Just got back from the People's Socialist Republik of Kalifornia yesterday.
Every time I fly, I lose more and more faith in my fellow man, even more so than what I experience on the job. Here are several simple truths that should be well known, but aren't for some reason:

1. You're not the center of the universe. Other people matter.
2. You’re supposed to be a grown adult. Don’t cut in line, and don’t try to board first with your two fifteen -year-old “tots.” Have some integrity.
3. (And this is a biggie) Find your seat, stow your crap, and park your rump, and do it quick. You’re not picking out furniture. Taking your sweet time while 100 other passengers wait is unconscionably inconsiderate.
4. When the flight attendants tell you to get off your phone, get off the dang phone. You’re holding up the flight for 100+ other people.
5. CONTROL YOUR CHILDREN!!!!!
6. Don’t grab the seat back of your neighbor in front to support all of your body weight as you maneuver into your seat, sling-shotting them forward when you let go.
7. Many passengers try to sleep on flights. Stop the loud talking, belly laughing, and horsing around.
8. The restrooms have locks on the doors. Use them. I’ve had enough traumas for a lifetime.
9. When the doors are opened at the end of the flight, grab your crap and get your rump off the plane. 100 + passengers are waiting for you.
10. I’m sure I’ve forgotten something. It’s very simple. Have some consideration for others around you, and behind you.

Every time I fly, I lose more and more faith in my fellow man, even more so than what I experience on the job. Here are several simple truths that should be well known, but aren't for some reason:

1. You're not the center of the universe. Other people matter.
2. You’re supposed to be a grown adult. Don’t cut in line, and don’t try to board first with your two fifteen -year-old “tots.” Have some integrity.
3. (And this is a biggie) Find your seat, stow your crap, and park your rump, and do it quick. You’re not picking out furniture. Taking your sweet time while 100 other passengers wait is unconscionably inconsiderate.
4. When the flight attendants tell you to get off your phone, get off the dang phone. You’re holding up the flight for 100+ other people.
5. CONTROL YOUR CHILDREN!!!!!
6. Don’t grab the seat back of your neighbor in front to support all of your body weight as you maneuver into your seat, sling-shotting them forward when you let go.
7. Many passengers try to sleep on flights. Stop the loud talking, belly laughing, and horsing around.
8. The restrooms have locks on the doors. Use them. I’ve had enough traumas for a lifetime.
9. When the doors are opened at the end of the flight, grab your crap and get your rump off the plane. 100 + passengers are waiting for you.
10. I’m sure I’ve forgotten something. It’s very simple. Have some consideration for others around you, and behind you.

I would add to that:

11. Don't throw both your oversized, so-called "carry-on" and your laptop, backpack or other item in the overhead storage bin. The smaller item is supposed to go under the seat.
12. Before you get in the security line know which items need to be put in the bins; we shouldn't have to wait for you to open your suitcase, open your toiletry bag, pull out your aerosols and liquids only to realize you don't have them in a plastic bag.

Can I also add one:

13. Sit in the seat number that is on your boarding ticket. Just because you don't like the middle seat doesn't mean you get to self-upgrade.

Until about 50 years ago, eating out, flying in a plane and going to a movie with kids was an "event." You dressed up, put on your best manners and you knew your parents would wail on you if you disturbed people around you. Kids didn't act like heathens so the wailing rarely happened but if it did, people around would nod approvingly. Parents would have dropped through the floor in shame if their kids acted like savages in public.

Life changed and a generation of lazy, exhausted (think two income/single parent), guilt-ridden, negligent parents gave birth to a wave of boorish narcissists. The narcissists have come of age and pretty much ruined public life for everyone else. Unfortunately, they have continued to breed and have given birth to children who are savages in every sense of the word. They make their narcissistic parents seem merely uncivilized.

The airlines screwed themselves (minus southwest) when they started charging for bags. the carry on bags seem to be getting bigger and bigger. which leads to almost every flight being delayed cause they have to check thier back on the jetway.

As for people talking, I had a guy behind me talk for 45 minutes straight on my way to houston last week on a dark thirty AM flight. People gave him the worst looks and he didnt even realize it. Off in lala land.

The overall lack of common courtesy is amazing.

