Steve wrote an article that appeared in this morning's DO about the proposed installation of 235 parking meters at a cost of $1,780,000. That's $7,574 per meter. You'd think that for this amount of money they'd be discrete, attractive, and have a history of flawless performance. None of these things are true. Other than the manufacturere, no-one seems to like the meters. Anybody here think that these are what's best for downtown OKC?

Parking lots all charge, why should the city not be able to. And sometimes if I'm going to be somewhere 20 minutes a meter is a good thing. As far as whether the initial expense is justifiable it's just like any other business decision. How much income do these 235 locations generate. If the payback and future income are favorable then so be it.

http://www.newsok.com/proposed-downtown-oklahoma-city-parking-meters-have-troubled-past-and-face-an-uncertain-future/multimedia/photos/gallery/3588789/1/1472760?custom_click=email_multimedia_gallery

I personally think a lot more information would be needed to actually make an informed comment for or against them.

1.) Why are we replacing the current ones?
2.) What are the other options?
3.) Why exactly was this model selected?
4.) Cost comparison between buying, installing and maintaining this newer meter as opposed to traditional meters or other newer options?
5.) Do these newer ones have any worse a track record than other options and are they as or more cost effective?
6.) How quickly do the meters pay for themselves?

The article read like a one sided editorial IMO.

As for the looks - its a meter, what are our expectations? Do we want it to blend in so well people have a hard time finding the meter (especially if one meter will control numerous spaces)?

Personally, I want a meter to be open, obvious, quick to use (so I'm not standing the in rain trying to figure it out), accurate and cost effective. Additional features like adding more time via my cell phone or the ability to see open spaces on a map on my cell phone would be cool too.

I don't object to parking meters, or even paying for parking - I get that. I also understand that a cost-benefit analysis is done in the private sector before committing to the expenditure - they are enterprises that take risk in order to earn a profit. The difference is that the City of OKC should be focused on collecting parking tolls for the least amount of money. A higher-priced meter won't exact a higher parking fee.

I vigorously object to the public expenditure of $1.8 million for high-tech devices with a history of problems when our existing mix of low-tech and higher-tech meters seem to work just fine.

A higher-priced meter won't exact a higher parking fee.

Actually it will. These meters have the ability to charge different prices at different times. For example, it is free to park at most meters after 6PM and on weekends. However, if there is a Thunder Game on a Saturday night the meters could charge $1 per hour starting 2 hours before the game and ending 2 hours after the game. These 235 meters could control over 2,000 parking spaces. At $6 each that would be $12,000 per game. Multiply this by 41 home games and that is an additional $500,000. Of course, the actual number would be based on how many on-street parking spaces are created.

Part of the reason we are changing meters is because the current ones are out of production and parts are no longer available. I got a ticket a couple of years ago because I parked on a one-hour meter and the mechanism had been accidentally swapped out with one set to expire in 30 minutes.

Beyond that, parking meters aren't there to collect revenue, they're there to ensure turnover of parking spaces. You can't run down and slug these meters over and over again. They won't take additional money until a new vehicle occupies the space.

Oklahoma City is the birthplace of the parking meter,so we might as well get the best!

Part of the reason we are changing meters is because the current ones are out of production and parts are no longer available. Assuming that this is true that's reason enough for me to replace/upgrade. Being in the business building maintenance/repair/construction I can say how hard it is trying to keep outdated junk running. It's not cost efficient and is very stressful.

These meters have the ability to charge different prices at different times. For example, it is free to park at most meters after 6PM and on weekends. However, if there is a Thunder Game on a Saturday night the meters could charge $1 per hour starting 2 hours before the game and ending 2 hours after the game.

I see confusion on the streets: Say that the hourly rate changes from $1 to $2 at 4:00 on a Saturday afternoon due to a Thunder home game. I park at 3:30 p.m., intending to stay for one hour (I'm not going to the game, obviously). All I want to do is how many quarters go into the meter. Even if the device had a way to describe the rate, how many average Oklahomans are capable of: (0.5 hours x $1.00) + (0.5 hours x $2.00) = $1.50?

Extra credit: Using the same rules, how much is it if I parked at 3:35 p.m.? Or 3:47. Or...

