Even though we all know the Joke is beholden to (and probably helped fund) the Committee For Momentum, and is completely slanted in its coverage of the convention center, it's still a drag to read this kind of crap. Of course, it will probably only enhance Ed Shadid's standing with Ward 2 residents, who don't exactly take their marching orders from the Gaylord-Everest-Bennett junta.

http://www.newsok.com/councilman-unrelenting-in-his-fight-against-oklahoma-city-convention-center/article/3589354?custom_click=pod_headline_opinion-oklahoman-editorials

Wow. That is an attack piece if I ever saw one. I was even almost kind of hesitant/skeptical when I first clicked on the thread. That is pathetic. Comparisons to Ralph Nader?

How about comparisons to the John Birch Society Newsletter? They even invented a new word, "Naderite." I'm starting to feel more and more like Mike Gundy does about the Oklahoman...

I could be wrong, but it seems to me that the Oklahoman has taken on a different tone since the recent change at the top.

It can't be toward real journalism..

We can put them out of business by not buying their papers, not clicking on their site and especially not clicking on their blog sites. I avoid them all and the bloggers like the plague.

Excellant article and I couldn't agree more with the content. It pays to study, listen and research a candidate before you cast your vote.

That editorial was a little disappointing (and I actually like the Oklahoman). Instead of attacking a City Councile Member they should have just investigated his questions and provided the answers. If there were good reason for making the decisions what would be the harm in sharing those reasons with the public?

What's that old saying. . .?
"You know that you are right over the target when you start catching flak" . . .?

What's that old saying. . .?
"You know that you are right over the target when you start catching flak" . . .?

I think the questions Dr Shadid raised must have hit too close to home for someone. I find it kind of ironic that people like rcjunkie say people should investigate their candidates more when refering to an editorial that condems questioning public operations. If rcjunkie really felt the way he said he does he should welcome the questions and expect real answers. In fact, he should have asked the question himself as part of his own due diligence in the voting process.

raising questions re:
prevailing power structure
jeopardizes ass*

~The Art of S'more
(Author Unknown, From etchings on ruins of Ancient Convention Center
Central North American Continent c. 2112)

(*alt. translations: "donkey" "mule" "elephant" "tea bags"[?])

"The ad contains about 2,500 words. By comparison, the Gettysburg Address is around 250 words and the Declaration of Independence is roughly 1,300."

What is this tripe? What would they have him say? "The Convention Center is bad?" Absurd.

BDK: Bingo.
(Plus, thanks for letting me know--via the avatar--that there is at least one other person in the entire universe who once watched--and appreciatied--the short-lived cartoon series "Home Movies".)

That hateful screed cannot die quick enough. Hopefully my son will see it dead and buried. Better yet bunt to a crisp.

I feel the Love/Anger . . . Yet to which "hateful screed" are you referring?
(I hope that maybe it's "The Jokelahoman") . . . ?

Wow, that was ridiculous! I wish they would put the actual author of the article instead of just editorial.

I started reading the Tulsa World for Oklahoma news. They are much better and of course the Journal Record is the best for business news.

I feel the Love/Anger . . . Yet to which "hateful screed" are you referring?
(I hope that maybe it's "The Jokelahoman") . . . ?

It is.

This feels like the 1940s, that the Gaylord-Chamber newspaper machine can just smell blood and write such an amazingly myopic attack piece on a councilman who's been saying the wrong stuff. They should really get their facts straight, and it is totally obvious that this is in response to all of the press Shadid has been getting in the Gazette. Does the Dark Tower not realize we can put two and two together?

Although the timeline doesn't exactly line up, isn't this related to the reason why Will Rogers used to get such huge laughs from audiences--back in the day--when he used to lead off his stage act with . . . "All I know I read in the newspapers" . . . .?

(Not to mention that "local comic"--Argus Somethingorother--who "They" cut loose like a slacker helicopter pilot?)

