I just watched the video from last month's Downtown Design Review Committee.

As they were looking forward to next month's agenda, the committee members asked two questions of the representative from the City planning office: 1) Have you seen anything come through on the Rainey Williams / Stage Center project (answer: no); and 2) Have you seen anything on the Preftakes properties (answer, no, not yet).

Question #2 is interesting because it implies they are expecting to see something soon.

I'm sure those terracotta tiles can be salvaged.

It's really the only thing about that building that is special and I'm sure they can be repurposed elsewhere.


You can almost bet the farm that building and the ones immediately to the west will be demolished.
Yeah, I'm not advocating renovation/preservation. I'm good with higher and better use on this one. But I highly doubt the terra cotta tiles will be salvaged. Too much labor for not a lot of return. Wrecking ball. I really don't get too excited about re-purposing stuff like that anyway. I mean, I do like to see it re-purposed, and it can be cool to see, but sometimes people act like that is the same as historic preservation and it absolutely is not. A building is either historic or it's not. It existed in that manner in that location or it did not. I've gotten tired of that argument when applied to Stage Center. "Moving" Stage Center, or disassembling and rebuilding elsewhere, is impossible, and pointless.

Regarding this one, a new building skinned in an old facade is still a new building. And I can also guarantee that if someone had lovingly preserved this building there wouldn't be discussion of tearing it down; whatever Nick is planning would be somehow planned around it. It's the problem with letting great old buildings go to seed. When they get to this state, few people see value in them, and it becomes a very easy (too easy) decision to tear them down.

It is a great building, but difficult to get too wrapped up in a two-story in its current shape, considering the neighborhood, assuming a higher-and-better-use replacement. As always, I would be opposed to spec teardown, but I don't think that is a possibility here.

These are the photos I was thinking of:

http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j286/UnFrSaKn/Old%20Oklahoma%20City/Carpenter%20Square/barons6.jpg

http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j286/UnFrSaKn/Old%20Oklahoma%20City/Carpenter%20Square/barons5.jpg

http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j286/UnFrSaKn/Old%20Oklahoma%20City/Carpenter%20Square/barons2.jpg

Walked by today and they had put new plywood up and was painting it tan to match. The plywood was caulked. Looks to me to be cleaning up the property for a longer term vacancy. The tile they removed was the 2x2 black and white tile that was just glued up there about 6-8 years ago.

He's owned those properties along main for over six years now and hasn't done a darn thing and they all look terrible.

With all the heat the City is putting on Midtown property owners, why does Preftakes get a free pass here?

As I mentioned before, these properties have all massively benefited from Project 180 and a bunch of other tax-payer driven projects.


Surrounding this shabby block:

Devon Energy Center
Brand new city-funded parking garage
Existing but now being renovated city parking garage
Stage Center Tower
New downtown elementary school
Adjacent to City Hall, Civic Center and newly renovated Bicentennial Park

Nicholas Preftakes is Doing Something - But What? | News OK (http://newsok.com/nicholas-preftakes-is-doing-something-but-what/article/3902003)

Why after all this time would he paint the windows in those buildings white??

Perhaps the City has been giving him a bit of grief about everything looking so bad? Still, is this an improvement?


He's a cagey one, that Nick Preftakes.

He's owned those properties along main for over six years now and hasn't done a darn thing and they all look terrible.

With all the heat the City is putting on Midtown property owners, why does Preftakes get a free pass here?

As I mentioned before, these properties have all massively benefited from Project 180 and a bunch of other tax-payer driven projects.


Surrounding this shabby block:

Devon Energy Center
Brand new city-funded parking garage
Existing but now being renovated city parking garage
Stage Center Tower
New downtown elementary school
Adjacent to City Hall, Civic Center and newly renovated Bicentennial Park

That's why the development of this site needs to be publicly scrutinized and evaluated. He doesn't get to ramrod a ton of demolish and corporate replacements down our throat.

"ACE Moving and Storage in Preftakes' Alley":

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BYksK-PIcAAZtV4.jpg:large

Source: https://twitter.com/OKCNightCourt/status/398898609523261440/photo/1

^

I saw that but remember that 420 W. Main is full of City departments.

