View Full Version : Probably a good idea... no texting while driving.



Roadhawg
12-13-2011, 12:08 PM
Washington (CNN) -- Federal accident investigators Tuesday called for a nationwide ban on the use of cell phones and text messaging devices while driving.
Study: Half of young people text, drive

The recommendation is the most far-reaching yet by the National Transportation Safety Board, which in the past 10 years has increasingly sought to limit the use of portable electronic devices. It has recommended such bans for novice drivers, school bus drivers and commercial truckers.

The new recommendation, if adopted by states, would outlaw non-emergency phone calls and texting by operators of every vehicle on the road.

It would not apply to hand-free devices or to passengers.

rcjunkie
12-13-2011, 12:10 PM
Washington (CNN) -- Federal accident investigators Tuesday called for a nationwide ban on the use of cell phones and text messaging devices while driving.
Study: Half of young people text, drive

The recommendation is the most far-reaching yet by the National Transportation Safety Board, which in the past 10 years has increasingly sought to limit the use of portable electronic devices. It has recommended such bans for novice drivers, school bus drivers and commercial truckers.

The new recommendation, if adopted by states, would outlaw non-emergency phone calls and texting by operators of every vehicle on the road.

It would not apply to hand-free devices or to passengers.

Should be mandatory in every state, any state that refuses to enforce should loose all Federal Funding immediately.

adaniel
12-13-2011, 12:20 PM
I think its a great idea but I really don't see how it would be enforced. Unless the police really started cracking down on it.

Its ridiculous that common sense must be legislated, but unfortunately there are simply too many idiots out there who put their friends text messages above their own safety.

Roadhawg
12-13-2011, 12:25 PM
I think its a great idea but I really don't see how it would be enforced. Unless the police really started cracking down on it.

Its ridiculous that common sense must be legislated, but unfortunately there are simply too many idiots out there who put their friends text messages above their own safety.

Especially teenagers

kevinpate
12-13-2011, 12:49 PM
... are simply too many idiots out there who put their friends text messages above their own safety.

Not arguing, but such a ban doesn't really focus drivers all that much more, not so long as such a ban "would not apply to hand-free devices or to passengers."

It seems like many other feel good, lookie what we done, pablum for the sheeple.

okcisok
12-13-2011, 01:27 PM
In all of my over 40 years of driving I don't remember so many people coming into my lane or slowing down or just generally not paying attention to their driving. I know it's certainly caused me to be much more of a defensive driver. BTW, most of the time it is NOT a teenager but an adult who is looking at their phone. Not talking on it, but looking at it. So, I figure they are either texting or dialing.

Skyline
12-13-2011, 01:39 PM
Once again the government taking away our rights.

First I can't drink and drive,.. Then I must wear a seatbelt, ... now I can't text and drive!.. geesh , thanks Obama!


j/k

Pete
12-13-2011, 01:53 PM
In California there has been a ban for quite a while as well as talking on the phone, although you can do that with a hands-free device. And people generally comply; at least when a law is passed most come to realize there is a reason and change their behavior.

As far as enforcement, in the case of a serious accident cell phone records can be obtained to determine if you were doing something you shouldn't have been doing.


And finally, as an avid runner and cyclist, I can tell you my biggest worry is people jacking with their cell phones while behind the wheel. Virtually every run or ride I come across someone with their head down not paying attention and I only avoid them because I see them first. It has become better since they changed the laws out here, but it's still a problem, especially with young drivers.

chuck johnson
12-13-2011, 02:20 PM
In California there has been a ban for quite a while as well as talking on the phone, although you can do that with a hands-free device. And people generally comply; at least when a law is passed most come to realize there is a reason and change their behavior.

As far as enforcement, in the case of a serious accident cell phone records can be obtained to determine if you were doing something you shouldn't have been doing.


And finally, as an avid runner and cyclist, I can tell you my biggest worry is people jacking with their cell phones while behind the wheel. Virtually every run or ride I come across someone with their head down not paying attention and I only avoid them because I see them first. It has become better since they changed the laws out here, but it's still a problem, especially with young drivers.

I've witnessed speed trap/checkpoints in CA where, rather than target light runners or seat belt violators, they specifically target those on cellphones. When the law was first passed they issued warnings, but not anymore.