Ed Shadid's comments at the July 19 council meeting are shown below:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A9fSsODri3I&feature=player_profilepage

This includes his remarks about the convention center as well as those which pertain to Larry Nichols and the Committee for Oklahoma City Momentum. He is obviously a student and a thinker. He might do well to keep his hand from his chin more often ...

I think the questions Dr Shadid raised must have hit too close to home for someone. I find it kind of ironic that people like rcjunkie say people should investigate their candidates more when refering to an editorial that condems questioning public operations. If rcjunkie really felt the way he said he does he should welcome the questions and expect real answers. In fact, he should have asked the question himself as part of his own due diligence in the voting process.

Not ironic at all. Mr. Shadid has done nothing but throw accusations without any evidence to support his claims. Reminds me of Brian Walters and we know where this type of BS got him.
As for me asking questions, I did, by email and received a responses 3 weeks AFTER the election. Even though I no longer live in OKC proper, I still get and stay involved with the happenings at City Hall.

I was using "Naderite" a decade ago, and I certainly didn't make it up.

I guess it is kinda a cool word, unless it's being used against you, that is.

Maybe the Oklahoman is "just jealous" (cliche I know) that Dr. Shadid's brother works for a real newspaper?? Lol.

I could be wrong, but it seems to me that the Oklahoman has taken on a different tone since the recent change at the top.

It seems very familiar to me. I remember when Brian Walters voted against something the CofC wanted and Kelley did an editorial on newsok.com saying Walters was obviously another corrupt south side pol, and it was just a matter of time before he got indicted. For what? Nothing. Ed just pulled that out of his a**. Indicted for disagreeing with the chamber, I guess.

They said the same thing about George Nigh when he was elected governor over the Gaylord candidate, Ron Shotts.

Here's a revealing quote: "And to raise his lance against business interests over the convention center's construction timetable."

The Oklahoman uses the term "business interests" as a code for "your holy overlords, us."

This was the newspaper that ran an editorial accusing Gov. Bill Murray of wearing dirty long johns. So it's, you know, a long and proud tradition.

Alfalfa did wear dirty long johns, though...

It's hard for me to liken Shadid v. Chamber to Walters v. Chamber. Walters was a backwards, embarrassing assclown, who was mostly done in because his own district couldn't stand him. He didn't realize how annoying his righteous garbage was to others, and no, he wasn't the second coming of Jesus just because he was Super-christian conservative councilman-man. Shadid is the opposite of Walters in every way.

I notice that not one comment at the end of the article supported their position. Most were very critical, as well they should have been.

It is surprising, BUT not all that so considering it was one of the most pathetic op-eds they've done in a long time. I wonder if anyone actually came away with a lesser opinion of Shadid. The crazy thing is that someone in the Dark Tower thinks they can use the words "is against a convention center" to drum up antipathy for a politician. Perhaps they are deluding themselves as well that someone actually wants this convention center?

I would not have voted for Walters were I in his ward. Even so, I thought it was inexcusable, although entirely predictable, that the Oke would try that cheap "let's hope he doesn't get indicted" shot.

Spartan, I agree with you wholly in this thread, I think you are a little off on the Walters issue. He lost by about 400 votes, and he did lose. I don't think it is accurate to say the entire ward hated him.

Although the timeline doesn't exactly line up, isn't this related to the reason why Will Rogers used to get such huge laughs from audiences--back in the day--when he used to lead off his stage act with . . . "All I know I read in the newspapers" . . . .?

(Not to mention that "local comic"--Argus Somethingorother--who "They" cut loose like a slacker helicopter pilot?)

For some reason, the name "Argus Hamilton" is stuck in my head???

When I saw this in the paper this morning, couldn't help but be reminded about how the paper was constantly bringing up the issue of others trying to introduce "party" politics in the non-partisan Council elections (when it was the Oklahoman that was doing most of the labeling and even then, trying to lump Shadid in with some of the other candidates they would mention).