Also, it could be someone moving out of One North Hudson, which will continue to happen through next April.

^

I saw that but remember that 420 W. Main is full of City departments.

Also, it could be someone moving out of One North Hudson, which will continue to happen through next April.

Yeah, I didn't know what that signified -- hoping that someone else would. Seems we all have to play amateur Kremlinologists with regards to this block.

^

I saw that but remember that 420 W. Main is full of City departments.

Also, it could be someone moving out of One North Hudson, which will continue to happen through next April.


Nope on One North Hudson. I have been the only tenant for several months and it wasn't me. Also, I don't think there is access to One north Hudson from this alley. There is a second alley between the parking garage and one north Hudson that runs down to the back side of the Lunchbox with no access to this alley which is on the north side of the parking garage.

Wow, didn't realize you were the last tenant!

Have you heard anything about their plans for that building?

Wow, didn't realize you were the last tenant!

Have you heard anything about their plans for that building?

Not anything I would feel comfortable disclosing or hasn't been said on here by others. Building is being maintained and cleaned. Preftakes' building management people have always been excellent to lease from as far as being responsive to maintenance and cleaning.

BIG NEWS

Just this morning, the Preftakes group filed applications with the Downtown Design Review Committee to RENOVATE the former Carpenter Square building (400 W. Main) and at least two of the buildings immediately west.

These are numbers 8, 7, 6 and possibly 5 above. The on-line City system specifies 400, 412 & 414 W. Main -- doesn't mention 408 (#7) but that is probably just a lack of alignment with physical addresses, which frequently happens in this process.


Cant' see the details (won't be able to see them on-line until a few days before their 12/19/13 meeting) but it does specify renovation and it also calls for an administrative review, which typically means only very minor changes. To alter the exterior in any meaningful way, the application would have to be reviewed by the full board, and that is not the case here.

Very odd... Hard to believe after all this time (six years of absolutely doing nothing) that suddenly they are going to renovate and lease these buildings, especially since the rumor has always been these would give way to a large tower.

I suppose it could be an intermediate step until they start on a larger project.

Hope to find out more soon and will share it when we do.


http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/precor5.jpg

Remember, there has been some activity with these buildings the last couple of weeks in terms of some slight clean-up, boarding up and painting some windows opaque.

Nicholas Preftakes is Doing Something - But What? | News OK (http://newsok.com/nicholas-preftakes-is-doing-something-but-what/article/3902003)

I wonder if this has anything to do with Steve's somewhat cryptic tweet from this morning:

https://twitter.com/stevelackmeyer/status/402445945733779456

I wonder if this has anything to do with Steve's somewhat cryptic tweet from this morning:

https://twitter.com/stevelackmeyer/status/402445945733779456

Hey, sounds like some kind of big announcement today! Woohoo!

May not have anything to do with the Preftakes block, but..... something.

Hey, sounds like some kind of big announcement today! Woohoo!

May not have anything to do with the Preftakes block, but..... something.

Maybe we will finally get some concrete information on the Stage Center Tower.

Oops, I missed Pete's post above. Go off for an hour, come back, and things have already happened.

I don't know what that Carpenter Square renovation means. Seems a little odd.

Probably had more to do with his NewOK downtown move tweet

Probably had more to do with his NewOK downtown move tweet

Oh. Well that's not so exciting. We've known about that move for a long time.

That application for the renovation of Carpenter Square (and buildings west) really threw me off. Wasn't expecting that.

Well, I have mixed feelings on this. It will be great to have something developed there and bring that area back from the dead. It's been horrible for years now.

On the other hand... dang! I really thought that we might be getting a second tower in the Preftakes block. May have just been wishful thinking on our part. :(

Very odd. Dormant forever. Only to be a renovation.

I'm glad. Towers are overrated.

I'm glad. Towers are overrated.

I disagree. I would like to see another tower or two downtown to balance out the skyline. That's looking less and less likely as time goes on. At the beginning of 2013 there was an article that mentioned a few towers would be announced this year. Here we are at year end and nothing.

bchris02,

What city could you live in that has construction all the time? Ah yes, Dallas. Move, now. LOL

This is very odd.