My pet peeve is those who try to merge on the highway while on their cell phone.

Roadhawg
12-13-2011, 02:35 PM
they can replace it with this http://www.cnn.com/2011/12/13/tech/gaming-gadgets/gag-gifts-iarm-idrive/index.html?hpt=hp_bn6 :tiphat:

Pete
12-13-2011, 02:36 PM
I know plenty of people out here that have received tickets for talking on the phone or texting.

It's a pretty steep fine, too.

HewenttoJared
12-13-2011, 03:04 PM
Good law. Good chance of passing, too. Most of the large carriers are already on board so you won't see as many anti-reality campaigns as other behavioral-protective laws.

TheTravellers
12-13-2011, 03:13 PM
Actually, the law should go farther - no cell phone usage by the driver, period. Doesn't matter if it's hands-free or not. Studies have shown that it doesn't matter if it's hands-free or hand-held, the driver is sufficiently distracted to cause problems. Google is your friend, you can find lots of studies that show this. There may also be studies that show the opposite. Not sure how valid any of them are, of course, since I have not read all of them, but based on personal experience/anecdotes, I fully support no cell-phone usage at all by the driver of a vehicle while driving.

HewenttoJared
12-13-2011, 03:24 PM
True, but if they try to push it hands-free then Motorola and a couple other brands will misquote some studies in an attempt to show that the law doesn't work. Pass this first, then go for the hands-free.

rcjunkie
12-13-2011, 03:38 PM
Good law. Good chance of passing, too. Most of the large carriers are already on board so you won't see as many anti-reality campaigns as other behavioral-protective laws.

Stop the press, HewenttoJared and Rcjunkie agree on something. LOL

Maybe a good time to close this thread.

MikeOKC
12-13-2011, 03:40 PM
Stop the press, HewenttoJared and Rcjunkie agree on something. LOL

Maybe a good time to close this thread.

No, a good time for a party! Where do we all meet? I mean, this is a huge development at this board.

HewenttoJared
12-13-2011, 03:49 PM
Stop the press, HewenttoJared and Rcjunkie agree on something. LOL

Maybe a good time to close this thread.

Like I told Frisky, there is probably more that we agree on than disagree on, it just isn't relevant here.

But if you actually agree with what I said then extend it to...everything else we disagree about.

BDK
12-13-2011, 04:29 PM
It should be a steep fine. I'd venture a guess that the already disturbing statistics do not even accurately reflect the truth, since phone records must be obtained to prove phone usage, as Pete mentioned. The feds should handle it just like they do with the drinking age and prod states to pass legislation by tying it to highway funding.

kevinpate
12-13-2011, 05:40 PM
6-5-die
http://news.yahoo.com/driver-sent-got-11-texts-11-min-crash-151619850.html

BBatesokc
12-13-2011, 07:26 PM
The biggest offenders I constantly see are police officers. I rarely see one that is not talking on their cell phone.

PennyQuilts
12-13-2011, 08:10 PM
I've also read that hands free is not much better than talking on the cell but at least they aren't trying to look down with their eyes off the road and directing their brain to try to spell out a text. Talking on a cell is bad enough but texting is even worse.

There is no doubt in my mind cell phones are killers. It has gotten to the point where it is a hazard to try to push a cart in the grocery store because some yahoo on a cell phone being reminded to pick up some radishes will run you down because they are too distracted to notice you.

Snowman
12-14-2011, 02:09 AM
Unless they end up banning all use of cell phones & texting(including passengers) and enforce it by having phone & mobile ISPs not allow the devices to receive or transmit above 25-ish MPH then unfortunately it is not going to stop the ridiculous amount of people still doing it, many of which are doing so violating existing state laws.

rcjunkie
12-14-2011, 04:00 AM
Unless they end up banning all use of cell phones & texting(including passengers) and enforce it by having phone & mobile ISPs not allow the devices to receive or transmit above 25-ish MPH then unfortunately it is not going to stop the ridiculous amount of people still doing it, many of which are doing so violating existing state laws.

Drivers--Yes
Passengers--No

Snowman
12-14-2011, 04:24 AM
Drivers--Yes
Passengers--No

I know, I am just saying making it illegal has not put much of a stop to it and technical solutions likely will not be able to distinguish between passengers and drivers.