Looks like we're all on the same page here... so where the hell do these people come from?

Looks like we're all on the same page here... so where the hell do these people come from?

Southern California and the San Francisco Bay Area. They are the most important people in the world. If you don't believe me just ask them.

Southern California and the San Francisco Bay Area. They are the most important people in the world. If you don't believe me just ask them.

I travel all over the country, though, and encounter them everywhere. It's like loading sheep onto a trailer. I've always said a couple of USMC drill instructors could have that plane loaded, with everyone seated, in two minutes.

I travel all over the country, though, and encounter them everywhere. It's like loading sheep onto a trailer. I've always said a couple of USMC drill instructors could have that plane loaded, with everyone seated, in two minutes.

LOL - I still remember the day I went from reception to basic training via the cattle car. Not only could a drill sergeant do it in 2 minutes, but they can could teach you how to pack properly so everything you need fits in a single carry bag that fits under your seat.

1 more for Oklahoma: If you are over 250 pounds, don't sit in a middle seat. It makes a 2 1/2 hour flight a living hell for your neighbors.

1 more for Oklahoma: If you are over 250 pounds, don't sit in a middle seat. It makes a 2 1/2 hour flight a living hell for your neighbors.

That just isn't Oklahoma. Some airlines are making over-weight people buy two tickets.

1 more for Oklahoma: If you are over 250 pounds, don't sit in a middle seat. It makes a 2 1/2 hour flight a living hell for your neighbors.



Or the window seat or you (The 250lber) will also be miserable... kind of sucks if you're not 11 years old, for whom the seats were designed.

Another for Oklahoma:
14: Even though this is probably your first time on a plane, this is not pep rally. Just because you're departing or landing in OKC does not mean you can start yelling "Boomer!, Sooner!"
15: One carry-on and one personal item means one carry-one and one personal item. Don't look surprised when the flight attendant calls you out when you're holding a medium carry-on suitcase, laptop messenger bag and your purse and you have no place to stow them.

I have landed in New York City only to hear all the New Yorkers on the plane start clapping and cheering.

Airlines should consider childless flight options and charging for carry ons in bins or eliminating them.

I disagree there. Why shoudln't one be able to carry on? I often fly to stay overnight. Its ridiculous for me to have to stand in an extra line and pay to check my bag when all I'm carrying is a back pack.

Flying sucks. It's just the way it is. It has nothing to do with the passengers or consideration. Trust me you're the target of just as many as you targeted.

Don't hate the playa hate the game.

Flying sucks. It's just the way it is. It has nothing to do with the passengers or consideration. Trust me you're the target of just as many as you targeted.

Don't hate the playa hate the game.

You're wrong. There's a way to show consideration for others in whatever you do.

...and there goes the nice discussion.

A Southwest flight attendant had a good one this weekend -

"OK, it's the time that even the really important people have to turn off their electronic devices"

LOL. Bravo

I was on a Delta flight and the flight attendant had announced two times for people to turn their devices off. However, there were still some people using their devices. On the third annoucement she simply said, "Our instruments indicate that there are still two people using their phones. I just want to let all the other passengers know that these two people are keeping us from leaving." About 8 people turned their phones off at the same time.

I had a Delta flight booked for me (Never again) for a writer's conference in Memphis, once. The aircraft was about the size of a city bus inside, and they had my 6' 250lb butt assigned to a window seat next to an A-1 nut boy. The guy wouldn't get off of his cell phone and began talking to himself in quite an animated way after they finally made him turn it off. He then began forcefully swearing to himself for about 15 minutes after that. One of my worst flights ever. (Not to mention they lost my luggage and I had to suffer the humiliation of showing up at the conference the second day in the same clothes)