These are not your typical coin operated meter - they have a display screen that does the calculation for you. You park your car, walk up to the meter, tell it how long you want to park, and it tells you how much it cost. I don't even know if you can put money in it but it will take a credit/debit card. I don't know if these will do it but it should be able to tell you if a rate change occurs while you are planning to be parked. Have you ever parked in a garage that charges one price for the first hour and then another price for each additional hour? It is the same thing. They should also issue a credit if you leave early (but the City will probably choose to pocket that money).

If the fine people of Troy, NY can figure it surely the people in OKC can.

http://alloveralbany.com/images/troy_pay_display_parking_meter.jpg

At $7,500/meter + maintenance, I'm not seeing how these are ever profitable at .25 per 15 minutes or .25 per 30 minutes in some places. I know profit isn't the only thing, but it sure sounds like these things have some ridonculous features. At a cost of 1.3MM or whatever, wouldn't it be cheaper just to have the replacement parts for the old machines custom manufactured?

Actually, the profit is not in the money put in the meter, but rather in the parking ticket generated when you don't pay the meter. I'd love to know how much revenue the city pulls in from downtown parking tickets. I've contributed my fair share, and it's been far more than I've put in meters. Saying that, they might as well buy the cheapest ones on the market.

That's a waste of money a bit to much for a parking meter.

Do these new meters have the ability to charge electric cars? I don't mean to charge them a parking fee neither.

At $7,500/meter + maintenance, I'm not seeing how these are ever profitable at .25 per 15 minutes or .25 per 30 minutes in some places. I know profit isn't the only thing, but it sure sounds like these things have some ridonculous features. At a cost of 1.3MM or whatever, wouldn't it be cheaper just to have the replacement parts for the old machines custom manufactured?

These new meters are all over downtown Tulsa and handle all the spaces for a whole single side of a street block. Probably usually 8-12 spaces. So While a single meter might be $7500 it's replacing on average probably like 10 meters. And I bet those old style meters cost every bit of $750 each. Here's Tulsa's version:

http://ktul.images.worldnow.com/images/12835994_BG1.jpg

http://activerain.com/image_store/uploads/7/4/2/1/9/ar127327674191247.JPG

http://homepage.mac.com/discodave2/tulsa/DSC01440.jpg

These meters are standard in Washington DC. I like, reduces street clutter.

Yeah... I park at a meter identical to the model that Swake shows every time I go to the MBG. The meters are on Main between Broadway and Robinson. There are several of these downtown. I don't see what the big deal is... aside from the fact that the proposed model for Project 180 looks like the "Atari" version. Tad on the large side.

Actually, the profit is not in the money put in the meter, but rather in the parking ticket generated when you don't pay the meter. I'd love to know how much revenue the city pulls in from downtown parking tickets. I've contributed my fair share, and it's been far more than I've put in meters. Saying that, they might as well buy the cheapest ones on the market.
Presume most of this is from DT but don't know for sure...from the City proposed budget book it stated the following:

Parking Meters
$810,610 (08-09 actual)
$754,501 (09-10 adopted)
$684,664 (10-11 proposed)

Parking Fines
$977,016 (08-09 actual)
$911,706 (09-10 adopted)
$1,072,579 (10-11 proposed)

The parking meters totals are probably just in the downtown area while the parking fines are city wide. Just one of the these electronic meters could replace up to 20 standard meters. However, due to block size it probably maxes out at 12.

That's what i was thinking as well (can't recall seeing a parking meter outside of the DT area). While the fines are probably city wide, I would imagine most come from the DT area. Has anyone seen the Meter Maids anywhere else (sorry if the term is sexist, not sure what the official PC term is..parking Enforcement officer, maybe...LOL)

Yeah... I park at a meter identical to the model that Swake shows every time I go to the MBG. The meters are on Main between Broadway and Robinson. There are several of these downtown. I don't see what the big deal is... aside from the fact that the proposed model for Project 180 looks like the "Atari" version. Tad on the large side.

Is that what the brown box is right outside the door to the Century Center?

What I liked about the old ones were that you could contest the ticket and 50% of the time I was told the meter was defective and to ignore the ticket.

Back in The People's Republic, near The University, due to parking scarcity in the 60's and 70's, there was an unwritten rule:
If you saw a ticket under someone's windshield wiper, you pulled it out, wadded it up, and [responsibly disposed of it].