BBatesokc
12-14-2011, 06:12 AM
Laws against drinking and driving didn't save the almost 11,000 people who died in 2009 because a driver was drunk. I'm fine with there being laws against texting and/or using a cell phone, but (like drinking) it has become a part of our society and no law is going to stop it. There should be laws against it, but you can't expect the laws are going to stop it. Too many people are just plain stupid when it comes to drinking, cell phones, stop lights, you name it. I personally think it should be much harder to get a driver's license and keep it.

Bill Robertson
12-14-2011, 07:42 AM
And finally, as an avid runner and cyclist, I can tell you my biggest worry is people jacking with their cell phones while behind the wheel. Virtually every run or ride I come across someone with their head down not paying attention and I only avoid them because I see them first. It has become better since they changed the laws out here, but it's still a problem, especially with young drivers.As an avid cyclist and motorcyclist I'm with you. Without any exageration I can say that almost all of the many close calls I've had on either bike in the past few years have been a driver drifting into my lane while there on the phone. In one case on N, Meridian I saw a car weaving behind me and moved over to the other lane. I let them pass and yep, on the phone. They proceded to rear end a car stopped for a red light at 19th. If that had been me stopped I might not be here typing.


Laws against drinking and driving didn't save the almost 11,000 people who died in 2009 because a driver was drunk. I'm fine with there being laws against texting and/or using a cell phone, but (like drinking) it has become a part of our society and no law is going to stop it. There should be laws against it, but you can't expect the laws are going to stop it. Too many people are just plain stupid when it comes to drinking, cell phones, stop lights, you name it. I personally think it should be much harder to get a driver's license and keep it.There will surely be some who will stop just because it's a law and they want to be law abiding. If this equals 10% of phone user/drivers I'll be at least a little safer out there.

PennyQuilts
12-14-2011, 07:47 AM
As an avid cyclist and motorcyclist I'm with you. Without any exageration I can say that almost all of the many close calls I've had on either bike in the past few years have been a driver drifting into my lane while there on the phone. In one case on N, Meridian I saw a car weaving behind me and moved over to the other lane. I let them pass and yep, on the phone. They proceded to rear end a car stopped for a red light at 19th. If that had been me stopped I might not be here typing.

There will surely be some who will stop just because it's a law and they want to be law abiding. If this equals 10% of phone user/drivers I'll be at least a little safer out there.

Yikes! Glad you managed to avoid that.

BBatesokc
12-14-2011, 08:06 AM
Problem is, there is no plan as to how this new law would be enforced. Our police department is already a reactionary force for the most part. The days of patrolling as a deterrent or to look for crimes is pretty much gone. Police spend most of their day responding to 911 calls. Sure, they'll set up stings every once in awhile, but the offenders know the odds of getting pulled over and ticketed are slim. As for hands free device - forget enforcing that. There will be no way of telling if the person was simply singing in their car or on a handsfree device. This isn't some CSI show, they are not going to pull cell phone records for a misdemeanor ticket unless an accident is involved.

Of Sound Mind
12-14-2011, 08:25 AM
The biggest offenders I constantly see are police officers. I rarely see one that is not talking on their cell phone.
Agree 100%.

Yesterday evening, I saw something even worse. A driver of a large SUV, driving inconsistent speeds and weaving around a lot in his lane... when we pulled up next to him, I saw that he was watching a video on his cell phone while driving 35-55 (in a 45 zone)... his eyes spending much more time watching the video than the road. It was ridiculous.

Something needs to be done, but let's make sure that the laws are smartly written (to not overreach) and correctly and thoroughly enforced, or don't even bother.

Skyline
12-14-2011, 12:09 PM
I watched a lady this morning that was nearly run over. She was jaywalking at 9th & Broadway downtown, and of course she was talking on here phone while walking into traffic. It seems a little difficult to concentrate on the fast moving vehicles when a phone is up to your ear, but that is just me.

Roadhawg
12-14-2011, 12:36 PM
As an avid cyclist and motorcyclist I'm with you. Without any exageration I can say that almost all of the many close calls I've had on either bike in the past few years have been a driver drifting into my lane while there on the phone. In one case on N, Meridian I saw a car weaving behind me and moved over to the other lane. I let them pass and yep, on the phone. They proceded to rear end a car stopped for a red light at 19th. If that had been me stopped I might not be here typing.