I can certify that there are no instruments on board any civilian aircraft that detect whether or not personal electronic devices are in use. The idea that it causes interference with navigation systems is also not 100% true. Cell phone signals travel on a completely different frequency range and wavelength than that of the instruments. The in-flight wifi signal does not interfere with navigation systems, nor does the main signal to the wifi-ground station or satellite station. And that signal is much stronger than any cell-phone, and carries a ton more bandwidth. It is a safety issue, though, to have non-anchored objects scattered about the cabin. Sudden decent, emergency landing, rejected (aborted) takeoff, crash, runway over-run, etc. can exert many G-forces of deceleration which could potentially send these objects flying through the cabin and possibly striking other passengers at fatal or injuring velocities. That's why you can have them out and on above 10,000 feet. You have a far less likely chance of encountering G-forces that can send these objects flying through the cabin at altitudes higher than 10,000 feet. Navigation is just as important at high altitudes as it is at lower altitudes, and in congested airspace, precise-to-the-second navigation at high altitude is imperative. Using the reasoning of the FAA and the airlines, electronics and personal devices should never be used during a flight.

Using the reasoning of the FAA and the airlines, electronics and personal devices should never be used during a flight.

And I would be perfectly fine with that. I think everyone could survive a few hours without the electronic fixes that seem to rule their daily lives.

Myth Busters did an episode on cell interferance with aircraft controls and totally busted it, however, they caved to government pressure and called it plausable. There are 2 reasons they don't want you using cell phones in flight. First, it would be crazy inside the plane if 130 people were all on the cell phones and second, all the calls would be free because the plane is flying through the cell towers faster than the billing system can keep up.

If there was even a 1% chance a cell phone could bring down a aircraft they wouldn't be allowed on the plane.

I have landed in New York City only to hear all the New Yorkers on the plane start clapping and cheering.

I should think the clapping and cheering would take place at take off! <vbg>

Flying sucks. It's just the way it is. It has nothing to do with the passengers or consideration. Trust me you're the target of just as many as you targeted.

Don't hate the playa hate the game.
Oh no. I can't believe that. Years ago, it was fun. Now, it is like being trapped in a toaster oven with a four year old whose mother is slamming the door shut to catch a break.

Airlines should consider childless flight options and charging for carry ons in bins or eliminating them.

Or just put the kids up there. <vbg>

I disagree there. Why shoudln't one be able to carry on? I often fly to stay overnight. Its ridiculous for me to have to stand in an extra line and pay to check my bag when all I'm carrying is a back pack.

The problem is that even if you have a backpack, many other people haul in a steamer trunk on wheels and insist it is the size of a coffee cup.

Myth Busters did an episode on cell interferance with aircraft controls and totally busted it, however, they caved to government pressure and called it plausable. There are 2 reasons they don't want you using cell phones in flight. First, it would be crazy inside the plane if 130 people were all on the cell phones and second, all the calls would be free because the plane is flying through the cell towers faster than the billing system can keep up.

If there was even a 1% chance a cell phone could bring down a aircraft they wouldn't be allowed on the plane.

My husband is an accident investigtor and he agrees with what has been written here on the odds of a cell phone bringing down a plane (and also the part about how dangerous they are if they are flying around the cabin in a crash although to be honest, that is the least of my own personal worries if a jetliner is on its way down).

Just the same, if it means people will stay off the dang things, I am all for insisting they will cause the plane to explode. The problem is that there are always yahoos (and trust me, Oklahoma is not the worst - we at least are an area where many of the passengers come from an aviation state) who, upon believing their cell phone won't cause a problem, will insist on their "right" to use the cell phone, no matter what.

...all the calls would be free because the plane is flying through the cell towers faster than the billing system can keep up.

Nope. Not unless your airline is flying right on the deck. Try to make a cell phone call at 30,000 feet. If you actually have service, please post the name of your provider, because we're all switching...

And here's one more for Matt's list:

16. By all means, don't let the fact that you know in advance that you're going to have to pass through a metal detector and remove your shoes deter you from wearing every piece of metal jewelry you own, a belt adorned with plenty of "bling", as well as shin-high lace up boots. And don't even consider taking any of that off first - be sure to walk through the detector first so that you can have that genuine look of surprise that you have to go back. Don't mind the rest of us - we love waiting in the rat maze.

Nope. Not unless your airline is flying right on the deck. Try to make a cell phone call at 30,000 feet. If you actually have service, please post the name of your provider, because we're all switching...



I have Sprint. I have received calls at 30,000 feet because I forgot to turn my phone off (thank goodenss I had the ringer on vibrate). I have also used the internet on my phone while in flight. The next time you fly turn your ringer off but leave the phone on then check to see if you are still getting service in flight. People make calls from airplanes all the time, including on 9/11.

