, 12:23 PM
I believe that for the most part that the city is doing a good job with the MAPS projects. Intervention? That is a little extreme! I have heard this all before. During MAPS 1 the popular complaint was "why do we need a new arena when we have the Cox center, it is a waste of money" Well look how it turned out today......NBA Finals. We all have ideas that we feel should be implemented and some make a lot of sense, but I say let them do their job. Besides there is absolutely nothing (except whine and point fingers). Those who really want to make a difference should do it the right way. Run for office. When you are in charge we can point fingers at and blame you.
You have heard it before because history has this annoying way of repeating itself unless some does something to change it. We had a myriad of issues with the original MAPS, an instead of learning from the mistakes, we are repeating them. But this time, since the largest project in this round is costing more than what all 9 of the original ones were supposed to have cost, the potential cost of fixing things is much greater. For example, we were supposed to have had Streetcars in the original (all the way to the Fairgrounds and Meridian motel corridor) but due to various federal funding issues we got the Trolleys instead. Then when MAPS 3 comes along, (IIRC) Streetcars are costing 8 times (800%) what they were supposed to back then. That is why it is critical that we get the Streetcars and all of the other projects right the first time. Shortly after the vote passed, we found out a "mistake" was made with the MAPS 3 Trails and it is going to cost $40 million or more to fix it.

I would have agreed with them back then, if we were replacing the Myriad with an arena that was the same size, but we needed a new Arena because the Cox has relatively limited seating to get the concerts that had passed us by or to get an NHL or NBA team. If anything, we needed to have built the Arena even bigger than we did (and with the improvements, reduced seating capacity by nearly 1,000 seats). Plus, having 2 arenas side by side has worked out well for college stuff (good thing Humphreys didn't get his way and rip out the Myriad/Cox arena)


Ahh man! Spartan's name is Nick too.. ugh! LOL
When I first saw yours, I thought Spartan had decided to go with another name...

GaryOKC6
06-15-2012, 12:53 PM
You have heard it before because history has this annoying way of repeating itself unless some does something to change it. We had a myriad of issues with the original MAPS, an instead of learning from the mistakes, we are repeating them. But this time, since the largest project in this round is costing more than what all 9 of the original ones were supposed to have cost, the potential cost of fixing things is much greater. For example, we were supposed to have had Streetcars in the original (all the way to the Fairgrounds and Meridian motel corridor) but due to various federal funding issues we got the Trolleys instead. Then when MAPS 3 comes along, (IIRC) Streetcars are costing 8 times (800%) what they were supposed to back then. That is why it is critical that we get the Streetcars and all of the other projects right the first time. Shortly after the vote passed, we found out a "mistake" was made with the MAPS 3 Trails and it is going to cost $40 million or more to fix it.

I would have agreed with them back then, if we were replacing the Myriad with an arena that was the same size, but we needed a new Arena because the Cox has relatively limited seating to get the concerts that had passed us by or to get an NHL or NBA team. If anything, we needed to have built the Arena even bigger than we did (and with the improvements, reduced seating capacity by nearly 1,000 seats). Plus, having 2 arenas side by side has worked out well for college stuff (good thing Humphreys didn't get his way and rip out the Myriad/Cox arena)


When I first saw yours, I thought Spartan had decided to go with another name...

I still feel that theoriginal MAPS projects turned out fine. The reason for the original trolly plan being scrapped was because Ernest Istook killed the funding in Washington. He apparently felt OKC did not need a Trolly system. the money (12 million) went to another community. There are always a lot of factors with any project which tend to make it a moving target. It is far too easy for us to be an armchair quarterback on this deal. OKC is actually the envy of a lot of communities with our MAPS projects. We have hosted a lot of progressive communities that vist us to find out how we didi it. That is a good palce to be as far as i am concerned. I am not agreeing or disagreeing with anyone else. We all are going to have different opinions and this is just simply mine.

soonerguru
06-15-2012, 01:13 PM
In an attempt to add levity to the discussion: I think some of you are confusing Spartan's passion with the sort of wild-eyed conspiracy ranting we've become accustomed to from Tom Elmore and other single-issue activists. My interpretation of his comments is that Spartan is pushing OKC to set and meet high standards, high standards I believe our city is fully capable of meeting today. Ten years ago, we might have had to stand down and accept whatever improvements we got, whether or not they met our standards of a city of OKC's size and major-league ambitions.