There will surely be some who will stop just because it's a law and they want to be law abiding. If this equals 10% of phone user/drivers I'll be at least a little safer out there.

I agree.... there have been many many times on my bike (motorcycle) I've almost been hit because the driver was either talking on the phone or texting. I've come real close to kicking somebodies door in after they almost hit me.

Bill Robertson
12-14-2011, 12:56 PM
I agree.... there have been many many times on my bike (motorcycle) I've almost been hit because the driver was either talking on the phone or texting. I've come real close to kicking somebodies door in after they almost hit me.So have I.

TheTravellers
12-14-2011, 01:01 PM
...I personally think it should be much harder to get a driver's license and keep it.:iagree::yeahthat::iagree::yeahthat::iagree::ye ahthat::iagree::yeahthat:

PennyQuilts
12-14-2011, 01:34 PM
I agree.... there have been many many times on my bike (motorcycle) I've almost been hit because the driver was either talking on the phone or texting. I've come real close to kicking somebodies door in after they almost hit me.

Glad you showed more civility than that. Answering violence/stupidity with violence has become pretty commonplace.

HewenttoJared
12-14-2011, 01:52 PM
I watched a lady this morning that was nearly run over. She was jaywalking at 9th & Broadway downtown, and of course she was talking on here phone while walking into traffic. It seems a little difficult to concentrate on the fast moving vehicles when a phone is up to your ear, but that is just me.
There's an app for that.
http://gizmodo.com/5863043/safely-cross-the-street-with-an-app-that-watches-for-traffic

HewenttoJared
12-14-2011, 01:53 PM
Glad you showed more civility than that. Answering violence/stupidity with violence has become pretty commonplace.

Violence has been on the decline for a few centuries now...not sure where you got this idea.

PennyQuilts
12-14-2011, 02:38 PM
Violence has been on the decline for a few centuries now...not sure where you got this idea.

Weren't you the one that once posted that you get physical threats at work, daily?

HewenttoJared
12-14-2011, 03:53 PM
Not daily, and I don't think chest-puffing counts. In either case, violence is on the decrease.

RadicalModerate
12-14-2011, 10:29 PM
Screw the fines for this (future, soon hopefully) violation:
Off With Their Thumbs!

Maynard
12-15-2011, 06:54 AM
Popular Mechanics - Distracted Driving or Distracted Policymaking? Why the Proposed Car Cellphone Ban Is Wrong (http://www.popularmechanics.com/technology/gadgets/news/distracted-driving-or-distracted-policymaking-why-the-proposed-car-cellphone-ban-is-wrong-6617334?click=pm_latest)

As Radley Balko notes, where are the accidents? Given the explosion of cellphone use, you'd think traffic accidents and deaths would be up. They're down.

Roadhawg
12-15-2011, 06:55 AM
Glad you showed more civility than that. Answering violence/stupidity with violence has become pretty commonplace.

Trust me, if they had hit me or caused me to wreck they would have seen more than a dented door. My civility only goes so far.

RadicalModerate
12-15-2011, 08:33 AM
Popular Mechanics - Distracted Driving or Distracted Policymaking? Why the Proposed Car Cellphone Ban Is Wrong (http://www.popularmechanics.com/technology/gadgets/news/distracted-driving-or-distracted-policymaking-why-the-proposed-car-cellphone-ban-is-wrong-6617334?click=pm_latest)

As Radley Balko notes, where are the accidents? Given the explosion of cellphone use, you'd think traffic accidents and deaths would be up. They're down.

There is no rational way to justify steering and texting rather than operating a motor vehicle (driving).
My favorites are those assh-les who sit at left turn arrows while visiting Cyberville, then wait until the arrow goes off to make the turn. Them and the morons driving twenty miles an hour in the left lane of a forty-five mph street while they update their friggin' Facebook pages.