I stand corrected! I have AT&T and routinely leave it on when I'm not on a commercial flight and it's nothing but a paperweight above 20,000 or so. Interesting - thanks for the info.

Thanks for some great laughs MattB, your post though really does hit on all the points I've noticed in all my years of flying, I'm in total agreement. I've never worn sandals or shorts when I'm flying, for me it's always a polo shirt and pants, and quick-removable tennis shoes.

I've seen all kinds of people as much I've as I've flown both domestic and international, and while there are people who really do leave their manners at home when they fly and parents who don't know basic parenting (or don't give a you-know-what's what), there are also people who know what to do, they just do it and move on. I've also seen well-behaved kids, but then their parents were also doing their job well from I noticed. There is always a pattern.

You're right that there are plenty of parents doing a swell job - surely the majority. I often give a nod and a compliment to parents with such "lovely, well behaved children" when I see them at a restaurant and they have things under control. By that, I mean the ones whose kids know how to behave and they do it without the parents screaming hysterically at them. Kids will be kids but you can tell in an instant the ones with sensible parents willing to take the time and effort to teach them how to be a member of society.

Back when I was doing guardian ad litem work, I would frequently go on home visits and some of the houses would be a zoo. A standard question, regardless, is to ask how the parent disciplines their children. The ones with the wildest kids invariably would tell me that they don't need to discipline their kids because the kids don't do anything wrong. Those are the same parents who throw up their hands when the kids get into their teens, start acting out and treat their parents like garbage. The standard line has been, "I don't know what happened! She/he used to be my best friend."

8. The restrooms have locks on the doors. Use them. I’ve had enough traumas for a lifetime.

What did you see?

Myth Busters did an episode on cell interferance with aircraft controls and totally busted it, however, they caved to government pressure and called it plausable. There are 2 reasons they don't want you using cell phones in flight. First, it would be crazy inside the plane if 130 people were all on the cell phones and second, all the calls would be free because the plane is flying through the cell towers faster than the billing system can keep up.

If there was even a 1% chance a cell phone could bring down a aircraft they wouldn't be allowed on the plane.
A close friend who is a pilot told me that he believes the reason behind the policy is because the cells hit so many towers so fast, with thousands of air travelers in the sky at any given time, it would increase the traffic flow to a rate that is unmanageable for the cell providers.
BTW: Anyone ever turn on your phone on on the plane? It just continually looks for a tower, and becomes useless.

The problem is that even if you have a backpack, many other people haul in a steamer trunk on wheels and insist it is the size of a coffee cup.

Got ya, but I carry a bag that is within regulations.

8. The restrooms have locks on the doors. Use them. I’ve had enough traumas for a lifetime.

What did you see?
Thunder, Pal, I've opened the door to use the restroom no less than three times in my travels and gotten an eye-full of bush or rump. While that may not sound bad to some, it certainly is when the "subject" looks like 180lbs of chewed bubble gum. One of the reasons I remembered to include it here was that I experienced the hind-side of a 70 year old grandma on my trip Monday afternoon! If I didn't need them so much, I'd gouge my eyes out!

I stand corrected! I have AT&T and routinely leave it on when I'm not on a commercial flight and it's nothing but a paperweight above 20,000 or so. Interesting - thanks for the info.

Honestly, I couldn't swear to the altitude of the airplane. I worked in Monroe, LA for 3 months and was talking to my wife while boarding one of my flights. After the call my phone was having issues turning off and when it finally start powering down I just stuck it my pocket. About 30 minutes into the flight my pocket started vibrating and it was my wife calling. Somehow my phone had either not really powered down or it came back on. Of course I didn't want to answer it so I sent her a text message that I would call her when I got to Atlanta. When I got to Atlanta I called her and she said I had been butt dialing her since we hung up. She could hear the pilot saying he turned the seatbelt light off and even heard the flight attendant ask what I wanted to drink. The calls didn't appear on my useage even though I called her several times.