It could be that Preftakes had planned on a tower, but that a sufficient number of tenants could not be found. We keep talking about a lack of downtown Class A space, so the demand seemed very high. But maybe it's not as high as we thought, and a single tower is, in actuality, quite capable of satisfying that need.

Rainey has been busy, no doubt, rounding up tenants for the Stage Center site. Preftakes may have found that many/most of the tenants he had in mind have already signed on, as it were, to the SC tower. So, without enough demand left over, he decided to go back to some Plan B he had stashed away -- some renovation plan.

Just random thoughts on my part.

I suspect he was getting pressure to clean up these sites since there has been so much investment -- including a ton of tax dollars -- surrounding his properties. And after all, they abut the main City offices.

Because they are only seeking an administrative review, they can't be doing much of anything to these properties. For all we know, he's just planning to clean them up a bit.

I still expect a much bigger project for this site and by no means has demand for office space lessened -- quite the contrary.

Preftakes has way, way too much money invested here just to rent the existing buildings out.

It could be that a new large tower would go between the bus station and One North Hudson, thus allowing the opposite corner to be cleaned up and leased out.

I disagree. I would like to see another tower or two downtown to balance out the skyline. That's looking less and less likely as time goes on. At the beginning of 2013 there was an article that mentioned a few towers would be announced this year. Here we are at year end and nothing.

Like clockwork... One has been announced...just because he is going to renovate this block doesn't mean a tower isn't going to go here and it doesn't mean another tower or 2 aren't going on one of the other 6 empty lots in the CBD.

I'm actually glad that he may not tear those buildings down, they are almost all that is left of what was once a great Main Street. Their still appears to be pleanty of room for something on the Sheraton side of this block.

I'm actually glad that he may not tear those buildings down, they are almost all that is left of what was once a great Main Street. Their still appears to be pleanty of room for something on the Sheraton side of this block.

I feel this way as well. It'll be nice to leave these old buildings standing while hopefully filling in the gaps elsewhere.

I want more towers for OKC just as much as anyone else, but there are so many empty lots that can have towers put up on them, why do we have to put towers on the blocks that already have buildings? Let's start with the empty lots, then we can move on to the higher/better use arguments.

Maybe the bigger plans are going to be delayed a bit so they've decided to lease them for a couple years... I'm not sure what businesses would move in under such circumstances though. Just a thought...

The Carpenter Square building is way underrated. I would be perfectly happy to see it and the motor hotel preserved, in addition to the (presumed) preservation of Hotel Black and the bus station. Everything else could come down and be replaced, whether by a tower or by something(s) more modest. That still leaves lots of land to play with.

I'm glad. Towers are overrated.Completely disagree. Towers make a city stand out, and I want more towers in OKC!

FALSE ALARM!

Although there were applications filed for "renovation" with the Downtown Design Review Committee, today they added the following project summary:


secure building by installing painted plywood to exterior at street level of north and east facades

So, this is just the general clean-up and board-up already done or in process. No real renovation is taking place.


Makes much more sense as the rumors of a new tower on that site (SW corner of Main and Hudson) are still quite active.

http://molliecoons.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/Phew.jpg

Thank goodness!

My dreams of a second tower are coming back to life......

Tears of joy!

http://p5.img.cctvpic.com/program/africalive/20120802/images/1343854571047_1343854571047_r.jpg

FALSE ALARM!

Although there were applications filed for "renovation" with the Downtown Design Review Committee, today they added the following project summary:

So, this is just the general clean-up and board-up already done or in process. No real renovation is taking place.

Makes much more sense as the rumors of a new tower on that site (SW corner of Main and Hudson) are still quite active.

I'd like to see a tower, however tall, with great street interaction and a lot of storefronts on that property. No reason they can't maintain a Main Street "feel" even with a new tower.

But I thought our tower hopes were fading every day.....

Wasn't Carpenter Square built to support a tower?

I'd love to see it reused as part of a new development, similar to Hearst Tower in NYC.