Cell phones and "driving" . . . Nah doesn't bother me a bit.
(After the thumbs have been removed, start on the fingers)

Just a reminder . . .
Picture the phone zombie in a car and the fountain as your car at an intersection . . .
umRXAkZ8Xo0

Bill Robertson
12-15-2011, 09:14 AM
Popular Mechanics - Distracted Driving or Distracted Policymaking? Why the Proposed Car Cellphone Ban Is Wrong (http://www.popularmechanics.com/technology/gadgets/news/distracted-driving-or-distracted-policymaking-why-the-proposed-car-cellphone-ban-is-wrong-6617334?click=pm_latest)

As Radley Balko notes, where are the accidents? Given the explosion of cellphone use, you'd think traffic accidents and deaths would be up. They're down.Maybe all the rest of us have become more aware that there are idiots around us. You can't tell me you've never seen a car weaving all over the place while the driver talked/texted and wondered how they don't hit anything or anyone.

Maynard
12-15-2011, 09:21 AM
Maybe all the rest of us have become more aware that there are idiots around us. You can't tell me you've never seen a car weaving all over the place while the driver talked/texted and wondered how they don't hit anything or anyone.

I see more drivers scarfing down their Big Macs in Oklahoma City (one of the fattest cities in the nation) -- hey, let's ban all "food stuffs" in motor vehicles (cars) while we're at it!

[*note implicit sarcastic tone]

Bill Robertson
12-15-2011, 09:24 AM
Glad you showed more civility than that. Answering violence/stupidity with violence has become pretty commonplace.I can't speak for Roadhawg but for me it's really hard sometimes. Especially on a bike where a wreck is likely to be much worse than just a dent to us riders. This is a bit off topic but a guy pulled in behind me this morning, in the right lane of I44. He proceded to get ticked that I didn't want to go 80 so he got right on my rear fender. Not that I was the only traffic holding him up anyway. He got off a mile later and passed me as he got on the exit lane. He honked and "waved". It took all I had at that moment to stay cool and not follow him to "explain" what a dangerous jerk he was. I have a temper and my "explaination" would at least be a scene.

Pete
12-15-2011, 09:38 AM
Popular Mechanics - Distracted Driving or Distracted Policymaking? Why the Proposed Car Cellphone Ban Is Wrong

As Radley Balko notes, where are the accidents? Given the explosion of cellphone use, you'd think traffic accidents and deaths would be up. They're down.

There has been a steady and progressive string of automotive safety improvements for the last 50 years. Besides the least inexpensive car having better braking and handling then even the best 30 years ago, there are other things that are now common on just about every car: better tires, anti-lock brakes, better visibility, tons of airbags and other restraints, etc. Add to that all types of other options like lane departure systems, back-up cameras, blind spot warning. Simply put, the average car on the road now is way better in terms of avoiding accidents and certainly avoiding major injuries.

It's like the argument that roads are safer even with the high percentage of huge, heavy ponderous SUV's... Imagine how much better the numbers would be without these things.

RadicalModerate
12-15-2011, 09:39 AM
I really have to wonder how Maynard--a brilliant satirist and kindred soul, in my humble, non-sarcastic opinion--seems to think that there is any connection whatsoever between packing food down one's gullet in the immediate present and having one's mind a thousand miles away via a cell phone tower in terms of "Driving Distractions." Unless, of course, some of the dressing on the Big Mac drips onto ones khakis and one reacts--rather than responds--inappropriately, while behind the wheel.

Many are the times that I have considered changing lanes to place my vehicle in the path of a texting "driver" then hitting the brakes. But I haven't done it. In fact, I only flip them the bird on rare occasions and I limit my verbal ourbursts of "Hang up the F-cking Fone and Drive" to about once every six months. I guess I'm generally passive aggresive in this context. Not so much a victim/instigator of Road Rage . . . More like The Gandhi of Road Annoyance.

And I must take umbridge at Maynard's misspelling of "Fattest" in connection with OKC . . .
The correct word--with all the recent improvements--is Phattest.

Bill Robertson
12-15-2011, 09:44 AM
I see more drivers scarfing down their Big Macs in Oklahoma City (one of the fattest cities in the nation) -- hey, let's ban all "food stuffs" in motor vehicles (cars) while we're at it!