Times have changed. The NBA Finals being hosted here is witness enough to this transformation. So here we are, flirting with the major leagues, but our flirtation involves the same minor leaguers who "do it their way because that's how it's always been done here."

All here can agree that during the last 50 years, OKC has made many disastrous urban planning decisions, creating problems where none existed. These are problems, often self imposed, that we're still trying to rectify. Sometimes these disasters were borne of convenience, others were borne of ignorance and wrongheadedness. But parallels can be drawn to the potentially damaging decision making of the past and some of the faulty reasoning being applied to challenges we face today.

I don't actually believe that Jim Couch makes decisions out of malice to OKC. I personally don't know the man. I also believe that ODOT is trying to do its best for OKC -- AS IT KNOWS HOW TO DO IT. Mayor Cornett has more than proven himself to be a high quality and even occasionally visionary mayor. But none of this is relevant. What is relevant is that those of us who do not wield the power to call the shots need to make our feelings known when bad decisions are being hatched. That is the only chance we have to change direction.

The last few months have shed some light on a series of decisions made outside the public domain that may lead to future disasters. No one wants to complain all the time; "outrage fatigue" is real. And frankly, it's a lot more pleasant to pat folks on the back for a job well done than it is to raise your voice in protest.

Overall, MAPS has been the best thing that has ever happened to this city. Not without its misses of course. But MAPS I and MAPS II are now in the books, so the time to speak out about MAPS III is now. The time to speak out about the Boulevard is now. The course of events is not writ in stone yet, so I ask that some of you give Spartan a break and consider his passion on this issue, whether or not you would handle and/or speak out in the manner he does. He cares about the future of this city as much as any of us, and he raises many truths here.

We need major-league city leadership capable of making major-league decisions if we want to truly become a "big league city." The pieces are mostly in place. But some of that is on us, too. Go to any big city and you'll notice that public input and discussion is always at the forefront of big decisions, and there are various forums to air these discussions. We've seen that in OKC too, but we shouldn't just cede what little power we have as advocates for quality urban planning because "MAPS is good," or "At least we're getting a road fixed," or "The highway turned out OK."

As for our city leadership, we've seen time and time again that they will respond to public concerns, but rarely unless they are forced to do so.

king183
06-15-2012, 01:45 PM
Interesting sentiments. I'm in agreement with many, but lean toward what Midtowner is saying as more practical. What is the true solution to this, if an immediate intervention is needed? Being involved in politics and campaigns, I can tell you griping about it on a messge board won't do it (N.B. I'm not saying this discussion is worthless--just that the complaining on this board won't lead to anything by itself). Some true action needs to be taken. Urbanists need to show up to council meetings en masse (not just one or two at a time), they need to be meeting with their city councilmen one-on-one or in small groups, they need to be educating the decision makers.

I can tell you from my years in politics, the most effective way to get what you want is not to be confrontational with a city councilman or representative--they're regular people for the most part and, like regular people, confrontation leads them to step back and then dig in. Seriously, let's start setting up meetings with the councilmen and talking about it one-on-one. If educating them does not work, then confrontation may be necessary, either in the form of ousting them from office or launching a publicity campaign against them.

Questor
06-16-2012, 05:39 PM
I've been saying this for a while, although probably not on this forum... if political action committees and the like rule politics at every level, why is there not one established for more urban style development in OKC, and if it is established what is it and how do I donate....

SouthwestAviator
07-09-2012, 10:13 AM
I've been saying this for a while, although probably not on this forum... if political action committees and the like rule politics at every level, why is there not one established for more urban style development in OKC, and if it is established what is it and how do I donate....

You can help with this right now. Posted on the Better Boulevard thread. We need everyone's help on this much needed public awareness campaign.

"It has been suggested on several posts, both here and OKC Central, that we formalize this endeavor to build a better boulevard, into and actual formal campaign. Everybody that I talk to seems shocked once they hear what we are actually getting from ODOT. It is obvious that we need to get the information out to the public out and beyond OKC Talk, Central, and our small Facebook group.

I am happy to write that we have a "Don Draper" on our side now (Mad Men viewers will know what I mean). Full-page ads and posters are in the works. We aren't forming a formal non-profit as this will probably be over by December. If people want to donate, email me. We are asking that you write checks directly to the Gazette and the printer as to avoid any concerns.

We will print however much is raised and get it out to the public. It sounds as though we need to get the bulk of this awareness out sooner than later as July 29th is the council meeting at which much of this will be decided, whether the council will respond to us or not.

Best, Bob. friendsforabetterboulevard@gmail.com"