Hearst Tower (New York City) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hearst_Tower_(New_York_City))

My vote is something like this.

http://extras.mnginteractive.com/live/media/site295/2008/0626/20080626__wire_03~p1_200.jpg

Let OKC put up a skyscraper that is radical and unique and will define the skyline. A skyscraper that is synonymous with OKC as the Library Tower is to LA, the pyramid tower is to San Francisco, and 700 Louisana is to Houston.

Let OKC put up a skyscraper that is radical and unique and will define the skyline. A skyscraper that is synonymous with OKC as the Library Tower is to LA, the pyramid tower is to San Francisco, and 700 Louisana is to Houston.

This actually threw me for a second because all I've ever known that building as is the U.S. Bank Tower. Nevertheless, there's something about it that just screams Los Angeles. It's definitely something that makes you say "hey, that's Los Angeles!!!"

As for Bank of America Center (700 Louisiana), the building that grabs me the most & makes me say "yep, that's Houston" is the Williams Tower.

My vote is something like this.

http://extras.mnginteractive.com/live/media/site295/2008/0626/20080626__wire_03~p1_200.jpg

Let OKC put up a skyscraper that is radical and unique and will define the skyline. A skyscraper that is synonymous with OKC as the Library Tower is to LA, the pyramid tower is to San Francisco, and 700 Louisana is to Houston.

I think that's what the Devon Tower would look like after an 8.5 magnitude earthquake.

I think that's what the Devon Tower would look like after an 8.5 magnitude earthquake.

It looks more like a direct hit from an EF-5 tornado to me.

Here is what was submitted on the Carpenter Square Building:


http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/carpenter112613.JPG


http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/carpenter112613b.JPG

Interesting.

My first reaction is that they are either trying to say the right things to appease the City or they really want to keep the façade.

If they were so concerned about the facade they would have done this six years ago when they bought these buildings.

The appearance of those buildings have been appalling for quite a while and are only slightly less so now. Those old black and white tiles were literally falling onto the sidewalk, feral cats were living in the old Dorn vestibule, etc.

To me, spending a few hundred dollars on plywood and paint does not represent any sort of real commitment to conservation. In fact, it has to be the absolute minimum they could have done here over all this time.

I don't disagree. Maybe this represents a change of thinking regarding preservation? Maybe up until now they were not planning on saving it but now they are?

I really don't think they have ever planned to save those buildings.

They are small and wouldn't be super expensive to fix up. Why would they leave them empty for six years to only now renovate them?

Beats me. Unless they plan on maintaining the facades and incorporating them into a larger development. But that is probably wishful thinking on my part

Some of the facades are torn to hell. I think he's doing the minimum required until his deal (whatever it is) is ready to go.

They also don't list these properties for lease.

Here has what has become of this block.

This is from yesterday:

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7322/11878276685_d94e60b9a4_c.jpg

Here is what was submitted on the Carpenter Square Building:


http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/carpenter112613.JPG


http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/carpenter112613b.JPG


Can someone verify that the tile was really that crappy? That was my favorite design aspect of the Carpenter Square Building.. :/

Will Preftakes be speaking before a public body to have this work done? Is he going to get dinged by the new vacant property registry?

I am getting a little tired of a huge chunk of downtown, really our best cluster of historic building stock, stuck in limbo while it's poorly mothballed as development rumors continue to rage. For a while the redevelopment rumors were exciting. But Pete is right. Now we're at the point where the reality is this entire block has been completely dead for 6 years.

This is the reality of development purgatory, where we find half of our downtown.

Yes, it was really that crappy... Just stuck on, falling off all over the place and it was not original.

Think it was tacked on sometime in the 80's.

Here has what has become of this block.

This is from yesterday:

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7322/11878276685_d94e60b9a4_c.jpg

It's been like that for a long time Pete. It's just more noticeable now that the bus station is closed. Makes me wonder how many urban campers are holding out underneath the SC ramps...

^His office chair seems pretty nice. My family has done business with Preftakes. I encouraged them to ask Preftakes what he plans to do here, and he only gives dodgy, vague responses.

Forgive me if that has been addressed before, but is it possible he is doing nothing? Just waiting for an offer? Perhaps his asking price is too high?