[*note implicit sarcastic tone]

For driver that would be fine with me also.

kevinpate
12-15-2011, 09:55 AM
Not to be overly rude, but until it is illegal, with actual teeth in the enforcement, for drivers to put on makeup, grimace and curse and weave over their spilled coffee or mustard drips, or bellowing at their kids that they have failed to parent properly to begin with, etc., etc., then please, mind yet own beeswax at to whether I am conversing with a passenger, someone on my phone, or one of the many little voices in my head who don't like it when they see you staring at me from your own vehicle instead of having your eyes front, where they ought to be.

RadicalModerate
12-15-2011, 10:19 AM
If we all drove with our eyes front we might miss the CellPhoney drifting into our lane from the side.

How about this for a compromise: All vehicles must be equipped with flashing yellow lights that come on when a cellular device is activated in the vehicle. An alternative might be a blinking sign: Distracted Dumbass At the Wheel. Not only would this warn other drivers of the immediate hazard, it would make it easier for law enforcement/public safety protectors to spot the offender and write the ticket.

Even "Popular Mechanics" might get behind that idea . . .

PennyQuilts
12-15-2011, 12:55 PM
Not daily, and I don't think chest-puffing counts. In either case, violence is on the decrease.

Hmm, no, I don't think so. Some crimes have dropped, but public incivility, domestic violence - including child abuse - and the like certainly hasn't. They even did a recent survey that said one in three women have been the victim of a violent attack by an intimate. That's up.

PennyQuilts
12-15-2011, 12:57 PM
Maybe all the rest of us have become more aware that there are idiots around us. You can't tell me you've never seen a car weaving all over the place while the driver talked/texted and wondered how they don't hit anything or anyone.

Deaths are down - can you give a link to accidents being down? Deaths are down because we have safer cars and people use seatbelts and passive restraints, not to mention babies and young children are required to be strapped in.

ETA - Okay, sorry - I followed the links, above and here is a relevant passage:


Let's start with the alleged problem. Obviously, we have more people texting behind the wheel today than we did in, say, 1985. And undeniably, those people pose a threat. But it's hard to find definitive empirical support for the idea that our highways are awash in BlackBerry-spilled blood. Since 1995, there's been an eightfold increase in cellphone subscribers in the United States, and we've increased the number of minutes spent on cellphones by a factor of 58.

What's happened to traffic fatalities in that time? They've dropped—slightly, but they've dropped. Overall reported accidents since 1997 have dropped, too, from 6.7 million to 6 million. Proponents of a ban on cellphones say those numbers should have dropped more. "We've spent billions on air bags, antilock brakes, better steering, safer cars and roads, but the number of fatalities has remained constant," safety researcher David Strayer told the New York Times in July. "Our return on investment for those billions is zero. And that's because we're using devices in our cars."

Hmm. Seems to me cellphone use and texting are really apples and oranges, notwithstanding they use the same equipment.

RadicalModerate
12-15-2011, 01:05 PM
Strapping in a child, in a car, and handing it a cell phone or kindle for entertainment purposes is planting the seed of future destruction and traffic violations.

Please be advised that the definitions of child abuse are being reexamined as well.

For the children.
But mostly for the sake of subliminally PO'd normal drivers who don't require cell phones to go about their business.

Bunty
12-15-2011, 04:16 PM
Surely one good reason to not text while driving is you could be subject to a costly civil lawsuit for causing someone harm from an accident.

windowphobe
12-15-2011, 06:08 PM
Failure to give full attention to your driving is already illegal; what's the point in making it, um, illegaler?

kevinpate
12-16-2011, 02:09 AM
Failure to give full attention to your driving is already illegal; what's the point in making it, um, illegaler?

Because people who contribute to campaigns want it more illegaler, and those who gladly accept the contributions know that explaining an existing law is actually satisfactory for a purpose means check books stay closed, and check book holders start hunting someone who will listen better.

oneforone
12-16-2011, 02:55 AM
Most states including Oklahoma already have failure to devote full attention to driving laws. Texting laws will be nothing but cash collecting methods for cash strapped towns. The only other time it will come into play is when an officer is trying link fault to a driver in accident when other methods are sketchy. Sometimes a minor crime violation can be the link that opens the door to felony charges. Let's say for argument sake your phone is sitting in your console. You crash the phone is not in use or your using the phone to listen to music. You get in a crash the phone goes flying into the back seat and the phone self dials (We have all butt or pocket dialed at least once) the cop sees it and writes a ticket for phone use.