Spartan, I agree with you wholly in this thread, I think you are a little off on the Walters issue. He lost by about 400 votes, and he did lose. I don't think it is accurate to say the entire ward hated him.

Fair enough, I would say. I just knew a lot of people that were tired of him, but you're right, I also know he had his supporters.

It says a lot about the paper's ownership that they would pen an editorial ostensibly admitting that their news team didn't do its job reporting about the convention center.

Imagine: newspaper ownership making a case against "asking questions." Could anything be more preposterous?

The fact is the Oklahoman has intentionally blurred this story and kept the public from the details. They've provided very little depth except the aspect that Steve has reported about regarding the substation. Perhaps this was "cleared" for publication because they're made at Mick Cornett. But the bottom line is what coverage there has been in the Joke about the CC has served more to obfuscate and diffuse than to enlighten.

The 2,500 words in Shadid's paid-for-editorial expose were extremely enlightening. And what they brought to light was what a lousy newspaper we have in this city. Clearly there has been very little real reporting about the convention center. And now we know why, when we're being told to "move on," as the editorial disrespectfully chides Shadid.

It is surprising, BUT not all that so considering it was one of the most pathetic op-eds they've done in a long time. I wonder if anyone actually came away with a lesser opinion of Shadid. The crazy thing is that someone in the Dark Tower thinks they can use the words "is against a convention center" to drum up antipathy for a politician. Perhaps they are deluding themselves as well that someone actually wants this convention center?

Small bone to pick here: it was not an "op ed." It was a main editorial. The Oklahoman hasn't had an "op-ed" page in years, as they only want right-wing opinions in their newspaper. Typically, newspapers have two pages of opinion: one is their own, written by their editorial board, as was this s-hit piece against Shadid. Op-ed pages are usually across the gutter and feature editorialists and columnists typically not employed by the paper, or people writing guest opinions. The Oklahoman does not do this -- nor does it do much else that qualifies as good journalism. There's a reason it's referred to as "The Joke."

after watching the video that doug posted about the july 19 city council meeting, im glad i voted for him. He is saying the right stuff.

after watching the video that doug posted about the july 19 city council meeting, im glad i voted for him. He is saying the right stuff.
I am coming to the conclusion that there are only three council members who have an open mind about fair play when it comes to potentially divisive matters which might be brought to city council: Ed Shadid, Pete White, and Skip Kelly.

I am coming to the conclusion that there are only three council members who have an open mind about fair play when it comes to potentially divisive matters which might be brought to city council: Ed Shadid, Pete White, and Skip Kelly.

They might have an open mind but only one of them has anything in it. Watching the streetcar presentation 2 weeks ago was an embarrassment for a couple of them. I was very critical of Ed Shadid pre-election but I have been proven wrong.

Not sure what you mean, Just the facts. Will you kindly elaborate?

Not sure what you mean, Just the facts. Will you kindly elaborate?

LOL - 2 (maybe 3) weeks ago the City Council spent about an hour and fifteen minutes discussing the streetcar. They couldn't understand why the streetcar needs two set of tracks when they could run a single train both directions on the same track even if that track was in a traffic lane and the streetcar was traveling head-first into on-coming traffic. While it was quit amusing, it hurt my brain listening to it. Thank goodness UP was there to straighten them out. There is a link to it a couple of pages back in the streetcar thread.

Ok, I guess (though I remain unclear). I do concur, though, that listening to city council discussions can cause one to be bewildered ... who said what, who's on 1st, that kind of thing.

Ok, I guess (though I remain unclear). I do concur, though, that listening to city council discussions can cause one to be bewildered ... who said what, who's on 1st, that kind of thing.

I would have to go back and watch it again but as I recall, the only person who showed signs of intelligence was Dr. Shadid (and UP). White or Kelly (don't remember which) kept going on and on about how freight trains only use one track and it seems to work fine. I guess they never saw a freight train sitting on a siding for an hour while it waited for the on-coming train.