Thunder, Pal, I've opened the door to use the restroom no less than three times in my travels and gotten an eye-full of bush or rump. While that may not sound bad to some, it certainly is when the "subject" looks like 180lbs of chewed bubble gum. One of the reasons I remembered to include it here was that I experienced the hind-side of a 70 year old grandma on my trip Monday afternoon! If I didn't need them so much, I'd gouge my eyes out!

You poor soul. :-(

Can I also add one:

13. Sit in the seat number that is on your boarding ticket. Just because you don't like the middle seat doesn't mean you get to self-upgrade.

WOW! That would really take balls! I've never seen that happen.

Flying sucks. It's just the way it is. It has nothing to do with the passengers or consideration. Trust me you're the target of just as many as you targeted.

Don't hate the playa hate the game.

I agree. Too bad Amtrak doesn't cover more areas. No taking your shoes and belt off; no getting to the terminal 2 hrs before departure; incredibly more leg, shoulder and headroom than any airline's 1st class section! Walking from car to car without seatbelt warnings.

I agree. Too bad Amtrak doesn't cover more areas. No taking your shoes and belt off; no getting to the terminal 2 hrs before departure; incredibly more leg, shoulder and headroom than any airline's 1st class section! Walking from car to car without seatbelt warnings.

Again I disagree. People should still have consideration for those around them, and we've well-articulated the ways in which that may be done.

Again I disagree. People should still have consideration for those around them, and we've well-articulated the ways in which that may be done.

Consideration (or lack of such) does not enter into my reason for disliking air travel, though it's appreciated when people exercise it. I, like you, am not built to be stuffed into an ever shrinking aluminum tube (6'3" - 235 lbs). Train travel is infinitely more relaxing, inexpensive and stress free, if you can afford the time.

Consideration (or lack of such) does not enter into my reason for disliking air travel, though it's appreciated when people exercise it. I, like you, am not built to be stuffed into an ever shrinking aluminum tube (6'3" - 235 lbs). Train travel is infinitely more relaxing, inexpensive and stress free, if you can afford the time.

That part of it will never change, since they want to cram as many people into the tin can as possible to increase their profits. However, the rest of it is totally avoidable if people would just have consideration for others.

I agree. Too bad Amtrak doesn't cover more areas. No taking your shoes and belt off; no getting to the terminal 2 hrs before departure; incredibly more leg, shoulder and headroom than any airline's 1st class section! Walking from car to car without seatbelt warnings.

And the quiet cars! Love those. You don't have to sit and be forced to listen to inane conversation for hours and hours and hours. The talkers will yak for 45 minutes and then hang up and IMMEDIATELY call someone else. Men and women. Just once, if I have to overhear a one sided conversation, I want it to be a doctor talking a medical student through an amputation or something.

Just once, if I have to overhear a one sided conversation, I want it to be a doctor talking a medical student through an amputation or something.

LOL - I think I will reherse that and try it.

I've had to break the rule of not disturbing others with a long "phone call" on a plane while we were delayed for a maintenance issue, I think it had something to do with an avionics stack that wasn't functioning properly.

In fact, it was a long one-sided conversation pretending to talk to a (fellow) aircraft mechanic how to change a fuel boost pump on a CRJ-700. Happened to have a maintenance manual for it on my netbook, and went through it step-by-step.

Reasoning: after sitting on the ground for 10 minutes, the person next to me started talking.....and talking, and talking, talking....would not shut up. 15 more minutes of talking and complaining about the delay she begins to say the aircraft mechanics who were working on our plane must not know what they were doing. This irritated me, so a few more minutes I pretend my phone is buzzing me, I pull out my phone, "Oh, hold on let me take this call." Talked for about a 15 minutes with my netbook open to the maintenance manual talking through the repair procedure step-by-step. Got off the phone and she had heard enough, didn't hear a word from her for the remainder of the delay, or the entire flight. Didn't even try to make eye contact with me. And for those that don't know, I'm an aircraft mechanic (albeit right now unlicensed, still in tech classes for my ratings to sign the paperwork, but I can do the work on aircraft with someone else checking and signing it off) - so it really did make me angry that she thought they didn't know what they were doing. It's a $10,000 investment for training, and 1.5 years of 8 hour class days and thousands of dollars worth of tools. All out of the mechanics pockets -- they take it seriously and did not just walk off the street.