That way, when YOU PAID every FIFTH parking ticket--and then got hassled "By The Man" on one of the others--you could claim that YOU paid your parking tickets . . . and that someone had probably pulled it off your car and [responsibly disposed of it]. And the fine was forgiven. Like at the Library.

Of course, by so doing, we were using The Social Contract as toilet paper . . .
But that was then and this is now . . . Or soon will be. =)

That's what i was thinking as well (can't recall seeing a parking meter outside of the DT area). While the fines are probably city wide, I would imagine most come from the DT area. Has anyone seen the Meter Maids anywhere else (sorry if the term is sexist, not sure what the official PC term is..parking Enforcement officer, maybe...LOL)

There are a number of meters around the American Fidelity buildings, which I don't think anybody considers downtown.

Interesting, are there others?

Those are the only ones I am certain about as I live nearby and see them all the time.

Is that what the brown box is right outside the door to the Century Center?

I don't believe so. The machine is identical to the model posted above by Swake. Here's a google maps link. The meter is in the center of the screen immediately above the VW. http://maps.google.com/maps?q=oklahoma+city&ll=35.467604,-97.515909&spn=0.001363,0.002838&client=safari&oe=UTF-8&gl=us&z=19&layer=c&cbll=35.467698,-97.515808&panoid=8a02438NVC0Mbzoo7r5R-w&cbp=12,129.11,,0,19.65

I don't believe so. The machine is identical to the model posted above by Swake. Here's a google maps link. The meter is in the center of the screen immediately above the VW. http://maps.google.com/maps?q=oklahoma+city&ll=35.467604,-97.515909&spn=0.001363,0.002838&client=safari&oe=UTF-8&gl=us&z=19&layer=c&cbll=35.467698,-97.515808&panoid=8a02438NVC0Mbzoo7r5R-w&cbp=12,129.11,,0,19.65

That is the brown box right outside the doors to the Century Center I was talking about. Thanks for confirming. So if we already use them, what is the big deal? I know there was some concern the proposed model looked bulky but it was the same width as the double meter standing next to it; maybe 18 inches wide. That isn't very big.

http://newsok.com/vendor-chosen-to-supply-parking-meters-for-oklahoma-city-is-under-federal-investigation-for-alleged-kickbacks-in-oregon-according-to-newspaper-reports/article/3594887

http://newsok.com/vendor-chosen-to-supply-parking-meters-for-oklahoma-city-is-under-federal-investigation-for-alleged-kickbacks-in-oregon-according-to-newspaper-reports/article/3594887

Very interesting and maybe very fortuitous for OKC.

As the old saying goes . . . "Follow the money . . .'

(Hopefully, none of this reflects negatively on other [proposed developments] which might possibly involve the invention of a whole new cliché: "Trackback/Backtrack the money . . .")

Congrats to the City for putting it on hold until it is sorted out.

If the company is having problems with their parking meters, can we still buy voting machines from them? ;)

LOL. The only problem I see there is if they shave a "few votes off"

Steve just reported at NewsOK, the fine people at CALE Parking seem to have a propensity towards understatement:

"In the letter, Bonardi acknowledged the replacement of parking meters throughout downtown Chicago “encountered some controversy.”



http://newsok.com/vendor-defends-track-record-of-parking-meters-to-oklahoma-city-officials/article/3596929#ixzz1Vs35uEC0

To me the bigger questions is - did the problem get fixed. In the case of Chicago, the answer is yes. Last winter Chicago had one of the worst ice-storms the city has ever seen (Lakeshore Drive was 6 feet deep in ice), and the meters didn't seem to have a problem. Getting your car to the parking space was the problem.

http://a.abcnews.com/images/US/ap_chicago_lakeshore_drive_2_ll_110202_ssh.jpg

While fixing the "problem" is an obvious concern (indications it was fixed), we do have our share of ice storms so it is a valid concern.

The bigger question is the criminal investigation. Again, wise of the City to put this on hold until it gets sorted out.

Yes, the criminal investigation is a big issue. That is why you shouldn't break the law. Even if they did it to get the Portland contract (and I am not saying they did it), it might cost them the contracts in OKC and Minneapolis. And of course, we all know how Chicago operates.