Another council member chimed in that if the entire system was just one track it could reach further away from the core. While true, the City could make a fortune selling the security cam video on late-night infomercials as the streetcar heads south in the northbound lanes of Lincoln. I'll see if I can find the video link and relevant time portion and you go get a beer and some nachos and make a night of it.

Here you go. This was originally posted by Urban Pioneer (who looks like Matthew McConaughey btw)

Here is a link to the video.

http://okc.gov/AgendaPub/mtgviewer.aspx?meetid=1305&doctype=AGENDA

You will need to skip to 49 minutes 30 seconds. That is where it starts.

I am coming to the conclusion that there are only three council members who have an open mind about fair play when it comes to potentially divisive matters which might be brought to city council: Ed Shadid, Pete White, and Skip Kelly.

Well Skip Kelly resents a lot of the economic development stuff as it is..

And woah, did someone just say Jeff looks like Matthew McConaughey?

Here you go. This was originally posted by Urban Pioneer (who looks like Matthew McConaughey btw)

Here is a link to the video.

http://okc.gov/AgendaPub/mtgviewer.aspx?meetid=1305&doctype=AGENDA

You will need to skip to 49 minutes 30 seconds. That is where it starts.
The link didn't work (not a fault to you, but it's not uncommon for city council video links to fail), but I think I understand what you mean ... earlier today, after getting what I wanted from it, I deleted the downloaded video from my hard drive. Like Spartan, though, I don't recall anyone on that video looking like Matthew McConaughey ... but at city council meetings, anything can happen. I'll see if I can still recover the meeting video from my recycle bin and have a better look.

On edit: Thinking better of it, I don't think I want to spend the time ... but I think that I understand what you mean. But I'll be glad to take you up on the beer ... not kidding ...

I think it is a reasonable question. To get more mileage out of it, why not build it down the center of the street (like center turning lanes where traffic can be heading either way), and have the streetcars running both directions (with the side tracks for passing)? By the time you put in the side tracks, may not be getting that much extra out of it.

As Urban Pioneer (Jeff) pointed out, there are reasonable "challenges" with that (like making riders travel to the center of the street to board etc). He also mentioned the possibility of head on collisions with Streetcar themselves (if a safety measure failed). Granted a head-on won't happen in a looped/couplet system but a streetcar could still potentially rear-end another couldn't it?

Small bone to pick here: it was not an "op ed." It was a main editorial. The Oklahoman hasn't had an "op-ed" page in years, as they only want right-wing opinions in their newspaper. Typically, newspapers have two pages of opinion: one is their own, written by their editorial board, as was this s-hit piece against Shadid. Op-ed pages are usually across the gutter and feature editorialists and columnists typically not employed by the paper, or people writing guest opinions. The Oklahoman does not do this -- nor does it do much else that qualifies as good journalism. There's a reason it's referred to as "The Joke."

While the typical 2-page spread doesn't appear in every edition anymore (may only be in the Sunday one now since they reformatted), they do indeed still have Op-Ed as you described. The paper often has pieces that are hardly "right-wing" from syndicated columnists (especially when it comes to "comprehensive illegal immigration reform"). Although I will agree that the Oklahoman typically runs pieces that agree with their editorial view on most issues. On rare occasions allowing the opposite side to appear, often in the "Your Views" (Letter to the Editor). Would love them to print a rebuttal piece from Shadid. What does anyone think the odds are on that happening? LOL

I could see the Gazette giving him a story about the editorial with his response. I dont want to read the original editorial again but what did stick out is the Oklahoman didn't mention where the 2 page ad appeared, which was odd...or did he put an ad in the Oklahoman too?

No. It was just in the Gazette. Nothing odd about it, though ... the Oklahoman never mentions the Gazette.

But, for me, my op-ed piece is here: http://dougdawg.blogspot.com/2011/07/oklahomans-selective-news-reporting-why.html, for whatever it's worth.