/End rant

You should have told her one the flangies wasn't working. That is a little 'Friends' reference.

you guys should try flying international, particular in China. ...

All of you would've hated me... I was a devil child on airplanes.. All I did was ask questions non stop the entire flight. "What happens if the plane blows up?" "Where are we going?" "Will we go up into space?" I did this once on a 10+ hour plane ride to Hawaii.... lol.

All of you would've hated me... I was a devil child on airplanes.. All I did was ask questions non stop the entire flight. "What happens if the plane blows up?" "Where are we going?" "Will we go up into space?" I did this once on a 10+ hour plane ride to Hawaii.... lol.

Were any of your questions answered?

you guys should try flying international, particular in China. ...

Actually, I once flew EVA Airlines to Taiwan (I know, not China) and it was one of the best airline experiences of my life.

Actually, I once flew EVA Airlines to Taiwan (I know, not China) and it was one of the best airline experiences of my life.

I think Hot Rod is referring mainly to domestic flights within China with one of their domestic airlines like China Southern or others. That is a totally different experience than the international flights.

I think Hot Rod is referring mainly to domestic flights within China with one of their domestic airlines like China Southern or others. That is a totally different experience than the international flights.

I know how China have weird houses and the walls inside are not like ours. More like sliding walls and can see the shadows thru the material. Is it something like that on the China planes for the restrooms? :-O

I know how China have weird houses and the walls inside are not like ours. More like sliding walls and can see the shadows thru the material. Is it something like that on the China planes for the restrooms? :-O

I think you're thinking of Japan... I think.

My peeve... people who slam their seat back as if they are at home in their La-z-boy. Be considerate, ease the seat back.

I think you're thinking of Japan... I think.

Yes. Shoji (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sh%C5%8Dji) and Futsama (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fusuma)

Just got back from the People's Socialist Republik of Kalifornia yesterday.
Every time I fly, I lose more and more faith in my fellow man, even more so than what I experience on the job. Here are several simple truths that should be well known, but aren't for some reason:

1. You're not the center of the universe. Other people matter.
2. You’re supposed to be a grown adult. Don’t cut in line, and don’t try to board first with your two fifteen -year-old “tots.” Have some integrity.
3. (And this is a biggie) Find your seat, stow your crap, and park your rump, and do it quick. You’re not picking out furniture. Taking your sweet time while 100 other passengers wait is unconscionably inconsiderate.
4. When the flight attendants tell you to get off your phone, get off the dang phone. You’re holding up the flight for 100+ other people.
5. CONTROL YOUR CHILDREN!!!!!
6. Don’t grab the seat back of your neighbor in front to support all of your body weight as you maneuver into your seat, sling-shotting them forward when you let go.
7. Many passengers try to sleep on flights. Stop the loud talking, belly laughing, and horsing around.
8. The restrooms have locks on the doors. Use them. I’ve had enough traumas for a lifetime.
9. When the doors are opened at the end of the flight, grab your crap and get your rump off the plane. 100 + passengers are waiting for you.
10. I’m sure I’ve forgotten something. It’s very simple. Have some consideration for others around you, and behind you.

Why so crotchity? I promise you I've been on a plane much more than you have in the last 3 years and in my extensive air travel experience I have learned to just tolerate this stuff. You can always tell the novice fliers by the people who get up as soon as the plane stops in front of the terminal and expects to start getting off the plane. Amateurs...lol

I recommend expecting all of these things. I was at first very put off as well by how inefficient some people are. But then I learned how to be patient on airplanes. Just keep sitting, maybe read another lame travel article in the on-board magazine, and wait for the morons and old people to clear out. Then you can get up and be content to just walk off the plane casually without having to stop and wait for someone every other row.

I also seriously recommend bringing music with you to listen to on the flight. This will cancel out the people talking or belly laughing around you. Also, if you don't have your iPod with you, it's generally quite acceptable to engage a stranger in conversation. Even in other countries like Canada and Europe where people might be more reserved, it's still generally okay to talk to the people sitting next to you on the plane. Of course you don't have to yell or disturb others, but it's another option for you.