Spokesman Chip Minty--!

I have been subscribing to the iPad version of The Oklahoman for several months now and they never run an opposing view. It is really surprising for a paper and city of this size. I have not been that impressed with its content and will likely be canceling in the near future. It is a really nice app though.

The Oklahoman is a dinosaur. I'm glad that they've been ahead of the curve on technology and the Web, but they are behind the curve on quality journalism, a curve they will never be able to catch up to. Unfortunately for them, we need them for their journalism, not their tech savviness. Seriously, I hope they sell out to a news corporation because that is the only solution that will change things for the better in our city. They insist on being tied up in all of the local business interests, and as a result, fail to meet their basic mission: providing neutral, relatively unbiased coverage of local matters. The Momentum Committee / Convention Center (they called it the MAPS IV "Crown Jewel" in editorials, so we know their position), Ed Shadid affair makes perfectly clear that they are way too intertwined in local politics to serve their journalistic mission. Unfortunately, people in Oklahoma have never understood what real journalism is, so they continue to get a pass. But the editorial against Shadid and the lack of complete, comprehensive coverage on all of the issues surrounding the Convention Center serve as shameful reminders of how bad the rot is at OPUBCO. A real city deserves a real big-city paper, and the Nichols Hills neanderthals who run the Oklahoman are clueless -- or simply don't care -- how to deliver a real newspaper.

You know, this paper is so bad that despite its significant profits, it cannot ever even win the Oklahoma SPJ award for best newspaper. The Tulsa World, a relatively mediocre city paper, beats the Oklahoman EVERY SINGLE YEAR. That's how bad the Oklahoman is. It is a joke.

I have been subscribing to the iPad version of The Oklahoman for several months now and they never run an opposing view. It is really surprising for a paper and city of this size. I have not been that impressed with its content and will likely be canceling in the near future. It is a really nice app though.

While they don't run them daily, they do run them. Can't speak for the iPad app, but did you see today's paper Oklahoman/NewsOK.com, where they ran two opposing guest editorial views on the Voter I.D. question?

http://newsok.com/on-voter-id-cries-of-fraud-help-suppress-democracy/article/3589976?custom_click=headlines_widget

http://newsok.com/voter-id-is-a-sensible-precaution/article/3589975?custom_click=headlines_widget

No wonder Mick and the others willing to weasel out and vote before Shadid got back. Looks like the cc is going to be a shiney white elephant that'll be a deficit producer rather than revenue enhancement. You can take the white elephant Canadian River cruise to the white elephant convention center. doesn't sound like the study we can't see recommneded a new cc. Just got back into town. It ain't easy to fly into OKC.

While the full study hasn't been released, the executive summary was available (downloaded it at one time). I new C.C. was recommended but they also mentioned many "challenges" that OKC has when it comes to C.C. business that a new C.C. doesn't solve. Some of them are chicken/egg but they exist (overall hotel inventory, and not just the required C.C. hotel, direct flights etc).

While I supported the idea of the Convention Center (knew it was bringing NEW money into the economy), I always thought that the Chamber's numbers on it might not be conservative. using quick-n-dirty math. to get the 3-fold increase they claim we will get, it will mean a 9-fold (900%) increase in the out of area/State conventions. Since, according to an editorial that ran a little while back by the Chamber head, NEW money only accounts for about 1/3 of events held there. Kerry has been saying for a long time that are current convention business is largely local and that editorial seems to have proven him correct. The editorial was pushing the idea that the C.C. isn't so much an economic driver as it is a quality of life issue. Complete opposite of what they were pushing during the campaign.

The balance of my article, "The Emperor's New Clothes," is here: http://dougdawg.blogspot.com/2011/07/okc-city-council-civility-is-it-lost.html

It includes video clips from the July 5 council meeting, both proponents and opponents of the requested continuances. It ain't pretty.